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Lots to mull for Devils’ legend Brodeur - Brooks NY Post

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How does announcing it to the public help the Yankees do that? He could have told the team without making a grand announcement and doing a goodbye tour.

I don't see why anyone would be offended by him announcing his retirement before the season. I've been watching Yankees games from before I could even remember. Baseball was the #1 sport in my house and the Yankees a religion. 1995 was the first year I can really remember individual games and moments so I've been fortunate enough to watch Jeter's legendary career the whole way through. I'm really thankful that I'll be able to cherish the final games I'll get to see him play this season.

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It's a huge ego move. He could have just played out the season and retired, instead it will be the Jeter Farewell Tour, like with Mariano last year.

I'm not sure if it's a distraction , but they did miss the playoffs last year. I think that was more due to injury though.

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I'm surprised there aren't more people who would be sad about Marty's last start as a Devil being the Yankee Stadium fiasco.  It's not as if they're going to give him a start for the hell of it before the deadline, the die's cast and the Devils are in must-win games.

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I don't see why anyone would be offended by him announcing his retirement before the season. I've been watching Yankees games from before I could even remember. Baseball was the #1 sport in my house and the Yankees a religion. 1995 was the first year I can really remember individual games and moments so I've been fortunate enough to watch Jeter's legendary career the whole way through. I'm really thankful that I'll be able to cherish the final games I'll get to see him play this season.

 

One thing that's obvious is that no matter how these things are handled, someone will always bitch about it.  I don't see anything wrong with what Jeter did here:

 

1) From the team standpoint, the Yankees can plan for the future knowing they will need a new SS in 2015 and beyond, and don't have to worry about it ever getting awkward by having to nudge him out the door.  And extra ticket sales never hurt (though I don't think for one second that was ever part of the motivation for any of this).

2) From Jeter's standpoint, he's let everyone know EXACTLY what his intentions are, so there won't be any constant "What if" possible retirement questions from reporters.  No suspense here.  He's playing one more season and that's it.

3) From the fans' standpoint, they get to enjoy his last moments of greatness, and know that if they want to see him live on last time, this is the season to do it. 

 

Not sure why being upfront about this is such a horrible thing.  He's a Yankee well worth being celebrated, and now everyone can enjoy his last season together, without anyone being unsure about his future plans or wondering about next season.  And this is all coming from a diehard Met fan, so it's not like I'm at all biased in this.

 

Re:  Brodeur, it would've been great if he had done the same thing, as I think he would've gotten much more of a pass on his overall "meh" performance this season.  But every case is different.  Maybe if Brodeur had suffered through an injury-plagued, frustrating season like Jeter's, filled with aggravating setbacks, maybe he would've gone a similar route.  Who knows? 

 

 

I'm surprised there aren't more people who would be sad about Marty's last start as a Devil being the Yankee Stadium fiasco.  It's not as if they're going to give him a start for the hell of it before the deadline, the die's cast and the Devils are in must-win games.

 

For me, it doesn't even register.  I'm sure you can find a lot of greats who didn't have anywhere near a great game in their last appearance.  Too many terrific games in his career to look back on, to let the outdoor trainwreck make much of an impact.

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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I'm surprised there aren't more people who would be sad about Marty's last start as a Devil being the Yankee Stadium fiasco.  It's not as if they're going to give him a start for the hell of it before the deadline, the die's cast and the Devils are in must-win games.

I just wish he retired on top in 2012. We all saw the trend in his play, he I guess didn't see it, and was only going to get worse. It doesn't mask his records and it stinks that his last game could be a dudaroo - but what are you going to do. In the long run, it's a footnote.

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I just wish he retired on top in 2012. We all saw the trend in his play, he I guess didn't see it, and was only going to get worse. It doesn't mask his records and it stinks that his last game could be a dudaroo - but what are you going to do. In the long run, it's a footnote.

 

He put up a .920 save% over a 50-game stretch to close out the 2012 season (regular season and playoffs), and looked good for most of that time.  I can't blame him for thinking he had something left.  Clearly other teams did too...the Devils weren't the only team interested that offseason.

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Oh I guess you meant acquire Cory AND Khudobin...there's no way they would have pushed Marty out in a hostile takeover like that after thirty meh and injury-marred games in a short season anyway.  It's one thing to push Marty onto the bench with a guy like Cory, it's another to force him off the team with a guy with limited experience, that wouldn't have gone over very well at all.  They threw a brushback pitch as it was by getting Cory and forcing out Hedberg (his buddy).

