Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
SMantzas

The Pete Deboer Thread

450 posts in this topic

Fayne I'll grant you but Gionta played less than 8 minutes last night and had 3 shots on goal.  He's not good, but he's really not the problem.  If Lou didn't want him played, he could've sent him to Albany.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fayne I'll grant you but Gionta played less than 8 minutes last night and had 3 shots on goal. He's not good, but he's really not the problem. If Lou didn't want him played, he could've sent him to Albany.

That is 8 mins too much. Lou is as much to blame for this Gionta fetish but he isn't going to wait to drop the axe either on Deboer if this continues for another week or two. If the Devils have a bad season the new owners will clean house and that includes Lou.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd like to see PDB not change his line combinations every other shift. How does he expect chemistry to develop when there's no consistency. He's gotta have some patience.

 

As for Larsson I think he's too laid back for his own good, which can make it look like he's not trying. He definitely needs to be more aggressive on ice and develop an edge. Opposition players seem to pick on him more than any of our other D.

Deboer stuck to his lines last night throughout the game.  As far as saying larsson is too laid back, many used to say the same thing about #27. calling him "heartless"(Nieds). because he looked so relaxed. Sal plays his heart out,  but, screws  (like on winning goal) up as does Volchie.  We spend time trying to slow down the quicker teams, rather than matching their speed. Larrson/Fahne/Green can keep up.  Sal/ volchie can't. There even a comment made by a Flame last night in intermission (interview) that you wanted to make Volchie "turn and fetch the puck. Why did he specifically say Volchie's name? maybe cause it's true?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

That is 8 mins too much. Lou is as much to blame for this Gionta fetish but he isn't going to wait to drop the axe either on Deboer if this continues for another week or two. If the Devils have a bad season the new owners will clean house and that includes Lou.

 

You've projected the imminent firing of Lou on to Vanderbeek and now the new owners.  I think firing either DeBoer or Lamoriello would be a large mistake.  The Devils have 4 new forwards in their top 9.  Michael Ryder and Ryane Clowe have a combined 7 shots on goal in 5 game - those would be disappointing results from one of those two.  Neither guy has fit in right away.  If the players quit on the coach that's one thing, but they didn't do that last year and I don't think they'll do that this year.

 

Players like Gionta don't win and lose games, at least not in the role he's in right now.  Most teams play a goon 5-6 minutes a night, a guy who would probably struggle to get top 9 minutes in the ECHL - the Devils play a 3rd line AHLer for 10 minutes a night.  They likely wouldn't expect him to be a -10 in a full season.  It could cost them a win or two over the course of a season.  It's not why they are losing now - they've scaled back his minutes from the 14 or so he was getting at the beginning of last season.

Edited by Triumph

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Robbie Ftorek's final game as Devils coach was a 5-0 loss to the Hurricanes, a team under .500 at the time, where New Jersey got outshot 37-22.  That was a Devils team that is one of the great territorial teams of all time - they would go on to outshoot the rest of the league by 190 in the playoffs.

 

If this team had won two shootouts, no one is saying boo.

 

They've had nine non-shootout wins in the last 40 games.  Nine...and two of THEM were in garbagetime the last week of the season.  

 

I know nobody wants to acknolwedge last year but it's going to factor in when Pete gets fired on Thanksgiving instead of Christmas like Mac was.

Edited by NJDevs4978

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

They've had nine non-shootout wins in the last 40 games.  Nine...and two of THEM were in garbagetime the last week of the season.  

 

I know nobody wants to acknolwedge last year but it's going to factor in when Pete gets fired on Thanksgiving instead of Christmas like Mac was.

 

Oh good, not only do we get to select random stretches of games, we get to omit certain games as garbage time.  Then we get to omit shootout WINS but not shootout losses.  Then we get to count this year as part of last year even though the two teams are totally different.  This is rich.  Why not just say 'Out of the last 25 games the Devils have lost, the Devils have lost them?'

 

DeBoer can't coach the goalies to be good.  They were awful last year.  He can't coach the shooters to be better - they weren't good enough last year.  One thing being missed from this stretch is that the Devils are getting their share of goals - they're not drawing PPs but they're scoring 2 goals a game anyway, which is about as good as can be expected.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Oh good, not only do we get to select random stretches of games, we get to omit certain games as garbage time.  Then we get to omit shootout WINS but not shootout losses.  Then we get to count this year as part of last year even though the two teams are totally different.  This is rich.  Why not just say 'Out of the last 25 games the Devils have lost, the Devils have lost them?'

 

DeBoer can't coach the goalies to be good.  They were awful last year.  He can't coach the shooters to be better - they weren't good enough last year.  One thing being missed from this stretch is that the Devils are getting their share of goals - they're not drawing PPs but they're scoring 2 goals a game anyway, which is about as good as can be expected.

