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Mike Brown

Did anybody else get this email?

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The team is probably still gonna be profitable even if attendance stays right where its at. I think that's part of the problem. Why care about the number of customers when you can still make money?

The trick from a pure money making standpoint is to find the right balance. It doesn't cost a sports team, or an airline for that matter, any money to more or less give away an otherwise empty seat. Of course you carry that thinking out to the extreme you're giving away all of your seats.

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The trick from a pure money making standpoint is to find the right balance. It doesn't cost a sports team, or an airline for that matter, any money to more or less give away an otherwise empty seat. Of course you carry that thinking out to the extreme you're giving away all of your seats.

 

The last I checked, we actually have middle of the pack ticket prices.  But I don't know how Forbes actually calculates average ticket prices.  We came in at number 18 on their list with average ticket prices of like $125.

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Another brilliant move by the new management. As a STH, I am one of the 10,000 people this policy is meant to benefit. The problem is, I would rather see a full energetic building regardless of the discounts to non STH's than the lifeless empty arena we've had this season. I didn't buy seasons to resell them, so I don't care how the deals undercut the STH resale market. The perks a few seasons ago were great and, as someone previously said, it should be something they should be increasing to attract new plan holders.

Just seems to me like these new suits have no clue how to reach this fan base, and are making a mess at every turn. Sad start to this regime.

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Another brilliant move by the new management. As a STH, I am one of the 10,000 people this policy is meant to benefit. The problem is, I would rather see a full energetic building regardless of the discounts to non STH's than the lifeless empty arena we've had this season. I didn't buy seasons to resell them, so I don't care how the deals undercut the STH resale market. The perks a few seasons ago were great and, as someone previously said, it should be something they should be increasing to attract new plan holders.

Just seems to me like these new suits have no clue how to reach this fan base, and are making a mess at every turn. Sad start to this regime.

 

This is basically how I feel.

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LOL, if they have 11K fulls they should shoot themselves because their walkup is putrid.   And oh yeah, their full seasons are going into the sh!tter next season unless something surprising happens

Edited by maxpower

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The "traditional group of 20 or more"? On what planet is a usual group of friends 20 or more? What a terrible job by the marketing department yet again.

I'm pretty sure they are referring to the group sales, where I believe you need at least 20 people for it to be considered a "group."  It's more for organizations and clubs etc.

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These new owners continue to astound. They want to add value for ST holders but fail to realize half empty arenas with no atmosphere lessen value to the ST holder experience.

Edited by devlman

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I'm pretty sure they are referring to the group sales, where I believe you need at least 20 people for it to be considered a "group."  It's more for organizations and clubs etc.

 

And unless they leave it wide open for abuse, like they have in the past, it's not going to make a damn bit of difference.

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i'm surprised that they haven't kept the discounted single plans, but just increased benefits to season ticket holders.

 

i'm a full STH as many of you know - for years, i got a season ticket holder gift (tiffany glasses, marty 552 plaque, desk plaque, etc), 4 private arena events, bonus present (e.g. suite for a game) and after game specials (picture on bench, skate on ice after game, etc). this year, it seems like they've cut back on a lot of that.

 

i felt that those perks made being a STH worth it. these things don't cost the devils all that much in the end. that there's no gift, questionable on the team skate session, and my bonus present was an invitation to the "sweet suite for desert during the game", is a little disappointing.

 

i'm really not sure what they're going for. i really thought 2 years ago was the best job they did - they did plenty of packages that kept the building packed with single game purchasers and mini-plans and gave their STH a bunch of perks.

 

I don't want to say anything, but the "gifts", I just have a feeling that a certain someone was behind those things and he ain't there anymore.   Because I can tell you we didn't get sh!t from the Devils until after the 04-05 lockout, which was when he came on board.   People can say what they want about JVB but he was a fan's owner and he "got it".

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No team as successful as us should have these attendance problems.  Of all the other teams with attendance problems, it's mostly because that team has been bad for a long time.  I look at a team like Boston.  From 96-97 (the 2nd year of the Fleet Center / TD Garden) to 07-08 they averaged less than 17,000 people.  From 08-09 to now, they're averaging well over 17,000 people.  The past 4 years alone they've sold out every game.

Maybe because the Bruins have been one of the elite teams in the league recently while the Devils has missed the postseason 2 out of 3 years while losing its 2 best players 2 years in a row? On top of the insane box office prices?

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I got the email, and well I failed to see the point. I mean the value of tickets based on the secondary market is lower than STH prices for the majority of the games, however having the place full of fans vs. empty while protecting "sth value" isnt all that great of an idea.

I have season tickets which I do not get because I get the cheapest price point per game (except ranger games, post season) or perks (i dont really goto the events too often). Having the same seat per game is sort of a reason, as my parents have seats next to mine.

