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Summer 2013 UFA/RFA Thread

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We have some lousy deals, but nothing THAT lousy, thankfully. I want to resign Zidlicky, but if we gave him anything like what Streit got I'd pretty much break sh!t.

 

With Streit (1 year younger) getting that and Gonchar (2 older) getting $5M per, you've gotta figure Zid is gonna be aiming for around 5. I do not want to see that invested in him.

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We have some lousy deals, but nothing THAT lousy, thankfully. I want to resign Zidlicky, but if we gave him anything like what Streit got I'd pretty much break sh!t.

 

With Streit (1 year younger) getting that and Gonchar (2 older) getting $5M per, you've gotta figure Zid is gonna be aiming for around 5. I do not want to see that invested in him.

I'd consider 2 for 8, but that's about it. That's even pushing it.

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must feels good for Pens and Sharks fan to see some of their top players re-sign over a year before it's due. Malkin and couture

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must feels good for Pens and Sharks fan to see some of their top players re-sign over a year before it's due. Malkin and couture

 

Zajac signed a year before his was up.

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must feels good for Pens and Sharks fan to see some of their top players re-sign over a year before it's due. Malkin and couture

 

Felt good when Jordan Staal signed early with Pittsburgh too, I imagine

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Zajac signed a year before his was up.

 

you're off by 6 months... not that bad

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yea instead we never hear about anything going on with our players.. if anything is even going on with our players.... on top of which half of them always end up walking away from us anyway

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Felt good when Jordan Staal signed early with Pittsburgh too, I imagine

 

yes it must have indeed, cause Shero was able to trade him and get something really decent instead of seeing Staal just walk away on free agency to join his brother. Pens has not being hurt at all i dont even know what youre trying to say there

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yes it must have indeed, cause Shero was able to trade him and get something really decent instead of seeing Staal just walk away on free agency to join his brother. Pens has not being hurt at all i dont even know what youre trying to say there

 

Yeah, Pens weren't hurt at all, that's why their third line got absolutely hammered in the playoffs (and the regular season too, but some good luck with the percentages kept people from noticing).  Now the Penguins actually have to develop some bottom six depth instead of having Jordan Staal make all their wingers look good.  Asset-wise, they did just fine, but they definitely took a step back this year.

Edited by Triumph

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yea instead we never hear about anything going on with our players.. if anything is even going on with our players.... on top of which half of them always end up walking away from us anyway

That's bullsh!t. Name the 50% of UFAs we lost.

We don't hear anything because Lou isn't an a$$hole and doesn't let info leak, not because nothing is happening.

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Yeah, Pens weren't hurt at all, that's why their third line got absolutely hammered in the playoffs (and the regular season too, but some good luck with the percentages kept people from noticing).  Now the Penguins actually have to develop some bottom six depth instead of having Jordan Staal make all their wingers look good.  Asset-wise, they did just fine, but they definitely took a step back this year.

 

alright come on Tri, are you seriously trying to tell me they should have just let Staal walk and that it wouldnt have made a difference? They got SOMETHING for Staal and it really helped them, get real. look at us trying to develop top 6 players out of top 12/AHL caliber players after we didnt replace we one who left... thats better right?

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must feels good for Pens and Sharks fan to see some of their top players re-sign over a year before it's due. Malkin and couture

 

God, you really can't let Parise go, can you? 

 

This is also a different CBA.  Under this one I think there probably would've been a better chance of Parise staying. 

 

And way to ignore the fact that Lou just did that very thing with Travis Zajac.   

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Pavel Datsyuk has signed a three-year contract extension with the Detroit Red Wings.

 

http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=425768

So much for the draw of the KHL, lol.

 

alright come on Tri, are you seriously trying to tell me they should have just let Staal walk and that it wouldnt have made a difference? They got SOMETHING for Staal and it really helped them, get real. look at us trying to develop top 6 players out of top 12/AHL caliber players after we didnt replace we one who left... thats better right?

And SD. Seemingly every day you go farther and farther down the line on the crazy train about Lou and how he's not doing this, that, the other. I want you to go look at other GMs and find me SEVERAL that are better than Lou. If you can't do that, you just proved yourself wrong.

Everyone is sick of hearing about how Lou is terrible while you give absolutely no logical reasoning behind it besides "Ray Shero did this and that, but Lou didn't". Well, Lou is not GM of the Penguins, we don't have their assets, we're a different team. I would LOVE to hear what trades, signing, etc you would have made that Lou did not, which of course would have led to glory for the team. It's getting ridiculous. Like LD territory.

1. Iginla is old and Shero overpaid.

2. Morrow is old and Shero overpaid

3. Murray is slow as molasses, like Volch slow

You could argue that Lou made far better trades this year than Shero did.

