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Is it me or in this insane sports world of today.......

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15 hours ago, thecoffeecake said:

Holy sh!t, you are actually telling me you think blacks have a natural tendency to be more violent? So we're not dealing with someone unwilling or unable to grasp the concept of institutional racism, like some other posters, but someone who overtly believes blacks are genetically more violent. Interesting.

The reason places like Newark and Baltimore (less so these days) are the way they are is multidimensional, but really quite simple. Deindustrialization is the primary culprit, the thing that flooded jobs (mostly unskilled, middle class ones) out of America's traditional industrial centers (ever heard of the Rust Belt?) overseas and to the Sunbelt. Suburbanization and white flight are major factors, with the development of suburban areas outside of cities that whites flocked to after World War II. No conspiracy for you to grasp at there, blacks were either red-lined (look it up; I can't teach you all of social studies 201 right now), unable to get mortgages because of their race (which still happens, but isn't legal now as it was then), or were legally barred from moving into suburban areas (such as Levittown, the quintessential American suburb). Some cities lost half of their population, lost a lot more than that in tax revenue (as wealth is disproportionately in white hands), and took on extremely expensive problems that unused, rotting cities deal with (an underused and aging infrastructure, abandonment, crime). Those towns fell apart with nothing much left but poor blacks, and an ever growing narrative (especially since Reagan) that it was their own fault. What you also can't deny, because there's no foundation for deniability, is that black people lower property values just by existing in a neighborhood. All else equal, a house in a black neighborhood is worse significantly less than one in a white neighborhood. Racist cops absolutely had nothing to do with the decline of the American city, you're right. Racist criminal justice is an exacerbating factor.

Endemic violent crime that you're referring to is almost always the result of concentrations of extreme poverty (this is why public housing projects, especially ones designed in the middle of the last century, have such violent reputations). Illinois and Maryland have major cities with concentrated poverty (the median incomes of both Chicago and Baltimore are lower than West Virginia) that skew their numbers. Endemic violent crime isn't generally found in white or black rural areas.

Yes I know red lining since I read the piece about it by the leading pseudo intellectual of our times Te Nahisi Coates.  He and you seem to forget about something called the fair housing act that’s been around for fifty years now.  The red lining theory doesn’t explain the fact that it’s unusual for a black child to have married parents (which was not the case until about the 1960s).  

Again, none of the factors you point to actually explain why blacks murder each other at ten times the rate of whites or something like five times the rate that Hispanics do.  The disparity not only includes murder but violent rape, a crime for which there is no logical connection with poverty deindustriization or whatever.

  You and the sociologists just see a correlation with poverty and urbanization and conclude that there’s causation, but then when you see the same factors at play in West Virginia you just assume external factors are still at work.  Do yourself a favor and talk to a couple of busy homicide detectives and ask what percentage of the murders they investigate might be considered crimes of desperation, like I murdered this person for food money or something like that.  The number is certain to be very low.  They’re usually just stupid people that lack impulse control.  

And finally, you falling back on what you learned in your sociology classes is the worst possible example of appeal to authority.  Sociology isn’t  a real science to begin with and the field is heavily influenced by the a priori political views of the sociologists telling you this stuff.  You and your professors will continue to focus on things that don’t cause or alleviate the problem and in the meantime you will continue to see hundreds or thousands more incremental murders per year.

And by the way, I don’t know the answer either.  But pretending like you, BLM or Te Nahisi Coates have any inkling of what the problem is won’t get anyone anywhere.

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On 10/28/2017 at 3:26 PM, Daniel said:

Yes I know red lining since I read the piece about it by the leading pseudo intellectual of our times Te Nahisi Coates.  He and you seem to forget about something called the fair housing act that’s been around for fifty years now.  The red lining theory doesn’t explain the fact that it’s unusual for a black child to have married parents (which was not the case until about the 1960s).  

Again, none of the factors you point to actually explain why blacks murder each other at ten times the rate of whites or something like five times the rate that Hispanics do.  The disparity not only includes murder but violent rape, a crime for which there is no logical connection with poverty deindustriization or whatever.

  You and the sociologists just see a correlation with poverty and urbanization and conclude that there’s causation, but then when you see the same factors at play in West Virginia you just assume external factors are still at work.  Do yourself a favor and talk to a couple of busy homicide detectives and ask what percentage of the murders they investigate might be considered crimes of desperation, like I murdered this person for food money or something like that.  The number is certain to be very low.  They’re usually just stupid people that lack impulse control.  