I have to say that losing start players two years in a row and not making the post season doesnt help sell season tickets, or tickets in general. I have to say that I see Marty and Elias as star players in NJ (even before others left)

Some things the Devils have done, or I have heard about could cause me to drop my tickets, especially considering with my schedule it is impossible to make the majority of the games. I generally print the my tickets for the game, or forward them if I can not make to friends. The last game I tried this I think my friend had to PAY to print them. Prior to that game it was FREE. I will see if there is a cost for the 11/25 game, if there is...

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It is marketing 101

Product on the ice vs

STH price point.

I remember'95 we won the cup. In '96 they raised the prices we missed the playoffs. They raised the price for'97 and justified the raise because they won the cup in 95.

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As an STH of 6 seasons now, and someone who plans to keep their tickets for many years, I have to say that for me this email was pretty nice to see.. Eric is basically saying that his current strategy is to make the value of owning season tickets incredibly better than going to games individually, so for people like me this just means I'll continue getting great value (cheap seats + perks).. I'm a little surprised that people think the perks have decreased since 2 years ago.. I find this to be very untrue as they still hold the player events, we get Food/Bev cards, they also have the prizes like ice cream suite, holiday gift, and they still have the STH renewal prizes.. I only experienced 1 season without Eric at the helm but all we got that year was a holiday gift and they did the usual lottery for STH renewal prizes.. There were no player events or F/B cards.. The only benefits STH really got were tickets below box office prices and having the same seat to every game, and under Eric, he's created even more disparity between box office pricing and STH pricing so that's a plus (in addition to adding all of the other perks mentioned above)

 

So to hear Eric say that he will continue making season tickets a great value via price difference from box office and the additional perks is great for me.. If you don't value the player events, F/B cards, renewal prizes, having the same seat to every game without having to constantly price shop, and you only want the cheapest possible way in the building, then season tickets are definitely not for you and StubHub is obviously the best route.. Can't really blame Eric for not designing a plan for these folks, there's just no way to do it that wouldn't allow people to buy the plan and undercut the team's sales via StubHub.. I think Eric is banking on most STH wanting more of an experience than just the cheapest seats to every game, and I know I do value that experience

 

What I will say is that I don't really believe they will get a lot of people to buy ticket packages by making single game seats well above what they should be (and they are pretty ridiculous this season).. I think for the casual fan (1-6 games a year) they'll just either look on StubHub, which doesn't increase attendance since you're just buying someone else's seat, or they'll simply reduce the number of games they attend.. I can see where he is going with this though if you go to 7+ games a year, they'll contact you about buying maybe a 13-game plan and use the reduced price to show you that you get some perks in addition to paying a bit less per game than you were when you were buying from the team directly.. Then they try to move you to a half season or full season if you've enjoyed the experience.. So they're goal is to create a funnel.. They start with a ton of casual fans, contact all of them, and get a bunch to move to a partial plan.. Then get a portion of those partial plan holders to eventually move up to half/full ticket holders.. Not everyone will move from one stage to another, but it's easier to sell a 13-game plan holder on a half/full season than it is to sell a 2 game a year casual fan on a half/full plan

 

I'm still frustrated by the low attendance.. It's embarrassing even if we no longer have to worry about money as a franchise, and I also think the players see it as a bit of a downer (not that I really believe free agents or other players choose where to sign based on attendance).. It's a strategy that I think is slightly flawed in that StubHub is still proving to be the cheapest route, and you're now keeping away the more casual fans by raising individual game prices from the team.. But this will definitely benefit me personally so I am happy about that

 

Oh and just to clarify, group sales aren't just for groups together.. When they refer to group sales I believe they also mean things like Groupon or like just sending a mass ticket promo to all PSE&G customers

Edited by Colin226

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Colin, the thing is the email Eric sent out would make sense if there was a wait list for STH but there is obviously not.  Why get season tickets when even at STH prices the tickets are much higher than on stubhub?  The prices are completely dopey even at the STH discount.  About 3-4 years ago I crunched numbers and based on attending 18 games that year all via the secondary market or NJ Devils discount deals, I saved about $800 based on just the cheapest season tickets available at that time for 2 tickets (and more often via stubhub I had better seats than the ST seats were).  I saved a ton of money and the perks like ice cream suite and meet and greets are not worth $800 extra at least to me.

 

This email to me sounded like it could have come from Bill Wirtz Sr. before he died.  Am I going to expect an email in a couple of years now saying that to provide a better value to our STH we are going to black out all home games because it is unfair to the STH who pay good money to see the games.  I know that is far-fetched at this point but to me this email is in the same vein.

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You guys are wayyyy overreacting. The amount of games last year that were on LivingSocial and Groupon was insane. If you start that culture of discounting almost EVERY game of the season, you'll end up like Florida in a few years, where people will be expecting $8 tickets for a game on Saturday night.