Sometimes it's like you don't watch hockey, just read articles about it and therefore think everyone else's trades, prospects, signings are great.

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alright come on Tri, are you seriously trying to tell me they should have just let Staal walk and that it wouldnt have made a difference? They got SOMETHING for Staal and it really helped them, get real. look at us trying to develop top 6 players out of top 12/AHL caliber players after we didnt replace we one who left... thats better right?

 

I'm saying if they kept Staal they might be in the Finals right now, and that while yes, Pittsburgh has the luxury of being able to trade its 3rd best center for a high draft pick, solid prospect, and decent 3rd line center, they were definitely set back by that move.  They slammed Sutter with defensive zone starts and he didn't really do well with them.

 

It's a good move, but it hurt them this year, no question.  Staal for Sutter is not a good trade, and that's what the deal worked out to this year.  In 5 years?  Of course they'll be better off.

Edited by Triumph

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Datsyuk signed for 3 years and 23 mill. Cap hit is 7.66 per.

What do you think this means for Elias? Do we still think <$6M per is possible?

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I'm saying if they kept Staal they might be in the Finals right now, and that while yes, Pittsburgh has the luxury of being able to trade its 3rd best center for a high draft pick, solid prospect, and decent 3rd line center, they were definitely set back by that move.  They slammed Sutter with defensive zone starts and he didn't really do well with them.

 

It's a good move, but it hurt them this year, no question.  Staal for Sutter is not a good trade, and that's what the deal worked out to this year.  In 5 years?  Of course they'll be better off.

 

its not because of suter or the no-staal that Malkin and Crosby didnt produce and that Letang did no play his best hockey. ridiculous to think that Staal would have change anything to the playoffs against the Bruins. they got SWEPT.

 

and fair to say and assume 100% that if that situation would have been in NJ, Lou would have approached Jordan like a week or 2 before free agency after Jordan already made his mind to test the market at that point and to play sign in carolina instead of costing the team youre going to of a pick and players.

 

THAT'S my complain about Lou, he's not setting himself up for the best return, its either 1- the guy will sign in the last week 2- we lose him for nothing

 

years and years of "going for it" all the time and not talking with players early to exactly know whats up and not getting at least something for them even if its a late pick. Its always better than losing a player for nothing in the long run. Of course it sucks to maybe trade away players that you know you wont be able to retain before the playoffs but you got to think about the future. I get that the ultimate goal is the cup but the sharks made if farther than us even after trading away 2 of their players this year. 

 

and then of course fans here will all be "you can't trade away players before a cup run cause thats the ultimate goal, nothing else matter, you have to go for it!" but then they'll go and make fun of Pittburgh "hahaha pittsburgh got screwed giving away all those picks and prospects for NOTHING they didnt win the cup!" well thats just fvcking hypocrite.

 

you stack picks and prospects that way and youre in a position to make moves like Minny and Pittsburgh did at the trade deadline. How long is it gonna take for us to have tradable assets? we can't do sh&#33;t cause we dont have much worth tradable players and no assets either 

Edited by SterioDesign

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A bit under the radar but I wonder if Lou would have any interest in 22 year old, right handed, C Corban Knight. The Edmonton Journal reports that he will be a free agent after August 15 as he has confirmed he will not be signing with the Panthers who drafted him 5/135 in 2009. He's 6'2, 201 lbs, and just spent the last 4 years at North Dakota. He entered college as a true freshman at 18 and has been at least a point-per-game player since his sophomore year. He was a finalist for the Hobey Baker Award this past season.

NCAA: 161 GP 52-94-146 0.91 PPG 145 PIM +65

The Edmonton Journal link above has a lot of quotes from Knight and speaks about how a few NHL teams have looked to acquire his rights. Hockey Prospectus recently ranked him just outside their top 50 drafted prospects and here is their write up on him.

 

 

 

Traded to the Flames for a fourth round pick, per Mirtle:

 

Flames acquire Corban Knight from Florida for a fourth round pick in 2013 draft.

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here's the one thing that MAYBE you can pin on Lou and that would be that Elias and Zidlicky aren't signed before a market gets set and makes Lou spend more. that being said, agents have a pretty clear idea of what the market will bare and aren't usually that off (semin is the one guy that doesn't fit this mold).

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and then of course fans here will all be "you can't trade away players before a cup run cause thats the ultimate goal, nothing else matter, you have to go for it!" but then they'll go and make fun of Pittburgh "hahaha pittsburgh got screwed giving away all those picks and prospects for NOTHING they didnt win the cup!" well thats just fvcking hypocrite.

