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Elias26

NEW NEWARK MAYOR TAKES ON HOCKEY

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Because you building a new house doesn't infuse millions of dollars and hundreds of jobs into a struggling economy. This is the same kind of socialist attitude that makes many Americans hate big business when we need it to grow the economy. Having the arena will be a boon for Newark and anyone that's against it is using political blustering to gain attention for their political party. You improve education not by just throwing money at the problem, but by improving the city from within so you can create a renewable source of funds (higher taxes, property taxes, etc.). A one time investment of even $200 million, as Newark Devil put it, will do nothing. You need to build from within and that takes time.

Just like building a successful sports franchise.

NewarkDevils 5 says

"As far as putting the money into education, the money was earmarked for economic development. It couldn't be used for education or any other purpose for that matter. Besides, $210 million or even $300 million if it ever comes to that, is a drop in the bucket compared with what is needed to educate a school district of 48,000 students. It would add a little more than $6000 per student for one year and then the money would be gone. One year of education will not do anything for any student."

Based on this statement Newark should shoot the parents and kill the children they will never have a chance. Of course that's bull. The money earmarked for economic development could have been diverted to a worthy cause for the people of Newark instead of lining the pockets of the owners of the Devils.

If the new owners didn't like CAA then they had choices: 1) build a new arena out of their own pockets without government funds 2) move to another place where suckers would help them and 3) stay where they are.

I would like a new house mine is old. What City or State will pay for 2/3's of the costs of new construction to financially help me? Will the City of Newark pay 2/3s of the cost of that new Marriott hotel? I don't think so.

How about a new manufacturing business with decent wages for Newark residents will they pay for that? That's what I am talking about when I speak economic development. Most jobs at the Devils arena will be low paying and are already taken with employers and their employees at CAA.

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wow...this homey sure don't like hockey.

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I never posted put the $300 M in education for Newark. I think there are other places to put that money that will improve Newark and offer jobs to Newark resident and will improve the value and that will translate into moneys from RE taxes and thinngs will imporve.

When I posted as #2 go elsewhere where a sucker will give to the wealthy sport owners I meant to another State. But ND5 made my point he posted that The wealthy owners did choose to go to a place where a sucker would be taken advantage of. That was Newark.

Newark needs a better government and it doesn't need a City paid for arena for the Devils. What have the Devils done for the State of NJ since they have been here? answer NOTHING What ave the Devils done to market the Devils to NJ fans? NOTHING What have the Devils done to improve their team? NOTHING What have the Devils done since they have been in NJ? Raise ticket prices to the third highest in the NHL.

Newark is the loser with the arena situation. Too bad. Seats for a Devils game in the new arena will remain empty like CAA after the newness wears off. How many fans can afford the price of the tickets for this new arena? Not many. Wait until you see the price increase next season for ticket I am sure you all read Lou's letter telling you haw great the Devils were the past season. That was the spin for a ticket price increase for next season.

The Devils have constantly lost money each season because of poor business management and that won't change. For years Devils fans never thought that the Devils was losing money while they were 30 to 35 M per season.

It's time they stand on their own and put out a product that will make money and bring in fans without welfare for them..

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I personally think that tax money can be put to better use. And I am speaking in generalities here - as has been mentioned this money was earmarked for "economic development". But I think the government should stay out of "economic development". If a business, such as a professional hockey franchise, can't make a go of it on their own, the government shouldn't be subsidizing that business.

As the Winnipeg study showed, the Jets brought *ZERO* economic benefit to the area. Nadda. Zero. And that was in hockey crazy Winnipeg. While the Jets were in town, the money collected by the Jets went mostly to the players who spent that money all around the world. After the Jets left, the people that normally would go to Jets games ended up going to movies, local restaurants, local theatre - or they saved their money to buy a big screen TV, or bought a new car, etc, etc, etc. That money in turn was spent within Winnipeg. And that money in turn was spent within Winnipeg.

Professional sports, particularly professional hockey, has a very debatable impact on the local economy.

I'd be upset if it were my tax money. But it's not. I'm glad the provincial and city governments didn't help bail out the disgrace that was the Ottawa Renegades when they ran into financial troubles. That money is better spent on education, health care, public transportation and affordable housing. Or at least a form of "economic development" that has historically proven to work.

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Mabey we should look into signing Anson Carter, then mabey he might change his mind.

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It is your tax money Don. The money going towards the arena comes from the

Port Authority which makes money collecting tolls and fees from airline passengers (among a myriad of other things).

