Jas0nMacIsaac Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 (edited) I certainly think he'll improve puck possession, but we're already a good puck possession team. I just can't see how he adds any scoring. Trickle down effect should happen. Ruutu is an upgrade offensively over Zubrus I think. Zubrus is an upgrade overall to Loktionov on the 3rd line as well. NJ doesn't need much more scoring. They are still an elite team defensively and along the boards. Tuomo is a very good at deflecting pucks and is 8 for 23 in shootouts so it is at least another option. Edited March 6, 2014 by Jas0nMacIsaac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarpathianForest Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 What other needs does his cap hit prevent the Devils from attempting to fulfill? If it's just the idea that he creates a logjam, his salary is neither here nor there. And unless he turns into a real dumpster fire next year, he is moveable. Yeah except he's another older player with a history of injuries and very little upside. If he doesn't work out you might be able to get a late round pick. In response to CoffeeCake: Clearing out Fayne takes one potential UFA off the books. He's kind of middle of the pack. He's not as valuable as Greene or some of the younger players but he's not as useless as Volch and Sal. So in my mind he's expendable. As far as prospects we're not talking Reid Boucher, but we are stacked on D prospects, we can afford to move a future player with possible NHL potential to address contemporary concerns. Finally, a 3rd or 4th round pick doesn't always equal a Datsyuk or Zetterberg. If you move all three of those things it's possible you can get a Moulson or Vanek out of the deal which addresses the scoring issues and even possibly get a late round pick in a later draft year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted March 6, 2014 Author Share Posted March 6, 2014 Yeah except he's another older player with a history of injuries and very little upside. If he doesn't work out you might be able to get a late round pick. Ok, fine. We didn't give up a ton to get him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarpathianForest Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 Trickle down effect should happen. Ruutu is an upgrade offensively over Zubrus I think. Zubrus is an upgrade overall to Loktionov on the 3rd line as well. NJ doesn't need much more scoring. They are still an elite team defensively and along the boards. They are a top possession and defensive team, but that doesn't translate to goal scoring. How many 1-0, 2-1 type games have we lost because no one is shooting the puck. Ruutu's shots per game is only half a point more than Loktionov's. In my mind that's not going to cut it. Ok, fine. We didn't give up a ton to get him. You're right. We didn't give up a ton to get him. However, we didn't need his type of player in the first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas0nMacIsaac Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 (edited) They are a top possession and defensive team, but that doesn't translate to goal scoring. How many 1-0, 2-1 type games have we lost because no one is shooting the puck. Ruutu's shots per game is only half a point more than Loktionov's. In my mind that's not going to cut it. You're right. We didn't give up a ton to get him. However, we didn't need his type of player in the first place. When healthy he is a 2 shots per game type player and generally has a high sh% because most shots are in close. In 20 games with Zajac and Jagr It wouldn't surprise me if he had 5 goals...he isn't a 6% shooter, that is for sure. Edited March 6, 2014 by Jas0nMacIsaac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecoffeecake Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 Yeah except he's another older player with a history of injuries and very little upside. If he doesn't work out you might be able to get a late round pick. In response to CoffeeCake: Clearing out Fayne takes one potential UFA off the books. He's kind of middle of the pack. He's not as valuable as Greene or some of the younger players but he's not as useless as Volch and Sal. So in my mind he's expendable. As far as prospects we're not talking Reid Boucher, but we are stacked on D prospects, we can afford to move a future player with possible NHL potential to address contemporary concerns. Finally, a 3rd or 4th round pick doesn't always equal a Datsyuk or Zetterberg. If you move all three of those things it's possible you can get a Moulson or Vanek out of the deal which addresses the scoring issues and even possibly get a late round pick in a later draft year. I think adding a Moulson or Vanek wouldn't work out well either way. I think the Ruutu trade was a message about where Lou wants to take this franchise. The Kovy deal blew up on us chemistry wise. Adding a scorer doesn't mean the teams scoring issues are solved. Besides, we're finally putting some pucks in the net, maybe this group has finally come together. Like I said, we're thin enough with picks and prospects. Let's build with what we have, and add system guys like Ruutu, maybe a Stastny this summer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarpathianForest Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 When healthy he is a 2 shots per game type player and generally has a high sh% because most shots are in close. In 20 games with Zajac and Jagr It wouldn't surprise me if he had 5 goals...he isn't a 6% shooter, that is for sure. That says a lot about the lack of talent on this team if Ruutu gets 1st line minutes. I don't see him potting more than 3 goals in the remaining games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas0nMacIsaac Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 (edited) That says a lot about the lack of talent on this team if Ruutu gets 1st line minutes. I don't see him potting more than 3 goals in the remaining games. That is only even strength, he may get on the 2nd PP unit in front of the net, he won't play the PK. Lou is looking for players to fill in certain roles. It is clear Zubrus just doesn't have the offensive skill at this point to play with Jagr and Zajac and produce consistently. If Ruutu is indeed healthy (I believe NJ did their homework) then Ruutu is skilled enough to finish on their line, will destroy players on the forecheck and be very heavy along the boards. I really think Ruutu fits the makeup of this team, just like I thought Jagr and Clowe matches the makeup of this team. Edited March 6, 2014 by Jas0nMacIsaac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarpathianForest Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 That is only even strength, he may get on the 2nd PP unit in front of the net, he won't play the PK. Lou is looking for players to fill in certain roles. It is clear Zubrus just doesn't have the offensive skill at this point to play with Jagr and Zajac and produce consistently. If