Triumph Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Good look by Justin Bourne about what the Devils are doing defensively: http://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/580411 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NLinfante Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Great article. I love the GIF showing Zajac move from offense to D in one hard stride due to the fact that the devils turn the puck over at the offensive blueline and Zubrus is there to accept the role as F1. Totally overlooked considering the speed of the game, but that's supreme discipline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazer Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 awesome, have to look at later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Namelesz Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Wow, that was broken down like the guy was in the practices and inside Deboer's head....scary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Should this be taking a long time to load? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derlique Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Should this be taking a long time to load? There are a lot of GIFS and pictures which probably delay load time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 There are a lot of GIFS and pictures which probably delay load time The homepage doesn't even appear to load. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SS-SS Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 (edited) Nice article. ''Trying to keep games close seems kinda smart when you go 1-8 in two-goal games (a .111 winning percentage, worst in hockey).''Especially when you cant win a single shootout Edited September 17, 2014 by SS-SS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 If it's not working for you, download thescore's app. I skimmed it, and its somewhat depressing in that it suggests that the Devils' strong possession stats are fools gold. I wish though that writers when noting the Devils low shots for also mention the possibility that shots are significantly undercounted at home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarDew Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 The homepage doesn't even appear to load. Took a bit for this to load for me. I stopped and tried again then I just went and got something to drink and when I returned it was loaded. btw I don't use apps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thefiestygoat Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Always enjoy Justin Bourne's articles and tweets. His Unique Team Traits series has been really insightful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazer Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 (edited) If it's not working for you, download thescore's app. I skimmed it, and its somewhat depressing in that it suggests that the Devils' strong possession stats are fools gold. I wish though that writers when noting the Devils low shots for also mention the possibility that shots are significantly undercounted at home. explain how the Kings rank 2nd or first i should say, to the devils in g's for and against. its the same system that went to the SCF, minus some key individuals edit: when the devils are doing well the D is pushing the play which is why you see some guys caught getting back. Edited September 18, 2014 by lazer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SterioDesign Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 this was very interesting, tells you how bad those guys are trained and have to know whats up at all time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted September 18, 2014 Author Share Posted September 18, 2014 If it's not working for you, download thescore's app. I skimmed it, and its somewhat depressing in that it suggests that the Devils' strong possession stats are fools gold. I wish though that writers when noting the Devils low shots for also mention the possibility that shots are significantly undercounted at home. That's not what it suggests at all. Look the Devils weren't a great posession team last year because their possession advantage did not result in a significant shots advantage. They generated lots more Corsi and Fenwick but not many shots. Even so they still could've made the playoffs with some shootout luck and less Brodeur. It's an open question whether this team will be better - I suspect yes, but it can't be overstated what a drag Gelinas was on possession in the back half of the year, in addition to the guys they've added who aren't really possession pluses (basically everyone they have added this off-season). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derlique Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 That's not what it suggests at all. Look the Devils weren't a great posession team last year because their possession advantage did not result in a significant shots advantage. They generated lots more Corsi and Fenwick but not many shots. Even so they still could've made the playoffs with some shootout luck and less Brodeur. It's an open question whether this team will be better - I suspect yes, but it can't be overstated what a drag Gelinas was on possession in the back half of the year, in addition to the guys they've added who aren't really possession pluses (basically everyone they have added this off-season). Reading Bourne's article, I think it pretty much confirms what we all saw with Gelinas and how poor he was in the neutral zone. Being in the wrong place or missing when stepping up makes for very easy passage through the neutral zone, thus, chances against. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hystyk28 Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 (edited) That's not what it suggests at all. Look the Devils weren't a great posession team last year because their possession advantage did not result in a significant shots advantage. They generated lots more Corsi and Fenwick but not many shots. Even so they still could've made the playoffs with some shootout luck and less Brodeur. It's an open question whether this team will be better - I suspect yes, but it can't be overstated what a drag Gelinas was on possession in the back half of the year, in addition to the guys they've added who aren't really possession pluses (basically everyone they have added this off-season).The only way I see this team being successful within this system is having the players have a high shooting percentage, which with the opportunities they create could happen. They are just as stingy with the puck in the o zone as the d zone, since they don't just haphazardly shoot the puck around, so I don't see a significant increase in shot attempts. Unfortunately, when the chances arose they couldn't bury Grade A chances. I believe this is why they are looking at guys or have brought in guys that that can play this quite unfun style.(Jagr, Zubrus,Clowe, Rutuu, Gomez, Fedotenko) I believe NJ is not a destination for FA's to play because of this style. It takes a special type of player to buy in, especially since guys in this league get paid in relation to their points. Also, it simply isn't fun hockey to play for most players. All the clamoring that was had for Evander Kane over the last year would have been an utter trainwreck if thatvcame to fruition under the current organizational plan. This is why losing Parise was so devastating, as he is the ideal player for how this team is designed to play. Not only was he good at it, he loves to play that Devil way. He thrived at both ends of the rink and was mstaer of the 2 foot putt. As a fan, it isn't the most entertaining hockey to watch, but as a player I completely get the concept and understand why we see the guys that end up here. That being said, I think this team is gonna miss Fayne more than anyone thinks.If this approach fails, I wonder how in tune the owners are into the brand of hockey they are selling. Not sure how you reconfigure the whole organization since the style is so ingrained, but but let's hope they don't ever have that decision to make or Oilers fans might be making fun of us. Edited September 18, 2014 by hystyk28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLL765 Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 (edited) If it's not working for you, download thescore's app. I skimmed it, and its somewhat depressing in that it suggests that the Devils' strong possession stats are fools gold. I wish though that writers when noting the Devils low shots for also mention the possibility that shots are significantly undercounted at home. That's not really what I got from it. It seemed to say more so that it's a quality system that if we were to bring in some higher end talent who could bury chances at a higher rate than most of last year's roster could, then we'd really be a force to be reckoned with.I think we're very similar to LA in that our ability to suppress shots also hampers our ability to get shots/chances. The difference between us and LA is that LA has that high end talent in every position with Kopitar, Gaborik, Carter, Doughty and co. to bury the chances they get while we don't have anyone that is in the same neighborhood as the talent they have, at least not until some of our prospects on defense have breakout sessions. The only player we have that is a safe bet to be elite is Schneider in goal as I have no doubt that he will be able to handle the workload of a starter and prove that he's worth the extension he recently signed. While Jagr and Elias are great, they're only getting older so they're better bets to regress than to improve on their performances from last season. Edited September 18, 2014 by ATLL765 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BostonNala370 Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 That's not really what I got from it. It seemed to say more so that it's a quality system that if we were to bring in some higher end talent who could bury chances at a higher rate than most of last year's roster could, then we'd really be a force to be reckoned with. I think we're very similar to LA in that our ability to suppress shots also hampers our ability to get shots/chances. The difference between us and LA is that LA has that high end talent in every position with Kopitar, Gaborik, Carter, Doughty and co. to bury the chances they get while we don't have anyone that is in the same neighborhood as the talent they have, at least not until some of our prospects on defense have breakout sessions. The only player we have that is a safe bet to be elite is Schneider in goal as I have no doubt that he will be able to handle the workload of a starter and prove that he's worth the extension he recently signed. While Jagr and Elias are great, they're only getting older so they're better bets to regress than to improve on their performances from last season. IMO you got the message. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 That's not really what I got from it. It seemed to say more so that it's a quality system that if we were to bring in some higher end talent who could bury chances at a higher rate than most of last year's roster could, then we'd really be a force to be reckoned with. I think we're very similar to LA in that our ability to suppress shots also hampers our ability to get shots/chances. The difference between us and LA is that LA has that high end talent in every position with Kopitar, Gaborik, Carter, Doughty and co. to bury the chances they get while we don't have anyone that is in the same neighborhood as the talent they have, at least not until some of our prospects on defense have breakout sessions. The only player we have that is a safe bet to be elite is Schneider in goal as I have no doubt that he will be able to handle the workload of a starter and prove that he's worth the extension he recently signed. While Jagr and Elias are great, they're only getting older so they're better bets to regress than to improve on their performances from last season. That's why I say the possession numbers are fools gold, although the term might be overstate the point. As I read the article, it suggests that ability to "finish" is a real thing that some teams/players do better than others, and that, if it's real, the Devils are very, very bad at it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLL765 Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 That's why I say the possession numbers are fools gold, although the term might be overstate the point. As I read the article, it suggests that ability to "finish" is a real thing that some teams/players do better than others, and that, if it's real, the Devils are very, very bad at it. By calling it fool's gold, it would seem you're suggesting that our tactics are not as effective as they seem, but really they are quite effective. We just need to be able to capitalize on our chances more often to go from middle of the pack to contenders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 By calling it fool's gold, it would seem you're suggesting that our tactics are not as effective as they seem, but really they are quite effective. We just need to be able to capitalize on our chances more often to go from middle of the pack to contenders. Didn't mean to suggest that, which is why I guess my choice of words wasn't that great. But as I said, the article suggests to me anyway that capitalizing on chances is something that some players do better than others and that the Devils don't have enough of those players, which is what separates the other teams with good possession numbers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazer Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 As I read the article, it suggests that ability to "finish" is a real thing that some teams/players do better than others, and that, if it's real, the Devils are very, very bad at it. this is a winning team with players who are dealing with losing parise is a loser and were better off in the long run without him parise has zero finish; someone get me some Finns gd Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted September 18, 2014 Author Share Posted September 18, 2014 (edited) The only way I see this team being successful within this system is having the players have a high shooting percentage, which with the opportunities they create could happen. They are just as stingy with the puck in the o zone as the d zone, since they don't just haphazardly shoot the puck around, so I don't see a significant increase in shot attempts. Unfortunately, when the chances arose they couldn't bury Grade A chances. I believe this is why they are looking at guys or have brought in guys that that can play this quite unfun style.(Jagr, Zubrus,Clowe, Rutuu, Gomez, Fedotenko) I believe NJ is not a destination for FA's to play because of this style. It takes a special type of player to buy in, especially since guys in this league get paid in relation to their points. Also, it simply isn't fun hockey to play for most players. All the clamoring that was had for Evander Kane over the last year would have been an utter trainwreck if thatvcame to fruition under the current organizational plan. This is why losing Parise was so devastating, as he is the ideal player for how this team is designed to play. Not only was he good at it, he loves to play that Devil way. He thrived at both ends of the rink and was mstaer of the 2 foot putt. As a fan, it isn't the most entertaining hockey to watch, but as a player I completely get the concept and understand why we see the guys that end up here. That being said, I think this team is gonna miss Fayne more than anyone thinks. If this approach fails, I wonder how in tune the owners are into the brand of hockey they are selling. Not sure how you reconfigure the whole organization since the style is so ingrained, but but let's hope they don't ever have that decision to make or Oilers fans might be making fun of us. The Devils have signed an armful of free agents in the last two years. They've signed 2 arms full of them in the last 5 years. Cammalleri claims he sought New Jersey out, not the other way around - he had a bunch of numbers to support his decision. Once a good player reaches free agency - and indeed, few players reach it at 27 - he can't be worried about his next contract. It's not like a bunch of other teams don't play similar hockey to NJ, either - St. Louis, San Jose, LA, etc. play a similar game. The Devils will always be a middle of the pack team in free agency, there's things about the organization that might keep guys away, and it's not a big city where hockey is the #1 sport. Fayne is a loss but the organization is hoping that Larsson can make up for most of what Fayne brought - he'll be weaker at the defensive end but stronger in the offensive zone. Edited September 18, 2014 by Triumph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lazer Posted September 18, 2014 Share Posted September 18, 2014 i thought they might have traded fayne for cammo; not sure why not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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