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ZeroGravityFat

Big Oil after Big Red?

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The Stars' deep-pocketed new owner from Canada didn't move the team or has plans to. Just because he's rich doesn't mean he's gonna move a team or wants to. Furthermore no one on here and elsewhere has provided a good enough reason as to why the Devils should move.

Short term, they are locked into NJ for all the reasons previously mentioned. Long term is a different story. The reason why any owner would want to move this team is the fact that it loses money, year after year, and cannot sell-out its building despite being one of the top NHL clubs for the past 18 years. Would the oil tycoon purchase this team with the intention of moving them in 10-15 years - I doubt it, but stranger things have happened.

We've always had owners with significant ties to NJ. Our previous owners lined up like this: JVB is a fan who lives in NJ (will do anything to keep control of the team and in the arena he helped create), Chambers/YankeeNets (purchased team to move them with the Nets to Newark and have them as staples on the YES network to fill winter programming), McMullen (moved team to NJ, where he resided. Yet he still came an inch away from moving the team to Nashville in 1995 because we were losing money). Without an owner having that emotional tie to the state/area, the only thing preventing him from moving this franchise is money. And if this guy has the cash to do it, and a strong feeling that the team would be better served somewhere else, there is little anyone could do to stop it.

I remember reading a report (I believe in Forbes a few months ago) that the Devils ranked #12 as far as generating revenue in the NHL. That's not bad and, when combined with the TV contract and arena lease deal, should entice any owner to keep the team here long term once the debt issue is settled. There is no reason why this team shouldn't be financially viable.

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Im just curious, but does anyone know if this guy is a fan of any specific team, or if hes just a hockey fan in general?

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Short term, they are locked into NJ for all the reasons previously mentioned. Long term is a different story. The reason why any owner would want to move this team is the fact that it loses money, year after year, and cannot sell-out its building despite being one of the top NHL clubs for the past 18 years. Would the oil tycoon purchase this team with the intention of moving them in 10-15 years - I doubt it, but stranger things have happened.

I am pretty sure the Devils made a profit every year except one since they moved to Newark, I may be wrong. Although they are making money they are not making it fast enough to pay off the loans.

EDIT: The only year they were in the negative for operating income while in Newark was 2007.

Edited by Zubie#8

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I am pretty sure the Devils made a profit every year except one since they moved to Newark, I may be wrong. Although they are making money they are not making it fast enough to pay off the loans.

EDIT: The only year they were in the negative for operating income while in Newark was 2007.

Really? I thought I remember reading an article in the Ledger a few years back where JVB said the team lost money but almost broke even after bowing out in the first round against the Flyers, and that things were improving from the first few years at the Rock. My assumptions are based strictly off of things I've read in the local NJ newspapers, but, if what your saying is true, then that is good news.

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Really? I thought I remember reading an article in the Ledger a few years back where JVB said the team lost money but almost broke even after bowing out in the first round against the Flyers, and that things were improving from the first few years at the Rock. My assumptions are based strictly off of things I've read in the local NJ newspapers, but, if what your saying is true, then that is good news.

Im wrong too haha, I wasnt looking at the latest team evaluation from forbes, Devils lost 15M in 2007 and 6.1M 2011, and made 6.9 in 2009, 1.4 in 2010, and 1.9 in 2008. So far the team lost 10.9 million dollars in operating costs since they moved to Newark but that is not including this past season which should wipe that number away.

http://www.forbes.com/teams/new-jersey-devils/

Edited by Zubie#8

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Im just curious, but does anyone know if this guy is a fan of any specific team, or if hes just a hockey fan in general?

Yes, he's a season ticket holder of the Calgary Flames, as well as a Calgary WHL team.

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You guys that are saying he'll move the team to Canada are jumping the gun. The guy's rich because he's a businessman. Businessmen make deals, they buy and manage assets, they make investments. Buying a hockey team is an investment. It doesn't always have to be a "NEW JERSEY PRIDE!" type guy to run the team. An outsider might have a better insight on what can make this a more marketable and better-run organization.

No reason a Western Canadian oilman would buy the New Jersey Devils in an effort to move them to a French Canadian city, that defies logic. Like someone said already, it's like claiming someone from Boston will move the team to New Mexico, but if Boston and Albuquerque had hundreds of years of different historical and cultural French/English development haha..