--

As for "what have the Devils done to improve the team", they did win three Cups. The primary reason ticket prices are so high is because the Devils get nothing from parking or concessions at CAA. They have no incentive to lower ticket prices when that is their primary revenue stream.

The Newark Arena will be more convenient for people to go to so even after the newness wears off attendance will still be better.

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And the author makes his bias clear as soon as he says that there won't be any black players on the ice. I wonder if he knows that there are black players in the NHL and which teams they play for? I wonder if he remembers the size of the Hispanic population in Newark and that one of the NJ stars is named, well, Gomez...but then again, apparently they don't count and, once again, he knows nothing about the sport. Only that he hates it.

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Speak for yourself ND5, I haven't, "kept any black man down".

He never mentioned anyone specifically. Are you denying that racism existed and still exists?

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I have a suggestion,

Maybe we should gut our entire roster and sign Jerome Iginla, Donald Brashear, Georges Laraque, Anson Carter, and in goal We'll have Kevin Weeks?

Would he be happy then?

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I never posted put the $300 M in education for Newark. I think there are other places to put that money that will improve Newark and offer jobs to Newark resident and will improve the value and that will translate into moneys from RE taxes and thinngs will imporve.

That is fine, but for that point to be valid you need to actually come up with some alternative ideas. No one has come up with anything but the arena as a valid alternative.

When I posted as #2 go elsewhere where a sucker will give to the wealthy sport owners I meant to another State. But ND5 made my point he posted that The wealthy owners did choose to go to a place where a sucker would be taken advantage of. That was Newark.

Newark knows exactly what it is getting and what it wants to get out of this. Newark is not the equivalent of cities like Cleveland and Washington that dominate their regions without competition. Newark rarely gets mentioned in the media and when it does it is usually in a derisive tone. The arena in Newark is for the same reason the Meadowlands were built in New Jersey: bring the cameras to the city. Let people outside of Newark see that there is something to see in Newark. People in New Jersey don't go to Newark for fun right now. A few go to some of the attractions, but for the most part Newark is trying to regain an image that it lost in '67 and hasn't regained since. The arena is to bring an image change for the city which is crucial for development to happen and, because of sports' great publicity draw, an arena is a very good way of going about it. The NJPAC is a beautiful venue, but you'll never see screen shots on TV of Newark's skyline because of a concert there. The arena will put the name Newark back on the consumer shelf and that is why they are willing to foot the bill.

Newark needs a better government and it doesn't need a City paid for arena for the Devils. What have the Devils done for the State of NJ since they have been here? answer NOTHING What ave the Devils done to market the Devils to NJ fans? NOTHING What have the Devils done to improve their team? NOTHING What have the Devils done since they have been in NJ? Raise ticket prices to the third highest in the NHL.

Newark is the loser with the arena situation. Too bad. Seats for a Devils game in the new arena will remain empty like CAA after the newness wears off. How many fans can afford the price of the tickets for this new arena? Not many. Wait until you see the price increase next season for ticket I am sure you all read Lou's letter telling you haw great the Devils were the past season. That was the spin for a ticket price increase for next season.

The Devils have constantly lost money each season because of poor business management and that won't change. For years Devils fans never thought that the Devils was losing money while they were 30 to 35 M per season.

It's time they stand on their own and put out a product that will make money and bring in fans without welfare for them..

The issue of who buys tickets and who doesn't matters much less than how much exposure the city gets from the arena. The goal is to get people to think of Newark as a household name again which it hasn't been in decades. Name me a project they could have used that money for that would advertise Newark on television at minimum 41 nights a year in various different cities across the country as well as within the state. It would cost more than $210 million to put together an equivalent advertising campaign in the prime time spots about the city for the period of 30 years that this arena is leased for.

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Again, the arena is just a step in the process. The NJPAC was a very good step as well. So too was the Newark Bears. The Red Bulls soccer stadium due across the pasaic river in Harison is another step, as was the new FBI building on the waterfront. The continued demolition of abandoned factories in the iron bound section and replacement on those sites with new houses is another step. Now, you have a solid foundation, so continue building, attract better hotels and restaurants. Try to round up a rich family to begin to underwrite an art museum or something. You've already got seton hall law school, convince the state to upgrade the rutgers campus also. You've got a transportation hub that makes access to the city available to all the state (amtrak, njtransit, path) as well as nyc - upgrade it. Hire some new cops and patrol the area like mad - total "no tolerance" zone. Then start to reassess other properties in the area - basically, tell them to clean up or get out.

