Mike Brown

RUMOR: Callahan to be traded as per Boomer Esiason

159 posts in this topic

According to Dreger, it's a 99% certainty Callahan will be traded.

 

well well well how could this happen! You clearly said that NO GM IN THE WORLD would trade their best player/captain when they are in a race for the playoffs.

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well well well how could this happen! You clearly said that NO GM IN THE WORLD would trade their best player/captain when they are in a race for the playoffs.

sather spoke with Callahan and realized that he is almost certainly too pricey for the rangers next season. If Callahan gets traded, it's because he 100% won't be re-signing. When Lou kept zach, that offseason he made him a competitive offer that might very well have kept him here if not for suter. I don't see the comparison here at all.

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sather spoke with Callahan and realized that he is almost certainly too pricey for the rangers next season. If Callahan gets traded, it's because he 100% won't be re-signing. When Lou kept zach, that offseason he made him a competitive offer that might very well have kept him here if not for suter. I don't see the comparison here at all.

 

lol you don't see a comparison? I dont even see me bringing up Zach or any names or any comparisons at all. Putting words in my mouth again?

 

edit: just for fun, since you brought it up now. How 'bout clarkson? At the price he wanted and the fact that Lou gave up on him even before the deadline he was 100% not resigning too, but Lou waiting after it was too late fvcked our chances to get a return.

Edited by SterioDesign

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Maybe Lou was blindsided by the ridiculous offer clarky got. Everyone here knows hes not even worth 70percent of it.

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lol you don't see a comparison? I dont even see me bringing up Zach or any names or any comparisons at all. Putting words in my mouth again?

 

edit: just for fun, since you brought it up now. How 'bout clarkson? At the price he wanted and the fact that Lou gave up on him even before the deadline he was 100% not resigning too, but Lou waiting after it was too late fvcked our chances to get a return.

 

It was heavily implied though.

 

Regardless, Sather could trade Callahan at the deadline and it can blow up in his face.  We don't know yet.  In 2012 Lou saw that we were firmly in the playoffs and probably figured that what he had now was better than any return he could get.  He took a little bit of a gamble and it did pay off a bit.  I mean we made the finals that year when no one, even most Devils fans, expect ourselves too and we beat 2 of our biggest rivals on the way.  That alone is worth losing him.

 

Plus again Minnesota can have that and Suter's ridiculous contracts.  I'm glad we don't have any like that now that Kovy "retired"

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lol you don't see a comparison? I dont even see me bringing up Zach or any names or any comparisons at all. Putting words in my mouth again?

 

edit: just for fun, since you brought it up now. How 'bout clarkson? At the price he wanted and the fact that Lou gave up on him even before the deadline he was 100% not resigning too, but Lou waiting after it was too late fvcked our chances to get a return.

 

You just cannot WAIT for chances to snivel about Lou's MO (I think EVERYONE here has gotten your point by now). 

 

As far as Clarkson goes, Lou rolled the dice and lost...that can and will sometimes happen, and all of the hindsight bitching, moaning, and should'ves won't change that.  GMs sometimes take chances and they don't all pay off, which opens them up to being criticized and second-guessed.  At the time, the Devils didn't have much in the way of goal-scoring, and Clarkson's recent track record, right or wrong, had suggested that he could score.  Unforunately we're seeing more and more that the 30 goals he scored in 2011-12 and the 10 goals he scored in 14 GP to start the 2013 season were flukey and probably won't ever happen again...basically, the "slump" Lou was probably hoping Clarkson would eventually break out of isn't a slump as much as it was Clarkson turning back into Clarkson again (almost overnight).  Just glad it's the Maple Leafs that are learning it the hard way. 

 

Devils had come within two games of winning a SC the season before and Lou likely thought they could at least pull it together enough to get into the playoffs, and thought guys like Clarkson would give the Devils the best chance to make that happen...he chose the present instead of the future.  Sadly, it didn't work out.            

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well well well how could this happen! You clearly said that NO GM IN THE WORLD would trade their best player/captain when they are in a race for the playoffs.

Well they have a chance to get a better player as his replacement. If we could have gotten MSL for Parise in 2012, I would have done it too.

