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The 2014 NJ Devils Offseason Thread

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I think it's a foregone conclusion that Gionta is going to be back, though, I hope he does explore UFA.  I just hope they slot Sislo in there because is speed and shot are welcome on this team

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I'm trying to think of a time Lou has said he doesn't want to keep a UFA.  

 

Gionta being back, provided it's for a 6 figure salary, would not be all bad.  The issue will be years, Gionta shouldn't be on a two year contract.

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I'm trying to think of a time Lou has said he doesn't want to keep a UFA.  

 

Gionta being back, provided it's for a 6 figure salary, would not be all bad.  The issue will be years, Gionta shouldn't be on a two year contract.

 

Difference between saying you want them back and we'll see or something.

 

I think Gionta and Carter are back. Lou and Pete are big fans of both. Not looking forward to any of the contracts though. Gionta and his agent are going to feel they earned a 1-way deal and probably would like some years too.

Edited by devilsrule33

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Difference between saying you want them back and we'll see or something.

 

I think Gionta and Carter are back. Lou and Pete are big fans of both. Not looking forward to any of the contracts though. Gionta and his agent are going to feel they earned a 1-way deal and probably would like some years too.

 

I mean, we'll see is usually reserved for rental types.

 

I don't really care about a 1 way contract for Gionta because he's earned a spot on the NHL team.  My issue would be with years because I don't think he has many to be an NHL contributor at the level he's contributing at, and I don't know how long it will take for NJ to recognize that.

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I mean, we'll see is usually reserved for rental types.

 

I don't really care about a 1 way contract for Gionta because he's earned a spot on the NHL team.  My issue would be with years because I don't think he has many to be an NHL contributor at the level he's contributing at, and I don't know how long it will take for NJ to recognize that.

How often does a fourth line journeyman like Gionta get more than 2 years?

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I wouldn't go nuts if Carter and Gio come back on one year deals. They are what they are, bona fide NHL fourth liners that should make six figures. And again, much as people seem to dump on Gionta, he was a big part of a PK that was the best in the league. Signing only two of them leaves an extra spot for a player like Sislo or Matteau to break into the league for good, especially when you consider that injuries are inevitable.

I am much more afraid that Lou will stubbornly hang on to Salvador (I won't say anything bad about Volchenkov for somewhat personal reasons). There are at least two or three defenseman whose spot he occupies that are better than him. And even if you believe in intangibles, and leadership, he doesn't really bring a lot to the table there. Hopefully the fancy stat guy can convince Lou that the Devils are simply a better team without him in both the near and long term.

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I'm trying to think of a time Lou has said he doesn't want to keep a UFA.

Gionta being back, provided it's for a 6 figure salary, would not be all bad. The issue will be years, Gionta shouldn't be on a two year contract.

He famously said it about Brian gionta. We've gotta get rod pelley in the lineup.

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He famously said it about Brian gionta. We've gotta get rod pelley in the lineup.

 

Pelley was to replace Madden, but I think he knew quickly that neither were coming back and wasn't afraid to say so.

 

Daniel, I don't think Gionta had much to do with the Devils PK. Not a big fan of his on the PK. Gionta is a fine 4th liner, but he wasn't a 4th liner for much of the season. He also got bumped up in the 3rd period when he wasn't on a 3rd line. It's an issue when coaches are infatuated with these kind of players where you start playing Gionta with Elias because "he can play anywhere". That simply was not the case.

 

It's going to take a long time before any Stats department is going to get through to Lou and Pete about the Salvador's or the Giontas because these are the kind of players coaches are enamored with that bring much needed grit. toughness, and locker room intangibles.

Edited by devilsrule33

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Difference between saying you want them back and we'll see or something.

I think Gionta and Carter are back. Lou and Pete are big fans of both. Not looking forward to any of the contracts though. Gionta and his agent are going to feel they earned a 1-way deal and probably would like some years too.

That's nice. Unfortunately Gionta is terrible.

Sislo deserves a shot and offers more as a winger.

How often does a fourth line journeyman like Gionta get more than 2 years?

When your coach and GM are clueless.

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He famously said it about Brian gionta. We've gotta get rod pelley in the lineup.

 

He said those things after the player left.  I'm talking about before the guy leaves.

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Pelley was to replace Madden, but I think he knew quickly that neither were coming back and wasn't afraid to say so.

Daniel, I don't think Gionta had much to do with the Devils PK. Not a big fan of his on the PK. Gionta is a fine 4th liner, but he wasn't a 4th liner for much of the season. He also got bumped up in the 3rd period when he wasn't on a 3rd line. It's an issue when coaches are infatuated with these kind of players where you start playing Gionta with Elias because "he can play anywhere". That simply was not the case.

It's going to take a long time before any Stats department is going to get through to Lou and Pete about the Salvador's or the Giontas because these are the kind of players coaches are enamored with that bring much needed grit. toughness, and locker room intangibles.