The arena is not, and should not ever be seen as, the be all to end all for Newarks woes, it's just another (big) step in the right direction toward revitalization of a city that really was a destination for millions in the past - talk to any resident around 60 to 80 years old from north jersey/eastern jersey and they'll tell you stories of going to newark for shopping etc.

btw, to the "throw more money at education" folks - statewide, schools spend about $9,000 to $11,000 per student, yet cities like newark, camden, asbury park spend over $20,000 per student - yeah, throwing more money into a corrupted system is really working wonders - the money never makes it anywhere near a classroom, it gets swallowed up by corrupt administrators and school boards and the various consultants and contractors who helped those in power get to power. More money doesn't make a problem go away. Committment and hard work are the only way to make a problem go away. More money breeds corruption and laziness, then an attitude of entitlement, while the outsiders' contempt and disdain grows stronger.

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Hire some new cops and patrol the area like mad - total "no tolerance" zone. Then start to reassess other properties in the area - basically, tell them to clean up or get out.

That's exactly what they have in the Baltimore waterfront tourist area. A friend of mine gave a bum a quarter and in 3.2 seconds a cop was carting the guy away, my friend protested saying it was no big deal, but the cop said, nope, no panhandling, period. The police swarm at the tiniest hint of trouble.

As for the schools in Newark, I think a voucher program would whip those schools into shape. Good stiff competition is the best cure. You'll never run your fastest time if no one is chasing you.

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Again, the arena is just a step in the process. The NJPAC was a very good step as well. So too was the Newark Bears. The Red Bulls soccer stadium due across the pasaic river in Harison is another step, as was the new FBI building on the waterfront. The continued demolition of abandoned factories in the iron bound section and replacement on those sites with new houses is another step. Now, you have a solid foundation, so continue building, attract better hotels and restaurants. Try to round up a rich family to begin to underwrite an art museum or something. You've already got seton hall law school, convince the state to upgrade the rutgers campus also. You've got a transportation hub that makes access to the city available to all the state (amtrak, njtransit, path) as well as nyc - upgrade it. Hire some new cops and patrol the area like mad - total "no tolerance" zone. Then start to reassess other properties in the area - basically, tell them to clean up or get out.

The arena is not, and should not ever be seen as, the be all to end all for Newarks woes, it's just another (big) step in the right direction toward revitalization of a city that really was a destination for millions in the past - talk to any resident around 60 to 80 years old from north jersey/eastern jersey and they'll tell you stories of going to newark for shopping etc.

btw, to the "throw more money at education" folks - statewide, schools spend about $9,000 to $11,000 per student, yet cities like newark, camden, asbury park spend over $20,000 per student - yeah, throwing more money into a corrupted system is really working wonders - the money never makes it anywhere near a classroom, it gets swallowed up by corrupt administrators and school boards and the various consultants and contractors who helped those in power get to power. More money doesn't make a problem go away. Committment and hard work are the only way to make a problem go away. More money breeds corruption and laziness, then an attitude of entitlement, while the outsiders' contempt and disdain grows stronger.

Newark does have an art museam. An small, but excellent one, in fact, that is free to anyone who lives in Newark. It has the largest collection of Greek and Roman glass in North America. I went to see the collection and the Exhibition of the Private Life of the Last Czar & Czarina when it was at the Museum in late 2004-early 2005. There was also a fantastic exhibiltion of designer handbags and scarves in the textiles wing at the time. I had a great visit. Well worth the $5 entrance fee since I wasn't a resident.

I plan to go back again...it is second on the list after I go back to the Cloisters.

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Newark does have an art museam. An small, but excellent one, in fact, that is free to anyone who lives in Newark. It has the largest collection of Greek and Roman glass in North America. I went to see the collection and the Exhibition of the Private Life of the Last Czar & Czarina when it was at the Museum in late 2004-early 2005. There was also a fantastic exhibiltion of designer handbags and scarves in the textiles wing at the time. I had a great visit. Well worth the $5 entrance fee since I wasn't a resident.

I plan to go back again...it is second on the list after I go back to the Cloisters.

Did you like the Chandeliers? I supplied them!

