NJDevs4978

2015 New York Jets thread

1,021 posts in this topic

they need a reliable te behind gronk

 

They could actually use Keller as a cheap #2 TE.

 

..here's the thing, Keller is not a reliable TE. You're going to supplement an injury prone Gronkowski, with a TE 6 years older, who's also injury prone? That's like the Jets signing Jake Delhomme to play backup to Michael Vick. :P

 

Keller had such a hideous injury last year that I wonder if he'll ever be the same

 

ditto. I think it speaks volumes (given the "spite-factor" benefit of the doubt by BB) that Keller left Foxboro without a contract yesterday. New England's TE cupboard is practically empty outside of RG. If they didn't sign him, it means Dustin's a shell of shell of what he once was.

Edited by Beezer34

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The Pat's usually stock pile draft picks, finding a new version of Gronk in the draft should not be that tough.  Considering the TONS of UFA TE's they have had in camp and just cut.   Grooming a "Gronk" who is only good for maybe 8 games a season via the draft is probably the direction the Pat go. 

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The Pat's usually stock pile draft picks, finding a new version of Gronk in the draft should not be that tough.  Considering the TONS of UFA TE's they have had in camp and just cut.   Grooming a "Gronk" who is only good for maybe 8 games a season via the draft is probably the direction the Pat go. 

 

You cannot just find a new version of Gronkowski anywhere in the draft or off the free agency scrapheap.  Everyone knew he had first round talent, but fell because of injury concerns, which did not prove to be unfounded.  He has a very unique skill set, which is evidenced by the fact that every team is looking for a TE like him, but virtually all of them come up way short.  It was a similar situation with Hernandez, who everyone knew was supremely talented, but had character issues, which also did not prove to be unfounded.  It's the same reason the Pats couldn't just plug in a WR that proved to be as good as Randy Moss during the 2008 season. 

 

Now, the Patriots have an excellent QB and an offensive system that has withstood the test of time.  So, yes, the Pats could plug in a halfway decent TE who will perform much better than if he were on some other team.  It's the same thing with a Peyton Manning run offense, who will make TEs like Dallas Clark and Julius Jones look like world beaters.  If you asked him though, he would give anything to have healthy TE that is as good as Gronkowski. 

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Chris Baker, Shaun Ellis, Danny Woodhead, James Ihedigbo, Darrelle Revis, Tim Tebow, Dustin Keller.. (since only 2010 mind you!)

..aren't they cute! :wub:  :wub: Keep sucking on the tailpipe of démodé ingredients from yester-year fella's. --next up: Bart Scott.

u forgot leon Washington ;)

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It's obnoxious CR, anyway you slice it.

..they caught lightning in a bottle with Woodhead 5 years ago, and have desperately been trying to find the next player that'll tweak the Jets since. There's 11 other TE's on the market, all of whom are UFA's, that are either the same as Keller skill-wise, or better.

 

5 TD's in 16 games in 2011..

2 TD's in 8 games in 2012..

0 TD's in 0 games in 2013..

 

..old man Kellen Winslow has more TD's since 2008 (playing for 4 different teams) than DK has, with just the Jets alone.

 

Keller turns 30 years old in four months, off seasons where he played through a pulled groin & shoulder injury in 2011.. missed half the season due to a fractured ankle in 2012.. and the entire 2013 season tearing his PCL, MCL, & ACL in his knee. I think it's a safe bet to assume his best years are behind him.

 

..but again, I won't be shocked when Santonio Holmes gets camp invite either. But don't lie and say you don't blush with each one of these antics. ;)

 

It was only the preseaon, but Keller looked poised to have a monster year last season before the injury.  It didn't help that he was playing in an anemic offense for much of his time with the Jets.  So I could see why the Pats wanted to give him a look.  Obviously his knee must be really screwed up.  But if he ever recovers, he's definitely a TE that a team with a capable offense should take a chance on.   

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You cannot just find a new version of Gronkowski anywhere in the draft or off the free agency scrapheap.  Everyone knew he had first round talent, but fell because of injury concerns, which did not prove to be unfounded.  He has a very unique skill set, which is evidenced by the fact that every team is looking for a TE like him, but virtually all of them come up way short.  It was a similar situation with Hernandez, who everyone knew was supremely talented, but had character issues, which also did not prove to be unfounded.  It's the same reason the Pats couldn't just plug in a WR that proved to be as good as Randy Moss during the 2008 season. 