 

you stack picks and prospects that way and youre in a position to make moves like Minny and Pittsburgh did at the trade deadline. How long is it gonna take for us to have tradable assets? we can't do sh!t cause we dont have much worth tradable players and no assets either 

 

First off SD, I think you've been a fan long enough to know that an opposing team's failure(s) makes for some laughter/jabs on our end...like when an opposing team gives up valuable prospects for a rental that doesn't work out.  I'm sure some fans were chuckling at our expense after the Gilmour/Ellett deal (a "now" deal if there ever was one) that cost the Devils Jason Smith, Steve Sullivan, and Alyn McCauley didn't really pan out...but I certainly understood why the Devils did it at the time.  Pittsburgh rolled the dice on bringing in some "now" guys this season and it didn't work.  You see deadline deals like that made in MLB, the NBA, and the NHL a lot.  And when it doesn't work out for a rival, you laugh about it.  But more often than not you can understand why the move was made.       

 

And I think, as usual, you're looking at things too black-and-white.  Yeah, last year, I thought it would've been a bad move to trade Zach, just to get something, anything, back.  That team had a good mojo going, and I wouldn't have wanted to see it screwed up.  You can't ALWAYS be thinking "future, future, future", at the expense of the present.  Lou and the 2011-12 Devils were right to be living in the "now" moment, and if anything, a deep playoff run was a potentially good selling point to Zach.  They fell two games short of winning another Cup.  I'm glad they took the Devils took their best shot at it.   

 

What do you think, teams constantly trade veterans for prospects, then later on trade prospects for veterans?  Wrong.  That's NOT how you build a prospect base, though a good deadline deal can help.  You also need to draft them, and as we know, that's been a problem lately for the Devils.  Guys like Smith, Sullivan, McCauley, Denis Pederson, Brendan Morrison (the latter two went in the Mogilny deal)...they weren't traded to the Devils for some UFA-to-be, then moved for something else.  The Devils' system used to be pretty deep with homegrown guys, guys who could be used to bring in a veteran, or to replace guys who'd left.  Clearly it's not very deep now.  But I don't think the answer is to panic every time a guy like Zach is about to become an UFA, and scream "OMG, we need to trade him right now before he leaves for nothing, and not pay attention to anything that's happening in the present!"     

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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First off SD, I think you've been a fan long enough to know that an opposing team's failure(s) makes for some laughter/jabs on our end...like when an opposing team gives up valuable prospects for a rental that doesn't work out.  I'm sure some fans were chuckling at our expense after the Gilmour/Ellett deal (a "now" deal if there ever was one) that cost the Devils Jason Smith, Steve Sullivan, and Alyn McCauley didn't really pan out...but I certainly understood why the Devils did it at the time.  Pittsburgh rolled the dice on bringing in some "now" guys this season and it didn't work.  You see deadline deals like that made in MLB, the NBA, and the NHL a lot.  And when it doesn't work out for a rival, you laugh about it.  But more often than not you can understand why the move was made.       

 

And I think, as usual, you're looking at things too black-and-white.  Yeah, last year, I thought it would've been a bad move to trade Zach, just to get something, anything, back.  That team had a good mojo going, and I wouldn't have wanted to see it screwed up.  You can't ALWAYS be thinking "future, future, future", at the expense of the present.  Lou and the 2011-12 Devils were right to be living in the "now" moment, and if anything, a deep playoff run was a potentially good selling point to Zach.  They fell two games short of winning another Cup.  I'm glad they took the Devils took their best shot at it.   

 

What do you think, teams constantly trade veterans for prospects, then later on trade prospects for veterans?  Wrong.  That's NOT how you build a prospect base, though a good deadline deal can help.  You also need to draft them, and as we know, that's been a problem lately for the Devils.  Guys like Smith, Sullivan, McCauley, Denis Pederson, Brendan Morrison (the latter two went in the Mogilny deal)...they weren't traded to the Devils for some UFA-to-be, then moved for something else.  The Devils' system used to be pretty deep with homegrown guys, guys who could be used to bring in a veteran, or to replace guys who'd left.  Clearly it's not very deep now.  But I don't think the answer is to panic every time a guy like Zach is about to become an UFA, and scream "OMG, we need to trade him right now before he leaves for nothing, and not pay attention to anything that's happening in the present!"     

 

again you dont understand at all what im saying. sigh... i seriously cant fvcking believe how people dont get what im saying its like you guys do it on purpose sometimes. i DONT look at things black and white but when i still need to throw EXAMPLES to the table for my points and you guys usually jump and look at the specific of the EXAMPLES i brought. every single fvcking time thats what happen.