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...so according to this guy all hockey fans are raceist bastards...ok yea that's pretty fair. i don't watch a sport to see an ethnic rainbow, i watch it cause i love the sport. if a man from kenya was the next big thing in hockey i'd welcome him with open arms...why does race have to be brough into everything? this is 2006 right? :noclue:

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Newark Attractions:

Museums:

Newark Museum

New Jersey Historical Society

Museum of African American Music (proposed/under construction)

New Jersey Jewish Museum (proposed)

Concert Venues:

New Jersey Performing Arts Center

Symphony Hall

Newark Arena (proposed)

PSE&G Plaza (outdoor amphitheater)

Notable Parks:

Branch Brook Park

Weequahic Park

Minish Park (proposed)

Military Park

Washington Park

Lincoln Park

Architecturally Significant Buildings:

National Newark Building (home of the Devils front office)

Pennsylvania Station

Old First Church

Cathedral Basilica of the Sacred Heart

Raymond-Commerce Building

Essex County Courthouse

Ballantine House (part of Newark Museum)

Broad Street Train Station

New Jersey Central Railroad Station (now a portion of Newark Arena)

There are many more of these but these are off the top of my head...

Clubs:

Here's a list of clubs in Newark

Restaurants:

Here's a list of restaurants in Newark

But the funny thing is that with all this stuff in the city (and plenty more that I forgot about or didn't think to mention) no one in New Jersey knows about it. The Arena will get people coming into the city on a regular basis and maybe a few start looking around and wondering about some of the things they see on the way in and out. You better believe that Newark will take full advantage of hosting an NHL All-Star game when the arena's built and the publicity the city gets when that happens. I'm sure they'll also try and get the Final Four and various other different high profile events. All this is more advertising than anything the city could pull off without the arena. People know what there is to see in Washington. People around Cleveland know what Cleveland has. People in New Jersey haven't a clue what they've got in Newark. Most people 40 and under have never actually gotten off the highway into the city of Newark before unless it was accidental. This will be a huge step in reversing that and letting the state and the country know what Newark has.

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Let's be honest though... the smell has a LOT to do with that. How many people know what beautiful downtown Gary Indiana has to offer either... :yucky: Honest that's what kept me away until I had a job at the Prudential Center - on occasion I go to Iberia.

What about Trenton? Thats' a beautiful city that needs help. how much do the Titans bring to that city?

I'm honestly curious. I am not at all against a Newark arena.

Is there any chance the Nets would join the Devils if the Brooklyn deal falls through?

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The Titans don't get national coverage. Its the equivalent of asking what the Newark Bears do for Newark.

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Let's be honest though... the smell has a LOT to do with that. How many people know what beautiful downtown Gary Indiana has to offer either... :yucky: Honest that's what kept me away until I had a job at the Prudential Center - on occasion I go to Iberia.

What about Trenton? Thats' a beautiful city that needs help. how much do the Titans bring to that city?

I'm honestly curious. I am not at all against a Newark arena.

Is there any chance the Nets would join the Devils if the Brooklyn deal falls through?

I had federal court jury duty in trenton, the court officer told us not to venture more than two blocks away from the court house. Trenton really needs to be bombed at this point, if there is anything "beautiful" there, you'd need a pirate's buried treasure map to find it.

If the nets brooklyn deal falls through, chances are the owner would sell them - he's using the nets as a means of doing a large real estate development, without the realestate deal, he has no need for the nets.

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ND 5 we can beat this to death.

Newark had a comprehensive economic development plan going back to 1978. The basic plan was to build from the Newark airport up throught the center of the city using Route 21 (McCarter highway) and Broard street as the main focus. Prudential had agreed to leave the Eastern Home office in Newark but because of failure of the City to follow the plan they moved the Eastern Home office to Wayne NJ. Then Newark built the PAC close to Route 21 and the Stadium for the Newark Bears. The City of Newark and it's people got nothing from these ventures. Then the FBI took prime property on the river (no RE taxes) along Route 21 and it did nothing for Newark and it's people. The water front hasn't been developed. Because the plan got diverted to the Newark Arena for the Devils. The new Arena will do nothing for Newark and it's people.

The failure of the City of Newark to follow the original plan has cause a splinter effect and it only benefits the owners of the NJ Devils. They can't draw in the present CAA and won't in Newark becuase of failures within the Devils marketing organization and Devils greed.

Newark will again lose out like the Past two or three changes to the master plan.

I sincerely hope that I am wrong but I don't think so.

ND5 you can talk education all you want but that's a nit to the overall development plan for Newark. It's the typical spin that the Devils use.