 

Now, the Patriots have an excellent QB and an offensive system that has withstood the test of time.  So, yes, the Pats could plug in a halfway decent TE who will perform much better than if he were on some other team.  It's the same thing with a Peyton Manning run offense, who will make TEs like Dallas Clark and Julius Jones look like world beaters.  If you asked him though, he would give anything to have healthy TE that is as good as Gronkowski. 

 

I said it last season, but Gronk has really become the Patriots' MVP.  Yes, Brady is still Brady and still very capable of greatness, but the offense changes drastically when Gronkowski is one of his primary weapons.  And that's a problem, because it's so hard to know how much you can expect to get out of him now.  He's played in 18 out of 32 regular-season games the past two seasons, and missed the playoffs both times.  I remember when Flyers fans used to say things like "if Lindros stays healthy"..."if Forsberg stays healthy".  Problem is those guys rarely seemed to stay healthy.  Gronk is getting to that point, where banking on him to play more than 10 games a year is probably foolish.   

 

Anyway, they've got to find a TE somewhere that can at least be a poor man's Gronk, if they want to stick with Plan A. 

 

And yeah, why not give Keller a look at this point?  Not much harm in it.  Who knows, if he shows progress, maybe they give him a look during the preseason or even during the season.       

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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u forgot leon Washington ;)

http://www.zamzar.com/download.php?uid=6ee67ce9ba32a5df6896f85eba38cadd-86a8cb16c1c93a4c&targetID=pmVo4ovEoklD6h7F90sLTw_I_I&fileID=p1933df0v3k0h6dj5q8aftgfq4.gif

..that I did.

8 former Jets signed in a 4 year span. (an average of 2 per season) Obsess Much? :giggle:

Edited by Beezer34

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..that I did.

8 former Jets signed in a 4 year span. (an average of 2 per season) Obsess Much? :giggle:

its a rivalry wat do u expect

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Maybe BB thought that the Jet players he targeted could be of help?  2 games minimum per season against them means he gets to know their personnel pretty well, and BB has a way of getting more out of some players than most would expect.  Could be that simple.  The "I can get more than anyone else can" approach hasn't always worked out for him...not going to argue that.  I'll never understand what Tebow was all about...that I'll admit freely.

 

Not sure why he'd be "obsessed" with a team he usually beats without too much problem.  There's nothing the Jets have done for him to envy.  Like I've pointed out, Jets came up huge in beating NE in the playoffs a while back, but other than that, the positive moments for the Jets against the Pats have been pretty few and far between.  This season, it's time for Rex to make inroads again in the rivalry, to start at least splitting the games against the Pats routinely.  He did a nice job in taking 3-out-of-5 in his first two seasons (topping that off with the Foxborough playoff win), but that's old news now.      

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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Rex did a nice job in taking 3-out-of-5 in his first two seasons (topping that off with the Foxborough playoff win), but that's old news now.

 

I don't necessarily think going 4-7 against the Pats since 2009, during (what will be viewed as) their "Juggernaut Years" is terribly bad. Granted, I'm not saying I'm proud of it.. but you are talking about the combination of arguably the best QB\Coach combo in NFL history. The timeline is also subjective to that of the moment. If the Jets sweep NE this season, then you're looking at only 7 losses in a 13 games span.. and that wouldn't be bad at all.

 

its a rivalry wat do u expect

 

..give and take. I wouldn't even care so much if the Jets reciprocated, but.. I guess that's what happens with rivals. I can remember the 6-7 year period when Lou was OBSESSED with Ranger castoff's. Bernie Nicholls, Sergei Nemchinov, Esa Tikkanen, John Vanbiesbrouck, Herb Brooks.. there was a conga-line that ran through the Lincoln Tunnel. But then 2000 hit, and the pendulum swung the other way.

