Phil Kessel?

[CarpathianForest]

So I was reading Puck Daddy's post on yahoo news and he posted a link to an article about a possible trade idea for Brian Burke. The Devils weren't specifically mentioned, but it got me to thinking. Kessel has two years remaining on his contract with the Leafs at 5.4 mil per season. I think it would be a possible decent trade to send something Toronto's way for Kessel.

[Daniel]

Unless we can give up basically garbage to get him, or one of the defenseman we would have to give up anyway, I wouldn't touch that guy with a five foot pole.

True, Semin's got the same baggage. But you don't have to trade anything for him, and he can also agree to go to the KHL if it's not working out.

[Onddeck]

Well that's be great but hat would to propose? I could see the demand pretty high

[Zubie#8]

Why bother blowing up your team for this guy when you can sign Semin.

Edited July 9, 2012 by Zubie#8

[ghdi]

So I was reading Puck Daddy's post on yahoo news and he posted a link to an article about a possible trade idea for Brian Burke. The Devils weren't specifically mentioned, but it got me to thinking. Kessel has two years remaining on his contract with the Leafs at 5.4 mil per season. I think it would be a possible decent trade to send something Toronto's way for Kessel.

I have a really tough time thinking we'd have a shot at this considering what Toronto gave up just to get him. I think it would take a good roster player, one of our best prospects, and I imagine Burke would try to get a 1st round pick out of the deal. Burke's going to get a high return for Kessel because he's got that contract. Its not a guy about to go UFA. Just like Nash and Ryan.

I would take Kessel over Nash and Ryan, but I don't think we have the assets to do it without giving up Henrique or Josefson at the minimal. I doubt Burke would even want Josefson.

Unless we can give up basically garbage to get him, or one of the defenseman we would have to give up anyway, I wouldn't touch that guy with a five foot pole.

Why not?? He's coming off an 82 point year and is only 24. The guy is an absolute beast. He's clearly getting better every year, especially when it concerns assists.

[devilsrule33]

Considering what Burke got to get him, and all the heat and backlash he got for the move, there is no way he is trading him. And if he did, the offer would have to be so outrageous, it make no sense. Burke, also, isn't looking for young players, prospects and certainly not draft picks. He needs talent to win now.

In conclusion, Phil Kessel might be one of the most untouchable players in the game.

Edited July 9, 2012 by devilsrule33

[CarpathianForest]

I think moving a couple pieces could work to get Kessel. It really depends on what Toronto needs. We're loaded at D and TOR needs some good D Men.

While Kessel is an amazing player, he's not a game breaker in Toronto which I think makes him a bit more affordable in a trade. Plus, he doesn't have much hype surrounding him like Nash and Ryan.

[ghdi]

Considering what Burke got to get him, and all the heat and backlash he got for the move, there is no way he is trading him. And if he did, the offer would have to be so outrageous, it make no sense. Burke, also, isn't looking for young players and prospects. He needs talent to win now.

In conclusion, Phil Kessel might be one of the most untouchable players in the game.

Yep. I think Kessel would be next to impossible for us to acquire without severely hurting this team.

It'd be one thing if he was a year from UFA and told Burke he wouldnt stay there, but with his cap friendly contract and the fact he is only 24, I doubt Burke would even answer the phone lol.

[Zubie#8]

I think moving a couple pieces could work to get Kessel. It really depends on what Toronto needs. We're loaded at D and TOR needs some good D Men.

While Kessel is an amazing player, he's not a game breaker in Toronto which I think makes him a bit more affordable in a trade. Plus, he doesn't have much hype surrounding him like Nash and Ryan.

Toronto will never trade Kessel unless they get something massive in return. Kessel was their offense last year. Thats the reason why Lupul had such a monster year.

[ghdi]

I think moving a couple pieces could work to get Kessel. It really depends on what Toronto needs. We're loaded at D and TOR needs some good D Men.

While Kessel is an amazing player, he's not a game breaker in Toronto which I think makes him a bit more affordable in a trade. Plus, he doesn't have much hype surrounding him like Nash and Ryan.

Kessel is arguably the best American in the game right now.

Burke gave up a sh!tload just to get him. I really don't think a "couple pieces" would do it and there's probably not one D-Man on our roster outside of Larsson that could be a centerpiece.

[CarpathianForest]

Well it was just a thought. You guys are right. Lou has already made a big splash adding Krys Barch.

[Devs1965]

Well it was just a thought. You guys are right. Lou has already made a big splash adding Krys Barch.

+1 I was so excited I nearly

Edited July 9, 2012 by Devs1965

[Daniel]

Kessel is arguably the best American in the game right now.

I would rather have: Parise, Kessler (when healthy), Schneider, Suter, Patrick Kane, Bobby Ryan, Joe Pavelski, Paul Statsny, Dustin Brown.

And if we're going on future consideration, I'd also rather have Seth Jones and Galchenyuk. You could even stretch things a bit and say Couturier (was born in Phoenix).