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Yes, he's a season ticket holder of the Calgary Flames, as well as a Calgary WHL team.

Ok, i was just wondering cause if he is a legitimate hockey fan i can see him buying the team for the reason of winning a stanley cup, which is basically what any hockey fan dreams of their team doing. If he wasnt a hockey fan i think it would be all about the money and he would be more likely to move the team to a more profitable area. If his intentions are to buy a team that can compete every year you cant go wrong with the Devils.

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Im wrong too haha, I wasnt looking at the latest team evaluation from forbes, Devils lost 15M in 2007 and 6.1M 2011, and made 6.9 in 2009, 1.4 in 2010, and 1.9 in 2008. So far the team lost 10.9 million dollars in operating costs since they moved to Newark but that is not including this past season which should wipe that number away.

http://www.forbes.co...-jersey-devils/

forbes should not be seen as gospel on this. What it also doesn't show is what the owner's "salary" is.

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I'm not sure I buy it. Saying a guy from Calgary is gonna buy the Devils and move them to Quebec because he's Canadian is like saying a guy from Boston is gonna buy the Devils and move them to Albuquerque because he's American. Maybe he has ties there, maybe he wouldn't care where he put the team, but if he's not buying a team to move it back to his hometown (which he obviously isn't), why move it at all?

(Again, all of this is hypothetical anyway, the Devils aren't moving anywhere for the numerous reasons stated throughout this thread.)

That would be awesome since I live outside of Albuquerque.

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I'd love for this team to be owned by a billionaire. I like JVB and how he's a fan, but..some financial stability would be nice.

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I have no issue with Gallacher or any other billionaire purchasing the team as long as there was some kind of commitment made to keep the team in NJ for the longterm. Yes, I'm aware of the TV deal and Arena lease, but at the end of the day a billionaire can afford to pay the penalties for breaching contracts and that is a concern. Not that it would make financial sense to move a team out of those kinds of sweetheart deals, but it doesn't really make financial sense to buy an NHL team to begin with.

The things that I valued most about Vanderbeek's ownership have been his commitment to keeping the team in NJ, the improvements in fan relations and the building of the Jersey brand. These are aspects of ownership that I would be concerned about if a non-Garden Stater were to purchase the team.

Edited by NewarkDevil5

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I have no issue with Gallacher or any other billionaire purchasing the team as long as there was some kind of commitment made to keep the team in NJ for the longterm. Yes, I'm aware of the TV deal and Arena lease, but at the end of the day a billionaire can afford to pay the penalties for breaching contracts and that is a concern. Not that it would make financial sense to move a team out of those kinds of sweetheart deals, but it doesn't really make financial sense to buy an NHL team to begin with.

The things that I valued most about Vanderbeek's ownership have been his commitment to keeping the team in NJ, the improvements in fan relations and the building of the Jersey brand. These are aspects of ownership that I would be concerned about if a non-Garden Stater were to purchase the team.

Even if a new owner declared that he planned to stay I would take it with a grain of salt if he were not to put his money where his mouth is. A release from all of the deals that tether the Devils to the PruCenter can be negotiated with enough money. But with all of the time it takes to do that negotiating and come up with arrangements for the new city, why would you declare that you're planning to leave right away? You would tell the team's fans that you're staying, keep the revenue streams flowing, and make your inquiries into moving in private. Teams only announce that they are making plans to leave when they want new, tax-payer funded arenas (Pittsburgh Penguins).

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I don't know why you all go running to the relocation wagon as soon as we have any interest. The worse case in my mind is that he knows we are a successful franchise in a very large market area so he will push on the 3rd 4th jersey, kovie doing the opening bells at wall street, etc marketing bonanza on the team, which lou would pack up and leave for. my only concern is that he hopefully is a manager with enough good ideas to make the team a real tri-state force while not whoring it out to make it as unbearable as say rags or crosby.

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To add to this whole relocation thing... The NHL would be HIGHLY opposed to losing a team from the New York market. They would fight very hard to keep the Devils right where they are.

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To add to this whole relocation thing... The NHL would be HIGHLY opposed to losing a team from the New York market. They would fight very hard to keep the Devils right where they are.