And finally, you falling back on what you learned in your sociology classes is the worst possible example of appeal to authority.  Sociology isn’t  a real science to begin with and the field is heavily influenced by the a priori political views of the sociologists telling you this stuff.  You and your professors will continue to focus on things that don’t cause or alleviate the problem and in the meantime you will continue to see hundreds or thousands more incremental murders per year.

And by the way, I don’t know the answer either.  But pretending like you, BLM or Te Nahisi Coates have any inkling of what the problem is won’t get anyone anywhere.

Oh man, the racist, anti-intellectual ramblings of an obsolete generation. I could argue with you that murder rates around the world are most heavily influenced by marginalization, that you will point to the black murder rate to demonize an entire race, but ignore the fact that whites have been and continue to be the leading culprits of domestic terrorism. I could argue with you about how the mythological America you believe you live in never existed, and will continue to not exist despite you and your fellow alt-righters plugging your ears and yelling over the noise, but there's no point, for either of us, right? 

Also, I never took a sociology course. An education would've done you some good, though, clearly. But go ahead and continue your crusade against secondary education, at least that nonsense most people know well enough to ignore. 

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27 minutes ago, thecoffeecake said:

Oh man, the racist, anti-intellectual ramblings of an obsolete generation. I could argue with you that murder rates around the world are most heavily influenced by marginalization, that you will point to the black murder rate to demonize an entire race, but ignore the fact that whites have been and continue to be the leading culprits of domestic terrorism. I could argue with you about how the mythological America you believe you live in never existed, and will continue to not exist despite you and your fellow alt-righters plugging your ears and yelling over the noise, but there's no point, for either of us, right? 

Also, I never took a sociology course. An education would've done you some good, though, clearly. But go ahead and continue your crusade against secondary education, at least that nonsense most people know well enough to ignore. 

If you would take the number of deaths from the last 10 years of domestic terrorism committed by whites and compare it with the number of murders where both the victim and the perpetrator were black, the numbers would be overwhelmingly more in the black on black murder column.

Also, it is not white people to blame that the number of single parent households in the black community is at an extremely alarming rate.  It is not the white man's fault that kids in Abbott districts continue to fail even when they receive more $ per student.

FWIW secondary education is important, it is just that college campuses are now these days hijacked by far left politics/professors.  I graduated with a degree in history so I also took quite a bit of humanities and political science classes.  All but 1 professors was either left leaning or far left leaning.  I remember in sociology 101 (this was fall of 2002) where on the first day of class the professor said that she hates republicans and despises George Bush and that all right-leaning viewpoints will be dismissed or given a lesser grade.  She made no bones about it and almost the entire class agreed.  I also took a course called "The political economy of violence."  It was a stupid course told by a crackpot far left leaning professor who basically blamed the US for every single act of violence of the last 100 years.

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Accurate stats be damned by the emotional alt-left

Edited by Jimmy Leeds

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5 hours ago, DevsMan84 said:

If you would take the number of deaths from the last 10 years of domestic terrorism committed by whites and compare it with the number of murders where both the victim and the perpetrator were black, the numbers would be overwhelmingly more in the black on black murder column.

Also, it is not white people to blame that the number of single parent households in the black community is at an extremely alarming rate.  It is not the white man's fault that kids in Abbott districts continue to fail even when they receive more $ per student.

FWIW secondary education is important, it is just that college campuses are now these days hijacked by far left politics/professors.  I graduated with a degree in history so I also took quite a bit of humanities and political science classes.  All but 1 professors was either left leaning or far left leaning.  I remember in sociology 101 (this was fall of 2002) where on the first day of class the professor said that she hates republicans and despises George Bush and that all right-leaning viewpoints will be dismissed or given a lesser grade.  She made no bones about it and almost the entire class agreed.  I also took a course called "The political economy of violence."  It was a stupid course told by a crackpot far left leaning professor who basically blamed the US for every single act of violence of the last 100 years.