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Not really juggernaut years, in that the Pats haven't won any championships in that time.  More like almost-juggernauts.  You yourself have also pointed out that the gaudy regular season won-lost records have been a result of a weak AFC East and some weak overall schedules as well, and there's some truth to that. 

 

Jets haven't swept NE since the 2000 season.  Pretty tall order.  I'm guessing it will be a split again this year, same as last, though neither team is a finished product yet. 

 

Same as BB, I don't think Lou ever made a move for an ex-Ranger because he was somehow obsessed with ex-Rangers.  I think he looks for players who he think can help, and then sets out to get them...I don't think he could care at all about whether or not they were Rangers.  No one really thinks of the Rangers when they think of Herb Brooks anyway...they think Miracle On Ice.  But you do get to see more of those guys than you might some others, so it's easy to have a little more first-hand knowledge of them. 

 

If Lou was truly "obsessed" with any franchise's lineage, I'd say it was the Canadiens...he kind of had Jacques Lemaire and Larry Robinson install their blueprint for winning, brought in Claude Lemieux and Stephane Richer, after years of having some nice talent, but no real MO on how to win with it.   

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And yeah, why not give Keller a look at this point?  Not much harm in it.  Who knows, if he shows progress, maybe they give him a look during the preseason or even during the season.       

this. like i said b4, hes never played with a qb as good as brady. beez is scared like the rest of jets fans that he will turn around his career

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this. like i said b4, hes never played with a qb as good as brady. beez is scared like the rest of jets fans that he will turn around his career

SCARED OF WHAT?! :w00t: -lol..

..the 5 games he'll play with the Pats, before he gets carted off the field?! TAKE HIM.. PLEASE! I seriously hope they do. What am I afraid of?! He left without a contract!!

http://bostonherald.com/sports/patriots_nfl/new_england_patriots/2014/04/ex_jets_te_dustin_keller_visits_pats_leaves_without

KELLER CAN'T PLAY ANYMORE! -he's finished. When he was 100% he couldn't block. I'm much happier with 25-year old 6'7 Zach Sudfeld (with much higher of an upside) on my Jets than Dustin Keller. The Pats can have a field-day with DK for all I care. I just think it's hysterical in the amount of ex-Jets they've signed since 2010.

Edited by Beezer34

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Anyway, including the playoffs, Pats are 53-52-1 against the Jets all-time.  Interestingly, besides the record being just about even, it's been rare than one team hasn't been dominant for seasons at a time:

 

Pats win first two games in the all-time series, and 6 out of the first nine overall.

Jets then dominate for several years, going 19-3-1 from the mid-60s to the mid-70s.

Pats turn it around in 1976 and win 8 out of the next 10.

Jets turn the tables and win four out of the next five.

Pats then win 9 out of 12 to just about close out the 80s.

Jets win 8 out of the next 10 through 1994.

Pats win matchup#2 in 1994, the first of 6 straight.

Jets follow by winning 7 of 8 (the last run of Jet dominance in the series, ended in 2002)

Pats take 11 out of 12.

Jets win four out of six (amazing, throughout their history, this has really been the only "battling" era between the two clubs, as most of the time, it's been one team owning the other)

Pats win 5 straight before Jets break their drought with a win.

 

I would've thought there would've been more 3 and 4-year stretches of splits. 

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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SCARED OF WHAT?! :w00t:  -lol..

..the 5 games he'll play with the Pats, before he gets carted off the field?! TAKE HIM.. PLEASE! I seriously hope they do. What am I afraid of?! He left without a contract!!

http://bostonherald.com/sports/patriots_nfl/new_england_patriots/2014/04/ex_jets_te_dustin_keller_visits_pats_leaves_without

 

KELLER CAN'T PLAY ANYMORE! -he's finished. When he was 100% he couldn't block. I'm much happier with 25-year old 6'7 Zach Sudfeld (with much higher of an upside) on my Jets than Dustin Keller. The Pats can have a field-day with DK for all I care. I just think it's hysterical in the amount of ex-Jets they've signed since 2010.

 

The Jet fan killing the Pats for signing ex-Jets is now using an ex-Pat signed by the Jets to prove a point.  #irony

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The Jet fan killing the Pats for signing ex-Jets is now using an ex-Pat signed by the Jets to prove a point. #irony

Sure did..

