Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
devlman

Why Do refs hate us?

44 posts in this topic

the league realizes we are a good team and have been for a while and are refusing to legitimize us because we're not a marquee team like detroit, pittsburgh, the ranjerks, etc. We're just not a household name and the rest of the world doesn't recognize us, so the league is trying to suppress us. Sooner or later they're going to have to give us some respect. we're getting the publicity now

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The officiating is bad. There is no way around it. Even when the dopes calling the games manage to somehow call the game even and be fair to both teams, they're also probably calling these ridiculous calls that have no place in the sport. Take the Shanahan penalty for example last night. Was there a little hook? No doubt, but so what. Did he stop the King from gaining the zone? Did he completely disrupt that play? I guess he is just supposed to let the guy skate right by him and watch him. What it looks like to me is a sad attempt to try and boost scoring opportunities because the hook was beyond marginal meanwhile Gionta gets his stick ripped from his hands and play just carries on. Who was really denied the scoring opportunity? Don't even get me started with the Elias penalty. That was such a lame ass call that whichever official called it should be suspended or go work for the NBA. Seriously, it is absolutely shameful that call was made in a professional male hockey league.

What it comes down to is that if the refs want to cite infractions on the ice, even if it's against one team more then another, then at least make calls when there is a REAL infraction. All these morons seem to be good at is removing all and any flow from the games and castrating the sport and the players. Elias gets 2 minutes for throwing a clean and basic body check? Fvck off!

Edited by SickMan

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
The Capitals are 5th in the league in most penalties taken and had to kill off 8 minutes of power play basically in a row in the 3rd period last night.

also what the hell are you talking about. the penguins are 4th in the league and the capitals are around 10th. did you do any research before making this statement or jsut figured it had to be true?

http://www.nypost.com/seven/02062009/sport...vant_153765.htm

"The Devils have enjoyed 178 power plays this season, 30th among 30. The NHL average was 216, as of yesterday, a hefty 21.3 percent more than New Jersey had, while, guess who, Pittsburgh, leads the league with 238."

The Capitals being #2 was said on NHL on the FLY by Jim Van Horne. (after the Nashville game) Fast forward 3 weeks later, Washington is currently 8th. Where is the overall strength of your point? (if the Ovechkin lead Capitals & the Crosby lead Penguins are both top 10 in penalties drawn) Meanwhile the Devils who are dead last in the league, (which conveniently was never challenged by you) continue to get the short end of the stick?!?! And a fan is not supposed to acknowledge it? It seems to me after checking the papers, reading websites, watching hockey games, (Cangelosi said it twice last night) that the rest of the hockey world is acknowledging it. However a fan is simply to sigh and say; *nope sorry, all coincendental on this side of the nut house.*

You want to know if the Devils players are acknowledging it?

"That's 60 more power plays, two full games of man-advantage more than us." -Dainius Zubrus

"What, we don't work hard enough to draw penalties? No." -John Madden

"I have answers, but they're not printable as long as I'm an active player." -Bobby Holik

"Ever since we went west, we've been getting one or two power plays per game. You'd think this group of forwards would draw more power plays. Good thing we're a good 5-on-5 team." -Zach Parise

You want to play beggers blind man, as I said in my prior post... BE MY GUEST! When you just talk to talk, despite an opinion that's felt by a majority... take a seat.

That is not even close to being true if you look at it by a per game basis

I never said anything about per game penalties, or average penalty(s) per game(s), or the basis of the penalty per team. I said the Penguins have the most called penalties with 238. (which was written in the NY Post) The fact that both the Caps & Pens being top 10, and the Devils dead last, really doesn't help your point.

Edited by Beezer34

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've always hated the term "to draw a penalty" IMO that means to deceive the ref by embellishing/diving to get a penalty called against the opposition.

A classic example of this in years past, see Forsberg-Peter. In this modern era, see Savard-Mark. Datsyuk-Pavel. there are many more.

I will take pride that the Devils IMO have never been a team that "draws" penalties. If I was a ref, I would call diving and punish it with a 5 minute major and a game misconduct. I hate diving=cheating.

This goes back to my theory (the evidence is overwhelming IMO) that the 2001 SCF was rigged. The Devils had 29 powerplays to the Avs 47, at the time the Devils had been the least penalized team in the NHL for a good 6-7 years.

