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Zidlicky close to re-signing?

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I share the same sentiments as the rest of the board, I too hope he re=signs, but at the same time, I hope bringing back Zids doesn't box out bringing back one of Elias/Zubrus/Clarkson

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Anything over 1 year and 3m is a mistake and I expect Lou to make a bunch of them yet again this offseason.

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I suppose I'm in the minority...

I'm just not convinced that Zidlicky's offense contributes enough to outweigh his defense. If this team is going to be suiting up the likes of Salvador and Volchenkov, they can't just throw Zidlicky out their on the blue line and pretend everything is fine. Especially when this comes at the expense of solid two way defensemen like Tallinder, Larsson, and Fayne - whom I think all of them are capable of moving the puck just as well towards the attack zone as Zidlicky and better overall.

Sure Zidlicky can score better than any of the Devils D but I'd rather see Lou address the scoring issue by getting better forwards and using solid D men than standing pat with the forwards he has (or bringing in more 3rd liners for top 6 roles) and sacrificing defense for offense on the blue line with Zidlicky.

I feel that bringing Zidlicky back just waste money that should go towards forward help and continues with the logjam and taking away of minutes of D that can actually play defense. If Lou does bring Zidlicky back - there better be a trade or two moving some defenders out.

 

Volchenkov is gonna miss at least 10 games and probably be a healthy scratch for another 10, so there I'm not concerned.  Salvador is a concern - naturally the Devils played way better without him, but that's a given.  It's indescribable what a boat anchor he is.  But it's basically all in the WOWY - Zidlicky and Salvador were 52% together, Zidlicky was 61% apart from him, Salvador was 47% away from Zidlicky.  While Zidlicky got plenty of starts in the offensive zone, I don't think that's entirely why the stats look this way.

 

I don't think NJ needs massive improvement to their forward depth.  They need another elite level forward - something which simply isn't coming this offseason.  The only real PP QBs coming available are Streit and Gonchar - two guys who are also ancient.  (I suppose Ian White's an option, but I have no clue how he is a healthy scratch right now given Detroit's not-so-great D).  Gelinas can work a power play but he's more of a Sheldon Souray type, Merrill I'm not sure about (4 goals in his college career would give me pause though), Harrold is okay but certainly less of an option.

 

That said, if Zidlicky were re-signed (and again, this report seems to have absolutely no sources), a two year deal would have to be out of the question.  I do not trust DeBoer and Stevens enough to cut back on his minutes.

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Its damned if we do, damned if we don't.

 

It'll be easy to accept if he's re-signed, but if he doesn't get re-signed, I think the loss is greatly exaggerated depending on how the team looks opening night which no one can tell at this point considering all the possible things that could happen. Letting him walk is not a bad option.

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I hope we keep him around.. Unless we draft a stud d-man. Need to get rid of Sal and Volchenkov instead.. Trade them both for picks, maybe Tallinder too.

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I hope we keep him around.. Unless we draft a stud d-man. Need to get rid of Sal and Volchenkov instead.. Trade them both for picks, maybe Tallinder too.

 

any stud d-man we'd draft wouldn't be up here next year anyway or probably the year after that barring him having a great year so it makes no difference. Aside from top 5 picks, not that many guys stay up that long (though this year seemed to have more w/ Laughton and Matteau and others getting more looks for whatever reason). And Salvador is going nowhere unfortuntately

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Seems there's at least a handful of Dmen in the draft that could possibly contribute next season.. Though, I guess that's not something you could plan your season on.. :)

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watching the playoffs really show that you need threat from the blueline but while Zid is bringing some offence its not relying on a huge bomb either he's often going around the forward and taking good shots. You still don't feel the threat when were getting the puck at the blue line like you feel watching or playing against other team... when you play Boston with Chara, Boychuk, Montreal with Subban, LA with doughty, Ducks with Souray, Wild Sutter, Preds Weber, Blues with Pietrangelo, Ottawa with Karlsson, etc etc... you dont want to see the puck go to the point against those team. 