..now name 7 more ex-Pats the Jets signed since 2010, and your post would have a point. #Veracity

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Bart Hubbuch ‏@HubbuchNYP 27m
Sammy Watkins told me Rex said to him recently that Watkins is so hot "the Jets are trying to trade 10 years of [first-round] picks for me."

 

 

would I give up next years first for Watkins and perhaps a 3rd this year?

 

I probably would, not 100%...but probably would.

 

Seems like the Jets are indeed on Watkins trail

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Sure did..

..now name 7 more ex-Pats the Jets signed since 2010, and your post would have a point. #Veracity

 

In 5 minutes of research, I found:

 

Ras-I Dowling

Jermaine Cunningham

Damien Woody

Zoltan Mesko

Shawn Crable

 

So it's not 8, but 6 is still not an insignificant number.

 

And if we move the bar back by number of years, it becomes more even; these two teams have been roster and coach sniping ever since Parcells went from Pats to Jets in 1999 (and probably before, though with less fanfare).

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Watkins would require trading inside the top 6 at least (Bucs long rumored to snatch him if he's at 7), maybe even top 3. Not happening. Could see a trade up for Mike Evans or Odell Beckham, however. If the Jets choose to keep their picks, Brandin Cooks seems like a reasonable target at 18. Could be a few CB to choose from as well if they go that route.

Edited by nmigliore

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yea, Fuller or Dennard. Though not sure how Dennards game would translate to the PI happy NFL

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How comfortable are nyj fans right now with Vick at QB. Manziel still on the board

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How comfortable are nyj fans right now with Vick at QB. Manziel still on the board

 

Doesn't look like the league is too high on Manziel. He even slipped past Dallas. Don't think I would've taken 'em. All the eggs are in the Geno basket and if that doesn't work out we have Vick to lean on, who is a proven commodity

 

I sort of overlooked Pryor. He definitely fills a need, looks like a solid pick.

 

But we still need offense. We need a receiver, I hope they trade back up and get Cooks or Lee. Now I'm not sure they ever wanted Beckham, could've been a smokescreen. Rumors were they were going to trade up to get him but nothing transpired.

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Jets pick pryor

 

I would have been a lot more enthused about it if it wasn't for all the stupid ripping the Jets are going to get for passing on Manziel, when it's even money he slips out of the first round entirely.  Or if we actually had better than #3 corners.

 

How comfortable are nyj fans right now with Vick at QB. Manziel still on the board

 

I'm fine with Vick as long as he's healthy, which won't be long.  Geno deserves at least another chance and not to get thrown down an elevator shaft.

Doesn't look like the league is too high on Manziel. He even slipped past Dallas. Don't think I would've taken 'em. All the eggs are in the Geno basket and if that doesn't work out we have Vick to lean on, who is a proven commodity

 

I sort of overlooked Pryor. He definitely fills a need, looks like a solid pick.

 

But we still need offense. We need a receiver, I hope they trade back up and get Cooks or Lee. Now I'm not sure they ever wanted Beckham, could've been a smokescreen. Rumors were they were going to trade up to get him but nothing transpired.

 

They can get receiver later, the draft's chock-full of them this year.  Having Milliner and Wilson as your top two corners with Brady in the division, Watkins/Steve Johnson in Buffalo and Wallace/Hartline in Miami worries me though.

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I would have been a lot more enthused about it if it wasn't for all the stupid ripping the Jets are going to get for passing on Manziel, when it's even money he slips out of the first round entirely.  Or if we actually had better than #3 corners.

 

 

I'm fine with Vick as long as he's healthy, which won't be long.  Geno deserves at least another chance and not to get thrown down an elevator shaft.

 

They can get receiver later, the draft's chock-full of them this year.  Having Milliner and Wilson as your top two corners with Brady in the division, Watkins/Steve Johnson in Buffalo and Wallace/Hartline in Miami worries me though.

 

There are, but there is a drop off after the Beckham/Cooks/Lee.

 

Maybe we can get someone like Latimer.

And Watkins to Buffalo bothers me. Yea they gave up a sh!t ton but he's a pain in the ass that I didn't want in this division

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