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lol you don't see a comparison? I dont even see me bringing up Zach or any names or any comparisons at all. Putting words in my mouth again?

edit: just for fun, since you brought it up now. How 'bout clarkson? At the price he wanted and the fact that Lou gave up on him even before the deadline he was 100% not resigning too, but Lou waiting after it was too late fvcked our chances to get a return.

I apologize if you think I was putting words in your mouth, but if you weren't talking about parise the who were you referring to? What other captain have we've had in his walk year during a playoff run? What other captain leaving via ufa after a playoff run has been debated on here by you ad nauseum? If it isn't zach, then what point are you trying to make on a devils board by arguing whether or not gms trade a their captain during a playoff run? No, I don't think I put words in you mouth, I think you've been putting them there yourself for the past year and a half. Edited by dmann422

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You just cannot WAIT for chances to snivel about Lou's MO (I think EVERYONE here has gotten your point by now). 

 

As far as Clarkson goes, Lou rolled the dice and lost...that can and will sometimes happen, and all of the hindsight bitching, moaning, and should'ves won't change that.  GMs sometimes take chances and they don't all pay off, which opens them up to being criticized and second-guessed.  At the time, the Devils didn't have much in the way of goal-scoring, and Clarkson's recent track record, right or wrong, had suggested that he could score.  Unforunately we're seeing more and more that the 30 goals he scored in 2011-12 and the 10 goals he scored in 14 GP to start the 2013 season were flukey and probably won't ever happen again...basically, the "slump" Lou was probably hoping Clarkson would eventually break out of isn't a slump as much as it was Clarkson turning back into Clarkson again (almost overnight).  Just glad it's the Maple Leafs that are learning it the hard way. 

 

Devils had come within two games of winning a SC the season before and Lou likely thought they could at least pull it together enough to get into the playoffs, and thought guys like Clarkson would give the Devils the best chance to make that happen...he chose the present instead of the future.  Sadly, it didn't work out.            

 

We also have no idea if Lou actually looked into trading Clarkson and didn't get any offers that were worth much.  Maybe it was just from me watching him play on a nightly basis, but if I were another GM I would have maybe given up a third round pick for him.  At the deadline he probably had something like 11 goals and 18 points.  All of the Cup contenders that Lou might have presumably been able to make a trade with either had no use for him or  were able to get better players. 

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It was heavily implied though.

 

Regardless, Sather could trade Callahan at the deadline and it can blow up in his face.  We don't know yet.  In 2012 Lou saw that we were firmly in the playoffs and probably figured that what he had now was better than any return he could get.  He took a little bit of a gamble and it did pay off a bit.  I mean we made the finals that year when no one, even most Devils fans, expect ourselves too and we beat 2 of our biggest rivals on the way.  That alone is worth losing him.

 

Plus again Minnesota can have that and Suter's ridiculous contracts.  I'm glad we don't have any like that now that Kovy "retired"

 

Callahan is also making himself expendable, first by asking for too much money, and second by not really playing all that well for a guy who's supposed to be on a contract drive.  The sad thing is Lou thought the Devils needed Clarkson at the time (I can understand why, as I outlined in my previous post), and that whatever return he would get wouldn't help the 2013 product much.  If these St. Louis rumors are to be believed, the Rangers will be upgrading for this season, at the very least.  That's a big difference than trading someone for draft picks and/or prospects.   

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You just cannot WAIT for chances to snivel about Lou's MO (I think EVERYONE here has gotten your point by now). 

 

As far as Clarkson goes, Lou rolled the dice and lost...that can and will sometimes happen, and all of the hindsight bitching, moaning, and should'ves won't change that.  GMs sometimes take chances and they don't all pay off, which opens them up to being criticized and second-guessed.  At the time, the Devils didn't have much in the way of goal-scoring, and Clarkson's recent track record, right or wrong, had suggested that he could score.  Unforunately we're seeing more and more that the 30 goals he scored in 2011-12 and the 10 goals he scored in 14 GP to start the 2013 season were flukey and probably won't ever happen again...basically, the "slump" Lou was probably hoping Clarkson would eventually break out of isn't a slump as much as it was Clarkson turning back into Clarkson again (almost overnight).  Just glad it's the Maple Leafs that are learning it the hard way. 