 

Yes, I meant Cory AND Khudobin. Would it have been unpopular? Perhaps with certain team members, but overall I think it would have been the most beneficial to the team. I don't think that most die-hard fans would have been upset about it and most casual fans would get over it fairly quickly. We here who watch and follow carefully realized instantly that Lou didn't replace Hedberg with Cory this season, he replaced Hedberg with Marty and replaced Marty with Cory. I just think that instead of going through this whole season charade of "who is the starting goalie" it would have been simpler to just do a wholesale change.

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It's not 100% publicity. How can the Yankees tell Jeter he's retiring? It's up to him to retire. I'm sure they're not disappointed with this result, but it also benefits Jeter so he doesn't have to deal with the endless questions. How often do we see Brodeur asked about it? And he's in a much lower profile sport on a much lower profile team.

we can agree to disagree. I never said the Yankees forced him to retire, but there is no doubt in my mind that once he told them he was going to, they wanted him to go on a farewell tour like Rivera did- now ticket sales, souveniers and tv ratings will go through the roof. I honestly don't see any other reason to announce it ~250 days in advance. It seems like this is now going to be the status quo in baseball (I honestly can't recall it happening so frequently ever before) there's going to be an entire market for players going on farewell tours. First chipper, then Mariano and now jeter.

If anything IMO announcing it now would be more of a distraction to the team throughout the year, now everyone on the team will be asked in every city their thoughts on the retirement...so I'm not buying the whole endless questions argument.

Anyway I don't think you can compare the Marty and jeter situations- jeter was still excellent before he got injured, whereas Marty has been on a steady decline for a few years now, and the devils already brought in a replacement for him.

Edit: apparently people have interpreted me to mean I think this is a horrible thing by jeter, which I specifically said wasn't the case. Jeter has earned to go out anyway he wants, I really don't care. But again, just be honest about the motivations of the announcement- IMO this all for $$$$. I'm already hearing Steiner sports commercials for jeter memorabilia less than 8 hours after the announcement.

Edited by dmann422

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Ticket sales will go up?  And this is a problem how?  That means fans are paying to see the guy they like.  What is wrong with that?  Instead of surprising everyone at the end of the year and saying 'sorry everyone, this is it - shoulda bought tickets in September, guys!  Shoulda read my mind!' - he's out.

 

Why in this scenario would he even tell them that he is planning on retiring at the end of the year?  Why would he even have that conversation?

 

76 hit the nail on the head - everyone benefits.

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we can agree to disagree. I never said the Yankees forced him to retire, but there is no doubt in my mind that once he told them he was going to, they wanted him to go on a farewell tour like Rivera did- now ticket sales, souveniers and tv ratings will go through the roof. I honestly don't see any other reason to announce it ~250 days in advance. It seems like this is now going to be the status quo in baseball (I honestly can't recall it happening so frequently ever before) there's going to be an entire market for players going on farewell tours. First chipper, then Mariano and now jeter.

If anything IMO announcing it now would be more of a distraction to the team throughout the year, now everyone on the team will be asked in every city their thoughts on the retirement...so I'm not buying the whole endless questions argument.

Anyway I don't think you can compare the Marty and jeter situations- jeter was still excellent before he got injured, whereas Marty has been on a steady decline for a few years now, and the devils already brought in a replacement for him.

Edit: apparently people have interpreted me to mean I think this is a horrible thing by jeter, which I specifically said wasn't the case. Jeter has earned to go out anyway he wants, I really don't care. But again, just be honest about the motivations of the announcement- IMO this all for $$$$. I'm already hearing Steiner sports commercials for jeter memorabilia less than 8 hours after the announcement.

IMO 76 has it right. The money is a benefit, but it's a small one compared to all the other ones, especially getting the media off Jeter's back.

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Yes, I meant Cory AND Khudobin. Would it have been unpopular? Perhaps with certain team members, but overall I think it would have been the most beneficial to the team. I don't think that most die-hard fans would have been upset about it and most casual fans would get over it fairly quickly. We here who watch and follow carefully realized instantly that Lou didn't replace Hedberg with Cory this season, he replaced Hedberg with Marty and replaced Marty with Cory. I just think that instead of going through this whole season charade of "who is the starting goalie" it would have been simpler to just do a wholesale change.

 

A steady transition from Marty to Cory was essential. Throwing out Moose and Marty like that in the offseason would have sent a real bad message to the locker room. The team needed to warm up to Cory as it was.

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Ticket sales will go up?  And this is a problem how?  That means fans are paying to see the guy they like.  What is wrong with that?  Instead of surprising everyone at the end of the year and saying 'sorry everyone, this is it - shoulda bought tickets in September, guys!  Shoulda read my mind!' - he's out.

 

Why in this scenario would he even tell them that he is planning on retiring at the end of the year?  Why would he even have that conversation?

