Colin226

GDT: NJ Devils vs. NY Rangers - 12:30pm on NBC - Stadium Series Editio

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The latter argument is flawed because Nieds was arguably not even the best defenseman on the Ducks.  He didn't carry mediocre teams to the Finals the way Pronger did TWICE.

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This is really a stupid argument....

 

I look at Niedermayer and I watch him play with a Ken Daneyko for years long after Daneyko should have retired and I see a player who is virtually playing D without a partner... I see guy who holds every championship known to his sport. I see a guy who left a team and a system and put a new team on his back and carries them to a championship.  Like I said, this is a stupid argument they are both HOFer's.  If I was starting over with both of them I'd take Niedermayer.

 

that sounds pretty much exactly like you aren't aware of how good or what Stevens did or was pre-2000s

Parise is a class of player that is allowed to exist because of the rule changes.   If they didn't change the rules, you'd need to be John Leclair's size to play his style.   Without it, he's probably a checking winger who plays off transition.   A John Madden type.

 

maybe a bigger pre-lockout Brian Gionta? There are outliers like St Louis, but either way, he wasn't putting up 96 points in 01 like Elias did

Edited by DH26

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The latter argument is flawed because Nieds was arguably not even the best defenseman on the Ducks.  He didn't carry mediocre teams to the Finals the way Pronger did TWICE.

He carried them through the finals.  He was by far their best player in the playoffs.

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He carried them through the finals.  He was by far their best player in the playoffs.

 

Chris Pronger says hey how's it going. Remember the 06, 07 and '10 playoffs? He was involved 

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that sounds pretty much exactly like you aren't aware of how good or what Stevens did or was pre-2000s

 

maybe a bigger pre-lockout Brian Gionta? There are outliers like St Louis, but either way, he wasn't putting up 96 points in 01 like Elias did

 

Yeah, but that's what I think Gionta was basically, a defensive transition winger.    If Parise's scored more than 5 goals in his career outside of the circles, he scored 2 or 3 of them recently.    He would have been beaten stupid.   St. Louis is dangerous anywhere on the rink

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that sounds pretty much exactly like you aren't aware of how good or what Stevens did or was pre-2000s

 

maybe a bigger pre-lockout Brian Gionta? There are outliers like St Louis, but either way, he wasn't putting up 96 points in 01 like Elias did

You can't look at Elias in this case in isolation of the A-Line.  Elias is a great player but the A-Line inflated his numbers some.

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It's unfortunate that it was a blowout loss on national tv in a first ever event, but it's one loss. And it's on the entire team, not Marty or Salvador or Fayne or anyone individually, because clearly nobody's early had a good game today.

Positives to take for me:

- the defensive breakdowns that we saw constantly are rare for us, so I'm not worried about it.

- the power play continues to produce. It's a shame we couldn't draw a few more penalties late because I think we could have made it interesting, but if our power play continues to convert at this rate we will be in good shape.

- josefson looked halfway decent on the jägr line, better than Boucher did. I hope to god Pete keeps him there for Tuesday

- broduer letting in 6 goals will further cement Cory as the starter. I hope and think he will get at least 20 of the final 29 games, probably more than that.

Hopefully they will be fired up on Tuesday because you know St. Louis will be after they were embarrassed by us last week.

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You can't look at Elias in this case in isolation of the A-Line.  Elias is a great player but the A-Line inflated his numbers some.

 

And what do Parise's numbers look like without Zajac and Langs?   They went down.   

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And what do Parise's numbers look like without Zajac and Langs?   They went down.   

I would argue the Parise was the driving force on that line and the others were hitch hikers.

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quite embarassing to see marty blaming the ice conditions now... brrr

I hate when quotes are taken out if context. The question to him was probably along the lines of: "Marty, how was the ice conditions today?", not "Marty, why did you let in 6 goals."

People see the quote and assume he was blaming the ice. I'd like to hear the entire conversation to understand what exactly he was responding to.

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I would argue the Parise was the driving force on that line and the others were hitch hikers.

 

well, he needs to start being more of a driving force because he's back to being a 60-65 point player now.  and btw, Elias was the best player on that line by a mile.  Arnott was a 50 point player.   I'm starting to think you didn't actually watch alot of this stuff.   Elias almost had a fvcking 100 point season during the dead puck era.... playing 18 minutes a night

Edited by maxpower

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ESPN - Devils G Martin Brodeur says "worst ice I ever played hockey on" after loss to Rangers at Yankee Stadium

Bro you're a goalie. Quit complaining about the ice, there were plenty of skaters that had to tough it out

Yeah, that's a lame excuse. He really just sounds like he's making excuses with that one. Everyone played on the same ice.

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Yeah there's no way Parise's a better player than Elias.  He's a marginally better goal scorer, though not a particularly varied one since all of Parise's goals come within a 5x5 box and Elias is better everywhere else.

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Parise better than Elias?  Oh boy, that's rich. They're close, but Elias has an easy edge because his career is nearly over but he has maintained an incredibly high level of play, whereas Parise has likely past his peak.  So for Parise to be as good as Elias, he has to keep being as good as he is for as long as Elias did.  Good luck doing that.

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This too...so long as you offer Cory an eight-year deal (which there's no real reason not to assuming he doesn't nosedive the rest of the season) there's really no reason he wouldn't be signed barring getting bitten by the 'I want to go home' disease.