Ruutu is indeed healthy (I believe NJ did their homework) then Ruutu is skilled enough to finish on their line, will destroy players on the forecheck and be very heavy along the boards. I really think Ruutu fits the makeup of this team, just like I thought Jagr and Clowe matches the makeup of this team. I think a lot of the criticism of Zubrus is unfounded. He's got 10 goals and 13 assists. He's not having a stellar season but he's meeting expectations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilsfan118 Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 If he was shooting his career average he'd have, what, 10 goals this season? So..that's one way to sort of sugarcoat it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas0nMacIsaac Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 (edited) I think a lot of the criticism of Zubrus is unfounded. He's got 10 goals and 13 assists. He's not having a stellar season but he's meeting expectations. He has been good, but he is also playing with our best possession center and Jagr. If Ruutu is healthy playing with Jagr I believe he gets close to 20 goals. Edited March 6, 2014 by Jas0nMacIsaac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarpathianForest Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 He has been good, but he is also playing with our best possession center and Jagr. If Ruutu is healthy playing with Jagr I believe he gets close to 20. 20 points? That's a very tall order. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas0nMacIsaac Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_statistics.php?c=0+1+3+5+4+6+7+8+13+14+29+30+32+33+34+45+46+63+67&ds=1&f3=TUOMORUUTU&f1=2013_s+2012_s+2011_s+2010_s+2009_s+2008_s+2008_p+2007_s Look at the penalty drawn ratio as well. The more we are on the PP the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarpathianForest Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_statistics.php?c=0+1+3+5+4+6+7+8+13+14+29+30+32+33+34+45+46+63+67&ds=1&f3=TUOMORUUTU&f1=2013_s+2012_s+2011_s+2010_s+2009_s+2008_s+2008_p+2007_s Look at the penalty drawn ratio as well. The more we are on the PP the better. It's a bit over 1 per game but he also averages penalties taken at 1 per game. Plus if he's going to play on the first line he's going to be taking his TOI to a new level. He's around 13 minutes per game TOI Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas0nMacIsaac Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 It's a bit over 1 per game but he also averages penalties taken at 1 per game. Plus if he's going to play on the first line he's going to be taking his TOI to a new level. He's around 13 minutes per game TOI Once again, he was coming into this season off two hip surgeries and a knee injury in camp. Looking at his career totals is probably a closer representation to what he will bring from here on out since it is said that he is finally healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarpathianForest Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 Once again, he was coming into this season off two hip surgeries and a knee injury in camp. Looking at his career totals is probably a closer representation to what he will bring from here on out since it is said that he is finally healthy. You can't overlook the fact that Jagr and Zajac are playing on average 19 minutes per game. I don't see how Ruutu can manage going from a career average of 13 minutes per game to 19 minutes per game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas0nMacIsaac Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 (edited) You can't overlook the fact that Jagr and Zajac are playing on average 19 minutes per game. I don't see how Ruutu can manage going from a career average of 13 minutes per game to 19 minutes per game. They are around 16 minutes ES, Jagr and Zajac often fill in with 4th line players to get a little more ice time as well. I think he will be fine at 13 and a half minutes at ES. Edited March 6, 2014 by Jas0nMacIsaac Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarpathianForest Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 I just don't see how replacing Zubrus with Ruutu on that line is more effective. Granted Zubrus has played 6 more games but Zube's S% is 3 points higher, he has 14 more shots and 7 more points. It's kind of a wash IMO. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas0nMacIsaac Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 I just don't see how replacing Zubrus with Ruutu on that line is more effective. Granted Zubrus has played 6 more games but Zube's S% is 3 points higher, he has 14 more shots and 7 more points. It's kind of a wash IMO. Ruutu is a career near 13% shooter, he is a better shooter than Zubrus regardless of the poor luck this season. Also, Ruutu is playing with inferior linemates. If you replace Zubrus with Ruutu, he is probably near 2 shots a game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CarpathianForest Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 If Ruutu pans out like I think he won't I'll be one of the first to inquire about his game worn Devils jersey at Meigray. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maxpower Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 Probably the best they could do given their limited buying chips Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thecoffeecake Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 That says a lot about the lack of talent on this team if Ruutu gets 1st line minutes. I don't see him potting more than 3 goals in the remaining games. 20 points? That's a very tall order. You can't overlook the fact that Jagr and Zajac are playing on average 19 minutes per game. I don't see how Ruutu can manage going from a career average of 13 minutes per game to 19 minutes per game. I just don't see how replacing Zubrus with Ruutu on that line is more effective. Granted Zubrus has played 6 more games but Zube's S% is 3 points higher, he has 14 more shots and 7 more points. It's kind of a wash IMO. If Ruutu pans out like I think he won't I'll be one of the first to inquire about his game worn Devils jersey at Meigray. Hey, everyone. CF doesn't like the Ruutu trade. Thought I'd save you the breath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grcenter47 Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 we got a player who can compete against henrik in head & shoulders advertisements Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onddeck Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 we got a player who can compete against henrik in head & shoulders advertisements that's all we need Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevilMinder Posted March 6, 2014 Share Posted March 6, 2014 Can the three of you take your love letters to private messages I am getting sick of weeding through them to read content 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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