Jump to content

Photo

Lockout 2012-2013 (Hockey's back!)


  • Please log in to reply
1718 replies to this topic

Poll: Lockout 2012-2013 (Hockey's back!) (130 member(s) have cast votes)

When will we see hockey?

  1. Oct 12 (10 votes [7.69%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.69%

  2. Nov 12 (19 votes [14.62%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.62%

  3. Dec 12 (26 votes [20.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.00%

  4. Jan 13 (33 votes [25.38%])

    Percentage of vote: 25.38%

  5. Feb 13 (1 votes [0.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.77%

  6. Mar 13 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  7. Apr 13 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  8. Oct 13 (14 votes [10.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.77%

  9. Never (27 votes [20.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.77%

Vote Guests cannot vote

#241 Scott O

Scott O

    Prospect

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 128 posts

Posted 13 October 2012 - 09:33 AM

May as well get comfortable. This could take awhile.

"One more sign the NHL lockout will be a long one popped up Friday when players for the farm teams of the Columbus Blue Jackets and New Jersey Devils, including a number of players on NHL contracts, were told to secure housing for the entire American Hockey League season."

http://www.theglobea...article4609079/
  • 0


#242 Devs3cups

Devs3cups

    All-Star

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,592 posts

Posted 13 October 2012 - 03:15 PM

The league can survive a two year lockout... hell, a 3 year lockout... They will be fine long term. It is the players who can't afford to miss this time.
Some run off to Europe, but there simply isn't
space for all of them. The players will cave, the owners do not care how long this takes... The guy who signs your paycheck will ultimately be the one who determines how much of the pie he gives you.

Sure, the KHL will steal primarily Russian superstars if the NHL is locked out long term. But you aren't going to get the majority of Americans/Canadians to sign oversees... moving
Their families, being across the pond fromextended family and friends... when the NHL comes back with the deal they want. You
are not going to get the American/Canadian fan bases to ignore the NHL and pay attention solely to the KHL and other elite leagues overseas.

The players are not 'partners'. They are tradable commodities that at any moment can be traded, injured, etc.

The sooner the players realize this, the sooner we can get back to hockey.


Wouldn't be surprised if Kovalchuk, Datsyuk , Ovechkin etc. stayed in Russia even when the lock-out is done, if it goes long-term.
  • 0

n2eg.jpg 

"BELIEVE in our team. We've had difficult momments as a fanbase, but we will get out of it"


#243 Zubie#8

Zubie#8

    Head Coach

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,356 posts

Posted 13 October 2012 - 04:39 PM

Wouldn't be surprised if Kovalchuk, Datsyuk , Ovechkin etc. stayed in Russia even when the lock-out is done, if it goes long-term.


Major implications would take place for every Russian player if these guys do not come back and finish their contracts. They will be breaking international rules between the NHL and other leagues which would allow the international committee to forbid Russian players from playing in the Olympics and in the KHL.

Players saying they will stay overseas are just talking out of their rear end.

Edited by Zubie#8, 13 October 2012 - 04:40 PM.

  • 0

believe-zubrus.jpg

 


#244 Devil Dan 56

Devil Dan 56

    Hall of Famer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,676 posts

Posted 13 October 2012 - 05:51 PM

Major implications would take place for every Russian player if these guys do not come back and finish their contracts. They will be breaking international rules between the NHL and other leagues which would allow the international committee to forbid Russian players from playing in the Olympics and in the KHL.

Players saying they will stay overseas are just talking out of their rear end.


The players may face implications, but what implications would the league have to face for forcing players to take a pay cut on a contract that had been signed and agreed upon? This is going to turn into a huge mess if they miss a season, especially when you add in the fact that the NHL doesn't want to allow players to play in the 2014 Olympics and the KHL of course will.

The owners are going to have to accept some kind of revenue sharing to help the weaker teams or they are going to have the same problems when they come back.
  • 0
Official NJDevs.com Keeper of Gory Corey Schwab, Mike Peluso, Troy Crowder, Jeff Frazee, and Rich Shulmistra.
"The Devils are that zombie that takes an ax to the skull, a bullet to the temple and is set on fire … and yet keeps lumbering along to the annoyance of all the other zombies." - Puck Daddy

#245 Satans Hockey

Satans Hockey

    A Legend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,954 posts

Posted 13 October 2012 - 06:33 PM

*sigh* should be at the game right now
  • 0

#246 ThreeCups

ThreeCups

    General Manager

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,323 posts

Posted 15 October 2012 - 10:29 AM

ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

Will the madness come to an end?!?
  • 0

"I'm not drinking anymore of Lou's Kool-Aid. I'm fed up with it." - Mike Jefferson/Danton


#247 Zubie#8

Zubie#8

    Head Coach

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,356 posts

Posted 15 October 2012 - 12:39 PM

Dreger is reporting that the PA upcoming proposal will be 'radically different'. Hopefully that means concessions and not something crazy like pulling the cap off the table.

Edited by Zubie#8, 15 October 2012 - 12:43 PM.