Think about it, Like Triumph said, it's all about ratings. Why do you think Detroit has been such a force over the years? sure they are a good team, but when you get powerplays given to you on phantom calls, it helps you. Look at the Bruins, how many times this season have we seen them trailing by a goal with 2 mins or less remaining in the third and they get a phantom powerplay to enable them to tie the game ?

A Bruins-Wings SCF would be a ratings blockbuster for Bettman. The trouble is that there are better teams than those two in each conference that are far more deserving of a SCF matchup, if those two teams are allowed to get a level playing field as far as officiating goes and the Wings/Bruins are not aided by the league with phantom powerplays we'll see who the real (legit) best teams are in the NHL.

It's pretty sad and it's accross all sports, even college football.

Lakers always get the calls, Yankees always get the calls. NE used to but now the Steelers get the calls. In college football USC always gets the calls.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I don't buy the conspiracy theory. The quality of officiating is inconsistent at best, but I have seen some bad calls go in our favor as well. Not as many as against us, but still. The problem is bad refs look for the obvious. When a player hits the ice, they assume they have to make a call. How many times have we seen a ref who was out of position call a penalty when someone just fell? If the refs need to see something obvious, divers (Crosby) are going to be rewarded. It's not because the league wants the Pens to win. The only bias in Crosby's favor is that refs are afraid to give him the 5 minute major/misconduct when he dives. We have every right to be proud of the Devils for refusing to dive, and I would be mad if they stopped, but it does hurt us. I just hope we get good refs for the playoffs, though that didn't happen last year.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I've always hated the term "to draw a penalty" IMO that means to deceive the ref by embellishing/diving to get a penalty called against the opposition.

A classic example of this in years past, see Forsberg-Peter. In this modern era, see Savard-Mark. Datsyuk-Pavel. there are many more.

I will take pride that the Devils IMO have never been a team that "draws" penalties. If I was a ref, I would call diving and punish it with a 5 minute major and a game misconduct. I hate diving=cheating.

This goes back to my theory (the evidence is overwhelming IMO) that the 2001 SCF was rigged. The Devils had 29 powerplays to the Avs 47, at the time the Devils had been the least penalized team in the NHL for a good 6-7 years.

Think about it, Like Triumph said, it's all about ratings. Why do you think Detroit has been such a force over the years? sure they are a good team, but when you get powerplays given to you on phantom calls, it helps you. Look at the Bruins, how many times this season have we seen them trailing by a goal with 2 mins or less remaining in the third and they get a phantom powerplay to enable them to tie the game ?

A Bruins-Wings SCF would be a ratings blockbuster for Bettman. The trouble is that there are better teams than those two in each conference that are far more deserving of a SCF matchup, if those two teams are allowed to get a level playing field as far as officiating goes and the Wings/Bruins are not aided by the league with phantom powerplays we'll see who the real (legit) best teams are in the NHL.

It's pretty sad and it's accross all sports, even college football.

Lakers always get the calls, Yankees always get the calls. NE used to but now the Steelers get the calls. In college football USC always gets the calls.

Actually, I think the Bruins have been very, very good this year. Although NJ played very well against them and won in OT the last game, do you think the lead they have on the rest of the conference is some sort of a mirage? I agree, there are better teams in the West than the Wings this year, but you make it sound like Bruins suck. They don't. Savard can't possibly dive his way to enough calls to explain this season. I hope if NJ faces them in the playoffs (which would require that both teams win a round or two if things keep up the way they are going) that the Devils don't take the Bruins as lightly as you do.

Has the officiating often been perplexing? Yes. But NJ has at or near the bottom of the league in PP awarded for years now. You somehow thought this would change? The difference may be that they also used to be among the least penalized teams, you rarely saw a period like the second period last night where there was just one after another. However, there was also one after another for the Kings at one point, it was NJ penalty, then an LA penatly, they would switch off and there would be 4-on-4 and it was only a matter of time before somebody connected. Essentially, it was insane - and whichever side connected first, the fans on the other side were bound to be extremely unhappy.

Even Chico - who was sputtering about the officiating - admitted between the 2nd and 3rd that NJ wasn't exactly playing their best. Blame the officiating all you want. The team wasn't all that great.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
http://www.nypost.com/seven/02062009/sport...vant_153765.htm

"The Devils have enjoyed 178 power plays this season, 30th among 30. The NHL average was 216, as of yesterday, a hefty 21.3 percent more than New Jersey had, while, guess who, Pittsburgh, leads the league with 238."