I went to undergraduate from 1997-2001 (majored in history) and law school from 2001-2004.  Was fortunate in undergrad that I didn't get a lot of political indoctrination, except in one particular political science class where according to the professor, pretty much everything in the United States boiled down to racism.  (Professor also had this annoying habit of over enunciating names of foreign leaders like . . .. in American accent... "In 1972 Richard Nixon met with" ... in heavy Chinese accent "Mao Tse Tung". Professor was not Asian).  I also was fortunate to really not get the soap box professors in law school.

These days though, the problem isn't really left wing professors.  That's sort of been a constant for a while, and a good and ethical professor knows not to require students to subscribe to a certain political view, only that positions be well reasoned.  (Supposedly, even Noam Chomsky says that he leaves his political views at the door when he teaches).   The problem are these bogus departments like gender studies, gender queer studies, critical race studies, and even "whiteness studies" where there is actual instruction in how pumpkin spice lattes are symbols of white supremacy.  All of them have a strident science denialism about them that would make young earth creationists blush.  It's ironic really, in that all of them believe that pretty much everything is a social construct and that we're all essentially just blank slates, which would make those pray the gay away people fundamentally correct that with proper conditioning a homosexual can be made to be heterosexual.  

The other thing about colleges that has to end is the exorbitant speaking fees that certain people get.  I'm usually not a "there ought to be a law" kind of guy, but it would be nice if the federal government passed a law that says that any school receiving federal funds (pretty much all of them) cannot pay a speaker more than $100 to give a speech.  That and I would pretty much nuke the NCAA from orbit.

Anyway, rant over.

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3 minutes ago, Daniel said:

I went to undergraduate from 1997-2001 (majored in history) and law school from 2001-2004.  Was fortunate in undergrad that I didn't get a lot of political indoctrination, except in one particular political science class where according to the professor, pretty much everything in the United States boiled down to racism.  (Professor also had this annoying habit of over enunciating names of foreign leaders like . . .. in American accent... "In 1972 Richard Nixon met with" ... in heavy Chinese accent "Mao Tse Tung". Professor was not Asian).  I also was fortunate to really not get the soap box professors in law school.

These days though, the problem isn't really left wing professors.  That's sort of been a constant for a while, and a good and ethical professor knows not to require students to subscribe to a certain political view, only that positions be well reasoned.  (Supposedly, even Noam Chomsky says that he leaves his political views at the door when he teaches).   The problem are these bogus departments like gender studies, gender queer studies, critical race studies, and even "whiteness studies" where there is actual instruction in how pumpkin spice lattes are symbols of white supremacy.  All of them have a strident science denialism about them that would make young earth creationists blush.  It's ironic really, in that all of them believe that pretty much everything is a social construct and that we're all essentially just blank slates, which would make those pray the gay away people fundamentally correct that with proper conditioning a homosexual can be made to be heterosexual.  

The other thing about colleges that has to end is the exorbitant speaking fees that certain people get.  I'm usually not a "there ought to be a law" kind of guy, but it would be nice if the federal government passed a law that says that any school receiving federal funds (pretty much all of them) cannot pay a speaker more than $100 to give a speech.  That and I would pretty much nuke the NCAA from orbit.

Anyway, rant over.

I went to college from 2002 through 2006.  The history professors, while almost all left, were not nearly as bad as the sociology or political science professors who were very far left.  It is very much department to department and I completely agree that some of these departments are completely bogus.  Thankfully I graduated before departments like gender studies became part of the criteria to graduate with a history degree.  These days I am fairly sure at least one of those classes are required.

Far lefties tend to pick and choose when they want to believe in science.  They scream that we should trust scientists in regards to climate change, but then scream at us when we say there are two genders.

I agree with that speaking fee change.  I would also like to add that I would have no problem adding a cap to spending by colleges that receive federal or state funds on athletics.  I get that for some colleges they are money makers.  However for a lot there are money pits.  If some rich alumni dweeb wants to spend his money on the football team for his alma matter then I have no issue with it, but there needs to be a cap on how much tuition money goes towards it.

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I went to college from '84-'89. I had tons of lefty professors, but the ones I talked to I got along with very well. It wasn't easy supporting Reagan on a campus.

I'd never survive now how crazy it's gotten. 