As you can tell, I'm not that high on Kessel. He's certainly talented, but he clearly hasn't lived up to expectations in Toronto. His talent also does not make up for how soft he is.

[lucifer91]

I would rather have: Parise, Kessler (when healthy), Schneider, Suter, Patrick Kane, Bobby Ryan, Joe Pavelski, Paul Statsny, Dustin Brown.

And if we're going on future consideration, I'd also rather have Seth Jones and Galchenyuk. You could even stretch things a bit and say Couturier (was born in Phoenix).

As you can tell, I'm not that high on Kessel. He's certainly talented, but he clearly hasn't lived up to expectations in Toronto. His talent also does not make up for how soft he is.

Quick isn't in that list?

[ghdi]

As you can tell, I'm not that high on Kessel. He's certainly talented, but he clearly hasn't lived up to expectations in Toronto. His talent also does not make up for how soft he is.

How can he live up to expectations on a bad team? He had 82 points last year, by FAR the statistical leader on that team. Career high in goals and assists last season. What do you want him to do? 100-120? He has never had enough around him there. That is almost a laughable statement to make considering the Leafs always have high expectations even if they were in last place the year prior.

I have never heard anyone call Phil Kessel soft. The dude is a cancer survivor and always produces and has never played less than 70 games and has been in the league since he was 18.

[Daniel]

Quick isn't in that list?

Yes definitely. Forgot about him.

[CarpathianForest]

It could be argued that Kessel isn't that untouchable. Burke traded what eventually ended up being Tyler Seguin for Kessel. If you've ever read Down Goes Brown you would know that that whole trade is viewed as a mighty debacle my many Tor fans.

Housen is basically open to exchanging his first class tickets for a bunch of coach in moving Nash. Why can't it be possible to move some pieces for Kessel?

[ghdi]

I would rather have: Parise, Kessler (when healthy), Schneider, Suter, Patrick Kane, Bobby Ryan, Joe Pavelski, Paul Statsny, Dustin Brown.

And if we're going on future consideration, I'd also rather have Seth Jones and Galchenyuk. You could even stretch things a bit and say Couturier (was born in Phoenix).

Couturier is Canadian. He was born in the states to Canadian parents, but plays for Canada in international and was raised in Canada. His father was playing in Phoenix at the time.

Would you rather have Parise at 7.5 for 13 years or Kessel for 5.4 right now?

Kane is the only name on that list that I would consider over Kessel. The rest of the guys you list are good players, but none provide the scoring touch Kessel does.

[Daniel]

How can he live up to expectations on a bad team? He had 82 points last year, by FAR the statistical leader on that team. Career high in goals and assists last season. What do you want him to do? 100-120? He has never had enough around him there. That is almost a laughable statement to make considering the Leafs always have high expectations even if they were in last place the year prior.

I have never heard anyone call Phil Kessel soft. The dude is a cancer survivor and always produces and has never played less than 70 games and has been in the league since he was 18.

82 points was his best season, either as a member of the Bruins or Leafs. Before that he never topped 65 points.

Obviously I meant "soft" on the ice. Don't take my word for it though, other NHLers feel the same way, and by a wide margin at that. My link

Again, he's a good player, but certainly not close to being the best US born player. And if he were that good, it would be harder for people to say how much Burke got butt-raped in that deal. Basically, nobody would be saying the same thing had he made the same deal for Parise, or many of the other players I mentioned above.

[Daniel]

Would you rather have Parise at 7.5 for 13 years or Kessel for 5.4 right now?

Value relative to how much he's getting paid is a different issue than how good he a player he is. And if the Devils could afford it pocketbook-wise, I'd take Parise at his current deal.

[ghdi]

82 points was his best season, either as a member of the Bruins or Leafs. Before that he never topped 65 points.

Obviously I meant "soft" on the ice. Don't take my word for it though, other NHLers feel the same way, and by a wide margin at that. My link

Again, he's a good player, but certainly not close to being the best US born player. And if he were that good, it would be harder for people to say how much Burke got butt-raped in that deal. Basically, nobody would be saying the same thing had he made the same deal for Parise, or many of the other players I mentioned above.

15% of 145 think hes easy to intimidate. I don't consider that a big deal. 20 players chose Kessel, but the rest chose someone else.

His stats are almost all on an uptick. He's gotten better when he has players around him and as he's gotten older. He had 60 in 70 games the one time he's been on a good team. He was on bad teams with the Bruins until his last year there and bad teams with the Leafs. There's no reason to believe his production would drop on a good team.

Bull. Any player in that deal bar the true superstars right now would've been considered overpayment especially considering that the Leafs were/are dogsh!t and gave up a huge chunk of their future. Had a good team made that deal, it'd be a lot different. Kessel also wanted out of Boston, which made it easier for the Bruins to deal him. Even Burke admits he overpaid. That was not a good deal.

