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Zubie#8

Andy Greene Signed +5 years @ $5M Per Season

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Alright guys get your guesses in...

Mine is Greene extended 5yrs, $25 mil.

This guy is the real winner!

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*takes a bow

Greene doesn't really rely too much on physical tools so I don't think he'll age too poorly. He's surely worth at least six on the open market. Lou did pretty well with this one

I see him aging like Niedermayer, but hopefully his speed isn't totally crap by then. 

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I don't think they did bad there. Do I want to pay a 37 year old Andy Greene $5 mil for the season? Not really.

Will I do it to get 32-34 Andy at the same price? Hell yes I will.

We all know the extra year is key in these deals. You either give it, or someone else does and he walks.

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Today on HF, I learned that Dan Girardi is better than Greene

I am the one having a discussion with that guy haha. HF drives me nuts sometimes, I get angry on there.

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4/22 is not as good. CAP hit higher and that is bigger issue than last year.

 

I'd rather have $500k more on the cap than a 5th year that's locked in at $5M.  I just can't see Greene being more than a 3rd pairing D at that point, but he'd still be being paid like a 2nd pairing D, and we've seen how this tends to go.

 

It's a good contract but still, Greene is basically 33 when it starts.  It's a bit of a risk.

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I'd rather have $500k more on the cap than a 5th year that's locked in at $5M.  I just can't see Greene being more than a 3rd pairing D at that point, but he'd still be being paid like a 2nd pairing D, and we've seen how this tends to go.

 

It's a good contract but still, Greene is basically 33 when it starts.  It's a bit of a risk.

 

I'm with you. Since this deal only starts in 2015, you might only get two good years out of this contract. There is some risk.

 

But, I'm happy he's back. He has so few miles on him, so that's a plus. Less than 600 pro games; that's pretty nutty.

 

On another note, I love how members of the media had such trouble accurately describing what Greene does well. I saw +/- stats thrown out and blocked shots #.

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Damn it. It's in my head now, too. Which is a shame because Weird Al's Foil was in there for the last day or so.

I have to say Word Crimes still has full control over my brain.

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I'm with you. Since this deal only starts in 2015, you might only get two good years out of this contract. There is some risk.

 

But, I'm happy he's back. He has so few miles on him, so that's a plus. Less than 600 pro games; that's pretty nutty.

 

On another note, I love how members of the media had such trouble accurately describing what Greene does well. I saw +/- stats thrown out and blocked shots #.

 

 

If we only get 2 years out of this contract that would be a disaster.

 

There is a risk with any long term contract but I think Lou properly played the odds here and if he has a 2014-15 like last year he was in for a BIG payday.

He could have gotten 6+ on the FA market and then to keep him the Devils would have paid way more. And the CAP stays the same this year now!

 

This is a really fair deal.

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If we only get 2 years out of this contract that would be a disaster.

 

There is a risk with any long term contract but I think Lou properly played the odds here and if he has a 2014-15 like last year he was in for a BIG payday.

He could have gotten 6+ on the FA market and then to keep him the Devils would have paid way more. And the CAP stays the same this year now!

 

This is a really fair deal.

 

But that's the risk you take. Look at the deal Girardi got. Even the most rah rah Blueshirt fan knows Danny G will be toast by the mid-point. That's why it's smart to frontload the contract and decrease the number.

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Bingo. Detroit would've forked that over for sure, along with a bunch of other teams. I'm fine with 5/25.

 

The Red Wings were so desperate they wound up giving Quincey $4.25 mill just to retain him after striking out on Niskanen and Stralman.

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remember contracts of nikitin? fu...nnyng Quincey?

and what real cash for def who is in best 50 of def of th league in points, goals, shots, pp points, sh points, blockshots, drive against best players, top 20 ice time, top 5 sh ice time and our sh is one of the best in league

and i think he deserve some discount

 

5KK - it`s luck

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I'm with you. Since this deal only starts in 2015, you might only get two good years out of this contract. There is some risk.

 

But, I'm happy he's back. He has so few miles on him, so that's a plus. Less than 600 pro games; that's pretty nutty.

 

On another note, I love how members of the media had such trouble accurately describing what Greene does well. I saw +/- stats thrown out and blocked shots #.

 

Anytime you sign a guy to five years and he's in his early 30s, it's always going to be a risk, and a near-guarantee that the end of the contract will get ugly. 

