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HellOnICE

The Battle of Brodeur

71 posts in this topic

It pains me to say this, but I think we should roll with Hedberg not because he is substantially better, but the team plays so much better in front of him. Can anyone pull up the stats of g/f with Hedberg compared to Brodeur?

this +100

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I think they've overachieved to get where they are, even at 14-12-1. All the numbers point to that, really...the bad goal differential (-13 when eliminating phantom shootout goals), the low GF total, only half their wins coming in regulation...it's impossible to make a case for them deserving to have a better record than they do.

I think while it's not possible to argue that they should have a better record - no team is good enough at the shootout to do sustainably well as NJ has been - I do think they should have more overtime games in general. Right now at even strength with the score tied, the Devils are -5 GA despite being even in shots and a .917 save percentage. They've given up a late 3rd goal in a lot of games and haven't gotten many themselves - their shooting percentage is worst in the 3rd period.

I don't think Hedberg will play so well as to take the #1 job for the year, but as much as I appreciate all Marty has done through the years, the GAA and save% are just flat-out bad right now. Hedberg's, for the moment, are solid. Marty's played an absurd number of games for his career, and at his age, it can end or drop off very quickly. Sports fans have seen the both the slow, steady decline in some players, and the much more abrupt one in the others (baseball's Mickey Mantle and Roberto Alomar are great examples of the latter). If this was four or five years ago I let Marty ride it out, but when the other guy is playing better, and the team has almost no margin for error, and I can't really bank on Marty at 39 being able to regain his form, I gotta give the other guy a chance.

I think the terrible offensive start last year masked how not good Brodeur was, but he did come on stronger at the end of the year. I still think we'll see Brodeur on Saturday, but if he's not good then, we will be seeing a lot more of Hedberg.

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He started his career platooning with Terreri, so its only fitting that he ends it platooning with another aging but serviceable goalie. The circle of life.

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Why does one of them have to be named the No. 1 goalie? Why can't DeBoer just alternate them every game?

That's what I'd like to see.

Bingo. Just alternate every game or every two games

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I'm not convinced of anything yet. From my seat at the Rock, we totally sucked for at least one period yesterday, and have for numerous periods past in front of Marty.

Let's see if Deboer can get them playing defensively well and then judge the goalies.

Yes. This.

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alot of people hate on Marty here but do any of you see the complete lack of help from the D he gets very lazy play from them on both goals last night and they seem at least to me to play like a completely different team for headburg much more responsible in front of him.the defense looks to almost not try when marty's in the net, i do agree that marty gives up the softy goals every now and then but for the most part and definitely last night most goals this year are not his fault.....just my opinion

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I thought Marty last year was worse, IMO. Marty could easily come back and have another second half like last year, and win a round or two. I think a lot of people would be begging him to come back with a one year deal at that point.

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I think they've overachieved to get where they are, even at 14-12-1. All the numbers point to that, really...the bad goal differential (-13 when eliminating phantom shootout goals), the low GF total, only half their wins coming in regulation...it's impossible to make a case for them deserving to have a better record than they do.

Shootouts don't count for goal differential, they are -8.

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i totally blame marty for both goals - no question.

too casual and bad puck handling on goal one and then out of position.

awful, unnecessary rebound and inability to recover on goal 2.

The first was a poor rebound and is definitely on Marty. But on the second one, he had Tedenby standing on top of him.

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The first was a poor rebound and is definitely on Marty. But on the second one, he had Tedenby standing on top of him.

Tedy took the wrong guy and got man-handled into marty's lap. you could tell by the look on his face that he was going to hear about it lol

plus, our D-men have been collapsing too much and taking bad angles

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Shootouts don't count for goal differential, they are -8.

No they're not.

They are 6-1 in shootouts. That means they have 6 goals added to the GF column and 1 goal added to the GA column that were never scored. The team that wins a shootout gets a "phantom" goal added to their total.

So in reality, the Devils have scored 70 - 6 = 64 goals

and have given up 78 - 1 = 77 goals

Understand?

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Why does one of them have to be named the No. 1 goalie? Why can't DeBoer just alternate them every game?

That's what I'd like to see.

Because the thought of Marty being the #2 goalie on this team (or any other) gives a lot of us hives.

I might be okay with Marty and Moose being #1 and #1A, but the idea of Marty flat-out losing his starting job is just too painful.

