Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
Z-Man

Latest on realignment

219 posts in this topic

As always, great stuff from Stu Hackel:

The whole thing is a really good read.

Definitely, thanks for posting that. After reading how it all went down, I don't think I mind this idea as much. I wonder what happens if the NHLPA is totally against this though.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Which part is the Brodeur-part of the trophy?

The Backbone.

I wish there were markets for the NHL to grow a couple more teams out west and end this travel/fatigue/etc issues... Las Vegas, Porland, Seattle, Spokane, Salt Lake.

But the economy has this a damper on the whole game right now

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't think the playoffs will get stale if we're playing the same teams.. You seriously want to tell me that even 15 years from now you'll be like "Oh the Devils are playing the Rangers in the playoffs? Yawn, wake me up when something new and exciting happens".. It'll be huge even if it happens every season

People like you and I will never get bored with it, but the casual fans may lose interest.

Edited by devlman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

yeah, and hockey was a lot better in the 80's.

Yeah whatever, and 1994 was the best year for the NHL, too, right?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah whatever, and 1994 was the best year for the NHL, too, right?

1994 aside, there was some real great stuff in hockey back in the 80's-early 90's that I miss. I love watching an old game and seeing few or no ads on the boards, smaller goalie equipment worn by goalies who did more than butterfly, enforcers who could skate a regular shift, and no instigator rule come to mind. I know those days are gone, but they sure were entertaining.

And anyone who says we won't have Cinderella runs or parity needs to look no further than the 1987-88 Devils. They were in a race with the Rangers till the very last game, upset the mighty Islanders, upset the Caps, and then took a great Boston team to 7 games.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Have to admit, that isn't too bad. Just shows how far away the Florida teams are from everyone else anyway, not to mention NW Canada.

i think it shows the league expects PHO to end up in QUE, then you move PIT back into the Northeast

and then re-add TAM/FLA back into the Atlantic with us, so we end up with the 8-team conference....until the Isles move out !

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1994 aside, there was some real great stuff in hockey back in the 80's-early 90's that I miss. I love watching an old game and seeing few or no ads on the boards, smaller goalie equipment worn by goalies who did more than butterfly, enforcers who could skate a regular shift, and no instigator rule come to mind. I know those days are gone, but they sure were entertaining.

And anyone who says we won't have Cinderella runs or parity needs to look no further than the 1987-88 Devils. They were in a race with the Rangers till the very last game, upset the mighty Islanders, upset the Caps, and then took a great Boston team to 7 games.

I'd argue that most enforcers have to skate a shift now versus back in the day. Troy Crowder, Dave Brown, Stu Grimson, Bob Probert, etc. wouldn't make it past the ECHL in today's era of salary caps. Most enforcers today are welter-weights in the mold of Boston's Shawn Thornton that are far from hopeless playing on the 3rd or 4th lines of most teams.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

1994 aside, there was some real great stuff in hockey back in the 80's-early 90's that I miss. I love watching an old game and seeing few or no ads on the boards, smaller goalie equipment worn by goalies who did more than butterfly, enforcers who could skate a regular shift, and no instigator rule come to mind. I know those days are gone, but they sure were entertaining.

And anyone who says we won't have Cinderella runs or parity needs to look no further than the 1987-88 Devils. They were in a race with the Rangers till the very last game, upset the mighty Islanders, upset the Caps, and then took a great Boston team to 7 games.

I remember that. We had family over for Easter Sunday, by the time they left the Rangers had already beaten Quebec, and I watched the end of the Devils-Blackhawks. Started my hatred of the Devils, but hated the Isles more so rooted for them against the Isles.

86 Rangers too, had 78 points off the top of my head. Beat the 100+point flyers in 5, and the 100+ point caps in 6. Lost to Habs and some unknown named Roy, but it was a great run.

Edited by Matteau#32

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i think it shows the league expects PHO to end up in QUE, then you move PIT back into the Northeast

and then re-add TAM/FLA back into the Atlantic with us, so we end up with the 8-team conference....until the Isles move out !

Phoenix is currently in one of the eight-team conferences. All that would happen if they did move to Quebec is you take them out of that division and put them in the Montreal-Boston-Buffalo 'conference', which currently has seven teams including Quebec's original rivals.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If someone proposed to name the baseball divisions after 1880s players they'd be laughed at. The old names are silly, I wouldn't mind names from the more recent past. I have to imagine, though, they'll stick with the geographical type names.

Of course the old division names are silly to you. You only started watching hockey in 1995.

The old division names were unique to hockey and the rivalries within them are stories and games remembered today.

Edited by SJP20

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

People like you and I will never get bored with it, but the casual fans may lose interest.

Casual fans are more drawn in by rivalries. Sox Yankees gets hyped, so casual baseball fans watch those games. It's why ESPN puts them on every chance they get, even though lately the games have turned into 4-5 hour snoozefests.