 

Would be awesome to get a fvcking canon on our blueline cause thats actually all we do feed our dmen to the point all game long but we don't have great shots from there in general. I dont consider Volch, Salvador, Fayne, Tallinder, Larsson Harrold and Greene to have really dangerous shots they'll score an occasional goal here and there having a shot screened or deflected or somehow getting space to go up and take a good shot, but really we're not scary from the back end and im sure if i'd look at our goals total from our D that we'd be last in the league or close

 

edit: hopefully Merril, Severson or Gelinas will be that guy

Edited by SterioDesign

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This is a classic example of you watching games and thinking things are one way but they're not.

 

Johnny Boychuk has a 2.8% career shooting percentage.  That's below Bryce Salvador.  It's even below Anton Volchenkov.  And of course it's way below Marek Zidlicky's.   Boy, hate to see him shooting the puck back there when one out of every 42 times it goes in the net - scary times.  Zdeno Chara's slapper also results in a lot of saves for goalies and not a lot of goals these days.

 

Ryan Suter averages .07 goals per game, Marek Zidlicky averages .11.

 

Gelinas is clearly that sort of player, so if he makes the NHL with the Devils you'll get your wish of seeing a guy put up a 3.5% shooting percentage with a bunch of shots, but in terms of team need I put this way down.  If it comes down to having a pylon like Souray who can shoot the puck but is slow and horrible in all other ways, I think I'll take a player like Zidlicky instead.

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This is a classic example of you watching games and thinking things are one way but they're not.

 

Johnny Boychuk has a 2.8% career shooting percentage.  That's below Bryce Salvador.  It's even below Anton Volchenkov.  And of course it's way below Marek Zidlicky's.   Boy, hate to see him shooting the puck back there when one out of every 42 times it goes in the net - scary times.  Zdeno Chara's slapper also results in a lot of saves for goalies and not a lot of goals these days.

 

Ryan Suter averages .07 goals per game, Marek Zidlicky averages .11.

 

Gelinas is clearly that sort of player, so if he makes the NHL with the Devils you'll get your wish of seeing a guy put up a 3.5% shooting percentage with a bunch of shots, but in terms of team need I put this way down.  If it comes down to having a pylon like Souray who can shoot the puck but is slow and horrible in all other ways, I think I'll take a player like Zidlicky instead.

 

ah Triumph shut up. you're the complete opposite which is not better you look at a team corsi's and shooting % numbers and right away assume they are not good if its not high enough. same thing with a player. Im sure you dont even watch games.

 

and if you dont agree with what im saying just shut up and ignore what im saying don't slap your godamn stats at me you know i dont give a sh!t.

 

look at Ovechkin's shooting numbers for the playoffs and look at his results. its complete bullsh!t if he shot 500 times or if he shot 6 times at the end of the day its the results

Edited by SterioDesign

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Jesus, then just ignore him yourself, you are far far worse SD.

 

im doing it lately actually. In that case he called me out on something i called him out on something. Thats it.

Edited by SterioDesign

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This is a classic example of you watching games and thinking things are one way but they're not.

 

Johnny Boychuk has a 2.8% career shooting percentage.  That's below Bryce Salvador.  It's even below Anton Volchenkov.  And of course it's way below Marek Zidlicky's.   Boy, hate to see him shooting the puck back there when one out of every 42 times it goes in the net - scary times.  Zdeno Chara's slapper also results in a lot of saves for goalies and not a lot of goals these days.

 

Ryan Suter averages .07 goals per game, Marek Zidlicky averages .11.

 

Gelinas is clearly that sort of player, so if he makes the NHL with the Devils you'll get your wish of seeing a guy put up a 3.5% shooting percentage with a bunch of shots, but in terms of team need I put this way down.  If it comes down to having a pylon like Souray who can shoot the puck but is slow and horrible in all other ways, I think I'll take a player like Zidlicky instead.