 

Devils had come within two games of winning a SC the season before and Lou likely thought they could at least pull it together enough to get into the playoffs, and thought guys like Clarkson would give the Devils the best chance to make that happen...he chose the present instead of the future.  Sadly, it didn't work out.            

 

 and you just cannot WAIT for chances to snivel at me, cause really you dont miss a single chance

 

and no Lou didnt "roll the dice" he went with his black and white ways of NOT talking during the season. Thats not gambling, thats following a dumb way to do things and refusing to adapt to situations

I apologize if you think I was putting words in your mouth, but if you weren't talking about parise the who were you referring to? What other captain have we've had in his walk year during a playoff run? What other captain leaving via ufa after a playoff run has been debated on here by you ad nauseum? If it isn't zach, then what point are you trying to make on a devils board by arguing whether or not gms trade a their captain during a playoff run? No, I don't think I put words in you mouth, I think you've been putting them there yourself for the past year and a half.

 

I was referring to Brown wtv who said that the other day when people we're saying that maybe we should trade Jagr or wtv or assets. And that he was saying that no GM would trade players when they are in a race.

Edited by SterioDesign

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 and you just cannot WAIT for chances to snivel at me, cause really you dont miss a single chance

 

and no Lou didnt "roll the dice" he went with his black and white ways of NOT talking during the season. Thats not gambling, thats following a dumb way to do things and refusing to adapt to situations

 

Wrong, I've barely responded to anything you've posted lately, with the exception of you being a sore winner in the Olympic thread. 

 

I've already pointed out why I think Lou rolled the dice in 2013.  Assuming Lou did decide to subscribe to the SD way of GMing and chose to talk contract in-season, and Clarkson's demands were too much, knowing that Clarkson was probably not going to bring back anything that could help the Devils on 2013 (and probably nothing significant anyway) when Lou clearly didn't want to bail out on that season (like I said, I think Lou felt Clarkson could still help that team before it all went to sh!t), I don't think Lou necessarily throws his arms up and shrieks "OMG, I'd better trade this guy for a draft pick or two that might help us in three years before I lose him for nothing!"  Lou wasn't thinking about 2015 and beyond after getting to a Cup final in 2012.        

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Wrong, I've barely responded to anything you've posted lately, with the exception of you being a sore winner in the Olympic thread. 

 

I've already pointed out why I think Lou rolled the dice in 2013.  Assuming Lou did decide to subscribe to the SD way of GMing and chose to talk contract in-season, and Clarkson's demands were too much, knowing that Clarkson was probably not going to bring back anything that could help the Devils on 2013 (and probably nothing significant anyway) when Lou clearly didn't want to bail out on that season (like I said, I think Lou felt Clarkson could still help that team before it all went to sh!t), I don't think Lou necessarily throws his arms up and shrieks "OMG, I'd better trade this guy for a draft pick or two that might help us in three years before I lose him for nothing!"  Lou wasn't thinking about 2015 and beyond after getting to a Cup final in 2012.        

 

lol its not the SD way, its the every single GMs in the league except Lou way.

 

and again you're twisting what you want to believe to make Lou look good on that one as most of you does. Clarkson could have got a pretty good return at that time, absolutely. Not saying he's worth his contract but a player like that for the playoffs and at that time most teams still thought he was really a 30 goals scorer who could do it all. And based on the offers he got on free agency. Pretty damn sure we could have got anything better than NOTHING, and yeah. He was incredibly useful in the playoffs last year right?

 

and again, what you simply refuse to understand from what ive been saying for years. It's not about specifically what "happened" in those cases, cause every single cases are different and there's lots of shades and stuff we dont know. What i've been pointing out is that its absolutely dumb to refuse to give you that extra tool through negotiations to talk during the season. It's a really cocky, stubborn, "go big or go home" and black and white way to go and it can be pretty bad when he doesnt go your way and the benefits are not great or different either.

 

I dont CARE that his track record is good. I could decide that im not looking both ways before crossing the streets anymore and dont get hit for the first 3 years. Doesnt mean it's a smart thing to do.