 

I'm sure they'll reintroduce College Nights, I'm sure they'll keep their family packs and other small discounts here and there, but you can't throw season ticket holders under the bus like they did last year with every game being on LivingSocial and people getting discount tickets and a free t-shirt every night. It left a bad taste in all our mouths. 

 

I think the guy's email is meant to say that those casual LivingSocial people (which were a lot of tourists, I noticed) don't mean dick to the future of the franchise. I don't think he's lumping in game-by-game purchases and people who go to 10-20 games a year.

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Overall, Eric has done a great job IMO.  I don't blame him at all and I can see the reasoning behind this policy change.  However, it has directly led to the building being empty, and the energy in the arena this season is lacking because of it.  Unless they severely discount the ticket prices next year, we will see the same thing again.  For me, that's just not worth it.   There just aren't any walk-up sales for Devils games (99% of commuters working in Newark speed out of there at 5 p.m. like they stole a car in Grand Theft Auto IV), and there are too many families and casual fans that attend only 1-3 games per season.  I can't see how they think they will convert these people into plan holders because they (a) don't have the money for it, or (b) aren't inclined to make that kind of commitment for whatever reason.  Seems like pie in the sky stuff that sounds great, but in reality is never going to happen. 

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 I generally print the my tickets for the game, or forward them if I can not make to friends. The last game I tried this I think my friend had to PAY to print them. Prior to that game it was FREE. I will see if there is a cost for the 11/25 game, if there is...

Was that this season?  I thought they changed it the other way around--I thought it used to cost money to forward your tickets but now it is free.

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Colin, the thing is the email Eric sent out would make sense if there was a wait list for STH but there is obviously not.  Why get season tickets when even at STH prices the tickets are much higher than on stubhub?  The prices are completely dopey even at the STH discount.

 

This is just my experience of course, but I've noticed the opposite. Deals on StubHub aren't cheaper than what my tickets cost me in section 119.

 

One thing to keep in mind is they re-priced a number of general sections. Some areas of the arena are priced drastically lower than they used to be, and others were priced up a few dollars. Me personally, I'm paying less for games this year than I did a couple years ago, that's my current experience.

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This is just my experience of course, but I've noticed the opposite. Deals on StubHub aren't cheaper than what my tickets cost me in section 119.

 

One thing to keep in mind is they re-priced a number of general sections. Some areas of the arena are priced drastically lower than they used to be, and others were priced up a few dollars. Me personally, I'm paying less for games this year than I did a couple years ago, that's my current experience.

 

I saw in 106 at the Vancouver game that I got on Stubhub for $28 and the single game price is $59 and I believe that the STH is still a decent amount higher than $28.  I often do not go to the Rangers/Philly/Pens type of games because they are indeed expensive so I always get cheaper than face and STH on stubhub. 

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Colin, the thing is the email Eric sent out would make sense if there was a wait list for STH but there is obviously not.  Why get season tickets when even at STH prices the tickets are much higher than on stubhub?  The prices are completely dopey even at the STH discount.  About 3-4 years ago I crunched numbers and based on attending 18 games that year all via the secondary market or NJ Devils discount deals, I saved about $800 based on just the cheapest season tickets available at that time for 2 tickets (and more often via stubhub I had better seats than the ST seats were).  I saved a ton of money and the perks like ice cream suite and meet and greets are not worth $800 extra at least to me.

 

This email to me sounded like it could have come from Bill Wirtz Sr. before he died.  Am I going to expect an email in a couple of years now saying that to provide a better value to our STH we are going to black out all home games because it is unfair to the STH who pay good money to see the games.  I know that is far-fetched at this point but to me this email is in the same vein.

 

But see that's also from a strictly "just want to get in the door for select games at the cheapest possible price" mentality.. There is no way the team can ever make a package that provides you with that while still generating revenue.. And to be fair, a lot of times the cheapest seats on StubHub are well below what anyone is paying for those seats.. Either the person got them for free, or they're taking a loss.. No matter how low they drop prices, there will always be STH willing to take a loss on games.. If they made season tickets $1, you would see them on StubHub for $0.25

 

FWIW, for the next 3 home games on StubHub, if you just want to get in the door and sit anywhere, you'll be paying about $75.. I'm paying $78 for those 3 games but also will have free food via the F/B cards, plus all of the other perks that I do value as a STH.. Again, if all you value is the absolute cheapest seat to a game and don't mind shopping for tickets to a bunch of games, then season tickets aren't the right option.. There is also some sentimentality that comes with it.. Owning season tickets is not a game or business

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You guys are wayyyy overreacting. The amount of games last year that were on LivingSocial and Groupon was insane. If you start that culture of discounting almost EVERY game of the season, you'll end up like Florida in a few years, where people will be expecting $8 tickets for a game on Saturday night.