 

get me here please for the love of god... Lou has pretty much his one way of doing everything and he's gonna stick with it without adjusting to situations. Its gonna have to work his way or its not gonna work at all. Thats not a good way to make business. he's still stuck in the past thinking there's still such thing has loyalty and the team is not as attractive as it was before. And of course BEFORE Lou had that going for him and it certainly helped his "stats" as a GM. But we don't have that anymore, how many top players would have NJ on their short list of teams they'd like to be in? how many wingers dream of being centered by Zajac? How many dmen would like to have 2 dinosaurs behind them to cover for their mistakes and sign a long term deal when they have no clue who the fvck will even be in nets in 2 years? Then how many youngsters or guys would want to play for a guy like Lou and an average team? think about it really... would you want Lou to be your boss? hard nose and stuborn oldschool guy that you have to stay in line and clean shave and you cannot have twitter or any social connections to the fans or anything. Some players may like that, older guys i assume but im sure it would turn off some players, would it be a good reasons? absolutely not but its still true.

 

so its NOT like im saying that Lou should trade guys before losing them UNDERSTAND THAT. what im saying is that he's not getting any leverage or putting the chances on his sides not getting to talk before its too late. Look at situations like Cammalleri or Staal for EXAMPLES... i repeat those are isolated EXAMPLES so please focus on the principle here. They started to talk early and the GM then knew they couldnt retain those guys or that there was a risk so they adjusted and traded them instead of losing them for nothing. With Lou he would have lost both cause he would have begin talks too late and at that point it would have been too late. Plus like Zach and Elias said (i'll re-phrase merging what they both said) if a player wants to stay in the organization and that the GM want to keep them, why not just sign him? when the player feels good about the place and everything. Why wait to the point when the players as been away from the team and see other teams doing well in the playoffs and may start to wonder the what if he was somewhere else and think... well i just have to wait a few extra week and see where i could go and how much money i could really get? 

Edited by SterioDesign

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its not because of suter or the no-staal that Malkin and Crosby didnt produce and that Letang did no play his best hockey. ridiculous to think that Staal would have change anything to the playoffs against the Bruins. they got SWEPT.

 

and fair to say and assume 100% that if that situation would have been in NJ, Lou would have approached Jordan like a week or 2 before free agency after Jordan already made his mind to test the market at that point and to play sign in carolina instead of costing the team youre going to of a pick and players.

 

THAT'S my complain about Lou, he's not setting himself up for the best return, its either 1- the guy will sign in the last week 2- we lose him for nothing

 

years and years of "going for it" all the time and not talking with players early to exactly know whats up and not getting at least something for them even if its a late pick. Its always better than losing a player for nothing in the long run. Of course it sucks to maybe trade away players that you know you wont be able to retain before the playoffs but you got to think about the future. I get that the ultimate goal is the cup but the sharks made if farther than us even after trading away 2 of their players this year. 

 

and then of course fans here will all be "you can't trade away players before a cup run cause thats the ultimate goal, nothing else matter, you have to go for it!" but then they'll go and make fun of Pittburgh "hahaha pittsburgh got screwed giving away all those picks and prospects for NOTHING they didnt win the cup!" well thats just fvcking hypocrite.

 

you stack picks and prospects that way and youre in a position to make moves like Minny and Pittsburgh did at the trade deadline. How long is it gonna take for us to have tradable assets? we can't do sh!t cause we dont have much worth tradable players and no assets either 

You mean just like how it happened with Zajac?

And yes, Pitt got screwed. They got 3 old ass players for picks and prospects. Old guys like that either get you a Cup NOW or they don't get you one, period, so yeah, Pitt did not make moves I found to be helpful for them.

Also, please tell me what amazing prospect got traded from Pittsburgh? We have some decent prospects on d, but prospects, unless they're highly touted blue chip, first rd picks, are near worthless until they get some NHL time. And we can trade NHL players too.

I know Tally isn't everyone's favorite, but he's not that bad and definitely could be traded for some value(this would require him to play somewhat well for at least a little while), Fayne is an asset that has value, so is Henrique. I know you'll say we could trade Clarkson, but what we'll get for his rights is near worthless and the chance we could re-sign him is worth more than any pick we'd get for him.

And on how many top players want to come to NJ, well, that's a situation that's been the way it has for a while, get used to it, it's nothing new, Lou isn't changing perception on that and I'm fine with it, hasn't hurt us that much before, won't now.

Edited by ATLL765

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here's the one thing that MAYBE you can pin on Lou and that would be that Elias and Zidlicky aren't signed before a market gets set and makes Lou spend more. that being said, agents have a pretty clear idea of what the market will bare and aren't usually that off (semin is the one guy that doesn't fit this mold).

 

I don't buy that - there are situations where I would, but this is not one of them.  I don't believe that there is some hidden giant market this year.  Remember, most years we wouldn't know what the cap number is for next year yet.  This year we know it.  So I don't think Gonchar and Streit signed for anything below what they would get on the market.  

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