I like the idea, though I hate how much tougher our division is with the Caps.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd argue that most enforcers have to skate a shift now versus back in the day. Troy Crowder, Dave Brown, Stu Grimson, Bob Probert, etc. wouldn't make it past the ECHL in today's era of salary caps. Most enforcers today are welter-weights in the mold of Boston's Shawn Thornton that are far from hopeless playing on the 3rd or 4th lines of most teams.

I don't know. I mean the Devils rolled 4 lines with Peluso on the 4th. They could never do that with Cam or Boulton. And don't forget heavyweights like Probert and McSorley could score. Both hit 15-20 goals a couple times.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Casual fans are more drawn in by rivalries. Sox Yankees gets hyped, so casual baseball fans watch those games. It's why ESPN puts them on every chance they get, even though lately the games have turned into 4-5 hour snoozefests.

I like the idea, though I hate how much tougher our division is with the Caps.

So let's just play the rags 82 games then. The rivalry fanboys are making more out of the rivalry factor here. The caps pens rivalry for example is manufactured by the league and hasn't been a genuine rivalry for decades. What happens if one team stinks? Dos the rivalry remain in tact? I think too much of the "rivalry games" can beat teams up and cause the standard of hockey to drop,standardize, lead to more reckless headshots, suspensions. In the end these games will become less and less interesting, much like the winter classic, and non divisional games that are usually fiery will diminish.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So let's just play the rags 82 games then. The rivalry fanboys are making more out of the rivalry factor here. The caps pens rivalry for example is manufactured by the league and hasn't been a genuine rivalry for decades.

How quickly some people forget the '90's when the Pens and Caps met in a ton of big, tight playoff series and there were stars on both teams (Jagr-Gonchar-Kolzig-Oates-Lemieux, etc). It's always been a legitimate hockey rivalry between the teams and fans, Crosby-Ovechkin has just given it national and casual fan appeal.

So let's just play the rags 82 games then. The rivalry fanboys are making more out of the rivalry factor here.

Now you're just being silly. Even with the unbalanced schedule and more teams in your division, teams still play a majority of their regular season games outside of the division and still have to win two of four series outside the division in the playoffs to win the Cup.

Edited by NJDevs4978

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So let's just play the rags 82 games then. The rivalry fanboys are making more out of the rivalry factor here. The caps pens rivalry for example is manufactured by the league and hasn't been a genuine rivalry for decades. What happens if one team stinks? Dos the rivalry remain in tact? I think too much of the "rivalry games" can beat teams up and cause the standard of hockey to drop,standardize, lead to more reckless headshots, suspensions. In the end these games will become less and less interesting, much like the winter classic, and non divisional games that are usually fiery will diminish.

It's already been mentioned, but the Caps and Pens had a rivalry going for a while in the 90's.

Did the standard of hockey drop the last time there were divisional playoffs? Of course not! Some of the great rivalries came from it... Boston-Montreal, Nords-Montreal, Calgary-Edmonton, Rags-Isles, Rags-Flyers, Pens-Flyers, Blues-Wings, Hawks-Wings, these were all matchups that were fueled by meeting in the playoffs year after year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So let's just play the rags 82 games then. The rivalry fanboys are making more out of the rivalry factor here. The caps pens rivalry for example is manufactured by the league and hasn't been a genuine rivalry for decades. What happens if one team stinks? Dos the rivalry remain in tact? I think too much of the "rivalry games" can beat teams up and cause the standard of hockey to drop,standardize, lead to more reckless headshots, suspensions. In the end these games will become less and less interesting, much like the winter classic, and non divisional games that are usually fiery will diminish.

You mentioned casual fans. They're more drawn in by rivalries. That's why they get manufactured or hyped. We can discuss whether rivalry games are good for quality of play, or if we want to see more of them, but I was responding to your point about casual fans.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

How quickly some people forget the '90's when the Pens and Caps met in a ton of big, tight playoff series and there were stars on both teams (Jagr-Gonchar-Kolzig-Oates-Lemieux, etc). It's always been a legitimate hockey rivalry between the teams and fans, Crosby-Ovechkin has just given it national and casual fan appeal.

Now you're just being silly. Even with the unbalanced schedule and more teams in your division, teams still play a majority of their regular season games outside of the division and still have to win two of four series outside the division in the playoffs to win the Cup.

The caps and pens may have had a couple tight playoff series but neither fan base considered the other a big rival.

And to your second paragraph, of course the last two rounds have to be played outside your division, but that doesn't make up for the same intra division playoff match ups we will see year after year for the first two rds.

DevilDan, I'm more worried about a lack of variety of style creeping into the game when you see the same team over and over. Some even suggest that the trap came about to help level the playing field for the lesser talented teams that kept facing a higher caliber opponent. And the trap wasn't good for the fans.