 

I wasn't omitting shootout losses...I wasn't saying they'd lost 29 of the last 40 games, just that they'd only WON eleven out of 40 with a couple being shootout and a couple being glorified preseason tilts.  You can't have success if you can't get regulation wins when it matters, or any wins.  The crappy OT loss points are a short-term salve, and god knows the Devils aren't going to win enough OT/SO games to help there (they've won something like 4 of the last 30 or so OT games in OT) so they have to start getting regulation wins.  

 

I can probably count on two or three fingers - if that - the number of teams have have had fewer wins than the Devils over the last half-season, whether you include shootout/junktime or not.

 

Getting goals doesn't do anything net-wise if you open it up more and make more bizarre mistakes defensively because of it.

Edited by NJDevs4978

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'm trying not to panic -- it's early, and there are new players who need to adjust -- but since the Cup run, DeBoer's decisions have gotten more and more questionable. I'd love to see this organization get some coaching stability, and I was hoping DeBoer would be the answer, but I just remember the Johnny Mac season, where we were saying a lot of similar things, and once they fired him, the team completely changed.My biggest regret from this year is that they ran out of time, because I think we had a better team than a couple of playoff teams, especially after trading Langenbrunner. If DeBoer is part of the problem, I'd like to see us solve that part soon. The hard part is figuring out if DeBoer is part of the problem or not. Clearly, the roster last year was bad, especially after Kovalchuk went down. IMO this roster is considerably better (at least than the roster we iced when Kovalchuk was hurt). If they don't improve soon, especially if DeBoer keeps making bad lineup decisions with the defense, bad moves that can hurt the future as well as the present, I'm not willing to blame the players, at least not 100%, and I'd like to see if someone else can give them a chance to succeed.

 

Of course, the problem is, the replacement choices leave something to be desired. Short of Lemaire coming out of retirement and creating a miracle again, I don't see anyone fixing things quickly. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I wasn't omitting shootout losses...I wasn't saying they'd lost 29 of the last 40 games, just that they'd only WON eleven out of 40 with a couple being shootout and a couple being glorified preseason tilts.  You can't have success if you can't get regulation wins when it matters, or any wins.  The crappy OT loss points are a short-term salve, and god knows the Devils aren't going to win enough OT/SO games to help there (they've won something like 4 of the last 30 or so OT games in OT) so they have to start getting regulation wins.  

 

I can probably count on two or three fingers - if that - the number of teams have have had fewer wins than the Devils over the last half-season, whether you include shootout/junktime or not.

 

Getting goals doesn't do anything net-wise if you open it up more and make more bizarre mistakes defensively because of it.

 

I see literally nothing about goaltending, and so I don't need to address this post.  If your goaltending sucks you are not going to win many games without having a fantastic offense, which the Devils do not.  The Devils' goaltending sucked last year.  It could be better this year - indeed, it could be much better, if Schneider starts playing like he's capable of playing and gets the bulk of the starts.  Winning games in OT or the shootout is not a magic formula which the Devils have lost, either.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I see literally nothing about goaltending, and so I don't need to address this post.  If your goaltending sucks you are not going to win many games without having a fantastic offense, which the Devils do not.  The Devils' goaltending sucked last year.  It could be better this year - indeed, it could be much better, if Schneider starts playing like he's capable of playing and gets the bulk of the starts.  Winning games in OT or the shootout is not a magic formula which the Devils have lost, either.

 

They scored 70 goals over the last 35 games of the season last year, they still would have lost games with average goaltending.  It wasn't just 'one' aspect of the team that failed, you make it out as such although Hedberg was historically bad. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

i cant believe pete called that goailie interference, and how he could let a player backdoor him with 2:00 left. FIRE HIM!

 

and we'll just ignore the effort this team puts forth every night, ......anyone thinking the effort is not there is spinning a false narrative

 

no way is Lou thinking about a change, most of the complaints revolve around personell, thats on lou as much as pete

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

maybe his name got dropped at some point here... not sure why so many are bringing up Laviolette... But Boucher would be a Lou kind of coach don't you guys think?

 

looks badass with his scar too lol

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

maybe his name got dropped at some point here... not sure why so many are bringing up Laviolette... But Boucher would be a Lou kind of coach don't you guys think?

 

looks badass with his scar too lol

 

Dat 1-3-1!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

@TGfireandice: Devs' D pairs: Greene-Larsson; Salvador-Zidlicky; Volchenkov-Harrold; Fayne. Sigh...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

 

and we'll just ignore the effort this team puts forth every night, ......anyone thinking the effort is not there is spinning a false narrative

 

no way is Lou thinking about a change, most of the complaints revolve around personell, thats on lou as much as pete

Legitimate point about effort, but it doesn't seem to be working.