Edited by SterioDesign

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I was referring to Brown wtv who said that the other day when people we're saying that maybe we should trade Jagr or wtv or assets. And that he was saying that no GM would trade players when they are in a race.

if that is truly the case that's fair but you specifically said captain, hence my assumption that you were talking about parise.wtv it not worth getting into.

So on your comparison of Callahan and jagr- I believe Lou will shop jagr just to see what he might be able to get, but I think (and Lou might think) that unless it's a slam dunk ie an nhl ready forward, it's better to hang onto him, play out the season, and maybe re-sign him for next year.

As opposed to Callahan, who clearly is not a ranger after this year and might be able to bring back an nhl ready player. I don't want a just first round pick for jagr, and by the looks of it Dolan doesn't want just a pick for Callahan.

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if that is truly the case that's fair but you specifically said captain, hence my assumption that you were talking about parise.wtv it not worth getting into.

So on your comparison of Callahan and jagr- I believe Lou will shop jagr just to see what he might be able to get, but I think (and Lou might think) that unless it's a slam dunk ie an nhl ready forward, it's better to hang onto him, play out the season, and maybe re-sign him for next year.

As opposed to Callahan, who clearly is not a ranger after this year and might be able to bring back an nhl ready player. I don't want a just first round pick for jagr, and by the looks of it Dolan doesn't want just a pick for Callahan.

 

listen. I did not make any comparison at all. 

 

This is a case of a guy saying "You'll never see a pig fly you're an idiot for thinking it would ever happen" and then one day you see a pig fly and you take a picture and send it to that guy with a "Ha!"

 

That's all it was.

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You could have made an argument for trading Clarkson last year but the Devils were still in a playoff position at the deadline.

Can the Rangers actually trade Callahan first before we start comparing it to Zach? The Kings were going to trade Dustin Brown two years ago too but that never happened. I'm still skeptical they trade him, but if they do it could well be in a package for an established scoring forward as opposed to just auctioning him off for futures.

Edited by NJDevs4978

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You could have made an argument for trading Clarkson last year but the Devils were still in a playoff position at the deadline.

Can the Rangers actually trade Callahan first before we start comparing it to Zach? The Kings were going to trade Dustin Brown two years ago too but that never happened. I'm still skeptical they trade him, but if they do it could well be in a package for an established scoring forward as opposed to just auctioning him off for futures.

 

If the Rangers do get a substantial return, it would also be because the team that was trading for him would probably already have an extension in place.  And for the last friggin' time, that could not have happened with Parise because of the old CBA, which gave no incentive for a pending UFA not to test the market other than perhaps giving a hometown discount.  If the new CBA were in place two years ago, Zach would either still be on the Devils or he would have been traded.

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lol its not the SD way, its the every single GMs in the league except Lou way.

 

and again you're twisting what you want to believe to make Lou look good on that one as most of you does. Clarkson could have got a pretty good return at that time, absolutely. Not saying he's worth his contract but a player like that for the playoffs and at that time most teams still thought he was really a 30 goals scorer who could do it all. And based on the offers he got on free agency. Pretty damn sure we could have got anything better than NOTHING, and yeah. He was incredibly useful in the playoffs last year right?

 

and again, what you simply refuse to understand from what ive been saying for years. It's not about specifically what "happened" in those cases, cause every single cases are different and there's lots of shades and stuff we dont know. What i've been pointing out is that its absolutely dumb to refuse to give you that extra tool through negotiations to talk during the season. It's a really cocky, stubborn, "go big or go home" and black and white way to go and it can be pretty bad when he doesnt go your way and the benefits are not great or different either.

 

I dont CARE that his track record is good. I could decide that im not looking both ways before crossing the streets anymore and dont get hit for the first 3 years. Doesnt mean it's a smart thing to do.

 

Already explained why, in this case, I don't think Lou talking contract in-season would've made all that much difference, and you have no idea what Clarkson would've fetched in a return...not only that, Lou thought his team was a playoff team at the time, so why would HE want to give up a "30-goal scorer who would do it all"?   

 

This is not a question of trying to make Lou look good.  Like I said, he took a chance and I explained exactly what taking that chance entailed.  No, it ultimately did not work out.  If you want to rip Lou for that, so be it.   

