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The 2014 NJ Devils Offseason Thread

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Yeah I'd love to hear all about the 30 RWs or 60 wingers overall better than Jaromir Jagr.  Then I can hear about the 60 centers better than Patrik Elias.  The Devils need to improve their forwards without question, I just think people wildly underrate their own players when it comes to assigning who is 'first line' worthy.

Edited by Triumph

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Three question go through my minde 1. Will Lou use his last buy out.  2. Is Salvador going to be healthy enough to help this team next year.  3. Is not only is Clowe going to be healthy to play next year but should he play next year.  With all those head injuries I am not sure he should play next year. One last thing i hope Lou get rid of the fourth line we have right now.  Thanks for helping us get to the finals but Devils need to move past that now                                                              

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Sal gets all flustered when he handles the puck now. He's like the doctor that had the yips on Curb Your Enthusiasm

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Lmao @ Elias not being a top 6 forward. That is a bit much, even for you SD. The guy put up almost exactly the same ppg as Jagr. What makes Jagr top 6 worthy, but not Elias?

Edited by ATLL765

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Elias and Jagr no question still have 1st line on their resume, because their skill level and hockey sense is so high even if certain elements are fading (endurance/speed/shot quality).

That said, their minutes have to be watched and considering their age, you do have to worry about the cliff showing up more an dmore.  I don't see that big of a concern, but you can't deny it's in the room.

The biggest problem I have with the team is that the forwards mix is just so terrible which to me forces the age issue to the forefront maybe more than it should. If the Devils had some competent young guns, it probably wouldn't be that worrisome.

 

Tri brought up Selanne on the Ducks, but he's been extremely protected the last couple years by Boudreau and the Ducks, and hasn't been eating quite as heavy minutes like Jagr has.  Selanne's skating for his age has also been quite good.  It's a fair example on his part in regards to the age concern, but it's not really an apples to apples comparison when you consider the big picture.  Now, to the credit of Jagr, he's also been asked to face harsher competition overall due to the minutes and playing 1st line roles.

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Well guys if you dont agree, you dont agree. Thats it.

 

There isn't much to agree on here. Good luck finding anyone to agree with you. Elias not good enough for top 6? You have him win a group with Brunner and Ryder. It's insulting to Elias. It's insulting to us. 0.82 points per game last year...good for 42nd in the league. As has already been said, that's exactly Jagr's number.  It was pretty much identical with Parise/Hossa/Couture/Eberle/Landeskog/Pacioretty and better than JVR/Skinner/Franzen/Lucic.

 

You'd be best to rethink that one. I should add of course Elias is not a one dimensional player either.

Edited by devilsrule33

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Elias and Jagr no question still have 1st line on their resume, because their skill level and hockey sense is so high even if certain elements are fading (endurance/speed/shot quality).

That said, their minutes have to be watched and considering their age, you do have to worry about the cliff showing up more an dmore.  I don't see that big of a concern, but you can't deny it's in the room.

The biggest problem I have with the team is that the forwards mix is just so terrible which to me forces the age issue to the forefront maybe more than it should. If the Devils had some competent young guns, it probably wouldn't be that worrisome.

 

Tri brought up Selanne on the Ducks, but he's been extremely protected the last couple years by Boudreau and the Ducks, and hasn't been eating quite as heavy minutes like Jagr has.  Selanne's skating for his age has also been quite good.  It's a fair example on his part in regards to the age concern, but it's not really an apples to apples comparison when you consider the big picture.  Now, to the credit of Jagr, he's also been asked to face harsher competition overall due to the minutes and playing 1st line roles.

 

That's fair re: ice time - Elias and Jagr should probably get less of it next year.  I don't think Selanne is a very good player lately, though, and especially not this year.  He's a power play ace, mediocre at 5 on 5.  I think Jaromir Jagr was much, much better than him through each of their respective primes and that that has stayed true now as well.  It just shows up in their +/- - Jagr is +200 more than Selanne.  Neither guy really played for that many great 5 on 5 teams in their career, Jagr's just better, and he's still better.  In fact what I'd want in an ideal world is Elias and Jagr moved to the 2nd PP unit with Gelinas anchoring the first PP unit with whatever else they want to put out there with him.