 

IMHO the players this year are much stronger, but the results are the same as last year. If guys gel, and this is a speedbump, that would be awesome, but at some point, Lou has to decide if he thinks that's the case, and it would be for the best if that happens soon, especially if some of this DOES fall on the coaching.

@TGfireandice: Devs' D pairs: Greene-Larsson; Salvador-Zidlicky; Volchenkov-Harrold; Fayne. Sigh...

Especially since Fayne, Greene, and Larsson are the only d who should be here long term, and DeBoer seems insistent on benching Fayne and Larsson. If he's still there, no way Fayne re-signs, and who knows how Larsson develops.

 

If we lose this year, but develop guys, it's not the end of the world, but if bad lineup choices hurt the team in years to come, then we have a serious problem.

Edited by mouse

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Legitimate point about effort, but it doesn't seem to be working.

 

IMHO the players this year are much stronger, but the results are the same as last year. If guys gel, and this is a speedbump, that would be awesome, but at some point, Lou has to decide if he thinks that's the case, and it would be for the best if that happens soon, especially if some of this DOES fall on the coaching.

Especially since Fayne, Greene, and Larsson are the only d who should be here long term, and DeBoer seems insistent on benching Fayne and Larsson. If he's still there, no way Fayne re-signs, and who knows how Larsson develops.

 

If we lose this year, but develop guys, it's not the end of the world, but if bad lineup choices hurt the team in years to come, then we have a serious problem.

 

Yup... i can only predict Fayne and Larsson to be pissed off from the result of Deboer's handling of them and Lou won't talk to them and they won't know whats up and he'll approach them like 1 week before free agency and all they'll have in mind is to get the fvck out of there asap. I certainly would in that situation.

 

i mean... seriously are we REALLY gonna have to go through 3 more full seasons of Volchenkov and 2 of Salvador? one of the 2 HAVE to be traded of bought out next summer there's no way around it

Edited by SterioDesign

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not sure how good a read other teams have on a guy like Fayne, due to his lack of playing time. An offer from the Devils might be his best offer in the end. But this is extremely premature, after all.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not sure how good a read other teams have on a guy like Fayne, due to his lack of playing time. An offer from the Devils might be his best offer in the end. But this is extremely premature, after all.

 

its not really about other teams at this point, at this moment there's absolutely no way that Fayne love being a NJ Devils... he knows too it's bullsh!t that Salvador is constantly playing no matter what over him and it's like any job, you look at what your coworker do and what they have that you don't and you see injustice everywhere and you get pissed off.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Going by today's practice lines and pairs, Josefson and Fayne figure to be healthy scratches again. ughhhhhh. I agree with others that Fayne probably can't wait to get out of here.

I don't think much of Tedenby so I don't care if he plays but I wonder how long can they keep him on the NHL equivalent of the phantom DL before it gets suspicious?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Going by today's practice lines and pairs, Josefson and Fayne figure to be healthy scratches again. ughhhhhh. I agree with others that Fayne probably can't wait to get out of here.

I don't think much of Tedenby so I don't care if he plays but I wonder how long can they keep him on the NHL equivalent of the phantom DL before it gets suspicious?

 

If other NHL GM's actually gave two ***** about Tedenby they'd have raised hell cause it's already suspicious.  I mean really, the guy's been skating for weeks like nothing's wrong, even introduced on Opening Night with the other scratches, and yet he's still on the 'non-roster injury list'.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fayne's as good as gone after this season guys, there's no point in thinking otherwise.

 

Would you resign here if you were him?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

all im fvcking hoping is that behind closed doors there's talks with Fayne telling him that Lou is trying to move bodies and that he'll be a part of the plan going forward. Just to hold on a little longer and that things will get in place and he'll have his spot.

 

Cause really thats the only way to make everything work, to move one of those 2 NOW. if we don't, we'll have 2 spots to fill, Fayne's spot (who would just want to get the fvck out of this circus) and Zid who will probably not resign.

 

Larsson - Green

Gelinas - Sal / Volch

Merril - Harrold

 

i dont know... i'd kinda want to see Fayne in there and Harrold as the 7th guy...

 

Larsson - Green

Gelinas - Fayne

Merril - Sal/Volch

Harrold

 

this leaves time for Santini to be ready to step in for Sal or Volch retiring or leaving after their contracts

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Fayne's as good as gone after this season guys, there's no point in thinking otherwise.

 

Would you resign here if you were him?

Only way I would is if there was another coach.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think our best hope at this point is that the Jets have 90 attempted shots and that Salvador/Volchenkov get injured from blocks. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0