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GDT - Devils @ Canadiens 12/14/17

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10 hours ago, Steven M. said:

guess we're all watching different games if Vatanen has been "horrible." being universally praised for his game literally two nights ago but he's been horrible. Seems legit.

guess we're all so spoiled now that we're going to act like the whole team sucked when they went punch for punch with montreal while down half our top six.

It is a product of people's expectations at this point. Come back down to earth people. I also am not sure what people expected out of Vatanen. I guess he was supposed to come in and just completely, and single handedly,  fix a D core that has blown all year lol. 

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3 hours ago, SterioDesign said:

So what was it? haha some dude acting weird with a Devils jersey on? 

Now that just sounds like something that could NEVER happen...

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2 hours ago, NJDevils1214 said:

It is a product of people's expectations at this point. Come back down to earth people. I also am not sure what people expected out of Vatanen. I guess he was supposed to come in and just completely, and single handedly,  fix a D core that has blown all year lol. 

I think he has mostly been pretty effective at what they're trying to get him to do. I would also defer to some of the more analytics focused guys but from my "eye test" I don't believe he's going to rack up many points with the way he is being deployed. He is being used as a shutdown defenseman more so than he is being used for offense. I could be wrong but that's just what I've seen. So the facebook animals are going to only get more and more angry as the year goes on because it's much tougher to evaluate a player playing defense well than it is to just see that Henrique is racking up points while playing top six minutes in ANA.

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10 minutes ago, Steven M. said:

I think he has mostly been pretty effective at what they're trying to get him to do. I would also defer to some of the more analytics focused guys but from my "eye test" I don't believe he's going to rack up many points with the way he is being deployed. He is being used as a shutdown defenseman more so than he is being used for offense. I could be wrong but that's just what I've seen. So the facebook animals are going to only get more and more angry as the year goes on because it's much tougher to evaluate a player playing defense well than it is to just see that Henrique is racking up points while playing top six minutes in ANA.

I said it somewhere a number of days ago...the mere fact this guy was the exchange for the fan favorite Henrique will alone put every single play he makes under intense scrutiny by fans. Some have already come to the conclusion he just completely sucks. I think it is called confirmation bias or something-- when a person only accounts for the things which support their current position. The old "I hit every single red light every time I swear it" thing, despite that not really being the case. They'll notice every little thing the dude does wrong and, short of scoring a goal, will ignore anything he does right. Just like with Moore, which I will say again, I have been impressed with over this stretch of last 10-12 games.

Edited by NJDevils1214
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Defensemen have a harder time with fans as it is because they make more 'mistakes' and more of their 'mistakes' end up in the back of the net.  This board has been around for 15 years in its present form and I can pretty confidently say that defensemen were the fan whipping boys far more often than forwards.  

Vatanen is playing on PP2 so he will get some points eventually and I like his aggressive pinches and that will get him a goal, but when is the last time Lou traded a fan-favorite type of player here?  Langenbrunner had worn out his welcome, no one really cottoned to Arnott part 2, Johnny Oduya I think people were pretty neutral on, it really could be back to 08 and Cam Janssen.  This fan base hasn't really had to deal with that in a long time - fan favorites leaving, sure, but not being dealt.

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Also, just thinking about this, the last time the Devils traded a forward as good or better than Adam Henrique who they drafted and who played here as long or longer - I think it was Petr Sykora.

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50 minutes ago, Triumph said:

Defensemen have a harder time with fans as it is because they make more 'mistakes' and more of their 'mistakes' end up in the back of the net.  This board has been around for 15 years in its present form and I can pretty confidently say that defensemen were the fan whipping boys far more often than forwards.  

Vatanen is playing on PP2 so he will get some points eventually and I like his aggressive pinches and that will get him a goal, but when is the last time Lou traded a fan-favorite type of player here?  Langenbrunner had worn out his welcome, no one really cottoned to Arnott part 2, Johnny Oduya I think people were pretty neutral on, it really could be back to 08 and Cam Janssen.  This fan base hasn't really had to deal with that in a long time - fan favorites leaving, sure, but not being dealt.

Chris Terreri in 2001 perhaps? Wasn't exactly a gut punch trade though, but he was very well liked

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3 minutes ago, '7' said:

Chris Terreri in 2001 perhaps? Wasn't exactly a gut punch trade though, but he was very well liked

Terreri had already been traded once.

