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Brodeur to be inducted into 2018 HOF


MadDog2020

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4 minutes ago, '7' said:

The Blues always wanted revenge on us. The tampering that led to Stevens after we rebuffed Brind'Amour & Cujo. Then the tampering with Stevens that led to us being awarded a pick. Having Brodeur in that uniform however brief it was, and then keeping him as a gofer was meant as a shot at us

There was no tampering when the Devils first got Stevens...Stevens had been signed by the Blues as a Group 2 FA (meaning they had to send five - yes, FIVE - first-round picks the Caps' way...the Caps managed to pretty much botch all of those picks, IIRC), then the following season, the Blues signed Shanahan as a Group 1 FA, which entitled the team that lost him to compensation.  The Devils asked for Stevens straight-up, and the Blues (begrudgingly) submitted a package built around Brind'Amour and Cujo.  Each team got a chance to plead its case, and an arbitrator would then simply pick one package or the other...to everyone's shock, he chose Stevens, mostly because the Devils presented a near flawless case as to why they should be awarded Stevens over the Blues' package.  On that count, the Devils won Stevens fair and square, though I've always wondered if the NHL got involved behind the scenes...the Blues were driving up salaries with these big signings, and I don't think the league liked that one bit.

There was definitely tampering involved in later Blues' dealings with Stevens, and they forced Lou to match an offer that was more money than Lou was used to doling out at the time...and yeah, Devils got a pick out of that whole mess.  Supposedly Stevens himself had nothing to do with any of the tampering. 

Gotta admit, if they thought bringing in what was then a sadly washed-up Brodeur (who no one else seemed to want at the time) to play seven games for them would tweak us, then they were pretty stupid...yeah, some at first lamented the fact that Brodeur didn't play every last game of his NHL career as a Devil, but most quickly got over it, and realized the 99.524% of his NHL career that he spent HERE was plenty...and most of us were ready to see Schneider get a real chance to do his thing without Marty around...that situation just couldn't be allowed to fester.  As for Marty being an exec...if that's what he wanted to do, he had to cut his teeth somewhere, and as we've seen, not every former great player does that with the team that he gave his best years on the ice. 

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9 minutes ago, Daniel said:

I don’t know of a writer that didn’t cover the Devils who comes close to appreciating how good Elias was and for how long he was so good.  They’re mostly the people who think the Devils teams of 1999 to 2003 were “boring.”  (Of course they’re the same people who say Ottawa was “crafty” for playing an even more exaggerated form of the trap).

 

Lol........I remember Roenick on Philly.........they were playing the trap (which he KILLED the Devs for) and called it, "exciting Defense" !!

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3 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

There was no tampering when the Devils first got Stevens...Stevens had been signed by the Blues as a Group 2 FA (meaning they had to send five - yes, FIVE - first-round picks the Caps' way...the Caps managed to pretty much botch all of those picks, IIRC), then the following season, the Blues signed Shanahan as a Group 1 FA, which entitled the team that lost him to compensation.  The Devils asked for Stevens straight-up, and the Blues (begrudgingly) submitted a package built around Brind'Amour and Cujo.  Each team got a chance to plead its case, and an arbitrator would then simply pick one package or the other...to everyone's shock, he chose Stevens, mostly because the Devils presented a near flawless case as to why they should be awarded Stevens over the Blues' package.  On that count, the Devils won Stevens fair and square, though I've always wondered if the NHL got involved behind the scenes...the Blues were driving up salaries with these big signings, and I don't think the league liked that one bit.

There was definitely tampering involved in later Blues' dealings with Stevens, and they forced Lou to match an offer that was more money than Lou was used to doling out at the time...and yeah, Devils got a pick out of that whole mess.  Supposedly Stevens himself had nothing to do with any of the tampering. 

Gotta admit, if they thought bringing in what was then a sadly washed-up Brodeur (who no one else seemed to want at the time) to play seven games for them would tweak us, then they were pretty stupid...yeah, some at first lamented the fact that Brodeur didn't play every last game of his NHL career as a Devil, but most quickly got over it, and realized the 99.524% of his NHL career that he spent HERE was plenty...and most of us were ready to see Schneider get a real chance to do his thing without Marty around...that situation just couldn't be allowed to fester.  As for Marty being an exec...if that's what he wanted to do, he had to cut his teeth somewhere, and as we've seen, not every former great player does that with the team that he gave his best years on the ice. 

Great post and dead on

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2 hours ago, DevsMan84 said:

I still think Elias is more impressive when you think 1) He played in the dead puck era while Goring mostly played mostly during the live puck era and 2) Elias probably left about 200 career points on the table by sticking with the Devils through those years including some pretty offensively-depleted teams.

Plus two lockouts and almost dying in Russia.

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Read this quote yesterday (can't remember where but it was an article on the HHOF festivities) and I appreciate the sentiment :evil: :

"I wouldn't miss it for the world," said Niedermayer, on returning in 2018 when Brodeur likely will be inducted. "After all, you know who is going to be put in the Hall at that time. Marty. Marty Brodeur. Come on, he's as much a slam dunk as you can get. I already have my tickets." 

 

Have you guys been on Elias's Instagram? He's been posting a bunch of pics from the HHOF ceremonies - he was invited to take part in the game (though he was not put on Stevens team!). Here he is sucking up (just kidding) to Lanny (chairman of the HHOF): 

 

Edited by LittleBallofHate
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Devils fans should be thrilled that Marty did not pressure ownership to make him an executive.  First, we have a great management group as is.  But more importantly, there was virtually no upside to grooming him to be GM or something close to that.  There’s a very, very small chance that he would have been truly a step above anyone else you could bring in.  It’s not a knock on him, it’s just that these days there are diminishing returns that come with having a good one.  On the other hand, having a bad one can really mess things up for a long time.  If Marty turned out to be one of those guys, it would be very difficult to replace him.  

I’ll be very happy if he turns out to be a great executive some day, so long as it’s not with the Rangers.  

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3 hours ago, Daniel said:

Devils fans should be thrilled that Marty did not pressure ownership to make him an executive.  First, we have a great management group as is.  But more importantly, there was virtually no upside to grooming him to be GM or something close to that.  There’s a very, very small chance that he would have been truly a step above anyone else you could bring in.  It’s not a knock on him, it’s just that these days there are diminishing returns that come with having a good one.  On the other hand, having a bad one can really mess things up for a long time.  If Marty turned out to be one of those guys, it would be very difficult to replace him.  

I’ll be very happy if he turns out to be a great executive some day, so long as it’s not with the Rangers.  

Hate to give them due, but the Rags were right to not give in to Messier and make him their coach after the 11-12 season. He stormed off in a huff but you can endure that. Eventually things simmer down. Firing him would've been really tough

In Marty's case if he ever becomes a good exec...yes he will be on the Rangers radar. That's the way they operate. They hired Trottier. They brought in John MacLean. They tried for Elias.

Heck (and I didn't believe it when I heard it) but Keenan tried to lure Denis Potvin out of retirement in 1994 at 42. 

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12 minutes ago, '7' said:

Hate to give them due, but the Rags were right to not give in to Messier and make him their coach after the 11-12 season. He stormed off in a huff but you can endure that. Eventually things simmer down. Firing him would've been really tough

In Marty's case if he ever becomes a good exec...yes he will be on the Rangers radar. That's the way they operate. They hired Trottier. They brought in John MacLean. They tried for Elias.

Heck (and I didn't believe it when I heard it) but Keenan tried to lure Denis Potvin out of retirement in 1994 at 42. 

I can’t ever see that happening if only for the fact that Sean Avery was a guy the Ranger organization and its fans embraced.  Ranger fans actually still like Avery, and you’ll see a decent amount of Ranger fans wearing his jersey for a long time.  I’m pretty sure Avery is literally the only person to have played in the NHL that Marty actually despises.  If you don’t have to, there’s no need to give yourself agita every work day by being reminded of it.

Yes, the Rangers were smart not to hire Messier, although if the reasons not to do so are obvious even to a guy like me, it probably wasn’t a stroke of genius.

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15 hours ago, '7' said:

The Blues always wanted revenge on us. The tampering that led to Stevens after we rebuffed Brind'Amour & Cujo. Then the tampering with Stevens that led to us being awarded a pick. Having Brodeur in that uniform however brief it was, and then keeping him as a gofer was meant as a shot at us

Eh I don't know. That's a bit of a stretch. I don't know how many members of Blues management are even still around let alone holding grudges from nearly 30 years ago. 

They didn't even offer him a contract until December

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Just now, Devil Dan 56 said:

Eh I don't know. That's a bit of a stretch. I don't know how many members of Blues management are even still around let alone holding grudges from nearly 30 years ago. 

They didn't even offer him a contract until December

Agree, I think them bringing in Brodeur was more out of pure desperation than anything else...Brian Elliot had gotten hurt, and Jake Allen was a question mark who wasn't playing well at the time...though Marty had to wait until December to play, that opportunity to thwart Father Time was the very best one he was ever going to get...if he had gotten on any kind of roll, he would've gotten a real shot to keep playing for a while.  The Blues quickly learned what we already knew...that Marty was pretty much done...it might have been Tri who posted the video, but it showed Marty either allowing a goal or getting very lucky NOT to allow a goal on a particular play, where his lateral movement was just about nonexistent at best.  If they were desperate for a goalie and chose to go with one that had experience and wouldn't cost the Blues any assets, that I get, though I don't think I would've brought in a 42-year-old who was coming off two poor seasons and had an insane amount of mileage on him.  But if anyone there brought Marty in with the primary purpose of trying to tick off the Devils, then that was just flat-out both dumb and counterproductive...so much so that I can't imagine the Blues would ever do that...and it's not like they've been an incompetent franchise prone to making poor decisions.   

One positive that may have come from Brodeur's presence during that brief 2014-15 stint...he may have pushed Allen a bit...after Marty's final appearance (1/2/2015), Allen put up a .929 save% in his final 18 games of the season, and even became the Blues' #1 goalie in that playoffs that year.

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15 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Agree, I think them bringing in Brodeur was more out of pure desperation than anything else...Brian Elliot had gotten hurt, and Jake Allen was a question mark who wasn't playing well at the time...though Marty had to wait until December to play, that opportunity to thwart Father Time was the very best one he was ever going to get...if he had gotten on any kind of roll, he would've gotten a real shot to keep playing for a while.  The Blues quickly learned what we already knew...that Marty was pretty much done...it might have been Tri who posted the video, but it showed Marty either allowing a goal or getting very lucky NOT to allow a goal on a particular play, where his lateral movement was just about nonexistent at best.  If they were desperate for a goalie and chose to go with one that had experience and wouldn't cost the Blues any assets, that I get, though I don't think I would've brought in a 42-year-old who was coming off two poor seasons and had an insane amount of mileage on him.  But if anyone there brought Marty in with the primary purpose of trying to tick off the Devils, then that was just flat-out both dumb and counterproductive...so much so that I can't imagine the Blues would ever do that...and it's not like they've been an incompetent franchise prone to making poor decisions.   

One positive that may have come from Brodeur's presence during that brief 2014-15 stint...he may have pushed Allen a bit...after Marty's final appearance (1/2/2015), Allen put up a .929 save% in his final 18 games of the season, and even became the Blues' #1 goalie in that playoffs that year.

From what I've read, Marty has put in a ton of work behind the scenes working with Allen even after becoming assistant GM

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18 hours ago, Daniel said:

If you hypothetically had players and league execs elect players to the HOF, and if you could control their impulse to vote for their buddies, Elias would be a lock.  

I don’t know of a writer that didn’t cover the Devils who comes close to appreciating how good Elias was and for how long he was so good.  They’re mostly the people who think the Devils teams of 1999 to 2003 were “boring.”  (Of course they’re the same people who say Ottawa was “crafty” for playing an even more exaggerated form of the trap).

On the other hand, I bet that most players and GMs appreciated that he was one of the best players in the game.  

But that’s not the way it works, so I don’t think Elias will ever make it.

When you look at it from a purely realistic and down to Earth put of view, this is pretty much how I feel.  Unfortunately. 

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19 hours ago, RunninWithTheDevil said:

You mean Hall of Fame St. Louis Blues Goaltender Martin Brodeur?! 

 

:evil:

I knew someone would do this.... that's just wrong.  

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17 hours ago, LittleBallofHate said:

Read this quote yesterday (can't remember where but it was an article on the HHOF festivities) and I appreciate the sentiment :evil: :

"I wouldn't miss it for the world," said Niedermayer, on returning in 2018 when Brodeur likely will be inducted. "After all, you know who is going to be put in the Hall at that time. Marty. Marty Brodeur. Come on, he's as much a slam dunk as you can get. I already have my tickets." 

 

Have you guys been on Elias's Instagram? He's been posting a bunch of pics from the HHOF ceremonies - he was invited to take part in the game (though he was not put on Stevens team!). Here he is sucking up (just kidding) to Lanny (chairman of the HHOF): 

 

I wish we had never traded Lanny away.  Can you imagine how awe inspiring it would have been to see him in a Devils uniform?  And it would have happened too.  He didn't want to be traded from the Rockies.  Apparently he took it as a rejection from a bottom dweller.  Anyway, nice to see two of our franchise greats, even if no one ever acknowledges the few beasts the Scouts/Rockies managed to have in their short existences.

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The only St. Louis that should be being discussed here is Martin, because he's eligible too (and should go in, but probably won't).  

There's really not much to say about Brodeur's candidacy.  Bill James said you could split Rickey Henderson in half and have two Hall of Famers and I doubt the same is strictly true of Brodeur, but he was very good to great for a very long time.

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3 minutes ago, AEWHistory said:

I wish we had never traded Lanny away.  Can you imagine how awe inspiring it would have been to see him in a Devils uniform?  And it would have happened too.  He didn't want to be traded from the Rockies.  Apparently he took it as a rejection from a bottom dweller.  Anyway, nice to see two of our franchise greats, even if no one ever acknowledges the few beasts the Scouts/Rockies managed to have in their short existences.

Actually, almost to a player, everyone on the Rockies was very sorry that they couldn't make it work in Colorado...the players all absolutely loved the area.  And you are right, Lanny really wanted to be a big building block towards better things, and didn't want to be dealt.  Supposedly Rob Ramage (who by that time was very fed up with the Rockies' struggles, and would demand a deal during his final season with the franchise) said to McDonald shortly after the trade was announced (to the Flames) something along the lines of "What are you upset about?  This is the best thing for your career!"  Lanny was definitely bummed though.  He and Ramage would win a Cup together in 1989, when Lanny was basically on fumes. 

 

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48 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Actually, almost to a player, everyone on the Rockies was very sorry that they couldn't make it work in Colorado...the players all absolutely loved the area.  And you are right, Lanny really wanted to be a big building block towards better things, and didn't want to be dealt.  Supposedly Rob Ramage (who by that time was very fed up with the Rockies' struggles, and would demand a deal during his final season with the franchise) said to McDonald shortly after the trade was announced (to the Flames) something along the lines of "What are you upset about?  This is the best thing for your career!"  Lanny was definitely bummed though.  He and Ramage would win a Cup together in 1989, when Lanny was basically on fumes. 

 

And Rockies only got Lanny due to spite from Imlach.  Imlach was in a power struggle with Sittler so he decided to trade his best friend on the team which was McDonald to the Rockies (trade also involved Quenneville going to Colorado with Hickey and Paiement going to Toronto).

I too read that Lanny was pretty upset about leaving.  He really wanted to play here and make it his team to lead. 

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1 hour ago, Triumph said:

The only St. Louis that should be being discussed here is Martin, because he's eligible too (and should go in, but probably won't).  

There's really not much to say about Brodeur's candidacy.  Bill James said you could split Rickey Henderson in half and have two Hall of Famers and I doubt the same is strictly true of Brodeur, but he was very good to great for a very long time.

St. Louis will get in pretty soon, but he might have to wait another year or two.  I base that on what the writers that are being asked about it are saying, and most of them seem to think that's how it'll play out.  A few of them think that it might be on the first ballot. 

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16 minutes ago, Daniel said:

St. Louis will get in pretty soon, but he might have to wait another year or two.  I base that on what the writers that are being asked about it are saying, and most of them seem to think that's how it'll play out.  A few of them think that it might be on the first ballot. 

Writers talk to people who are responsible for electing members of the HHOF, but unlike baseball they are not the ones who actually do it.

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  • 7 months later...
8 minutes ago, mfitz804 said:

Should be a unanimous decision, anyone who would not vote for Marty to make the Hall has a screw loose. 

You would think, but then again I’ve seen it suggested on a certain other hockey MB that he wasn’t even top 5 of all time. There’s a lot of goofy people out there that don’t know their head from their ass. 

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