Dead

Lockout 2012-2013 (Hockey's back!)

   130 members have voted

  1. 1. When will we see hockey?

    • Oct 12
      10
    • Nov 12
      19
    • Dec 12
      26
    • Jan 13
      33
    • Feb 13
      1
    • Mar 13
      0
    • Apr 13
      0
    • Oct 13
      14
    • Never
      27

Please sign in or register to vote in this poll.

1,718 posts in this topic

A bunch of those 240 guys probably would have retired or been replaced anyway.

Tri's right about Gionta, especially since he had a one-year deal this year that converts back to two-way next year.

Edited by NJDevs4978

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Gotta give the players credit for sticking together here. The third and fourth line guys, you know the guys who will only play the NHL average of 3 seasons. They show tremendous character to stick together with the Ovechkins, and Crosbys of the league. Sacrificing probably 1/3 of what they will ever make for a cause they won't benefit from. Heard an interesting stat on NHL Radio. 240 members of the 2004-05 players association never played another NHL game when the NHL finally returned. That is nearly 1/3 of the Players Association. Solidarity amongst the guys who are about to suffer that same fate is mind boggling.

Agreed! Which is why I was telling people to go easy on Krys Barch for his (probably drunken) rant last month.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@TSNBobMcKenzie: Sounds as if there's no traction or progress coming out of the mediation session. Official statements to follow, no doubt.

@TGfireandice: RT @Real_ESPNLeBrun: Source also says no more meetings with mediators planned

Edited by njd3b1ink

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This is looking pretty bad for the possibility of a half season. I think january 1st is really the latest they can start. To get that start up they need to get this done in the next 2-3 weeks. Doesnt look good. Ive been saying the whole lockout that it will be a half season and there is no way the owners would lose another full season, but im starting to think that might happen.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

lol even I didn't think it would take all of 'two' days with the mediators for this thing to blow up.

Still think this ain't coming down to the last minute Tri? At this point nothing concrete is going to happen until the BOG meeting next week where a drop-dead date will likely be floated.

This is looking pretty bad for the possibility of a half season. I think january 1st is really the latest they can start. To get that start up they need to get this done in the next 2-3 weeks. Doesnt look good. Ive been saying the whole lockout that it will be a half season and there is no way the owners would lose another full season, but im starting to think that might happen.

They were willing to start in mid-February last time and they did start in mid-January in '95 so I don't think the drop-dead date will be that early, though it likely won't be as late as mid-February this time either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pierre LeBrun @Real_ESPNLeBrun

Should be getting statements from both sides within the hour. This is easily the low point of the lockout.

Edited by Zubie#8

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Pierre LeBrun@Real_ESPNLeBrun

Daly's statement confirms no progress made, mediation over. ``We are disappointed that the mediation process was not successful,'' Daly said

Tom Gulitti@TGfireandice

Daly: “After spending several hours with both sides over two days, the presiding mediators concluded that the parties remained far apart.."

lol...the No Hockey League is still at it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So...Oh forget it, there is no more jokes to be made. I guess the season is done for in about two weeks.

Edited by DevilMinder

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

To say this sucks is an understatement and no real surprise.

Both sides can eat it at this point. With every passing day I am learning that I can live without NHL hockey....again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know during the last lockout they waited until February until they scrapped the season. What do you estimate is the cut off date to reach an agreement to get a season in?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know during the last lockout they waited until February until they scrapped the season. What do you estimate is the cut off date to reach an agreement to get a season in?

It depends on what the league considers its bare-bones minimum for a season. If it's 38 games like I suspect it may have been in '05 (four division games, home and home against other conference teams) then it'll be early-mid February again. If it's 48 games like in '95 then it'll mid-January, just like that was.

Either way I'm not expecting any real progress until early January, or if the players file a 'disclaimer of interest' as they did in the NBA and somehow that gets the process going the way it did there (I've come to expect the worst about anything with this lockout though). Probably a drop-dead date will be floated after the BOG meeting next week.

Edited by NJDevs4978

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If the NHLPA uses the disclaimer of interest, there may be a breakthrough. I don't understand why the owners haven't given anything more than they have - it just doesn't make sense to me. They are risking a lot over a little.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The owners are letting Bettman (who has Phoenix's vote), Jacobs and friends drive the bus, for the most part...they really don't have much of a choice since Bettman's a hard-liner himself. All they need is six other owners to vote against a CBA to block it indefinitely.

Edited by NJDevs4978

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If the NHLPA uses the disclaimer of interest, there may be a breakthrough. I don't understand why the owners haven't given anything more than they have - it just doesn't make sense to me. They are risking a lot over a little.

I think Bettman might be negotiating for his job. I have nothing to back this up besides wild speculation but it would explain a lot. I think he might need to break the NHLPA this CBA fight to remain commissioner

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Bettman might be negotiating for his job. I have nothing to back this up besides wild speculation but it would explain a lot. I think he might need to break the NHLPA this CBA fight to remain commissioner

I hope so, at least it would provide something good out of a lost season...but you do keep reading that Bettman promised the owners a big win, so if he doesn't deliver there'll be hell to pay finally.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think Bettman might be negotiating for his job. I have nothing to back this up besides wild speculation but it would explain a lot. I think he might need to break the NHLPA this CBA fight to remain commissioner

They've continually raised his pay. I mean, the owners as a group have done some dumb things, but saying 'Hey, control this group of people you have no control over or else' is completely senseless.