 

I'm sure they'll reintroduce College Nights, I'm sure they'll keep their family packs and other small discounts here and there, but you can't throw season ticket holders under the bus like they did last year with every game being on LivingSocial and people getting discount tickets and a free t-shirt every night. It left a bad taste in all our mouths. 

 

I think the guy's email is meant to say that those casual LivingSocial people (which were a lot of tourists, I noticed) don't mean dick to the future of the franchise. I don't think he's lumping in game-by-game purchases and people who go to 10-20 games a year.

 

The way I see it, the allure of ST for Devils games were never cheaper tickets as there have always been the option of getting them cheaper on the secondary market, but instead the main selling point were the perks and the same seats for every game.  Those perks mean nothing to me as they are not worth the extra money you drop for season tickets.

 

I also feel a little offended by what Eric is saying that us game-by-game people who look for deals don't mean dick to the future.  Without us like many have said, the building is at best 75% full.  Again his email would make sense if the building was sold out every night but they are not selling out every night and there is no waiting list for season tickets.  I go to 10-20 games a year and I am only able to do so because of LivingSocial, Groupon, Group and stubhub deals.  Maybe if the Devils fixed their dopey STH pricing scheme maybe then I can re-consider and actually afford to take them up on their ST offers.  Until then they can go fvck themselves.

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I saw in 106 at the Vancouver game that I got on Stubhub for $28 and the single game price is $59 and I believe that the STH is still a decent amount higher than $28.  I often do not go to the Rangers/Philly/Pens type of games because they are indeed expensive so I always get cheaper than face and STH on stubhub. 

 

Depends what row in 106.. I think some people still pay between $25 - $30 to sit in the balconies over there for certain games.. But again, you skip the biggest draw games (NYR/Philly/Pitt) so, like I said, it's further proof season tickets wouldn't make sense for you.. Part of the value is getting the great deal to those games and of course if you skip them you'll be avoiding paying the premiums on those and will save money on the less desirable games..

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But see that's also from a strictly "just want to get in the door for select games at the cheapest possible price" mentality.. There is no way the team can ever make a package that provides you with that while still generating revenue.. And to be fair, a lot of times the cheapest seats on StubHub are well below what anyone is paying for those seats.. Either the person got them for free, or they're taking a loss.. No matter how low they drop prices, there will always be STH willing to take a loss on games.. If they made season tickets $1, you would see them on StubHub for $0.25

 

FWIW, for the next 3 home games on StubHub, if you just want to get in the door and sit anywhere, you'll be paying about $75.. I'm paying $78 for those 3 games but also will have free food via the F/B cards, plus all of the other perks that I do value as a STH.. Again, if all you value is the absolute cheapest seat to a game and don't mind shopping for tickets to a bunch of games, then season tickets aren't the right option.. There is also some sentimentality that comes with it.. Owning season tickets is not a game or business

 

 

Those prices always go down the closer you get to the game.  I'll bet it will be closer to $40-50 for all 3 games.

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Depends what row in 106.. I think some people still pay between $25 - $30 to sit in the balconies over there for certain games.. But again, you skip the biggest draw games (NYR/Philly/Pitt) so, like I said, it's further proof season tickets wouldn't make sense for you.. Part of the value is getting the great deal to those games and of course if you skip them you'll be avoiding paying the premiums on those and will save money on the less desirable games..

 

I sat in row 5 and the price I gave is based on the row.

 

I don't need to see the biggest draws.  I have just as much fun seeing them play the Panthers as I do the Rangers.  Yeah I have seen a ton of Carolina, Florida, TB, Buffalo and Ottawa the past few years but I still get the same pleasure out of it seeing them play the Pens or Philly.

 

I know ST are a give and take but my main arguement is the tone of that email.  The pricing scheme is dopey and that is why you always see pockets of empty seats in the same exact sections every game this year.  Maybe they should fix them instead of calling some STH brokers and then badmouthing game-by-game people like me.  One additional advantage of being a game by game person is that if I want to go, I just go buy tickets to it.  If I can't make it, I don't buy tickets so I do not have to worry about selling them or giving them away.  The Devils now make it very hard for STH to sell their extras as they almost force you to go through TicketExchange where they are rarely sold (believe me I have tried that website and its much worse than SH)

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I sat in row 5 and the price I gave is based on the row.

 

I don't need to see the biggest draws.  I have just as much fun seeing them play the Panthers as I do the Rangers.

 

That's you, though... I personally like seeing us beat up the Rangers 4-0 in our arena for $23, and for those nights, my STH deal is worth it. It's as simple as that, really.

Edited by DJ Eco

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