Whether Gionta had much to do with the penalty kill's success I can't tell you. I just know that the PK was very good, and he got a lot of PK time, so he obviously is not the albatross that people think, especially when you keep in mind that he was a bottom line player who gets 12 minutes of ice time a game. The fancy stats can say whatever they say about him, he's just not really the difference between winning and losing, and might actually be a net positive regardless since you don't have to pay him much, and you can jettison him if it's really clear that he can't hack it.

Sal is a different issue. There are players that he is preventing from playing that would make the Devils better. What could prove to ultimately force Lou's hand is that Larsson has to be on the NHL roster this year because he's waiver eligible. I think when push comes to shove, even if DeBoer has a vendetta against Larsson, Lou is not stupid enough to have him picked off waivers for the sake of Sal's overrated intangibles. The nail in the coffin for Sal and Volchenkov could be the stat person telling Lou not that the two of them stink, but that Fayne is extremely underrated, and you basically have an opportunity to lock him up for the relative long term for a bargain. Or, he tells Lou to look at what the Rags gave Girardi, and that you can have someone that's better than him for a lot less.

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Carter I definitely want back... Gionta I guess I can live with... If we bring back Bernier, I'll pop a vein. He's garbage. Let him go Lou.

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Pelley was to replace Madden, but I think he knew quickly that neither were coming back and wasn't afraid to say so.

 

Daniel, I don't think Gionta had much to do with the Devils PK. Not a big fan of his on the PK. Gionta is a fine 4th liner, but he wasn't a 4th liner for much of the season. He also got bumped up in the 3rd period when he wasn't on a 3rd line. It's an issue when coaches are infatuated with these kind of players where you start playing Gionta with Elias because "he can play anywhere". That simply was not the case.

 

It's going to take a long time before any Stats department is going to get through to Lou and Pete about the Salvador's or the Giontas because these are the kind of players coaches are enamored with that bring much needed grit. toughness, and locker room intangibles.

 

You can't on the one hand talk about a stats department and then talk about how you don't like Gionta on the PK.  Gionta had a better shots against rate than any of the regular penalty killing defensemen.  Now granted he had a much worse SV% while on ice, but we know that there's no way we can make any sort of claim about that with one season's worth of data (or even two - and Gionta looks bad last year also).

 

Gionta *can* play anywhere in the sense that he won't be totally lost, he just has zero finish.  He cannot score goals.  He's no longer a territorial drag though.  The Devils have employed much worse over the last several years.

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Carter I definitely want back... Gionta I guess I can live with... If we bring back Bernier, I'll pop a vein. He's garbage. Let him go Lou.

my EXACT thoughts.. i happen to like ryan carter he brings certain elements that are a plus.. hes a fighter too and we dont have many of those on our team.. gionta i wouldnt mind if he came back the guy breaks his ass and works hard every single night i wouldnt be sadened if he left but wouldnt mind if he came back. Now bernier on the other hand Jesus Christ i dont even understand why lou would want him back..this guy is the definition off dead weight.. hes useless and is a waste of a spot on this roster.. i pray he does not come back here!

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You can't on the one hand talk about a stats department and then talk about how you don't like Gionta on the PK.  Gionta had a better shots against rate than any of the regular penalty killing defensemen.  Now granted he had a much worse SV% while on ice, but we know that there's no way we can make any sort of claim about that with one season's worth of data (or even two - and Gionta looks bad last year also).

 

Gionta *can* play anywhere in the sense that he won't be totally lost, he just has zero finish.  He cannot score goals.  He's no longer a territorial drag though.  The Devils have employed much worse over the last several years.

 

Well I wasn't citing a statistic to show Gionta is good and another to say he is bad. I don't think there is enough data to say if Gionta is a great PKer or not. I am not in love with him because he has no reach and isn't overly fast.

 

I know some of the numbers show some good that Gionta does and that's fine, but if he gets re-signed for a few more years, I imagine that's at least two more years of Pete trusting Gionta in important defensive situations, or 5-on-6, or moving him up to play with players he shouldn't. This is what happens when coaches have higher expectations for some players than others. Any positive Gionta does, he gets talked up.

 

It's the same way with Carter to a lesser extent. He can be MIA for 20 games, and then he chips in with a goal, and we can sing his praises for another few months even if he doesn't do anything.

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Other than the magic they struck in the 2012 run into the lockout season, CBGB is an average fourth line and a terrible third line. They did have a hell of a run though, you have to admit. But that time has come to an end. Bernier looked lazy and slow last year, Gionta is an acceptable fourth liner but is constantly punching above his weight getting bigger roles. I do like Carter, and ideally he is the only one who would be back.

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In a perfect world (which would mean no Bernier or Gionta), Josefson would be centering the 4th line with Carter and Zubrus/Ruutu. But Zubrus and Ruutu make too much money to play on the 4th line, and Pete and Lou worship Gionta.