The Capitals being #2 was said on NHL on the FLY by Jim Van Horne. (after the Nashville game) Fast forward 3 weeks later, Washington is currently 8th. Where is the overall strength of your point? (if the Ovechkin lead Capitals & the Crosby lead Penguins are both top 10 in penalties drawn) Meanwhile the Devils who are dead last in the league, (which conveniently was never challenged by you) continue to get the short end of the stick?!?! And a fan is not supposed to acknowledge it? It seems to me after checking the papers, reading websites, watching hockey games, (Cangelosi said it twice last night) that the rest of the hockey world is acknowledging it. However a fan is simply to sigh and say; *nope sorry, all coincendental on this side of the nut house.*

Not only did I bring it up long before (N)Єverson in this thread, here:

http://www.njdevs.com/forums/index.php?sho...t=0&start=0

I thought we got to the bottom of why that was the case. The Devils don't dive and they get leads in games. They were 5th in penalty differential over several seasons. Now this year, since they've added penalty machines Holik and Shanahan, things have changed, but in general the Devils have gotten many more power plays than penalties.

Beyond that, I think it's ludicrous to instantly point to referee bias instead of considering things that are more likely, like that having Mike Green, Alex Ovechkin, Alex Semin, and so on means a team is likely to draw a lot of penalties because of the offensive skill those players possess. And if it were officials' bias, you'd see a lot less penalties called against the Capitals.

Anyway I see the tinfoil hat crowd is out in this thread. I do think the Devils don't draw any reputation calls and that hurts them, but to claim it's a league-wide bias is totally missing the boat.

Edited by Triumph

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Looks like that (N)Єverson article is getting to everyone, I feel like people are complaining more since that article came out. Looks like (N)Єverson has won the battle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Beyond that, I think it's ludicrous to instantly point to referee bias instead of considering things that are more likely, like that having Mike Green, Alex Ovechkin, Alex Semin, and so on means a team is likely to draw a lot of penalties because of the offensive skill those players possess.

And the Devils don't have two of the league's top ten scorers? The Devils have 13 fewer goals than the Caps in one less game, there's no way there should be that much of a disparity.

Yeah we never seem to get a lot of the calls but it's gotten even worse over the last couple years.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I feel like people are complaining more since that article came out.

...including our own players. :whistling:

And the Devils don't have two of the league's top ten scorers? The Devils have 13 fewer goals than the Caps in one less game, there's no way there should be that much of a disparity.

+1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I've always hated the term "to draw a penalty" IMO that means to deceive the ref by embellishing/diving to get a penalty called against the opposition.

Drawing a penalty really means that the offensive player is going to beat you like a rented goalie and the only way to stop it is to commit a penalty. Think of it like basketball. Diving is a penalty. I haven't seen it called in a long time, but have.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Actually, I think the Bruins have been very, very good this year. Although NJ played very well against them and won in OT the last game, do you think the lead they have on the rest of the conference is some sort of a mirage? I agree, there are better teams in the West than the Wings this year, but you make it sound like Bruins suck. They don't. Savard can't possibly dive his way to enough calls to explain this season. I hope if NJ faces them in the playoffs (which would require that both teams win a round or two if things keep up the way they are going) that the Devils don't take the Bruins as lightly as you do.

Has the officiating often been perplexing? Yes. But NJ has at or near the bottom of the league in PP awarded for years now. You somehow thought this would change? The difference may be that they also used to be among the least penalized teams, you rarely saw a period like the second period last night where there was just one after another. However, there was also one after another for the Kings at one point, it was NJ penalty, then an LA penatly, they would switch off and there would be 4-on-4 and it was only a matter of time before somebody connected. Essentially, it was insane - and whichever side connected first, the fans on the other side were bound to be extremely unhappy.

Even Chico - who was sputtering about the officiating - admitted between the 2nd and 3rd that NJ wasn't exactly playing their best. Blame the officiating all you want. The team wasn't all that great.

Sue, I've never said the Bruins suck, they are a good team, but IMO they are nowhere near as good as their record suggests, that's what I'm getting at.

I don't take the Bruins lightly, you have to be careful playing against them because at some point or the other they will get a BS penalty (Rupp/Savard faceoff) and get away with murder (Colin White speared in the neck)

That game should never have reached OT, the Bruins scored very shortly after White got speared and they also scored on the BS powerplay where Rupp got called when Savard dived. All things being equal the Devils win that game 2-1 in regulation.

These extra points (even in losses) inflate the Bruins record, and it's transparent, similar to the Rangers SO record (bring back ties-eliminate the skills game, aka SO)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Looks like that (N)Єverson article is getting to everyone, I feel like people are complaining more since that article came out. Looks like (N)Єverson has won the battle.

Well every team's fanbase thinks they get screwed by the refs regardless. The difference is we actually have irrefutable numbers to back it up.

Besides, consider the source. When even (N)Єverson (who normally looks for ways to rip us) notices it why wouldn't everyone else?

Edited by NJDevs26

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
the league realizes we are a good team and have been for a while and are refusing to legitimize us because we're not a marquee team like detroit, pittsburgh, the ranjerks, etc. We're just not a household name and the rest of the world doesn't recognize us, so the league is trying to suppress us. Sooner or later they're going to have to give us some respect. we're getting the publicity now

Inferiority complex much.....

3 Stanley Cups, consistently competitive year after year, and this fanbase still whines like babies that didn't get their bottle.....

Yeah, I said it.

You think Sutter's telling these guys: "Sorry boys, we should have won that game if not for the officiating!"

What do you think he's saying today in prep for tommorrow??????

If this team is good enough the officiating can be overcome, good or bad....

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sue, I've never said the Bruins suck, they are a good team, but IMO they are nowhere near as good as their record suggests, that's what I'm getting at.

I don't take the Bruins lightly, you have to be careful playing against them because at some point or the other they will get a BS penalty (Rupp/Savard faceoff) and get away with murder (Colin White speared in the neck)

That game should never have reached OT, the Bruins scored very shortly after White got speared and they also scored on the BS powerplay where Rupp got called when Savard dived. All things being equal the Devils win that game 2-1 in regulation.

These extra points (even in losses) inflate the Bruins record, and it's transparent, similar to the Rangers SO record (bring back ties-eliminate the skills game, aka SO)

NJ has had 14 games decided in OT or the SO this year, one more than Boston. If what you are saying is, NJ has won more of those games, whether by SO or OT, then you are correct. Boston has won 6 and lost 7, NJ has won 11 and lost 3. However, some of NJ's win's are still by the SO. We still aren't pure, either. Under your rules, NJ would give back 4 points from the wins by SO, and all 3 of the points from the losses. That's 7 points. Boston would give back the 7 points from the losses and 3 points from the wins in the SO, that's 10 points. They would still be ahead of NJ. I don't really see that that would change.

I love that in your version of the game in Boston, you seem to think that the first Boston goal just magically appeared, and wasn't caused by our own goalie's stupidity. Also, I don't recall that their getting away with spearing Colin White actually caused them to score a goal. Yes, they should have gotten a penalty for it. But, it didn't actually put the puck in the net for them.

I read the Boston boards after that game. You want to know what they were saying? Their goalie cost them the game. It's amazing how the two sides can look at it. They think Thomas was a sieve on both the 3rd NJ goal and the winning OT goal.

Please, you know what your post would sound like if you read it? Joe Micheletti doing color commentary on a Ranger game (if you substituted NY for NJ). According to him, the refs pretty much cost NY most of their games.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Inferiority complex much.....

3 Stanley Cups, consistently competitive year after year, and this fanbase still whines like babies that didn't get their bottle.....

Yeah, I said it.

You think Sutter's telling these guys: "Sorry boys, we should have won that game if not for the officiating!"

What do you think he's saying today in prep for tommorrow??????

If this team is good enough the officiating can be overcome, good or bad....

:rolleyes:

of course he isn't saying that. but it does seem like we always have to work much harder than the big name teams to get recognition outside the fanbase. we don't have the name that EVERYBODY knows when they think of hockey

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
You think Sutter's telling these guys: "Sorry boys, we should have won that game if not for the officiating!"

...I don't think he needs to. From the quotes I've read from the team, they already seem to pretty much know the poor calls (or lack-there-of) that have or have not gone their way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
:rolleyes:

of course he isn't saying that. but it does seem like we always have to work much harder than the big name teams to get recognition outside the fanbase. we don't have the name that EVERYBODY knows when they think of hockey

lol, er.. Brodeur?

( but i guess he doesn't count since he really cant draw penalties, if thats what are you trying to infer.. )

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I was at the Devils vs. Kings game and I have to say that it was the worst called game I have ever seen. It really does seem like the refs are always against us, especially those video guys in Toronto....and at the game there was a little kid behind me who had a great comment on the refs..he screamed "Hey ref check your phone! You missed 10 calls!"...i had never heard this before, and it pretty much summed up the night.

Edited by RockingTheRed81

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0