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Patrice Cormier Elbow

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devilsfan26    54

+1

Much as I can't stand this hit, what happens on the ice is not criminal -- it's a physical, dangerous sport, and Tam knew the risk when he took the ice.

That's ridiculous, at some point you draw the line. You don't agree to put your life in someone else's hands when you play hockey. If a player stomped on someone else's neck with a skate would you still say what happens on the ice is not criminal? There are certain things that transcend a hockey game.

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sundstrom    256

+1

Much as I can't stand this hit, what happens on the ice is not criminal -- it's a physical, dangerous sport, and Tam knew the risk when he took the ice.

they knew the risk when they bought their tickets. i say, "let them crash."

That's ridiculous, at some point you draw the line. You don't agree to put your life in someone else's hands when you play hockey. If a player stomped on someone else's neck with a skate would you still say what happens on the ice is not criminal? There are certain things that transcend a hockey game.

this is the truth. i'll pretty much support the devils and their guys on anything but there is no conceivable way this can be excused. the fact that he's got a history only makes it worse. assuming the Q either suspends him for a very long period or the rest of the season, it'll be interesting to see how lou plays it bringing him to the AHL?

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mouse    43

That's ridiculous, at some point you draw the line. You don't agree to put your life in someone else's hands when you play hockey. If a player stomped on someone else's neck with a skate would you still say what happens on the ice is not criminal? There are certain things that transcend a hockey game.

He didn't get his neck stomped. He took an elbow. As has been discussed on this thread, 99 times out of 100, he doesn't come anywhere close to dying. I'm not defending Cormier, he took a cheap shot and badly endangered an opponent, and doesn't deserve to play again this year, in Quebec or in the AHL, but even dirty hits are a part of the game and not crimes. He should therefore be punished by the league, not the courts.

As for Tam, I feel horrible for him, he in no way deserved this, and I wish him the best, but as a hockey player, I can say with complete and total confidence that anyone who laces them up knows that there are dirty hits, and that there is the possibility that they will be the 1 person in 100 to suffer a sever injury or worse from a dirty hit. I think nearly all players hope that the game polices itself, and that hits like this never happens, but the minute you choose to play a fast, physical game on skates, you know the risk you are taking.

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xxchaznjxx    3

there is no defending this hit at all. i hate to see it, especially from one of our top prospects.

but people who think he should never suit up for the devils are going way overboard. lou will get this kid in line before he ever dresses for the devils. i remember corrente had a fairly bad rep before he came up and he seems to have found a way to play tough but within the rules. i would expect patrice to do the same, or he will never be brought up.

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maxpower    21

if you don't think stevens ever made a dirty hit in his life, you have to be pretty deluded. the point that sarge made is that while this play is heinous and cormier deserves whatever suspension is coming, a player capable of these sorts of things is going to be a tough player for opponents to reckon with even when he cleans up his act.

and you can have clean hits that are "dirty"... like his rampage against the 'Canes in '01

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Devils731    36

and you can have clean hits that are "dirty"... like his rampage against the 'Canes in '01

I would add, for Stevens, the time he climbed on top of a guy and cross checked him about 6 times while the guy turtled, that was pretty dirty too.

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maxpower    21

I would add, for Stevens, the time he climbed on top of a guy and cross checked him about 6 times while the guy turtled, that was pretty dirty too.

alot of people forget the old game. it was nasty. this was extremely nasty but not unprecidented. really what has people up in arms is what happened afterwards. and it was bad. there's so many other things that can go wrong in games that put you in that situation. my pet peeve is shoving someone head-first into the boards. most of the time, the player gets up. eventually, one won't.

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devilsfan26    54

He didn't get his neck stomped. He took an elbow. As has been discussed on this thread, 99 times out of 100, he doesn't come anywhere close to dying. I'm not defending Cormier, he took a cheap shot and badly endangered an opponent, and doesn't deserve to play again this year, in Quebec or in the AHL, but even dirty hits are a part of the game and not crimes. He should therefore be punished by the league, not the courts.

As for Tam, I feel horrible for him, he in no way deserved this, and I wish him the best, but as a hockey player, I can say with complete and total confidence that anyone who laces them up knows that there are dirty hits, and that there is the possibility that they will be the 1 person in 100 to suffer a sever injury or worse from a dirty hit. I think nearly all players hope that the game polices itself, and that hits like this never happens, but the minute you choose to play a fast, physical game on skates, you know the risk you are taking.

Yea he didn't get his neck stomped, but my point was that you can't just say "what happens on the ice is not criminal" because there are certain situations where the league simply banning him isn't enough punishment. Do you at least agree with that, that the line must be drawn somewhere (in which case we just disagree on where that line is put), or do you think it doesn't matter what happens and nothing that happens on the ice should end up in court?

Also I've played hockey for 17 years, I know I can be seriously injured, but that doesn't mean I'm okay with someone escaping criminal charges for nearly killing me in a vicious play that is obviously outside the rules of the game.

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mouse    43

Yea he didn't get his neck stomped, but my point was that you can't just say "what happens on the ice is not criminal" because there are certain situations where the league simply banning him isn't enough punishment. Do you at least agree with that, that the line must be drawn somewhere (in which case we just disagree on where that line is put), or do you think it doesn't matter what happens and nothing that happens on the ice should end up in court?

Also I've played hockey for 17 years, I know I can be seriously injured, but that doesn't mean I'm okay with someone escaping criminal charges for nearly killing me in a vicious play that is obviously outside the rules of the game.

I disagree on where the line is, I agree it exists. I think it's tough to figure out where it is -- I would say premeditated would be the biggest factor. You'd have to change the sport to eliminate "crimes of passion," and short of changing the game, you can't make those illegal, unless they're frighteningly heinous (like stomping the neck).

alot of people forget the old game. it was nasty. this was extremely nasty but not unprecidented.

It's tougher to fight in juniors -- I'm more tolerant of dirty hits when you will be held accountable for them.

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devilsfan26    54

I disagree on where the line is, I agree it exists. I think it's tough to figure out where it is -- I would say premeditated would be the biggest factor. You'd have to change the sport to eliminate "crimes of passion," and short of changing the game, you can't make those illegal, unless they're frighteningly heinous (like stomping the neck).

Fair point.

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jsonnabend    0

I disagree on where the line is, I agree it exists. I think it's tough to figure out where it is -- I would say premeditated would be the biggest factor. You'd have to change the sport to eliminate "crimes of passion," and short of changing the game, you can't make those illegal, unless they're frighteningly heinous (like stomping the neck).

It's tougher to fight in juniors -- I'm more tolerant of dirty hits when you will be held accountable for them.

An elbow to the head at that speed is heinous. Legally speaking, implied consent and/or assumption of risk don't begin to cover it.

And as for "crimes of passion", how about stomping on someone's neck (to use your example) in the heat of the moment, as opposed to premeditatedly? The law says "crimes of passion" and/or "heat of the moment" don't excuse criminal acts (but they may change the severity of the charge).

- Jeff

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William    0

You are 100% correct. No one consents to that kind of contact merely by signing-on to play. In New York, that's assault and if the player died, manslaughter.

I hope to never see Cormier in NJ.

- Jeff

don't be surprised to see him in jersey this year.

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maxpower    21

I disagree on where the line is, I agree it exists. I think it's tough to figure out where it is -- I would say premeditated would be the biggest factor. You'd have to change the sport to eliminate "crimes of passion," and short of changing the game, you can't make those illegal, unless they're frighteningly heinous (like stomping the neck).

It's tougher to fight in juniors -- I'm more tolerant of dirty hits when you will be held accountable for them.

these things really shouldn't be happening in juniors at all. which is why I guess they're cracking down. the last couple of times, I've been surprised by the chippyness of the WJC. the pros won't play that chippy in the Olympics.

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MadDog2020    1,901

That hit was unacceptable and he deserves a lengthy suspension. However, I will say this: I can't wait to see Cormier in a Devils uniform. He WILL learn where that line is- you can be sure Lou will see to that. And when he does- and he still has that edge to his game- he will bring a much-needed physical presence to the line-up. It's been said in this thread a few times- this team lacks grit and toughness. Cormier will provide some.

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That hit was unacceptable and he deserves a lengthy suspension. However, I will say this: I can't wait to see Cormier in a Devils uniform. He WILL learn where that line is- you can be sure Lou will see to that. And when he does- and he still has that edge to his game- he will bring a much-needed physical presence to the line-up. It's been said in this thread a few times- this team lacks grit and toughness. Cormier will provide some.

Exactly. Cormier could be the "a$$hole" the Devils lack on the ice if and when he gets to the NHL. This team still has a choir boy feel to it all too often.

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thefiestygoat    134

That hit was unacceptable and he deserves a lengthy suspension. However, I will say this: I can't wait to see Cormier in a Devils uniform. He WILL learn where that line is- you can be sure Lou will see to that. And when he does- and he still has that edge to his game- he will bring a much-needed physical presence to the line-up. It's been said in this thread a few times- this team lacks grit and toughness. Cormier will provide some.

I agree completely. This entire incident should never have happened and is horrible, but I think he will learn from this. I've been excited about him ever since he got drafted and this incident doesn't change that.

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DevilMinder    372

Seems like Cormier is getting somewhat infamous for this, I am seeing him on non sports forums. The convulsions of his victim are stirring up a little hatred.

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Im sure he will be don in th qmjhl for the season but in no way should he be arrested.

The Quebec Major Junior Hockey League Disciplinary Prefect, Raymond Bolduc, today announced that Rouyn-Noranda Huskies forward Patrice Cormier has been suspended indefinitely for his hit on Quebec Remparts' defenseman Mikael Tam which occurred during yesterday's game.

The Disciplinary Prefect confirmed that the disciplinary process will follow existing protocols. Once the disciplinary process has been completed, an announcement will be made. No timetable has yet been

set.

Edited by marty_is_better30

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maxpower    21

Seems like Cormier is getting somewhat infamous for this, I am seeing him on non sports forums. The convulsions of his victim are stirring up a little hatred.

oh, it's going to be huge, in Canada, at least.

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justdo3043    14

I personally am glad he'll be a Devil. I think he'll learn to walk that line much better and the Devils will use the dirty play to their favor in the future.

Here's some footage with an interview of the the poor kids coach Patrick Roy.

My link

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jim777    14

No need for that magic "talking to from Lou" to cure this kid of his 'go straight for the head' ways, as he doesn't have a problem with it.

A suspendable offence, Lou?

"I'm not the judge or jury, but in my opinion, no," Lamoriello told the Newark Star-Ledger.

and

"I certainly have spoken to Patrice, only because of the rhetoric," Lamoriello told the Star-Ledger. "I asked him how he felt because of the rhetoric.

"There is no issue from my end of it."

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/opinion/Time+stop+vicious+head+hits/2458089/story.html

Edited by jim777

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