I dont think Zach or Kane or Brown would've improved the Leafs to the point of that deal ever being considered good.

Based on his age, his current cap hit, and what he does well, Id take Kessel over almost any US born player right now. It also depends on need. We need scoring more than we need a Suter. Kane and Kessel would be a hard decision to make between. Quick would be the only other consideration because of our future goaltender needs and we've seen what goaltenders can do after a good run. Quick is no lock to being worth a 10 year deal. Id bet on it before against it, but he's not shown he can do what he does over a period of time.

Edited July 9, 2012 by ghdi

[Daniel]

15% of 145 think hes easy to intimidate. I don't consider that a big deal. 20 players chose Kessel, but the rest chose someone else.

His stats are almost all on an uptick. He's gotten better when he has players around him and as he's gotten older. He had 60 in 70 games the one time he's been on a good team. He was on bad teams with the Bruins until his last year there and bad teams with the Leafs. There's no reason to believe his production would drop on a good team.

Bull. Any player in that deal bar the true superstars right now would've been considered overpayment especially considering that the Leafs were/are dogsh!t and gave up a huge chunk of their future. Had a good team made that deal, it'd be a lot different. Kessel also wanted out of Boston, which made it easier for the Bruins to deal him. Even Burke admits he overpaid. That was not a good deal.

I dont think Zach or Kane or Brown would've improved the Leafs to the point of that deal ever being considered good.

Zach and Brown were captains on Stanley Cup finalists. That doesn't show up on the stat sheet, but does count. Kane is the best or second best forward on a team that won the Cup. Zach and Kane have both done better on the meat and potatoes stat sheets over the years.

Yeah, Kessel had more points last year, which was his best statistical year. That hardly counts as a trend. I'll also note that tallying a lot of points on a bad team isn't better than a guy who does so on a good team. The scoring even on a bad team has to come from somewhere and will usually be more concentrated in a few players.

Also note that there's a reason he got benched during the Olympics.

Again, good player. But I wouldn't trade that much to get him.

Edited July 9, 2012 by Daniel

[ghdi]

Zach and Brown were captains on Stanley Cup finalists. That doesn't show up on the stat sheet, but does count. Kane is the best or second best forward on a team that won the Cup. Zach and Kane have both done better on the meat and potatoes stat sheets over the years.

Yeah, Kessel had more points last year, which was his best statistical year. That hardly counts as a trend. I'll also note that tallying a lot of points on a bad team isn't better than a guy who does so on a good team. The scoring even on a bad team has to come from somewhere and will usually be more concentrated in a few players.

Also note that there's a reason he got benched during the Olympics.

Again, good player. But I wouldn't trade that much to get him.

Hell, I wouldnt give up that much to get him either at least from a Devils perspective. It would take key ingredients to our team that have already been here to acquire Kessel and theres very few guys Id consider putting a Henrique or Larsson into a trade for and almost none of them are American.

Look at his stats overall. He is consistent and since he's been in Toronto, his stats go up as the Leafs acquire more pieces. The better players he has around him, the more he contributes, same thing in Boston. The only years he's been under 50 points were at age 18 and 19 on bad teams. From our perspective, putting Kessel with Kovalchuk or on a line with Elias, is deadly and probably the best talent he will have ever played with from a scoring perspective.

Zach has also had a major knee injury and missed a year. I don't think he lasts 10 of the years that he's signed for, much less 13. Nor do I think Kessel is worth a 13 year deal. This year will tell us a lot about Zach as a hockey player.

I would argue for Toews over Kane, but IMO Kane is probably the only guy I consider over Kessel in this argument from our perspective. They're the youngest and provide the best value for what they do. I dont think we need Suter and I dont think Zach is worth 13 years.

Edited July 9, 2012 by ghdi

[CarpathianForest]

Kessel may be soft, but he's also considered by the NHLPA poll to be the 4th fastest skater in the NHL. Something we need with all the geriatric cases on our team.

Burke gave up 2 first round picks and a 2nd round pick which is insane. But I think a combination of picks, prospects and players could get Burke thinking. And, no we wouldn't have to include Henrique or Josefson.

[Triumph]

Kessel may be soft, but he's also considered by the NHLPA poll to be the 4th fastest skater in the NHL. Something we need with all the geriatric cases on our team.

Burke gave up 2 first round picks and a 2nd round pick which is insane. But I think a combination of picks, prospects and players could get Burke thinking. And, no we wouldn't have to include Henrique or Josefson.

2 1st round picks and a 2nd round pick isn't insane to give up for a player like that if you knew the 1st round picks would be between 15th and 30th. Since they ended up 2nd and 9th, it didn't really end up working out.

I don't like Kessel, even though he is without a doubt a very good player. He's not a play driver, he's weak defensively, and he's not a creative player. And of course the Leafs would never trade him for anything NJ has, but that's immaterial I suppose.