Remember - the CBA that the owners think is so bad now? That's what they got after supposedly breaking the union the first time. How much more can they really get?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Remember - the CBA that the owners think is so bad now? That's what they got after supposedly breaking the union the first time. How much more can they really get?

Doesn't that strengthen the case for wanting to fire Bettman? Especially if you're a small market owner. He broke the union last time and promised a system that could give you cost certainty and provide stable profits. However instead it's created a system where the top 5-8 teams in the league enjoy all the spoils of the NHL's massive revenue explosion. If I were a bottom half owner I'd be annoyed, assuming the bottom half of the league legimately struggles to break even. The NHLPA has access to their revenue numbers and seems to believe they do from their revenue sharing propositions.

I don't know it's just speculation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Doesn't that strengthen the case for wanting to fire Bettman? Especially if you're a small market owner. He broke the union last time and promised a system that could give you cost certainty and provide stable profits. However instead it's created a system where the top 5-8 teams in the league enjoy all the spoils of the NHL's massive revenue explosion. If I were a bottom half owner I'd be annoyed, assuming the bottom half of the league legimately struggles to break even. The NHLPA has access to their revenue numbers and seems to believe they do from their revenue sharing propositions.

I don't know it's just speculation.

If you're a small market owner, this is your first lockout. Here's the teams that have changed owners since the last lockout:

Nashville

Tampa Bay

Florida

Phoenix (lol)

St. Louis

Dallas

Anaheim

Atlanta (which became a mid-market in Winnipeg)

So the small market teams that haven't changed hands are Carolina, Long Island, Columbus, and arguably Colorado. Karmanos was heavily involved during the last lockout, for some reason he's taken a back seat here. His team made a splash this off-season, I imagine he wants to get the season underway as soon as possible. Long Island's getting a bone thrown to it - revenue sharing is going to be open to all teams now. I don't think Colorado or Columbus's owners are particularly active.

I understand you are speculating, but I don't see any reason why the owners would be unhappy with Bettman. They went behind his back in 95 and paid the price for it. They followed him in 2005 and most of them have seen enormous gains in profit. They just want more than that.

Edited by Triumph

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Meh, if they cancel this season, you can put me in the "good riddance NHL" group. I'll find other hockey to watch.

Because if they lose this season, it's proven they really haven't learned anything from the last lockout, and that they'll probably lock out again when this current CBA expires. I don't need this added frustration, anger, angst, and disappointment in my life every 5 years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Owners want a seven-year deal, which the union says is too long because less than half the current players will be active by the last season.

Why does the NHLPA really stick with this 5 year deal thing? Can't they see they lose more each time and a longer contract would be BENEFICIAL to them? Jeez.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why does the NHLPA really stick with this 5 year deal thing? Can't they see they lose more each time and a longer contract would be BENEFICIAL to them? Jeez.

Exactly and like others have said it will probably take the NHL about 2 years to recover from this lockout so that leaves only about 3 years of growth.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why does the NHLPA really stick with this 5 year deal thing? Can't they see they lose more each time and a longer contract would be BENEFICIAL to them? Jeez.

The union is probably betting on the notion that Bettman will still be commissioner in 5 years and that there'll be a ton of pressure on the league to not lock the players out. Alternately they are pressing on this point because they are willing to trade it for something else.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The union is probably betting on the notion that Bettman will still be commissioner in 5 years and that there'll be a ton of pressure on the league to not lock the players out. Alternately they are pressing on this point because they are willing to trade it for something else.

Actually, five years from now would be the 100th anniversary season of the NHL, that's probably the real reason they've been pushing five years...betting the league won't want to push a lockout THAT year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Meh, if they cancel this season, you can put me in the "good riddance NHL" group. I'll find other hockey to watch.

Because if they lose this season, it's proven they really haven't learned anything from the last lockout, and that they'll probably lock out again when this current CBA expires. I don't need this added frustration, anger, angst, and disappointment in my life every 5 years.

. If they lose this season, they'll learn their lesson the hard way because people will go away for good- even some hardcore fans. Then we'll see if they think twice about doing this again in 7 years. If hockey fans display the same type of discontent baseball fans did after the strike, it should hopefully be enough to wake these fvcktards up that you can't cancel 2 seasons in 8 years and get away with it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

. If they lose this season, they'll learn their lesson the hard way because people will go away for good- even some hardcore fans. Then we'll see if they think twice about doing this again in 7 years. If hockey fans display the same type of discontent baseball fans did after the strike, it should hopefully be enough to wake these fvcktards up that you can't cancel 2 seasons in 8 years and get away with it.

100% agreed I dropped baseball after 1994!! Have never gone back

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites