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SMantzas

Summer 2013 UFA/RFA Thread

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its not about him not being important, its about if HE was the 4th best option. Thats pretty bad news, cause now your 4th best option was the 5th one last year (considering that after Kovalchuk it was sh!t) its pretty bad. 

 

But again, lets keep on saying losing our top players at various aspect of the game is no big deal and that the other guys will step up, was great last season

You've again forgot that he will be replaced by someone and I can totally think of 4 people I'd put in the SO on this team before Clarky.

Kocy

Elias

Loktionov

Zajac

Henrique

All those guys I think would have better luck in the shootout than Clarky. How many SO went past 5 rounds for us last year? I doubt it was many, if any at all.

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You've again forgot that he will be replaced by someone and I can totally think of 4 people I'd put in the SO on this team before Clarky.

Kocy

Elias

Loktionov

Zajac

Henrique

All those guys I think would have better luck in the shootout than Clarky. How many SO went past 5 rounds for us last year? I doubt it was many, if any at all.

 

thats just one point. And again i dont like the guy but am i seriously the only one seeing a problem in losing so much production back to back? we finished 2nd last in the league in goals. We may have some kind of trade coming or wtv but like i said i dont think im wrong saying we absolutely need to ADD to what we had in production, not lose a good chunk and replace him with 2-3 pick up off waivers or a guy like Langenbrunner or another washed out ex devils to fill

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thats just one point. And again i dont like the guy but am i seriously the only one seeing a problem in losing so much production back to back? we finished 2nd last in the league in goals. We may have some kind of trade coming or wtv but like i said i dont think im wrong saying we absolutely need to ADD to what we had in production, not lose a good chunk and replace him with 2-3 pick up off waivers or a guy like Langenbrunner or another washed out ex devils to fill

Who cares where our acquisitions came from? Who did we claim off waivers this year anyways besides Butler? Last year we claimed Carter, which was great, so I don't see your issue with the waiver wire.

Also, you constantly pick out the bad while simultaneously ignoring the good. Holik and Arnott didn't work, but Sykora did for a year. We made a pretty good trade to get Kovy, but of course, this team will never make another trade for a star player according to you, nor will we ever sign any FA, just like that year we didn't sign Volchenkov and Tallinder.

You constantly say we didn't replace Parise and Sykora, we did in different ways than acquiring another single player to replace that production. We acquired quite a few players this past season: Lotionov, Sullivan, Butler, D'Agostini. That's 4 players, I didn't count Poni because he was on the team last year too. They had more points(23) than Sykora was gonna get if we had retained him. So yes, we lost much of Parise's production, though some was recouped through players having better years, but we didn't miss Sykora.

What did you expect the team to do? Find a way to fill that hole instantly? It's not easy to replace Parise's production, but to say we replaced none of the goals Sykora or Parise would have scored this year is ridiculous.

You are cherry picking stats and events and it's painfully clear to everyone.

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Who cares where our acquisitions came from? Who did we claim off waivers this year anyways besides Butler? Last year we claimed Carter, which was great, so I don't see your issue with the waiver wire.

Also, you constantly pick out the bad while simultaneously ignoring the good. Holik and Arnott didn't work, but Sykora did for a year. We made a pretty good trade to get Kovy, but of course, this team will never make another trade for a star player according to you, nor will we ever sign any FA, just like that year we didn't sign Volchenkov and Tallinder.

You constantly say we didn't replace Parise and Sykora, we did in different ways than acquiring another single player to replace that production. We acquired quite a few players this past season: Lotionov, Sullivan, Butler, D'Agostini. That's 4 players, I didn't count Poni because he was on the team last year too. They had more points(23) than Sykora was gonna get if we had retained him. So yes, we lost much of Parise's production, though some was recouped through players having better years, but we didn't miss Sykora.

What did you expect the team to do? Find a way to fill that hole instantly? It's not easy to replace Parise's production, but to say we replaced none of the goals Sykora or Parise would have scored this year is ridiculous.

You are cherry picking stats and events and it's painfully clear to everyone.

 

 

This. In addition to the players mentioned by ATLL765, the Devils also expected more production out of Tedenby and Josefson, and they drafted Matteau who will also add offense down the line.  It's very easy to complain when risks or estimations don't pay off, but to say 'nothing was done' is ridiculous.

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thats just one point. And again i dont like the guy but am i seriously the only one seeing a problem in losing so much production back to back? we finished 2nd last in the league in goals. We may have some kind of trade coming or wtv but like i said i dont think im wrong saying we absolutely need to ADD to what we had in production, not lose a good chunk and replace him with 2-3 pick up off waivers or a guy like Langenbrunner or another washed out ex devils to fill

 

This is what's at issue - you are panicking before anything has happened.  If the Devils lose Clarkson and replace him with nothing outside the organization, yeah, that's trouble.  If they go the low-cost route and patch up some other areas, then it won't be so bad.

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This. In addition to the players mentioned by ATLL765, the Devils also expected more production out of Tedenby and Josefson, and they drafted Matteau who will also add offense down the line.  It's very easy to complain when risks or estimations don't pay off, but to say 'nothing was done' is ridiculous.

 

my point was the production was replaced in a cheap and high risk way last season. Of course its not easy to replace Zach's production within a season. It clearly didnt work as we finished 2nd last in scoring. And my worry is that Lou goes down the same path this season on top that we have even more production to replace if Clarkson leave. 

 

Lokti should produce more, Henrique should too lets hope so, we get almost no production from our Dmen on top of that. So what im saying is that we REALLY need a boost in production from last season but a few of our own guys producing a little more than last year won't be enough either.

This is what's at issue - you are panicking before anything has happened.  If the Devils lose Clarkson and replace him with nothing outside the organization, yeah, that's trouble.  If they go the low-cost route and patch up some other areas, then it won't be so bad.

 

well not that im panicking but im in the same state of mind that i was last summer and guess what, i was right. So i kinda hope im not again this year cause giving up a top 10 pick next year will be fvcking painful

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my point was the production was replaced in a cheap and high risk way last season. Of course its not easy to replace Zach's production within a season. It clearly didnt work as we finished 2nd last in scoring. And my worry is that Lou goes down the same path this season on top that we have even more production to replace if Clarkson leave. 

 

Lokti should produce more, Henrique should too lets hope so, we get almost no production from our Dmen on top of that. So what im saying is that we REALLY need a boost in production from last season but a few of our own guys producing a little more than last year won't be enough either.

 

well not that im panicking but im in the same state of mind that i was last summer and guess what, i was right. So i kinda hope im not again this year cause giving up a top 10 pick next year will be fvcking painful

It was high risk because it didn't pan out. Bobby Butler alone should have easily replaced Sykora's numbers when you look at his previous NHL and AHL seasons. As for Parise, you said yourself that you can't just replace the in one season. If you understand that, then why the panic? If it was that easy to just "replace" 50 goals, wouldn't every team in the league just do it?

 

 

Also, yes, you are panicking. Free agency is in 10 days and your mourning the loss of a draft pick in 2014.

Edited by Devil Dan 56

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Last summer was sort of an outlier in terms of the summer period. No one knew what the cap would look like and I don't blame Lou one bit for sitting still

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It was high risk because it didn't pan out. Bobby Butler alone should have easily replaced Sykora's numbers when you look at his previous NHL and AHL seasons. As for Parise, you said yourself that you can't just replace the in one season. If you understand that, then why the panic? If it was that easy to just "replace" 50 goals, wouldn't every team in the league just do it?

 

 

Also, yes, you are panicking. Free agency is in 10 days and your mourning the loss of a draft pick in 2014.

 

It's true that it's early of course a lot could happen at the draft but our team structure and set up for this season and for the future is nothing to be happy about. Plus the financial trouble on top of that. And we simply don't have the prospect depth / NHL depth to make a drastic change either. and our stars are all aging and there's no one in our system that i can see really replacing them and again we don't have the depth to make great trades either.

 

As a fan you see this coming and you wonder how its gonna be solved.

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It's true that it's early of course a lot could happen at the draft but our team structure and set up for this season and for the future is nothing to be happy about. Plus the financial trouble on top of that. And we simply don't have the prospect depth / NHL depth to make a drastic change either. and our stars are all aging and there's no one in our system that i can see really replacing them and again we don't have the depth to make great trades either.

 

As a fan you see this coming and you wonder how its gonna be solved.

Kovy is not old, Henrique is not old, Larsson is not old. Fayne also not old. Who is old besides the tenders, Elias, Zubes, Volch, Sal and Tally?

And we totally have the prospects to replace the aging D, just waiting for their contracts to end.

Cherry picking again.

 

 

my point was the production was replaced in a cheap and high risk way last season. Of course its not easy to replace Zach's production within a season. It clearly didnt work as we finished 2nd last in scoring. And my worry is that Lou goes down the same path this season on top that we have even more production to replace if Clarkson leave. 

 

Lokti should produce more, Henrique should too lets hope so, we get almost no production from our Dmen on top of that. So what im saying is that we REALLY need a boost in production from last season but a few of our own guys producing a little more than last year won't be enough either.

 

well not that im panicking but im in the same state of mind that i was last summer and guess what, i was right. So i kinda hope im not again this year cause giving up a top 10 pick next year will be fvcking painful

How is trading late rd draft picks high risk? Someone else already mentioned that the off-season was filled with uncertainty and many teams sat on their hands because of it.

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my point was the production was replaced in a cheap and high risk way last season. 

 

How was that 'high risk'? More risky than either a) sending a pick, a roster player and a prospect for a top 6 player or b) signing a player to a relatively huge deal to get him to NJ? Lou made minor trades and got guys for very, very little. Yeah it didn't pan out, but hey that's the modern NHL. Sometimes it doesn't pan out, sometimes you go to the Cup final.

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It's true that it's early of course a lot could happen at the draft but our team structure and set up for this season and for the future is nothing to be happy about. Plus the financial trouble on top of that. And we simply don't have the prospect depth / NHL depth to make a drastic change either. and our stars are all aging and there's no one in our system that i can see really replacing them and again we don't have the depth to make great trades either.

 

As a fan you see this coming and you wonder how its gonna be solved.

 

"I'm not panicking, but here's a lot of panicky talk".  No one else is thinking this way - do you think you're the one person gifted with the second sight, or that maybe you think way too negatively about the team?

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That's a good contract for Nik Backstrom - risk is the years, but the cap hit is palatable for sure.

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wtv i guess there's no use of posting about any of this anymore. If our future and next season seems so bright in reality, cant wait.

 

edit: i seriously won't talk about any of this until we see results but expect some serious "i told you so" if things turn the way i expected.

Edited by SterioDesign

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wtv i guess there's no use of posting about any of this anymore. If our future and next season seems so bright in reality, cant wait.

 

edit: i seriously won't talk about any of this until we see results but expect some serious "i told you so" if things turn the way i expected.

 

You don't seem to understand that things don't have to be black or white.  Did I say the Devils future is super bright?  No, I did not.  There have been a lot darker periods for the Devils in the recent past.  We'll see how free agency turns out - if both Elias and Clarkson are gone with no external replacements, I'll be down on next season as well.  But to just panic about everything is ridiculous.  The Devils have young players in their system who look like NHLers - there's periods in the recent past where that really wasn't the case.

 

Wow, really, we'll see some 'I told you so?'  I'm surprised.  We only saw it what, twice in our discussions today?  

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wtv i guess there's no use of posting about any of this anymore. If our future and next season seems so bright in reality, cant wait.

 

edit: i seriously won't talk about any of this until we see results but expect some serious "i told you so" if things turn the way i expected.

 

It's easy to predict the worst and wallow in it. No one here said next season would be awesome and we can't wait for the cup parade.

 

As long as you're ok with the 'I told you so' when Clarkson doesn't live up to his contract if he leaves.

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It's easy to predict the worst and wallow in it. No one here said next season would be awesome and we can't wait for the cup parade.

 

As long as you're ok with the 'I told you so' when Clarkson doesn't live up to his contract if he leaves.

 

He won't, thats for sure we all know that.

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That's a good contract for Nik Backstrom - risk is the years, but the cap hit is palatable for sure.

 

better than giving up a young player/anything for MA Fleury or giving away actual assets for the unknown of Bernier

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kind of sad when you know the brodeur that was absolutely amazing.. then the brodeur that was just average.. to the marty that is now who is pretty much past his prime.. i don't want to see him go out as a last memory of being all washed up.. i feel maybe he should have left last season gracefully ... fans have already started turning on him which is truly fvcked up and a shame.. and new fans will only know him of how his play is now.. I'm 23.. I've been watching him since i was 5 years old and he's been my hero since.. i love the guy and will truly feel sadness when he officially hangs it up... but i don't want to see the team suffer or his reputation after all he has done because he is having a hard time walking away

 

The thing is, Brodeur never really declined into consistently average, if you think about it.  Brodeur's worst "prime" season in my opinion was 2000-01...it's the only season I can remember not feeling as confident in net as usual in the Brodeur Era.  The offense really covered up for him a lot that season...his 2001 SCF was a mess.  He had the four-year stretch of .906, .910, .906, and .906 save%, (2000-01 was the third of this four-year stretch), but '01 was the only season where I remember being critical of Marty's play during his prime, and the .897 save% (.870 in the Finals) he put up during the '01 playoffs was reflective of his play...he simply was not very good in those playoffs.    

 

Outside of that...from '93-'10, the guy rarely had a prolonged down period, let alone a down season...I'm hard-pressed to think of one, and he was remarkably healthy throughout.  The last three seasons for Marty haven't been consistently average as they've been consistently inconsistent, but the low end is the look of an aging guy who has lost his skills.  It's reason to be concerned. 

 

Sterio, I think the problem with you trying to play GM is that you do it from a place of fear...constantly afraid of the worst...eeeeeeeeeeeek OMG what are we going to do if this guy leaves and that guy leaves?  I think what you have to accept, painful as it may be, is that after a very long period of relevance, the Devils aren't as well-equipped to keep staying in the hunt on the fly.  You may have to endure a couple of years of true rebuilding.  Elias is not getting any younger, and if Clarkson is due to get silly money from some GM who can't control himself, so be it.  I'm not saying that I just let those walk without at least talking to them, but let's face it, the team wasn't all that great last season WITH those guys (I know Kovy being hurt didn't help, nor did the weak goaltending).  You can get to a place where you're re-signing guys to maintain a status quo that may not be so great to begin with.  Even if you re-sign Elias and Clarkson, then what?  Bringing them back for what could be significant dollars isn't going to answer the goalie question...after this season (which will probably not be great in goal to begin with), we have NO idea who's going to be net beyond. 

 

You can only delay the inevitable downturn for so long.  The Eliases, the Brodeurs...the faces of success we've grown accustomed to for so long...they're going to change, and very soon.  I don't accept that the Devils HAVE to keep Elias and HAVE to keep Clarkson, especially if someone out there wants to sign a guy like Clarkson to something overly long-term.  I don't necessarily want to watch a possibly declining Elias in 2014-15, or a consistently overpaid Clarkson, just because we're so afraid of the unknown.  The unknown doesn't have to be a negative by default (though it might be rough at first).           

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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So..to take this in a different direction, since I think the Clarkson/UFA leaving debate has been sufficiently beaten to death..

 

If the Penguins were to buy out MAF (which I think is doubtful), would you want him given a shot on the Devils?  Would a change of scenery help improve his game?

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So..to take this in a different direction, since I think the Clarkson/UFA leaving debate has been sufficiently beaten to death..

 

If the Penguins were to buy out MAF (which I think is doubtful), would you want him given a shot on the Devils?  Would a change of scenery help improve his game?

I would, it would be an upgrade over Moose because it will be very hard to be worse than him last season. Put a good defense in front of MAF and he will be good, nothing great though.

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So..to take this in a different direction, since I think the Clarkson/UFA leaving debate has been sufficiently beaten to death..

 

If the Penguins were to buy out MAF (which I think is doubtful), would you want him given a shot on the Devils?  Would a change of scenery help improve his game?

 

Sure, Fluery isn't a bad goalie, he's just very inconsistent and has played some of his worst hockey at the most important times the last 2 years.  We've also seen him play some strong hockey in important situations, so I think we can chalk it up to his natural consistency issues rather than any choking scenario.

 

I'd rather the Devils look at someone who is more consistently average than sometimes great/sometimes awful and ending up average but if you believe the Devils won't be that good for the next few years then having a goalie who can play amazingly for weeks at a time then Fleury can be that guy if you get lucky on your timing.

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I don't think they'll buy him out, but yeah, I'd take him.  Then again there's just about no goalie I would say no to at this point.

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