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Because the thought of Marty being the #2 goalie on this team (or any other) gives a lot of us hives.

I might be okay with Marty and Moose being #1 and #1A, but the idea of Marty flat-out losing his starting job is just too painful.

I'd much rather see him lose his job than keep getting obliterated and pulled after a period.

Besides, he did already lose his job a couple of times last winter, albeit temporarily.

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No one is saying he should lose his job yet. I'm saying they need to do a better job of putting him in more positions to succeed. Last night proved to me, he shouldn't play in 2 games in a row unless there's at least 2 days off.

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Because the thought of Marty being the #2 goalie on this team (or any other) gives a lot of us hives.

I might be okay with Marty and Moose being #1 and #1A, but the idea of Marty flat-out losing his starting job is just too painful.

Really? I don't give a sh!t. I want the better goalie to start. If Marty can't compete effectively, or if the team doesn't play effectively in front of him, he shouldn't play. I'm totally cool with that.

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tell ya what: when our players get out of the habit of making some of the worst turnovers in the history of the game, then I'll talk goalie performance with you but right now, I just can't tell.

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I really this team should just alternate goalies and ride hot hands when there are shutouts and the like. The team has much less to do with the goalie they're playing in front of than they used to.

Also I think it's worth nothing that the Devils as an organization haven't had to use a real backup that played more than 10 games in about 20 years (save for the Clemmensen/Weekes year), so it's understandable they're having trouble using one now.

Edited by DevilNurn

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Because the thought of Marty being the #2 goalie on this team (or any other) gives a lot of us hives.

I might be okay with Marty and Moose being #1 and #1A, but the idea of Marty flat-out losing his starting job is just too painful.

That's what I was saying -- have them alternate. That way, nobody is the No. 1 goalie. At least for a little while to see how it works.

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No they're not.

They are 6-1 in shootouts. That means they have 6 goals added to the GF column and 1 goal added to the GA column that were never scored. The team that wins a shootout gets a "phantom" goal added to their total.

So in reality, the Devils have scored 70 - 6 = 64 goals

and have given up 78 - 1 = 77 goals

Understand?

They get the goal added to the score so people can tell who won, but they don't get a goal added to their season total just like players don't get credit for shootout goals. They had 66 goals going into last night's game, they won 5-4 in a shootout, and now they have 70. Ottawa entered the game with 95 goals against and now they have 99. You can check the standings on nhl.com and go back to yesterday and see for yourself.

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They get the goal added to the score so people can tell who won, but they don't get a goal added to their season total just like players don't get credit for shootout goals. They had 66 goals going into last night's game, they won 5-4 in a shootout, and now they have 70. Ottawa entered the game with 95 goals against and now they have 99. You can check the standings on nhl.com and go back to yesterday and see for yourself.

This is wrong. The phantom goal awarded for winning a shootout DOES get added into the total GF for each team. It has been that way sense the shootout was implemented. Look here:

http://espn.go.com/nhl/team/stats/_/name/nj/new-jersey-devils

and here:

http://devils.nhl.com/club/stats.htm

Add up the goals and you'll see it comes to 64 on both sites. The Devils have NOT scored 70 goals.

Also from here:

http://proicehockey.about.com/od/rules/a/shootout_debate_2.htm

The winning team in the shootout gets one goal added to its season total. The losing team has one goal-against added to its season total. This holds regardless of how many goals are scored during the shootout itself.

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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This is wrong. The phantom goal awarded for winning a shootout DOES get added into the total GF for each team. It has been that way sense the shootout was implemented. Look here:

http://espn.go.com/nhl/team/stats/_/name/nj/new-jersey-devils

and here:

http://devils.nhl.com/club/stats.htm

Add up the goals and you'll see it comes to 64 on both sites. The Devils have NOT scored 70 goals.

Also from here:

http://proicehockey.about.com/od/rules/a/shootout_debate_2.htm

The winning team in the shootout gets one goal added to its season total. The losing team has one goal-against added to its season total. This holds regardless of how many goals are scored during the shootout itself.

I have no idea then, somebody must be making a mistake somewhere because the Devils won 5-4 in a shootout and went from 66 goals to 70. :noclue:

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I tthink Marty would be ok if he just stopped overplaying the puck, positionally and out of the crease. Just let the puck come to you, Marty.

I would love to see moose get more starts.

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