 

76 hit the nail on the head - everyone benefits.

lol where did I say it was a problem? Where did I say nobody benefits? The only point I'm making is that the announcement was made for $$$ reasons. I'll ask you why has there never been this push to announce retirement in advance before? This is a fairly new phenomenon. Gretzky announced his one game early, that's the only other high profile guy I can recall announcing it early. Now the past 3 mlb seasons there have been retirement tours. Why? The answer to me is that they found out that there is big money in it. That's all I'm saying here and that's all I've ever said in this thread.

Point is next thing you know every big name from now on is going to announce it early to profit from it. I'm not sure what of all that I've said is outrageous or groundbreaking... To me it seems quite obvious. But again you can disagree, that's fine.

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lol where did I say it was a problem? Where did I say nobody benefits? The only point I'm making is that the announcement was made for $$$ reasons. I'll ask you why has there never been this push to announce retirement in advance before? This is a fairly new phenomenon. Gretzky announced his one game early, that's the only other high profile guy I can recall announcing it early. Now the past 3 mlb seasons there have been retirement tours. Why? The answer to me is that they found out that there is big money in it. That's all I'm saying here and that's all I've ever said in this thread.

Point is next thing you know every big name from now on is going to announce it early to profit from it. I'm not sure what of all that I've said is outrageous or groundbreaking... To me it seems quite obvious. But again you can disagree, that's fine.

 

Ted Williams announced his retirement early.  But yeah I guess it's a new thing.

 

I have no idea how Derek Jeter personally profits from this.  His salary is guaranteed.

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Ted Williams announced his retirement early.  But yeah I guess it's a new thing.

 

I have no idea how Derek Jeter personally profits from this.  His salary is guaranteed.

if you don't think jeter (and a lot of other people) will profit from this than you are being obtuse, and if your example is from 53 years ago then IMO it helps prove my point. But like I said, agree to disagree... To be honest also I agree with 76 that everyone ultimately benefits from this, but that doesn't mean that was the motivation behind the announcement.

To bring it back on topic, I think that Marty announcing his retirement early (let's say he did it before this season) would have caused more problems at this point- whether he did or not, his play itself shows that this will be his last year- at least in a devils uniform. The hooplah of a retirement tour only would have fueled the flames of the early season goalie controversy IMO.

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A steady transition from Marty to Cory was essential. Throwing out Moose and Marty like that in the offseason would have sent a real bad message to the locker room. The team needed to warm up to Cory as it was.

 

Maybe I'm just beyond the point of caring about steady transitions and messages to the locker room, but after ending a season the way we did last year I thought a clearer message would be that a new era was starting. Warming up to a goalie? I've played goalie in multiple sports. Is it essential for your goalie and defense to be on the same page? Absolutely. Is it hard to get on the same page? Not really. That's what training camp is for.

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Maybe I'm just beyond the point of caring about steady transitions and messages to the locker room, but after ending a season the way we did last year I thought a clearer message would be that a new era was starting. Warming up to a goalie? I've played goalie in multiple sports. Is it essential for your goalie and defense to be on the same page? Absolutely. Is it hard to get on the same page? Not really. That's what training camp is for.

 

In the locker room. If you take a team leader like Marty and a well liked locker room guy like Moose and force both of them into retirement for 2 new guys, you may as well go full on re-build. Why would a guy like Elias re-sign if they did something like that to Brodeur?

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I have no idea how Derek Jeter personally profits from this. His salary is guaranteed.

It's an ego boost. 162 games of everyone telling him how great he is. Plus when Mariano did it, he got fun prizes.

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It's an ego boost. 162 games of everyone telling him how great he is. Plus when Mariano did it, he got fun prizes.

 

Oh please, Derek has never really been about ego.  And c'mon, this is the Yankees...do you really think, if he had announced his retirement after the season, there wouldn't be a big-time Derek Jeter day next season?  This is the Yankees.  They'd give him a first-class send-off, full of prizes.  And the prizes are simply tokens of appreciation...what could the Yankees possibly give him that he can't already buy on his own?

 

Maybe you don't like him, for whatever the reasons, but he is not a me-first ego guy, never has been.  He's the last guy who comes off as needing to be stroked all of the time.  That's part of what makes him so likable, even though he's pretty vanilla as a person (he's actually pretty reserved in the media). 

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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In the locker room. If you take a team leader like Marty and a well liked locker room guy like Moose and force both of them into retirement for 2 new guys, you may as well go full on re-build. Why would a guy like Elias re-sign if they did something like that to Brodeur?

I agree, but after the sh!t finish last year, there's something to be said for shaking up the room, getting guys a little uncomfortable. IMO it wouldn't have mattered either way -- they started like sh!t, but they were trying -- but when you play really badly, your comfort level doesn't get to matter much.