Don't be so selfish and screw the Devils. ND5 think the City of Newark and it's people.

Let the Devils move to another State. I doubt that anyone wants them when it comes to taxpayer dollars.

Newark is building off of the hospitals and the CMD in Newark that will help.

The Devils have done nothing for anyone, period. What they won 3 cups so how much food does that put on the table of the poor. While winning 3 Cups they continue to lose money and fans at CAA. The joke has been that there isn't anyone in the seats during the playoffs for the Devils.

I don't want to debate this failed plan any longer. I won't reply. I just hope that Newark can find a way to demand more from the Devils or break the arena plan. It's up to the courts.

Edited by LucifersDog

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ND 5 we can beat this to death.

Newark had a comprehensive economic development plan going back to 1978. The basic plan was to build from the Newark airport up throught the center of the city using Route 21 (McCarter highway) and Broard street as the main focus. Prudential had agreed to leave the Eastern Home office in Newark but because of failure of the City to follow the plan they moved the Eastern Home office to Wayne NJ. Then Newark built the PAC close to Route 21 and the Stadium for the Newark Bears. The City of Newark and it's people got nothing from these ventures. Then the FBI took prime property on the river (no RE taxes) along Route 21 and it did nothing for Newark and it's people. The water front hasn't been developed. Because the plan got diverted to the Newark Arena for the Devils. The new Arena will do nothing for Newark and it's people.

The failure of the City of Newark to follow the original plan has cause a splinter effect and it only benefits the owners of the NJ Devils. They can't draw in the present CAA and won't in Newark becuase of failures within the Devils marketing organization and Devils greed.

Newark will again lose out like the Past two or three changes to the master plan.

I sincerely hope that I am wrong but I don't think so.

ND5 you can talk education all you want but that's a nit to the overall development plan for Newark. It's the typical spin that the Devils use.

Don't be so selfish and screw the Devils. ND5 think the City of Newark and it's people.

Let the Devils move to another State. I doubt that anyone wants them when it comes to taxpayer dollars.

Newark is building off of the hospitals and the CMD in Newark that will help.

The Devils have done nothing for anyone, period. What they won 3 cups so how much food does that put on the table of the poor. While winning 3 Cups they continue to lose money and fans at CAA. The joke has been that there isn't anyone in the seats during the playoffs for the Devils.

I don't want to debate this failed plan any longer. I won't reply. I just hope that Newark can find a way to demand more from the Devils or break the arena plan. It's up to the courts.

lucifers dog no offense but you are the most pessimistic person i have ever met, normally i would respect yuor ideas but what you have written is plain bs and really negative. you say that the devils havent given aything to nj, how about 3 cups, or a great sports team. it seems to me that you want the devils to be some kind of miracle worker like jesus and save the world, REALTY CHECK THEY ARE A HOCKEY TEAM. this arena will help newark alot, for example my family doesnt go to newark, but now that the devs are moving there i will get some kind of season plan. oh btw i believe you said that the money should be given for schools, let me inform you about something, nj has given over 1 billion dolars to newark and it really hasnt helped, so trust me 200 million wont do anything. if yuo want to improve schools tell parents to discipline their children better, like make them study, or keep them of the streets.

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There are various things in my opinion wrong about your argument, but I will agree to disagree with you.

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I don't want to debate this failed plan any longer. I won't reply. I just hope that Newark can find a way to demand more from the Devils or break the arena plan. It's up to the courts.

I guess you won't be attending any games in Newark, eh GetReal?

And what happens if they do "break the arena plan"? Who's going to be responsible for removing the half-built arena?

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I

And what happens if they do "break the arena plan"? Who's going to be responsible for removing the half-built arena?

I think the cost of removal is in the contract. It is born by the Devils if the fail to come forth with funds on a timely basis. They have already missed some schedules as the project has gone on.

But it could be converted to something else by someone else without the Newark give aways.

As for going to games, I probably can't afford the new higher prices, should it ever open for Devils hockey.

I can't afford next seasons ticket price increase at CAA.

Edited by LucifersDog

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I think the cost of removal is in the contract. It is born by the Devils if the fail to come forth with funds on a timely basis. They have already missed some schedules as the project has gone on.

Wasn't this already resolved? I seem to remember the Devils being required to produce their entire share of the money (or prove that they had it) or else the project would stop... they're still building, so I'm assuming the Devils' end of the finances are satisfactory.

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