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What was the best trade in Devils history?


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#61 Chuck the Duck

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 10:23 AM

Unless you also want to make the argument that signing Kovalchuk resulted in not re-signing Parise. That's been what TG has argued.


Does TG still believe that now? I know he was speculating before this past FA period began, and Parise signed in Minny, but I thought it was pretty clear following everything that transpired this summer that the Kovy deal had nothing to do with Parise's decision to leave NJ (other than maybe drive up the market value of top end FA's like Parise and Suter).
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#62 Marshall

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 10:38 AM

Unless you also want to make the argument that signing Kovalchuk resulted in not re-signing Parise. That's been what TG has argued.


Yes, but I don't want to make that argument.
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#63 Chimaira_Devil_#9

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 10:38 AM

Hated & still hate the Sykora trade... friesen was awful...

Kurvers had to be the #1 trade

Almo made Gomez great, no doubt that was a great trade...


:giggle: Havent seen that in a while on here, it made me smile.
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#64 Daniel

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 10:56 AM

Does TG still believe that now? I know he was speculating before this past FA period began, and Parise signed in Minny, but I thought it was pretty clear following everything that transpired this summer that the Kovy deal had nothing to do with Parise's decision to leave NJ (other than maybe drive up the market value of top end FA's like Parise and Suter).


From TG's standpoint, if the Devils hadn't spent so much money and effort signing Kovy when they did, they could have worked out an extension with Parise before the start of last season. There is some validity to that. From what I've heard, the offer on the table at that time was 7/50. If Kovy weren't owed so much money, that offer could have been 8/64 or something like it, which might have been enough for Parise to forego UFA.
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#65 Marshall

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 10:58 AM

IIRC I read that Parise was ready to sign 7/50 but agent said he could hold out for more?
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#66 95Crash

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:12 AM

In the playoffs it's all about depth, having a big time scorer on your second line was a huge factor. The speed of Mogilny made matching against the Devils an defensive nightmare.


He certainly helped the Devs knock off the Flyers in the 2000 ECF, scoring the game-winner in Game 6 and I believe getting an assist on Elias' game-winner in Game 7.
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#67 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:33 AM

IIRC I read that Parise was ready to sign 7/50 but agent said he could hold out for more?


Supposedly, there was an offer like that around February, and Zach's agents advised him to wait for free agency.
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#68 Triumph

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:47 AM

I'd take Zach at 5/45 but not 7/50.

What's interesting about these long contracts is going back into the recent past and looking at scoring leaders from 2000, say. What if half of them were signed to lifetime deals - some of them would look real good and others really bad.
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#69 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:50 AM

:giggle: Havent seen that in a while on here, it made me smile.


Not sure what all the Friesen hate is about...10 playoff goals in the '03 playoffs. He did suck after that, but he was solid in '02-'03 and he stepped up come playoff time that year.

He was always a headcase and seemed to lose it awfully quick after '03 (in 204 GP with 4 different teams from '03-'04 on, he scored just 27 goals and added just 33 assists), and he was awful in '03-'04, but he was the right guy at the right time in '03...Devils probably don't win that Cup without him.
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#70 Daniel

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 11:55 AM

Supposedly, there was an offer like that around February, and Zach's agents advised him to wait for free agency.


Yeah, but without the money and cap hit for Kovalchuk, the offer likely would have been higher, and made before the start of last season with Zach coming off a season where he hadn't played.

And I absolutely would have taken Zach at 7/50 no questions asked. For all intents and purposes it's the same deal as Elias got, which turned out very well.
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#71 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 12:03 PM

Yeah, but without the money and cap hit for Kovalchuk, the offer likely would have been higher, and made before the start of last season with Zach coming off a season where he hadn't played.

And I absolutely would have taken Zach at 7/50 no questions asked. For all intents and purposes it's the same deal as Elias got, which turned out very well.


I'd say the returns on Elias' deal were mixed, especially the first couple of years. Overall the Devils got about a B to B- on that investment, which when you consider how these deals sometimes go, is pretty good...some of these deals are flat-out disasters from Day 1.
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[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
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- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

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It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

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#72 sundstrom

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 12:05 PM

IIRC I read that Parise was ready to sign 7/50 but agent said he could hold out for more?


Supposedly, there was an offer like that around February, and Zach's agents advised him to wait for free agency.


this is what i got from pretty solid sources.

minny's involvement did show up only this season so it is true that parise might have been ready to sign a long term deal for less during the summer of kovalchuk but that ship has sailed.
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#73 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 12:07 PM

Yeah, but without the money and cap hit for Kovalchuk, the offer likely would have been higher, and made before the start of last season with Zach coming off a season where he hadn't played.

And I absolutely would have taken Zach at 7/50 no questions asked. For all intents and purposes it's the same deal as Elias got, which turned out very well.


That's definitely very possible. Zach was looking for big money, and if there was more to give, he may have stayed. I still think he was going to free agency no matter what.