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In the locker room. If you take a team leader like Marty and a well liked locker room guy like Moose and force both of them into retirement for 2 new guys, you may as well go full on re-build. Why would a guy like Elias re-sign if they did something like that to Brodeur?

 

Because it's still a team committed to winning? Because it's still a team that views the crest as more important than the name on the back? The alternative is to do exactly what they did do which didn't help any better IMO.

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In the locker room. If you take a team leader like Marty and a well liked locker room guy like Moose and force both of them into retirement for 2 new guys, you may as well go full on re-build. Why would a guy like Elias re-sign if they did something like that to Brodeur?

 

Since none of us have never been inside an NHL locker room, I think it's pointless to suggest that we know at all how the "locker room" feels about this or that.  But I'll venture a guess that the other veterans would prefer to win rather than get to hang out with their buddies while they're at the rink.   

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Oh please, Derek has never really been about ego.  And c'mon, this is the Yankees...do you really think, if he had announced his retirement after the season, there wouldn't be a big-time Derek Jeter day next season?  This is the Yankees.  They'd give him a first-class send-off, full of prizes.  And the prizes are simply tokens of appreciation...what could the Yankees possibly give him that he can't already buy on his own?

 

Maybe you don't like him, for whatever the reasons, but he is not a me-first ego guy, never has been.  He's the last guy who comes off as needing to be stroked all of the time.  That's part of what makes him so likable, even though he's pretty vanilla as a person (he's actually pretty reserved in the media).

"Derek Jeter Day" is one thing. This will be "Derek Jeter Season". There's no other reason to do it. The "distraction" of not knowing if he is coming back is lesser than the distraction of the spending a whole season kissing his ass rather than focusing on baseball.

And I was really only joking about the prizes. When Mariano met Metallica and they gave him that guitar, I was 99% sure he had no idea who they were.

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"Derek Jeter Day" is one thing. This will be "Derek Jeter Season". There's no other reason to do it. The "distraction" of not knowing if he is coming back is lesser than the distraction of the spending a whole season kissing his ass rather than focusing on baseball.

And I was really only joking about the prizes. When Mariano met Metallica and they gave him that guitar, I was 99% sure he had no idea who they were.

 

It is not going to be some major distraction.  For one, there's plenty of other storylines to follow with the Yankees:  Robertson taking over the closer role, Tex coming back from injury, the performances of their big free agent signings.  I already posted why it makes sense from just about every standpoint...you seem determined to make this whole thing a lot more than it really is, and to try to find a downside when there really isn't one.  There will be some tributes here and there, but Jeter answered many of the questions about his retirement and post-career life in his statement already.  The big articles about him calling it quits have already been written.  You'll see them spike up again as the season ends, but during the season, this is not going to be that big of a deal...a lot of the angles that this can be covered from will be touched on in spring training.  And sometimes you've just got to use your brain...Jeter has never been an attention whore, or thought of as such.  If you want to see a prime example of a pure attention whore, look no further than Rodriguez, Alex. 

 

It's like I said previously, someone will always bitch no matter what the approach.  If he didn't announce it and said "I knew I was going to retire at the end of the year, just kept it to myself", you'd have fans bitching about "Geez, if he had said something earlier, I would've gone to more games to see him play, why didn't he say anything?"

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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"Derek Jeter Day" is one thing. This will be "Derek Jeter Season". There's no other reason to do it. The "distraction" of not knowing if he is coming back is lesser than the distraction of the spending a whole season kissing his ass rather than focusing on baseball.

 

Even if it is, a 30 minute (at most) tribute about 19 times (last game of last road series) distracts no one, since they'll all be warming up. Maybe Jeter will get some cheers instead of boos, which again distracts no one. The question about who the next shortstop is, or if Jeter is hurting the team by sticking around is a much bigger issue. Same with Marty. If he announces his retirement, some people cheer for him. Especially in Montreal. Instead, the team, especially Schnieder, have had to deal with obnoxious questions, especially by Chere, all year long. Not that our threads are perfect, but look how many Marty threads we've had that wouldn't have been there if we knew he was just going to retire. Certainly money may be a factor, but there is a huge tangible benefit to announcing your retirement early. The real reason people don't do it is they rarely know they're done. Marty still thinks he can play. Tony Gonzalez announced it, then played again. Very few players get to leave on their own terms, in large part because the confidence that allowed them to play at this level tends to distort reality. Jeter and Mo happened to have a rare level of self awareness, that allowed them to leave on top (hopefully for Jeter), and enjoy their last season.

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re:  Marty, I don't think he was thinking retirement after this season...I agree with you mouse, in that he still thinks he can play.  He probably thought he could bounce back from last year, have a year close to 2011-12 overall (with hopefully an extended stretch of very good play again).  Hopefully he's thinking retirement now and doesn't try to play next season.   

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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