 

To be fair to Sterio, you are compartamentalzing things a bit.  You're looking at goals and shooting percentage, which don't tell the whole story so far as defenseman's offensive production.  (Although I guess I shouldn't blame you since Sterio was talking about defensemen with "cannons").  While I can't give you a game by game analysis, Chara or any other defenseman's ability to shoot will utlmately result in goals, whether it's by virtue of putting it in off a rebound, or having a defender having to account for someone who can shoot the puck resulting in opportunities for other players.  Chara's high point total and plus/minus would be an indication of this.   Whatever metric you want to use though, there can be no doubt that Chara is a big help to an offense, whether on the powerplay, even strength or both.

 

And of course Sterio is not saying that he'll take a defenseman with a good shot that can't play defense at all.  (You seemed to jump all over him for mentioning Souray, but it didn't really have much to do with anything).  If anything, you could fault him for just stating the obvious . . . wouldn't it be great if we had a defenseman like Chara, Karlsson, Pietragelo and Doughty. 

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threads like this are a big reason I spend more time reading devils stuff on twitter than on this forum these days...

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To be fair to Sterio, you are compartamentalzing things a bit.  You're looking at goals and shooting percentage, which don't tell the whole story so far as defenseman's offensive production.  (Although I guess I shouldn't blame you since Sterio was talking about defensemen with "cannons").  While I can't give you a game by game analysis, Chara or any other defenseman's ability to shoot will utlmately result in goals, whether it's by virtue of putting it in off a rebound, or having a defender having to account for someone who can shoot the puck resulting in opportunities for other players.  Chara's high point total and plus/minus would be an indication of this.   Whatever metric you want to use though, there can be no doubt that Chara is a big help to an offense, whether on the powerplay, even strength or both.

 

And of course Sterio is not saying that he'll take a defenseman with a good shot that can't play defense at all.  (You seemed to jump all over him for mentioning Souray, but it didn't really have much to do with anything).  If anything, you could fault him for just stating the obvious . . . wouldn't it be great if we had a defenseman like Chara, Karlsson, Pietragelo and Doughty. 

 

Thank you so much Daniel for simply understanding what i said, you got it. So damn refreshing. All i said is that we dont have "canons" thats it, thats all. and for pointing out the general meaning of my post. almost every damn time i post something with a few examples just to put a context (obviously theres rarely perfect matches when youre comparing stuff) guys like him will jump on those examples to throw off my point with stats and sh!t and ignoring the whole meaning. i really didnt need to get thrown stats at and nitpicking a few of the names i threw out names i put there for simple examples. 

 

edit: and by canon i meant hard shots from guys who can get the puck through to the net. which like you said can create rebounds or offence one way or the other and exactly shooting percentage doesnt tell you the whole story at all.

Edited by SterioDesign

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To be fair to Sterio, you are compartamentalzing things a bit.  You're looking at goals and shooting percentage, which don't tell the whole story so far as defenseman's offensive production.  (Although I guess I shouldn't blame you since Sterio was talking about defensemen with "cannons").  While I can't give you a game by game analysis, Chara or any other defenseman's ability to shoot will utlmately result in goals, whether it's by virtue of putting it in off a rebound, or having a defender having to account for someone who can shoot the puck resulting in opportunities for other players.  Chara's high point total and plus/minus would be an indication of this.   Whatever metric you want to use though, there can be no doubt that Chara is a big help to an offense, whether on the powerplay, even strength or both.

 

And of course Sterio is not saying that he'll take a defenseman with a good shot that can't play defense at all.  (You seemed to jump all over him for mentioning Souray, but it didn't really have much to do with anything).  If anything, you could fault him for just stating the obvious . . . wouldn't it be great if we had a defenseman like Chara, Karlsson, Pietragelo and Doughty. 