I don't know if I agree with you there. The only reason why there is still a NJ franchise IMO is that we won the Stanley Cup in 1995 and McMullen's heart got all soft with age. Honestly I can think of at least 3 separate occasions in my lifetime where there were very strong rumors and possibilities of the Devils moving out of state.

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I'm wondering if JVB is thinking wow, I have a great opportunity now to recoup some $$$, in a few months, if I'm in deep shizzle, the offer might have moved on. Say for example buy the club now for 200 mil, or 150 mil when you as an owner is in the crapper if you can't raise the $$. Is this a good investment as a minority owner?? Hell no

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To add to this whole relocation thing... The NHL would be HIGHLY opposed to losing a team from the New York market. They would fight very hard to keep the Devils right where they are.

In 1995, Bettman basically stated a preference for the Devils to move when he said that the NY market might not be able to support 3 teams. I know he was posturing to help the team get a new lease at the Meadowlands with more favorable terms, but this team came damn close to defending its first Stanley Cup Championship in Nashville.

Basically, the Devils and Islanders are not un-movable, like the Rangers, Bruins, Canadiens, Toronto, etc. With the right market conditions and certain guarantees from a desperate city looking to bring the team in (Quebec City), the monetary advantages of being in the "NY market" can be overcome, especially in a league that is heavily dependent on ticket revenue like the NHL.

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Basically, the Devils and Islanders are not un-movable, like the Rangers, Bruins, Canadiens, Toronto, etc. With the right market conditions and certain guarantees from a desperate city looking to bring the team in (Quebec City), the monetary advantages of being in the "NY market" can be overcome, especially in a league that is heavily dependent on ticket revenue like the NHL.

The Devils are one of the higher revenue teams in the league, great tv deal and high ticket prices. If the league is looking at maximizing total team revenue then the league wouldn't want the Devils moving.

The league also doesn't want to move a team that just built a brand new arena, it sets bad precedence for getting new arenas built in the future using public money.

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In 1995, Bettman basically stated a preference for the Devils to move when he said that the NY market might not be able to support 3 teams. I know he was posturing to help the team get a new lease at the Meadowlands with more favorable terms, but this team came damn close to defending its first Stanley Cup Championship in Nashville.

Basically, the Devils and Islanders are not un-movable, like the Rangers, Bruins, Canadiens, Toronto, etc. With the right market conditions and certain guarantees from a desperate city looking to bring the team in (Quebec City), the monetary advantages of being in the "NY market" can be overcome, especially in a league that is heavily dependent on ticket revenue like the NHL.

There are a lot of other teams ahead of the Devils and Islanders. Coyotes (obviously), Ducks, Columbus. If Nashville takes a serious nosedive in the standings, they would be ripe for the picking (I don't even think all of their games are televised locally).

Looking at things objectively, relocation is rare, and a last resort. In the past 20 years there have been four of them. One of those teams, Hartford, played in a mall. Atlanta was dead on arrival. Minnesota and Winnipeg are viable hockey markets that eventually got their teams back.

Never say never, but it would take a ten year stretch of non-playoff and resulting 6000 a night attendance for the team to move.

If the league is fighting tooth and nail to keep the Coyotes where they are, they won't let the Devils move because a billionaire wants his own team somewhere in Canada.

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While everything you say is true (although I've never heard of Anaheim being in danger of relocation), the one other factor you missed is the lack of a buyer willing to keep the team in NJ. At the end of the day, that is the deciding factor. Like with Atlanta, if the Devils are put up for sale and nobody comes forward with an acceptable offer that is willing to keep them here, the league has no choice and, as a last resort, they will have to be moved. I don't think this team is going anywhere anytime soon, but you never know.

I also agree that the League doesn't want to move any of its franchises that have recently built an arena (especially an arena that was created to serve 1 professional sports tenant like the Rock). It makes the League look terrible and will hamper their ability to strong-arm other communities to continue to build publicly financed buildings in the future. I/M/O, that is one of the biggest reasons why Phoenix still has a team.

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Atlanta and NJ are 2 totally different situations. A team who never won a playoff game, barren arena more times than not despite cheaper prices, a horrible box office draw, of course future ownership would be hesitant in keeping a team in a place where it hasn't worked out on and off the ice. Didn't help that previous ownership wasn't committed to Phillips Arena.

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Not sure about any of you but if the Devils ever did move my days of following the NHL would be over. Without question.

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