I also think if you get a chance to land a player like Kovalchuk, you have to take it.
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#74 Triumph

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 12:07 PM

And I absolutely would have taken Zach at 7/50 no questions asked. For all intents and purposes it's the same deal as Elias got, which turned out very well.


Sure didn't look that way after the first two years, did it? It turned out well because the cap exploded and Elias maintained his level of play - somehow. Elias's shot rate has plummeted but he is still an outstanding defensive player. He's one of the smartest players in the NHL. It wouldn't surprise me if he is +1000 shot attempts in the Corsi era.

The Devils' situation has changed also - if they were going to be a cap team, 7/50 is fine, but if they are not, it sucks. 7 years is a goddamn long time and if that contract went bad it would seriously impact the Devils' ability to get a decent replacement.
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#75 Daniel

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 12:08 PM

I'd say the returns on Elias' deal were mixed, especially the first couple of years. Overall the Devils got about a B to B- on that investment, which when you consider how these deals sometimes go, is pretty good...some of these deals are flat-out disasters from Day 1.


I'd say at least a B+. His production declined, that was to be expected. The money he got is the cost of doing business. The Devils are a significantly worse team without him.
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#76 Triumph

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 12:10 PM

I'd say the returns on Elias' deal were mixed, especially the first couple of years. Overall the Devils got about a B to B- on that investment, which when you consider how these deals sometimes go, is pretty good...some of these deals are flat-out disasters from Day 1.


For a 7 year deal on a 30 year old player that looks like it's going to stay good up until the end, I'd say they got a B+ at least. Some of these big deals are going to go awful bad soon. Vincent Lecavalier already looks bad, for instance, and it's got 7 years left.
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#77 Daniel

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 12:15 PM

Sure didn't look that way after the first two years, did it? It turned out well because the cap exploded and Elias maintained his level of play - somehow. Elias's shot rate has plummeted but he is still an outstanding defensive player. He's one of the smartest players in the NHL. It wouldn't surprise me if he is +1000 shot attempts in the Corsi era.

The Devils' situation has changed also - if they were going to be a cap team, 7/50 is fine, but if they are not, it sucks. 7 years is a goddamn long time and if that contract went bad it would seriously impact the Devils' ability to get a decent replacement.


A seven year deal is a roll of the dice, no question about it. But unless you have a good prospect pipeline, which the Devils really don't, it's a risk worth taking. And you can keep overall payroll within a reasonable amount with three $6.5 million plus cap hits. The Rangers have that, and they're middle of the pack from a salary cap standpoint.

Edited by Daniel, 13 December 2012 - 12:16 PM.

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#78 MantaRay

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 01:44 PM

Unless you also want to make the argument that signing Kovalchuk resulted in not re-signing Parise. That's been what TG has argued.


You can include a lot of other players besides Parise as the price for the Kovy acquisition. It changed the culture of the team under Lemaire and lead to a locker room mutiny as Kovy got preferential treatment.

I think Steven Gionta and the forth liners in getting us to the Finals last year may have inflated artificially the value of Kovy.

It is far too early to evaluate this trade as we are still close to a .500 since getting him. And while I applaud the team effort in getting to the Finals, last year was pretty much a fluke.

When we are consistent winners again and can point to this deal as a turning point, then we can re-evaluate this trade. Right now, this roster is barren in terms of quality depth.

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#79 Daniel

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 03:02 PM

You can include a lot of other players besides Parise as the price for the Kovy acquisition. It changed the culture of the team under Lemaire and lead to a locker room mutiny as Kovy got preferential treatment.

I think Steven Gionta and the forth liners in getting us to the Finals last year may have inflated artificially the value of Kovy.

It is far too early to evaluate this trade as we are still close to a .500 since getting him. And while I applaud the team effort in getting to the Finals, last year was pretty much a fluke.

When we are consistent winners again and can point to this deal as a turning point, then we can re-evaluate this trade. Right now, this roster is barren in terms of quality depth.


The locker room mutiny I think you're referring to had nothing to do with Kovalchuk. (I have yet to hear anyone on the team, even anonomously say Kovy is a bad teammate or a cancer). It was a rift between Langs and Lemaire that well predated Kovy even coming to the team. And even if you're right, the mutiny started to pay huge dividends when Langs was traded and Lemaire came back. It's really impossible to dispute that the 2010-2011 failure was 95 percent attributable to MacLean.

And, Parise aside, there is not a single player that the Devils were unable to get/retain because of Kovalchuk. And even Parise, as an opportunity cost is not a certainty.

The fourth line, "inflating" Kovy? LOL. You remember Carter's game winning goal in Game 5? I seem to recall that the whole thing was set up by Kovy's aggressive forechecking.
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#80 njd3b1ink

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Posted 13 December 2012 - 03:21 PM

Last years team come playoff time was a damn good team. There was no fluke about getting that far last year. They had arguably the best offensive depth out of any team in the playoffs. If players were not hurt (kovy, elias, clarkson) we very well could have won the cup.
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