 

Which is an empty statement.  You're both right, I was unfair, but we're talking about the context of bringing back Marek Zidlicky, which having a Norris-level defenseman who's great in all 3 zones has very little to do with.  Now if you're going to compare Zidlicky to the type of guys who are available - your Boychuk and Souray types - now you've got a stew going.  That's an actual question and there are merits to each type of player.  But Sterio has slammed the Devils for having guys who just shoot the puck at the net without thinking, now he wants Johnny Boychuk, the poster child for that?  It's just an odd line of thinking. 

 

I don't think Chara helps a power play by the way.  Being a great defenseman and being on a very good team with great goaltending is why he has such a high plus-minus - I'm not convinced Chara is an offensive dynamo (he might've been, I don't think he is now, despite his very high shot rate - Boston's PP has been rotten for a while now, I think Chara's long reach is actually a detriment on a PP but I don't have numerical evidence for that - just watching the games is all)

Edited by Triumph

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Chara's shot is really overrated, who cares how hard your shot is when you have absolutely no accuracy.

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Chara's shot is really overrated, who cares how hard your shot is when you have absolutely no accuracy.

 

Bri-an Rol-ston CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP CLAP

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apparently lou does since he got rolston to sign for 6 years with a cannon with no accuracy but epic precision. 

 

lol that was too good, every fan jumped on rolston at once.

Edited by ZeroGravityFat

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Which is an empty statement.  You're both right, I was unfair, but we're talking about the context of bringing back Marek Zidlicky, which having a Norris-level defenseman who's great in all 3 zones has very little to do with.  Now if you're going to compare Zidlicky to the type of guys who are available - your Boychuk and Souray types - now you've got a stew going.  That's an actual question and there are merits to each type of player.  But Sterio has slammed the Devils for having guys who just shoot the puck at the net without thinking, now he wants Johnny Boychuk, the poster child for that?  It's just an odd line of thinking. 

 

I don't think Chara helps a power play by the way.  Being a great defenseman and being on a very good team with great goaltending is why he has such a high plus-minus - I'm not convinced Chara is an offensive dynamo (he might've been, I don't think he is now, despite his very high shot rate - Boston's PP has been rotten for a while now, I think Chara's long reach is actually a detriment on a PP but I don't have numerical evidence for that - just watching the games is all)

So where did i say that i wanted boychuk on the devils again? I said i didnt feel we had guys other than zid mayyybe who had a really good and dangerous shot from the blueline that other team had to respect and take in consideration (not that you let any dman with average shot taking slapper all game long)but some guys you have to make sure they dont get too comfy with space with the puck at the blue line.)

And then i named a few guys here and there from other team who had good shooters with canons that you have to be aware when you are on the ice. Its a fact, no coaches are screaming at their players that salvadore is wide open alone on one side thats for sure.

So not as if we dont clash enough already and that the whole board is sick of it, why in hell did you have to pick one of my example and put all the focus on it with stats, then miss my whole point and call me out on it ? I dont mind that you call me out on stuff but for love of god try to understand what im saying first, you miss my context in 90% of each cases

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I mean, your example of Johnny Boychuk is just bad - if the Devils had Johnny Boychuk, or a guy like him, you would complain all the time that he shoots like an idiot and no one respects his shot and it doesn't do anything.  I agree that it would be nice if the Devils had some better shooters, and Gelinas is certainly a guy unafraid to shoot the puck, but when you give examples that are that far off from reality, I have to take issue with what you're seeing.  

 

Appreciate your apology for your lashing out post before, and I'm sorry too.

Edited by Triumph

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can we have like a weekly podcast where Triumph and Sterio debate advanced stats? It ends every week when one tries to murder the other/gets arrested 

Edited by DH26

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can we have like a weekly podcast where Triumph and Sterio debate advanced stats? It ends every week when one tries to murder the other/gets arrested 

 

This podcast must happen....

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can we have like a weekly podcast where Triumph and Sterio debate advanced stats? It ends every week when one tries to murder the other/gets arrested 

Haha dont think the world as we know it is ready for that

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