Edited by Triumph

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First Jagr's contract is bad and now Elias isn't a top 6 forward. NJDevs going crazy this off-season.

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I know I keep saying this and it's a pipe dream but if we can land both Vrbata and Statsny then this team is golden and solidifies the top 6 and it makes sure the likes of Ruutu Ryder Brunner and Zubrus remain in the bottom 6. Lou needs to make a big splash for the offense, it would be a breathe of fresh air for the team.

Elias Statsny Vrbata

Henrique Zajac Jagr

Edited by Zubie#8

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There isn't much to agree on here. Good luck finding anyone to agree with you. Elias not good enough for top 6? You have him win a group with Brunner and Ryder. It's insulting to Elias. It's insulting to us. 0.82 points per game last year...good for 42nd in the league. As has already been said, that's exactly Jagr's number.  It was pretty much identical with Parise/Hossa/Couture/Eberle/Landeskog/Pacioretty and better than JVR/Skinner/Franzen/Lucic.

 

You'd be best to rethink that one. I should add of course Elias is not a one dimensional player either.

 

It was not a knock on Elias,he's one of my fav of all time and one of the smartest. He's obviously above Brunner and Ryder we all know that, my "grouping" was rather large and it was more about his style of play. And i meant at his point of his career he's getting pretty damn slow and his style is not really suited as a 3rd line grinder either. I give Jagr a slight edge cause he's a beast and he can control the play like no one and he's so hard to knock off the puck, Elias is super easy to knock off his skates now and he takes years to get back up. I still don't see him as a "perfect top 6 player" anymore. Thats not saying he sucks or anything. 

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It was not a knock on Elias,he's one of my fav of all time and one of the smartest. He's obviously above Brunner and Ryder we all know that, my "grouping" was rather large and it was more about his style of play. And i meant at his point of his career he's getting pretty damn slow and his style is not really suited as a 3rd line grinder either. I give Jagr a slight edge cause he's a beast and he can control the play like no one and he's so hard to knock off the puck, Elias is super easy to knock off his skates now and he takes years to get back up. I still don't see him as a "perfect top 6 player" anymore. Thats not saying he sucks or anything.

You're missing everything he said. 42nd in points per game in the league says he is quite clearly a top 6 forward.

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You're missing everything he said. 42nd in points per game in the league says he is quite clearly a top 6 forward.

 

if anything all those "responses" were replies to MY post... when i posted it i had more in mind what Lou had to get to long term and where we we're lacking and what we needed going forward. I may not have mentioned it clearly or wtv but i s hould know what i meant, fair that some didnt take it this way. But Elias is going downhill and won't be here in the long run. So is Jagr.

 

I guess what i ultimately means or want to figure out is where our long term core is. like... will Zajac and Henrique be our top 2 centers for years to come? i dont think thats good enough. Should Henrique be moved to wing permanently because of that so that then we know we have to go for a center? or a winger? etc etc

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If SJ is moving players after this abomination, definitely something we should look into

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If SJ is moving players after this abomination, definitely something we should look into

 

Why?  The ones they're going to move are over 30 with a ton of miles on them anyway, they ain't trading Couture.

And they just signed Thornton and Marleau to extensions too, good luck with that Wilson lol

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First things first; finding a steady LW for Zajac and Jagr should be the top goal now that Jagr is taken care of.

Internally, if they go with Zubrus I don't think I'll be able to handle it.

Ruutu would not be great, but passable. Those three played pretty well together. Boucher deserves a look with them. Then there is Henrique and Elias, but I'd rather have them be 2/3 of the second line. Clowe maybe? Hmm, I wonder how that would look.

XXXX Zajer Jagr

Henrique Elias YYYY

Ruutu, Clowe, Brunner, Ryder, and Boucher should be the ones in the running for those two openings.

We have a log jam of mediocre forwards, I wonder how it's going to sort out.