Mouse, in regard to the casual fan, I agree they love rivalries. But don't you think they'd grow tired of the same overhyped rivalry? You brought up a good analogy with the sox and yanks. I'm a baseball fan and casual fans outside of our market don't really get giddy to watch them play just because espn pushes it on them.

Edited by devlman

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The caps and pens may have had a couple tight playoff series but neither fan base considered the other a big rival.

you're wrong. the penguins were the capitals' main rival in the 90s.

And to your second paragraph, of course the last two rounds have to be played outside your division, but that doesn't make up for the same intra division playoff match ups we will see year after year for the first two rds.

yeah that's terrible for ratings and fan interest. all of these people who watch the NHL all the time will be bored out of their skulls.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

you're wrong. the penguins were the capitals' main rival in the 90s.

yeah that's terrible for ratings and fan interest. all of these people who watch the NHL all the time will be bored out of their skulls.

No, they were not. you're wrong :rolleyes:

Read the thread before jumping in.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like the new format, just hope it evolves to allow more than 2 games out of the division per team.

Seems silly cities as close as Boston, Toronto, and Montreal only get seen twice. At one time back in the day, I felt like the Leafs were a bigger rival after the playoff series.

Wouldn't you want to see cup and conf final teams see each other a bit more the following year?

Edited by mxm262

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Of course the old division names are silly to you. You only started watching hockey in 1995.

The old division names were unique to hockey and the rivalries within them are stories and games remembered today.

The Patrick/Smythe/Norris/Adams division names were around for 19 years. This year marks the 19th year since those names were junked. As far as a name goes, the Atlantic Division has exactly as much history/as many memories as the Patrick Division.

Those names are old and dusty, and three of the four belong to owners. I mean, who cares about Charles Adams? Might as well name the conferences after James Dolan and Bill Wirtz.

The names never came off the trophies, so keep them there (even though James E. Norris never played defense and Conn Smythe never displayed playoff heroics). But the names came off the divisions. Let's start fresh and honor the greatest players to ever lace 'em up.

At least, that's my two cents.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why are they calling them conferences? and will the playoff format change to 4-4-4-4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Patrick/Smythe/Norris/Adams division names were around for 19 years. This year marks the 19th year since those names were junked. As far as a name goes, the Atlantic Division has exactly as much history/as many memories as the Patrick Division.

Those names are old and dusty, and three of the four belong to owners. I mean, who cares about Charles Adams? Might as well name the conferences after James Dolan and Bill Wirtz.

The names never came off the trophies, so keep them there (even though James E. Norris never played defense and Conn Smythe never displayed playoff heroics). But the names came off the divisions. Let's start fresh and honor the greatest players to ever lace 'em up.

At least, that's my two cents.

Lol if conferences were named after owners - We'd play in the Vanderbeek Conference!?

(McMullen Conference would be more fitting to us, but still...)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Patrick/Smythe/Norris/Adams division names were around for 19 years. This year marks the 19th year since those names were junked. As far as a name goes, the Atlantic Division has exactly as much history/as many memories as the Patrick Division.

You better go look up your history:

Patrick Division Stanley Cup Champions: 7

Atlantic Division Stanley Cup Champions: 5

Patrick Division President's Trophy winners: 2

Atlantic Division President's Trophy winners: 1

The "younger" crowd who only really remembers/knows the Atlantic Division era will always associate the Devils and their success with it. 9 division titles and 3 Cups will do that. The Devils are the most successful team of the "Atlantic" division era, of course we all will have an attachment to it, just like.....

those of us that grew up in the 80's with the Patrick Division and were introduced to hockey (and the Devils when they moved here) at a young age. We remember the Devils 1988 run, the Islanders dynasty, NYR/NYI playoffs, Capitals/NYI Lafontaine OT goal, NYI shocking Pittsburgh and the rivalries born. That's not to mention a Flyers cup and the 70's NYR/NYI playoffs, either.

Sorry, but i prefer the unique names of the past. They may be "old and dusty", but the men honored with them were builders and influential in the early days of the sport that the Gretzky's and the Lemieux's, et al., can owe gratitute towards for being able to be what they were.

Hell, why were at at, let's have the NFL take the Vince Lombardi name off the Super Bowl trophy since he's old and dusty, too!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Seems silly cities as close as Boston, Toronto, and Montreal only get seen twice. At one time back in the day, I felt like the Leafs were a bigger rival after the playoff series.

Wouldn't you want to see cup and conf final teams see each other a bit more the following year?

Attendance will go down in many eastern American markets (certainly ours) when you have longer homestands and replace the Leafs, Habs, Bruins with the Coyotes, Avalanche, Ducks, Stars, Predators, CBJ, etc...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0