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Who cares if Zubrus and Ruutu make to much money, they should be on the fourth line, throw Matteau on that line if you want to keep the price down

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It's going to take a long time before any Stats department is going to get through to Lou and Pete about the Salvador's or the Giontas because these are the kind of players coaches are enamored with that bring much needed grit. toughness, and locker room intangibles.

 

This seems to indicate that Gionta should not be on the team, but it could be a response to Daniel.

 

Well I wasn't citing a statistic to show Gionta is good and another to say he is bad. I don't think there is enough data to say if Gionta is a great PKer or not. I am not in love with him because he has no reach and isn't overly fast.

 

 

I know some of the numbers show some good that Gionta does and that's fine, but if he gets re-signed for a few more years, I imagine that's at least two more years of Pete trusting Gionta in important defensive situations, or 5-on-6, or moving him up to play with players he shouldn't. This is what happens when coaches have higher expectations for some players than others. Any positive Gionta does, he gets talked up.

 

It's the same way with Carter to a lesser extent. He can be MIA for 20 games, and then he chips in with a goal, and we can sing his praises for another few months even if he doesn't do anything.

 

Gionta should be trusted in important defensive situations, he has a very good shots against rate.  It's part of what he excels at is suppressing shots against.

 

Look, ideally a 4th line is a bunch of young players who are good (or at least decent) in all situations who don't have a spot in the top 9 forwards.  Think Pandolfo-Madden.  The Blackhawks have put together a solid 4th line.  The Devils don't have that.  They might with Josefson, although I don't think Josefson played very well at all last year.  They might see fit to try to get a guy who can be elevated to other lines for their 4th line, but I think I'd rather have Gionta because I think he'll be cheaper.

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This seems to indicate that Gionta should not be on the team, but it could be a response to Daniel.

 

 

Gionta should be trusted in important defensive situations, he has a very good shots against rate.  It's part of what he excels at is suppressing shots against.

 

Look, ideally a 4th line is a bunch of young players who are good (or at least decent) in all situations who don't have a spot in the top 9 forwards.  Think Pandolfo-Madden.  The Blackhawks have put together a solid 4th line.  The Devils don't have that.  They might with Josefson, although I don't think Josefson played very well at all last year.  They might see fit to try to get a guy who can be elevated to other lines for their 4th line, but I think I'd rather have Gionta because I think he'll be cheaper.

 

The Devils could have that with Sislo, Josefson and Matteau or maybe even Darcy Zajac. You bring the entire 4th line back, and there is no chance of it happening.

 

Sometimes there is no room for youngsters to step in and sometimes there is. This season is definitely that year.

 

As a unit, there is nothing special about that group. The Cup run created more goals from them than all of last season. The Cup run created more goals from Salvador than he'll get in 5 seasons. It was a great run, but it is painful that Lou would still get tricked into those 20-something games when making roster decisions two years later.

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The Devils could have that with Sislo, Josefson and Matteau or maybe even Darcy Zajac. You bring the entire 4th line back, and there is no chance of it happening.

 

Sometimes there is no room for youngsters to step in and sometimes there is. This season is definitely that year.

 

As a unit, there is nothing special about that group. The Cup run created more goals from them than all of last season. The Cup run created more goals from Salvador than he'll get in 5 seasons. It was a great run, but it is painful that Lou would still get tricked into those 20-something games when making roster decisions two years later.

 

Matteau had 13 goals in 67 games last year.  That's not exceptional - it's decent for a 19 year old, but not exceptional.  He'll be an NHL player, probably, but he has one year of AHL eligibility left - I'd prefer he stayed in the AHL as long as possible unless he really turns heads.

 

Josefson now has 2 straight years of being pretty not good.  I'm not sure what the Devils plan to do with him.  I'd like to see him get 20 straight games in the lineup, but he also cannot seem to score.

 

Sislo is an NHL player - of course, NJ has to re-sign him first, as he is also a UFA.  He's not young.  He belongs in the NHL but it's hard to imagine given his offense in the AHL that he would ever be anything more than a 4th liner.

 

I assume you mean Kelly Zajac but I doubt he'd be as good as Gionta.

 

None of these players should be 3rd liners at any point except maybe Josefson.  Now neither should Bernier or Gionta, hopefully, but the trouble is that NJ doesn't have the minor league depth to make this happen.  They have Reid Boucher and that's it for now.

 

That 4th line doesn't have some sort of special chemistry, but it's a lot better than it's being given credit for being.  This is a franchise that's given 100 games to Tim Sestito, and more than that to Rod Pelley.  The 4th line has been good/decent in these seasons post lockout-II:  2009, 2010, 2013, 2014.  The rest, it's been largely a disaster, with 2012 reserved for being a special disaster.

Edited by Triumph

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