 

But it all goes back to the same thing...on the UFA market (barring serious injury), he'd likely get more both in term and in coin.  The ironic thing is that Tri's post is exactly the kind of post he gets on other people for making, claiming that such posters don't understand how UFA works when they bring up overpayments (in terms of too many years, etc).  Obviously Greene wasn't a UFA in this case, but this was a nice pre-emptive strike by Lou to make this a "reasonable" overpayment, as opposed to an insane one.  And good for the Devils that Greene wasn't interested in leaving or getting every last cent.  I think if he had wanted to go that route and play out his current deal, like others have noted, he might've gotten six years at $6 million per, which really DOES seem crazy. 

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So let's see here. The flyers extended Andrew fvcking MacDonald for 6/30. We signed Andy Greene for 5/25. I'd much rather be throwing the 5 mil at Greene. 

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Anytime you sign a guy to five years and he's in his early 30s, it's always going to be a risk, and a near-guarantee that the end of the contract will get ugly. 

 

But it all goes back to the same thing...on the UFA market (barring serious injury), he'd likely get more both in term and in coin.  The ironic thing is that Tri's post is exactly the kind of post he gets on other people for making, claiming that such posters don't understand how UFA works when they bring up overpayments (in terms of too many years, etc).  Obviously Greene wasn't a UFA in this case, but this was a nice pre-emptive strike by Lou to make this a "reasonable" overpayment, as opposed to an insane one.  And good for the Devils that Greene wasn't interested in leaving or getting every last cent.  I think if he had wanted to go that route and play out his current deal, like others have noted, he might've gotten six years at $6 million per, which really DOES seem crazy. 

 

Andy Greene was never on the market.  And I contended that the Devils should've offered similar-ish money in fewer years.  22/4 instead of 25/5.  They have a lot of cheap D years coming, but 5 years out, that defense will likely no longer be cheap - Gelinas will be UFA, Larsson will be UFA, Merrill will be too.  Who knows what the future holds for those three guys, but what we can be pretty sure of is that the Devils will still be spending loads on forwards at that point.  

 

They could've even gone longer on a Greene contract - something like 30/7, with slight frontloading, encouraging an early retirement.  It's a decent contract and I'm glad Greene is signed for next year but I imagine there will be issues with this deal in the future.

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Anytime you sign a guy to five years and he's in his early 30s, it's always going to be a risk, and a near-guarantee that the end of the contract will get ugly. 

 

But it all goes back to the same thing...on the UFA market (barring serious injury), he'd likely get more both in term and in coin.  The ironic thing is that Tri's post is exactly the kind of post he gets on other people for making, claiming that such posters don't understand how UFA works when they bring up overpayments (in terms of too many years, etc).  Obviously Greene wasn't a UFA in this case, but this was a nice pre-emptive strike by Lou to make this a "reasonable" overpayment, as opposed to an insane one.  And good for the Devils that Greene wasn't interested in leaving or getting every last cent.  I think if he had wanted to go that route and play out his current deal, like others have noted, he might've gotten six years at $6 million per, which really DOES seem crazy. 

 

I don't think it's a guarantee that Greene gets more term or much more $$$ if he tested the market. I could see $2.5 million more over the course of the deal. He's still incredible underrated around the league as the general reactions of this deal have shown, and his not being on the US' radar for the last few years for any tournament. Add that with him hitting the UFA market at 33.

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I don't think it's a guarantee that Greene gets more term or much more $$$ if he tested the market. I could see $2.5 million more over the course of the deal. He's still incredible underrated around the league as the general reactions of this deal have shown, and his not being on the US' radar for the last few years for any tournament. Add that with him hitting the UFA market at 33.

 

I think he would've gotten more dollars/year if - and this is not a small if - he repeated this past season offensively.  Don't forget we know the cap is going up to $74M independent of anything else.  I think he could've gotten 5/30 if he repeats this year, or 4/27.  Your top UFA D next year are Mike Green, Paul Martin, Andrej Sekera, Christian Ehrhoff, Marc Staal.  It isn't exactly a deep pool and of course it will only get shallower as the season progresses.

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Andy Greene was never on the market.  And I contended that the Devils should've offered similar-ish money in fewer years.  22/4 instead of 25/5.  They have a lot of cheap D years coming, but 5 years out, that defense will likely no longer be cheap - Gelinas will be UFA, Larsson will be UFA, Merrill will be too.  Who knows what the future holds for those three guys, but what we can be pretty sure of is that the Devils will still be spending loads on forwards at that point.  