Thankfully Boston locked up Rask, so they don't need a goalie lol.

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Not attacking Marty, but goalies need to save you some games, and there was a stretch in the second where Marty could have saved at least SOME shots, which makes it a different game. He gave up 3 goals in a row, a couple of which went through his legs. A couple times, Marty was slow coming across the goal mouth, and never got his feet set, which meant he couldn't adjust to deflections. If the shots were unpredictable, I'd get it, but everyone knew who was going to be shooting, and the ice was slow enough that the passes weren't exactly crisp. I don't want to beat on Marty here, but he was off, and IMO he was off because he's nowhere near the athlete he used to be. This hurts, because we should love Marty, and we're used to him being great, and because this game was supposed to be his swan song, but it's also good, because if we play Schneider for the stretch run, this doesn't happen again, at least assuming most of the defensive breakdowns were flukes (an assumption I make because they haven't made this type of mistake with any frequency in awhile). We witnessed a perfect storm of sh!t. Hopefully, we learn from it. Benching Sal or Volch, preferably Sal, for Merrill or Larsson would be another good lesson, though I don't see DeBo going that far.

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Hey, the Devils and Brodeur made the front page of ESPN.

 

http://espn.go.com/new-york/nhl/story/_/id/10356255/martin-brodeur-new-jersey-devils-says-ice-yankee-stadium-was-worst-ever

 

What a fvcking dumb headline. Maybe a dumb comment too, but this is a non-story. Shocking that the worst ice he ever played an NHL game on came in the 1 game he didn't play in an NHL arena.

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8 years at a $7m cap hit is what I'd do for Cory.

 

I hate long term deals after Kovi and hopefully Schneider feels the same after getting screwed over by the Luogo contract. 

 

There's few players that are as good as they were 8 years ago. And there's few teams that are good as they were 8 years ago. Too risky for both sides.

 

I realize some players require long term deals... But if a guy won't be your friend unless you sign an 8-year-deal... then he's not really your friend.

Edited by devils102

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I hate long term deals after Kovi and hopefully Schneider feels the same after getting screwed over by the Luogo contract. 

 

There's few players that are as good as they were 8 years ago. And there's few teams that are good as they were 8 years ago. Too risky for both sides.

 

I realize some players require long term deals... But if a guy won't be your friend unless you sign an 8-year-deal... then he's not really your friend.

don't think we are in much of a position to worry about guys taking breaks for us. We need to keep cory here or we will be dogsh!t for the next 8 years.

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Devils are 10-5-5 in their last 20 GP.  They were 5-1-2 in their last 8 before this mess.  Today sucked something fierce, but it is just one loss.   

 

Anyone who wants to blame Marty 100% for this loss isn't seeing the whole picture.  Plenty of blame to go around today.  That being said, I really hope more than ever that Marty stops thinking about playing next year, and retires after this season.  Like I've said, Marty will probably always think he still has it in him to be what he was.  He doesn't.  He may have some good games left in him, but good luck guessing when he'll have them. 

 

We've known that the Cory Schneider Era was going to start before much longer, but this is the game that slammed the door shut on the Marty Brodeur Era.  Like I said, I don't blame Marty for everything that went wrong today, but from here on out, he can't ever be thought of as a 1B here again, only as a distant #2.  This is Cory's time now.  Just ride him.     

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Devils are 10-5-5 in their last 20 GP.  They were 5-1-2 in their last 8 before this mess.  Today sucked something fierce, but it is just one loss.   

 

Anyone who wants to blame Marty 100% for this loss isn't seeing the whole picture.  Plenty of blame to go around today.  That being said, I really hope more than ever that Marty stops thinking about playing next year, and retires after this season.  Like I've said, Marty will probably always think he still has it in him to be what he was.  He doesn't.  He may have some good games left in him, but good luck guessing when he'll have them. 

 

We've known that the Cory Schneider Era was going to start before much longer, but this is the game that slammed the door shut on the Marty Brodeur Era.  Like I said, I don't blame Marty for everything that went wrong today, but from here on out, he can't ever be thought of as a 1B here again, only as a distant #2.  This is Cory's time now.  Just ride him.     

 

Pretty much agree with this.

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Devils are 10-5-5 in their last 20 GP.  They were 5-1-2 in their last 8 before this mess.  Today sucked something fierce, but it is just one loss.   

 

Anyone who wants to blame Marty 100% for this loss isn't seeing the whole picture.  Plenty of blame to go around today.  That being said, I really hope more than ever that Marty stops thinking about playing next year, and retires after this season.  Like I've said, Marty will probably always think he still has it in him to be what he was.  He doesn't.  He may have some good games left in him, but good luck guessing when he'll have them. 

 

We've known that the Cory Schneider Era was going to start before much longer, but this is the game that slammed the door shut on the Marty Brodeur Era.  Like I said, I don't blame Marty for everything that went wrong today, but from here on out, he can't ever be thought of as a 1B here again, only as a distant #2.  This is Cory's time now.  Just ride him.     

 

pretty much, i feel the same that the loss is not on Brodeur but this decision today was obviously made based on feelings and the whole chabang... but seeing the results its pretty damn fair to justify that i has to be the last time it comes in play in any decisions. There's no way to know if we would have won with Cory in net but still, Brodeur is not the #1 anymore, thats as clear as day

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