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I really think we'll see how good Lou can be this offseason cause he has to make the right moves and his margin of error is pretty small or we'll get the same results than this year.

 

Our problem is that we have too many good but average players. We barely have room to sign people without creating another logjam of average players. We dont really have a legit first line guy either. This is how i see our team

 

2nd line guys:

Henrique

Zajac

Jagr

 

Below average or borderline top6 but not suited for 3rd line:

Elias

Ryder

Brunner

 

3rd line:

Clowe

Josefson

Zubrus

Ruutu

 

Above average 4th liner:

Carter

Bernier

 

4th liner:

Gionta

 

He'll have to find ways to infuse talent, let go of extra weight that can get some kind of fair compensation and make room for better suited players.

 

Hahhaha, you'll never believe it but for a second I thought you grouped Elias in with Brunner and Ryder. hahahaha.....oh....

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rumor has it Panthers are shopping there first round pick.  Should the Devils try to get this pick and what would they have to give up to get it, Andy Green maybe

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rumor has it Panthers are shopping there first round pick. Should the Devils try to get this pick and what would they have to give up to get it, Andy Green maybe

I doubt the panthers really want one year of Andy Greene, they will find much better offers elsewhere, besides if we want to compete for a playoff spot next year we have nobody ready to fill in for Greene should he be moved (and him not being moved and eventually being quietly re-signed is one thing I will bet good money on).

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We have no one on our roster (single player) that would reap us a first round pick. I love Andy green but please, he's no Shea Weber.  I'll bet Habs would love Gelly but he'll be a first/2nd pp guy.

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rumor has it Panthers are shopping there first round pick.  Should the Devils try to get this pick and what would they have to give up to get it, Andy Green maybe

 

My idea was to trade Larsson for Edmonton's first rounder, depending on what our scouts thought of the forwards that would be available there.  During the season, MacTavish said that the pick was in play.

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My idea was to trade Larsson for Edmonton's first rounder, depending on what our scouts thought of the forwards that would be available there.  During the season, MacTavish said that the pick was in play.

 

I don't mean this in an attacking way, I'm just curious - do you really value Larsson that little?  Or rather, do you think his ceiling is that low?

 

To me it seems crazy to trade Larsson (with a few years under his belt now) for a 1st round pick - it'd be essentially starting over.  

Edited by Devilsfan118

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I don't mean this in an attacking way, I'm just curious - do you really value Larsson that little?  Or rather, do you think his ceiling is that low?

 

To me it seems crazy to trade Larsson (with a few years under his belt now) for a 1st round pick - it'd be essentially starting over.  

 

Not at all.  We have plenty of young defenders and some very good veterans as it is, such that Larsson is not as important to the Devils as people might have once thought.  Basically, the defense, even with guys like Salvador and inexperienced player in Merrill and Gelinas playing a lot of games was still a great unit this season, not to mention that Merrill is probably better than Larsson. 

 

in the meantime, you'd get a young forward that experience in other drafts would tell you should become at least a second line forward in two or three years, if not sooner.  Or at least the forwards that have been drafted in the three or next closest spot over the past few years have proven to be that, or even better... Drouin, Galchenyuk, Huberdeau, Johansen, Duchene. 

 

Again, I couldn't tell you the first thing about Bennett, Reinhart or Draisitl, but if past results are any indication, the chances are pretty good that we would be getting much needed help at forward in the relative short term.

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Why trade the larson for the pick to edmonton, why not just take one of their fowards. Give them Larson for Taylor Hall :D make it happen!

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I don't think the Devils would trade away Larsson when they have taken such a careful approach with his development.  He wasn't kept out of the lineup because he wasn't good enough.  He's been able to (hopefully) develop some of his offensive skills (PP positioning) while playing in the A, not to mention developing some mental fortitude and confidence.  Having too many dmen who are overly-agressive and not solid in their own ends can be playing with fire.  Such as keeping players such as Gelinas AND Zidlicky in every game.  It could be possibly why Gelinas and Larsson looked good together when they played this season, as the more conservative Larsson covered up the aggressiveness of Gelinas.  My two cents.

Edited by RizzMB30

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