 

They could've even gone longer on a Greene contract - something like 30/7, with slight frontloading, encouraging an early retirement.  It's a decent contract and I'm glad Greene is signed for next year but I imagine there will be issues with this deal in the future.

 

If $5 million for Greene when the cap might be $85 million is going to stand in the way of signing Gelinas, Larsson and Merrill, it means that the intervening five years will have been very successful.  Or, you're getting into the realm of Blackhawks' problems, which I'll take any day of the week.  At worst, it'll be like Salvador's deal at the end, in that it's not really his salary that is getting in the way of doing something you would otherwise want to do, but that you feel compelled to play someone that's overpaid and past his prime over someone that might be better.

 

I'm also not clear how you can be so sure that the Devils will be spending a lot on forwards at that point, or what you even meant by that.  At the fifth year of Greene's deal, only Zajac is under contract.  Unless what you're getting at is that Lou will have had to shell out a lot of money for Henrique, and maybe some of the forwards that you would consider prospects right now (Matteau, Quenneville, Boucher).  But again, if Andy Greene's contract is what stands in the way of retaining those players, or even just makes it a little difficult, it means that the team will be very, very good at that point.

Edited by Daniel

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wait, amateur question coming:

 

is the cap supposed to go up every year? or is it just once every several years?

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wait, amateur question coming:

 

is the cap supposed to go up every year? or is it just once every several years?

 

The cap for each year is based on league revenues.  The assumption is that there will be healthy revenue growth for the remainder of the CBA, and that the cap should go up every year until then. 

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If $5 million for Greene when the cap might be $85 million is going to stand in the way of signing Gelinas, Larsson and Merrill, it means that the intervening five years will have been very successful.  Or, you're getting into the realm of Blackhawks' problems, which I'll take any day of the week.  At worst, it'll be like Salvador's deal at the end, in that it's not really his salary that is getting in the way of doing something you would otherwise want to do, but that you feel compelled to play someone that's overpaid and past his prime over someone that might be better.

 

I'm also not clear how you can be so sure that the Devils will be spending a lot on forwards at that point, or what you even meant by that.  At the fifth year of Greene's deal, only Zajac is under contract.  Unless what you're getting at is that Lou will have had to shell out a lot of money for Henrique, and maybe some of the forwards that you would consider prospects right now (Matteau, Quenneville, Boucher).  But again, if Andy Greene's contract is what stands in the way of retaining those players, or even just makes it a little difficult, it means that the team will be very, very good at that point.

 

How are the Devils going to get forwards? Once Elias and Jagr retire, the Devils have no top line offensive talent. They will constantly have to acquire forwards by UFA like they have with Clowe and Cammelleri. Very hard to get good forwards in free agency without paying a sh!t ton. 

 

Matteau, Queneville and Boucher has to be the worst group of forward prospects that any team in the NHL has. The Devils will be paying a lot for offense for years to come.

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How are the Devils going to get forwards? Once Elias and Jagr retire, the Devils have no top line offensive talent. They will constantly have to acquire forwards by UFA like they have with Clowe and Cammelleri. Very hard to get good forwards in free agency without paying a sh!t ton. 

 

Matteau, Queneville and Boucher has to be the worst group of forward prospects that any team in the NHL has. The Devils will be paying a lot for offense for years to come.

 

Basically this.  While I don't think that's the worst forward prospect group anyone has (I think Pittsburgh is worse off the top of my head), the issue is also that the Devils have 0 forwards who will start on next year's team who will be on ELCs, and their best forwards are quite old.  While I think one of Larsson, Gelinas, Merrill, or Severson will be gone to get NJ a decent young-ish forward in the coming years, that still leaves another large hole.  And that means free agents, and that means large, long deals that end in tears.

 

The Devils are paying $45 million for their forward corps which is absolutely nuts given that their forwards aren't above NHL average.  I'd be surprised if there's a team paying more.

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Not to derail the discussion but what happens if/when we get a couple of injuries on defense? We know it's only a matter of time before Salvador gets hurt but what happens if another one or two go down? I guess at this point we're looking at Helgesen or Scarlett? Does anyone think Lou will try to sign one more defender just in case? 

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Not to derail the discussion but what happens if/when we get a couple of injuries on defense? We know it's only a matter of time before Salvador gets hurt but what happens if another one or two go down? I guess at this point we're looking at Helgesen or Scarlett? Does anyone think Lou will try to sign one more defender just in case? 

Harrold is pretty capable so him getting a few games isn't the end of the world. I'd bet Severson is the first in line to get called up, though.

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