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You could have made an argument for trading Clarkson last year but the Devils were still in a playoff position at the deadline.

Can the Rangers actually trade Callahan first before we start comparing it to Zach? The Kings were going to trade Dustin Brown two years ago too but that never happened. I'm still skeptical they trade him, but if they do it could well be in a package for an established scoring forward as opposed to just auctioning him off for futures.

 

of course but again for the last time, at least by sitting with the guy and talking contract it gives you the chances to take a step back and make a decision and decide what's the best thing to do for the present AND the future, then you decide if you're willing to gamble. Cause you know the players demand, your chance of keeping him and you know you're playoffs chances. It gives you options to actually make a decision without being fvcked by a ridiculous demand or anything else that could go wrong and if you choose to part ways strictly based on demands well you can get a better return. 

 

im beyond disbelief that people can't "agree" about this common sense to at least TALK (not sign / trade) during the season, it absolutely wouldnt hurt to at least try. But of course people dont accept it simply cause its lou's way so they dont want to go against it.

Edited by SterioDesign

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Well now I know you are officially completely unequivocally insanely out of your mind. 4th line players don't get second line minutes because they can't produce as second line players. There's a reason Bernier nearly washed out of the league and was basically AHL fodder for a couple years and really hasn't been any good at all in his time in the NHL aside from a role as a checker with some physical edge.

And by the way, when Bernier was drafted, it was because he "HAD" the ability back then. But a lot of things change and sometimes things aren't actually what they were once thought to be. Hugh Jessiman was a first round pick and was picked before Parise. I guess he still has the "ability", no?

Bernier has been terrible this year by the way. Just want to remind everyone on that.

I think we're gonna get something out of him at some point. He's still young, could be a better Clarkson. He wasn't putting up bad numbers at all last year. If someone has shown that ability, especially at the NHL level, there's no reason to think the potential isn't there.

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listen. I did not make any comparison at all.

This is a case of a guy saying "You'll never see a pig fly you're an idiot for thinking it would ever happen" and then one day you see a pig fly and you take a picture and send it to that guy with a "Ha!"

That's all it was.

lol what you were the one who brought up jagr's name in a thread about Callahan. How is that not a comparison? If you didn't mean to that's fine but don't be surprised or offended when I take it that way and try to have a conversation about it. Sheesh.

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I bet he doesn't get traded.

 

I think this is just Sather attempting to force the Callahan camp into a deal.  A negotiation tactic.  That's my feeling.

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If the Rangers do get a substantial return, it would also be because the team that was trading for him would probably already have an extension in place. And for the last friggin' time, that could not have happened with Parise because of the old CBA, which gave no incentive for a pending UFA not to test the market other than perhaps giving a hometown discount. If the new CBA were in place two years ago, Zach would either still be on the Devils or he would have been traded.

Zach probably does stay under the new CBA but if anything the new CBA makes it far less of a gamble to sit on your player through July 1 than it was before 2013. Since the extra year and fewer cap shenanigans equalizes the field.

Plus people like SD don't want to acknowledge how big ownership's role is in what happened. Probably Lou hoped he would have more money the next summer to retain Zach if VBK could get his **** together by then. If he didn't think there was a better than 50/50 chance he stayed he wouldn't have made him captain IMO.

I bet he doesn't get traded.

I think this is just Sather attempting to force the Callahan camp into a deal. A negotiation tactic. That's my feeling.

I still think that too...usually if you're gonna trade a guy it isn't this public with leaks saying things like 'he's getting traded unless someone gets cold feet or someone lowers their asking price'.

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I bet he doesn't get traded.

 

I think this is just Sather attempting to force the Callahan camp into a deal.  A negotiation tactic.  That's my feeling.

 

That's why I think it's not '99% that he gets traded'.  But if I'm Callahan, I have to look at what Brad Richards is making and ask myself am I willing to take less again to stay here?  Why don't I get paid commensurate with what the market values me while this guy gets a huge windfall?

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Lou and Clarkson's mid season talk, 2013...

 

Lou: "Hey Dave, are you gonna want lots and lots of money in July?"

 

Clarkson: "YUP!"

 

This checks out. I definitely see how this could have changed things.

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