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I remember MacLean being traded was a big deal.  Same thing with Terreri the first time around.

McKay as being part of the Arnott for Langs and Nieuwendyk trade is also up there.

Same with Mike Peluso to an extent.

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2 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

I remember MacLean being traded was a big deal.  Same thing with Terreri the first time around.

McKay as being part of the Arnott for Langs and Nieuwendyk trade is also up there.

Same with Mike Peluso to an extent.

MacLean requested a trade and was being a jerk about things. Then he signed with the Rags. Then he came back here and was a terrible assistant coach, a terrible head coach, and a terrible TV guy.

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1 minute ago, '7' said:

MacLean requested a trade and was being a jerk about things. Then he signed with the Rags. Then he came back here and was a terrible assistant coach, a terrible head coach, and a terrible TV guy.

Still was not easy seeing him leave even under the circumstances.  I also really don't care he signed with the Rags, it is not like the Devils were interested in bringing him back anyways and he spurned an offer from us.

He was a decent assistant coach.

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1 minute ago, DevsMan84 said:

Still was not easy seeing him leave even under the circumstances.  I also really don't care he signed with the Rags, it is not like the Devils were interested in bringing him back anyways and he spurned an offer from us.

He was a decent assistant coach.

It made sense for him to sign with the Rags since his entire life was pretty much here...still hated seeing it. He became dead to a lot of us like Driver. Nowadays when Drivers name is announced it's Bruuuuuce. But for a lot of years those were legit boo's.

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15 hours ago, devlman said:

But fvck, we have two guys pinning one Hab, and Coleman decides to abandon his position and come over?! fvck me..

I felt he should have, the puck was there for the taking with the other two pinning the Hab on the boards. As we all saw, that Hab wasn't pinned enough and was able to touch the puck out.

Frustrating, yes. But I feel it was more a good play by him then a bad move with our boys

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1 hour ago, Triumph said:

Also, just thinking about this, the last time the Devils traded a forward as good or better than Adam Henrique who they drafted and who played here as long or longer - I think it was Petr Sykora.

Like others have mentioned...John MacLean (he was a bit before your time, in that obviously you saw him play here, but missed his early and prime years).  When he announced in a pre-game show that he asked Lou to trade him, it really bummed me out...I kept hoping that somehow it would all work out, and that he'd have a change of heart and accept his new role (as more of a checker).   

If you're making Henrique comparisons, there's Kirk Muller too.  On that one, I was fine with it...Richer could really be dynamic back then and was fully in his prime, and I was thinking "Damn, two-time 50-goal scorer, on the DEVILS!"...and the feeling at the time of the deal was that Chorske could turn out to be a lot more than just a throw in...Lou liked his speed a lot.  Chorske had a terrific start here (12 points in his first 13 games), and I remember thinking what a steal that deal might turn it out to be...of course, Chorske would never turn out to be that kind of offensive force, due to his stone hands.  Turned out to be a good deal for both teams, though the Devils got much more out of Chorske than the Canadiens got from Melanson. 

sh!t happens of course, but it sucked that MacLean tore his ACL in a fvcking PRESEASON game.  To this day I think he had a shot at 50 goals that year...he was shredding it in preseason and just seemed like he was in a zone...that 1991-92 team really could've done some damage that season, with Mac in the fold. 

But yeah, to answer the question of the most recent guy before Henrique, pretty sure it's Sykora. 

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976

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Sykora got a raw deal heading out the door. Guy could barely move out there in the 02 playoffs vs the Hurricanes. Then criticized for a supposed lack of toughness before being traded. The trade itself was a good one for us but Sykora had done enough for the team at that point where he deserved nothing but respect.

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15 minutes ago, '7' said:

Sykora got a raw deal heading out the door. Guy could barely move out there in the 02 playoffs vs the Hurricanes. Then criticized for a supposed lack of toughness before being traded. The trade itself was a good one for us but Sykora had done enough for the team at that point where he deserved nothing but respect.

The team needed a jolt...something was severely off with that 2001-02 team, and Sykora has become invisible for games at a time that year.  That felt like a deal where two guys in Friesen and Sykora could benefit from a change of scenery.

Of course, the killer was that, while Sykora was quietly not bad for several seasons following the 2002-03 season, Friesen basically completely vanished...he was toast in the NHL by the time he was 30.   

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