You write well, Daniel

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This is very frightening stuff.  A bisexual graduate student in philosophy at the University of Texas San Antonio remarked to an acquaintance of his who was marrying a Muslim woman that Islam makes him uncomfortable because in ten Muslim countries he could be  executed.  In other words, he said something that was objectively true, while it’s fashionable to say that the United States is pretty much the Handmaids Tale because religious Christians serve in the government, i.e. a hyperbolic and false assertion.  The grad student was ratted out, and thrown into an academic star chamber of sorts where he was berated by his department head.  It’s Orwellian that a philosophy chair — i.e. someone who’s supposed to be interested in the truth — is berating a grad student for saying something that is true.   Fortunately,  the grad student recorded the encounter and here it is.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1xCjOb-ysUAo7nqhKng1Rgeo3FxvvMRg1Cx0OtspmTAI/pub

Student no longer is at UT, but hopefully found another university that is not run by crazy people.

Still, this is what political correctness and social justice warriors have wrought.  You can face official consequences from universities or work for saying things that are actually true on your spare time.  And, I’ve stopped believing that they’re acting in good faith.  They think they’re creating utopia, and they’ll do whatever is expedient to achieve that goal.  This is the best quote I’ve ever read about the purpose of political correctness by Theodore Dalrymple, which applies to what we’re seeing today:

Quote

In my study of communist societies, I came to the conclusion that the purpose of communist propaganda was not to persuade or convince, not to inform, but to humiliate; and therefore, the less it corresponded to reality the better. When people are forced to remain silent when they are being told the most obvious lies, or even worse when they are forced to repeat the lies themselves, they lose once and for all their sense of probity. To assent to obvious lies is...in some small way to become evil oneself. One's standing to resist anything is thus eroded, and even destroyed. A society of emasculated liars is easy to control. I think if you examine political correctness, it has the same effect and is intended to.

 

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8 hours ago, Daniel said:

This is very frightening stuff.  A bisexual graduate student in philosophy at the University of Texas San Antonio remarked to an acquaintance of his who was marrying a Muslim woman that Islam makes him uncomfortable because in ten Muslim countries he could be  executed.  In other words, he said something that was objectively true, while it’s fashionable to say that the United States is pretty much the Handmaids Tale because religious Christians serve in the government, i.e. a hyperbolic and false assertion.  The grad student was ratted out, and thrown into an academic star chamber of sorts where he was berated by his department head.  It’s Orwellian that a philosophy chair — i.e. someone who’s supposed to be interested in the truth — is berating a grad student for saying something that is true.   Fortunately,  the grad student recorded the encounter and here it is.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1xCjOb-ysUAo7nqhKng1Rgeo3FxvvMRg1Cx0OtspmTAI/pub

Student no longer is at UT, but hopefully found another university that is not run by crazy people.

Still, this is what political correctness and social justice warriors have wrought.  You can face official consequences from universities or work for saying things that are actually true on your spare time.  And, I’ve stopped believing that they’re acting in good faith.  They think they’re creating utopia, and they’ll do whatever is expedient to achieve that goal.  This is the best quote I’ve ever read about the purpose of political correctness by Theodore Dalrymple, which applies to what we’re seeing today:

 

Wow and star chamber is right.  Kid did a decent job holding his position best he could under both leading and contradictory questioning.

I heard about these sort of things happening with students (overwhelmingly male) in college who are accused of sexual assault on campus.  Under an Obama initiative, colleges can set up these star chamber or kangaroo courts without need for a police investigation to kick the accused out of the school simply off of the accusation and testimony by the "victim" without any regards to evidence.  That's very scary and to her credit DeVos is trying trying to end this practice.

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1 hour ago, DevsMan84 said:

Wow and star chamber is right.  Kid did a decent job holding his position best he could under both leading and contradictory questioning.

I heard about these sort of things happening with students (overwhelmingly male) in college who are accused of sexual assault on campus.  Under an Obama initiative, colleges can set up these star chamber or kangaroo courts without need for a police investigation to kick the accused out of the school simply off of the accusation and testimony by the "victim" without any regards to evidence.  That's very scary and to her credit DeVos is trying trying to end this practice.

The Obama initiative was actually worse than you think.  Colleges, for the most part, are pretty much free to discipline students however they see fit subject to certain exceptions.  So, for instance, I imagine a college could kick you out of school for cheating on an exam even if it didn't have evidence of it beyond a reasonable doubt like a criminal trial.  So if colleges wanted to come up with kangaroo courts for this sort of thing on their own initiative, I would only prefer that they be up front about it so people know what they're getting into. 

What Obama did was really awful in that it somehow interpreted Title IX, a federal law that bans discrimination on the basis of sex, to require that colleges set up proceedings without due process in the case of allegations of sexual assault.  Note also that the term "sexual assault" as it's used on campus has a really broad meaning which could also include telling one's partner that if you don't sleep with me I'll find someone who will. 

Of course you now have liberals complaining about actually giving people accused of serious crimes due process of any sort.  That's how you can tell that social justice warriors don't actually have a clue what actual justice really is. 

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1 hour ago, Daniel said:

The Obama initiative was actually worse than you think.  Colleges, for the most part, are pretty much free to discipline students however they see fit subject to certain exceptions.  So, for instance, I imagine a college could kick you out of school for cheating on an exam even if it didn't have evidence of it beyond a reasonable doubt like a criminal trial.  So if colleges wanted to come up with kangaroo courts for this sort of thing on their own initiative, I would only prefer that they be up front about it so people know what they're getting into. 

What Obama did was really awful in that it somehow interpreted Title IX, a federal law that bans discrimination on the basis of sex, to require that colleges set up proceedings without due process in the case of allegations of sexual assault.  Note also that the term "sexual assault" as it's used on campus has a really broad meaning which could also include telling one's partner that if you don't sleep with me I'll find someone who will. 

Of course you now have liberals complaining about actually giving people accused of serious crimes due process of any sort.  That's how you can tell that social justice warriors don't actually have a clue what actual justice really is. 

They don't care about due process, it is all about doing what is "right" in their minds, no matter how warped it is.

Sexual assault longer means what it mean.  In that silly survey that stated that one in five or two in five (some really high statistic) college women reported being sexually assaulted while in college, they listed things like having consensual sex and regretting it the next morning and even stolen kisses as "sexual assault."  It cheapens the seriousness of women (and even men) who have been sexually assaulted.

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Since the topic is about how ridiculous universities have gotten, ill just leave this here...

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/10/31/having-white-nuclear-family-promotes-white-supremacy-says-new-york-professor-report-says.html

“She reportedly tweeted: “I mean, if you’re a white person who says they’re engaged in dismantling white supremacy but … you’re forming a white family (and) reproducing white children that ‘you want the best for’ – how is that helping [and] not part of the problem?"

She reportedly ended her arguement suggesting that “white people” should confront their racism and stop perpetuating inequality by leaving their homes for their children.”

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35 minutes ago, Jerzey said:

Since the topic is about how ridiculous universities have gotten, ill just leave this here...

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2017/10/31/having-white-nuclear-family-promotes-white-supremacy-says-new-york-professor-report-says.html

“She reportedly tweeted: “I mean, if you’re a white person who says they’re engaged in dismantling white supremacy but … you’re forming a white family (and) reproducing white children that ‘you want the best for’ – how is that helping [and] not part of the problem?"

She reportedly ended her arguement suggesting that “white people” should confront their racism and stop perpetuating inequality by leaving their homes for their children.”

I'll preempt any social justice warriors that will take criticism of this "professor" and say "look who's the snowflake now."   It's not that this woman is saying anything that really "offends" anyone other than a white nationalist.   Rather she's saying something embarrassingly stupid and she should be fired for that.   In the same way that I would think that a biology professor could be fired for touting bogus herbal remedies as cancer treatment, or an astrophysicist who also tweets about the truth of alien abductions.  If my kid had a professor like this, I would immediately ask for a refund of tuition.

There's also the blatant double standard.  As anyone can imagine, you can replace "white cisgender person" with pretty much any other classification you can think of, and there would be marches, triggered college students galore, antifa violence and mass media hysteria.  I can live with the double standard, it's not really that big a deal, but it's pretty nauseating when it's taboo to even point it out. 

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Sad times that a majority of college students believe that “hate speech” can and should be legally prohibited.  

https://www.cato.org/blog/supporting-racists-free-speech-rights-same-being-racist

Not too long ago, BLM activists beclowned themselves (is that a redundancy?) by shutting down a speaker from the ACLU who was discussing free speech (irony also seems to be lost on SJWs).  

http://reason.com/blog/2017/10/04/black-lives-matter-students-shut-down-th

Millenials are easily the worst and dumbest generation this country has ever seen.  The country will be severely fvcked when we start seeing millennial Supreme Court justices.  

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