  • 0

believe-zubrus.jpg

 


#248 ZeroGravityFat

ZeroGravityFat

    Head Coach

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 3,780 posts

Posted 15 October 2012 - 01:52 PM

so..... lockout? lockout.
  • 0

martyb.jpg
Proud Winner of the 2012 Sergei Brylin Award and 2011 Andy Greene Award, Official keeper of Doc and Chico's random ramblings during play in blowout games


#249 ThreeCups

ThreeCups

    General Manager

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,323 posts

Posted 15 October 2012 - 01:56 PM

LOCKOUT
  • 0

"I'm not drinking anymore of Lou's Kool-Aid. I'm fed up with it." - Mike Jefferson/Danton


#250 Triumph

Triumph

    A Legend

  • Mod
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 27,514 posts

Posted 15 October 2012 - 02:05 PM

The players may face implications, but what implications would the league have to face for forcing players to take a pay cut on a contract that had been signed and agreed upon? This is going to turn into a huge mess if they miss a season, especially when you add in the fact that the NHL doesn't want to allow players to play in the 2014 Olympics and the KHL of course will.

The owners are going to have to accept some kind of revenue sharing to help the weaker teams or they are going to have the same problems when they come back.


The players aren't getting out of this without an immediate pay cut. It's just not possible, unless the escrow system gets pulled off the table, in which case you are looking at replacement players, a multiple year lock out, and so forth. If they miss a full year and the players don't take 'an immediate paycut', they will end up taking one anyway.
  • 0

http://drivingplay.blogspot.com - The blog with three first lines
 


#251 Devil Dan 56

Devil Dan 56

    Hall of Famer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,676 posts

Posted 15 October 2012 - 03:54 PM

The players aren't getting out of this without an immediate pay cut. It's just not possible, unless the escrow system gets pulled off the table, in which case you are looking at replacement players, a multiple year lock out, and so forth. If they miss a full year and the players don't take 'an immediate paycut', they will end up taking one anyway.


Yeah, the owners hold the power and will most likely get their way. I was just pointing out that the players face punishment if they stay in Europe, while the owners face no punishment for refusing to pay what was agreed upon. My other point was that unless the owners do something to help the smaller market teams, we will be right back here again as soon as this next CBA runs out.
  • 0
Official NJDevs.com Keeper of Gory Corey Schwab, Mike Peluso, Troy Crowder, Jeff Frazee, and Rich Shulmistra.
"The Devils are that zombie that takes an ax to the skull, a bullet to the temple and is set on fire … and yet keeps lumbering along to the annoyance of all the other zombies." - Puck Daddy

#252 DaneykoIsGod

DaneykoIsGod

    Hall of Famer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 8,187 posts

Posted 16 October 2012 - 09:24 AM

Not to try to make this political, but does anyone else see this "Wastebook 2012" thing affecting the lockout?

For anyone who didn't catch it, apparently the NFL got itself out of paying $91M in taxes by classifying itself as non-profit, and the NHL (and PGA, too) take advantage of the same non-profit, tax-exempt status. (Also worth note, MLB gave up its tax-exempt status in 2007.)

If suddenly the NHL needs to reclassify itself and start paying taxes, is that gonna make the league want even more concessions to make up for lost money? Or will negative PR from labeling themselves as being the same kind of organization as the Red Cross make them humble up and end this damn thing?

Probably grasping at straws here.
  • 0
Posted Image

"I don't like those Rangers fans from New Jersey." - Jim Dowd

#253 Daniel

Daniel

    Hall of Famer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 5,620 posts

Posted 16 October 2012 - 11:06 AM

Not to try to make this political, but does anyone else see this "Wastebook 2012" thing affecting the lockout?

For anyone who didn't catch it, apparently the NFL got itself out of paying $91M in taxes by classifying itself as non-profit, and the NHL (and PGA, too) take advantage of the same non-profit, tax-exempt status. (Also worth note, MLB gave up its tax-exempt status in 2007.)

If suddenly the NHL needs to reclassify itself and start paying taxes, is that gonna make the league want even more concessions to make up for lost money? Or will negative PR from labeling themselves as being the same kind of organization as the Red Cross make them humble up and end this damn thing?

Probably grasping at straws here.


I don't think it will matter all that much. These negotiations aren't really about what's fair or how much the owners or players think they ought to be making. It's just a matter of who blinks first and how much leverage one side has over the other. The last time around, it just wasn't worth it for the owners to operate the business without a much more owner friendly CBA which ultimately put the players in a bind. I don't think the taxes the NHL has to pay will enter so much into the equation.

Also, while I'm not a tax expert, seems to me that whether the league has to pay income tax doesn't really have all that much of an effect, since the amount the league pays in taxes will offset the owners income and hence the direct taxes the owners have to pay.

I don't think there's anything inherently sneaky about the league classifying itself as a non-profit.
  • 0
Posted Image
I collect spores, molds and fungus.
Hello fellow American. This you should vote me. I leave power. Good. Thank you, thank you. If you vote me, I'm hot. What? Taxes, they'll be lower... son. The Democratic vote is the right thing to do Philadelphia, so do.
How do you spot risk? How do you avoid risk? And what makes it so risky?

#254 DevsMan84

DevsMan84

    Hall of Famer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,782 posts

Posted 16 October 2012 - 11:46 AM

Per everyone on twitter, NHL made proposal to NHLPA with 50/50 HRR split implemented in year 1, no phasing in. Contigent on that the first game is on Nov 2nd and 82-game season is preserved.

For the sake of the players and my sanity I think the players should take it.
  • 0

#255 njd3b1ink

njd3b1ink

    Senior Devil

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 973 posts

Posted 16 October 2012 - 11:59 AM

its a 50-50 split and apparently there is no phasing into the 50-50 split BUT per TG:
"Don't know details yet, but from what I'm told NHL proposal in some way protects player salaries as is in 2012-13. Interested to see how."
If the Fehr comes out and does his normal "no progress" BS im ganna go ape sh!t. Im in class right now though so it would probably make a great story if I did flip out.


  • 0

#256 Satans Hockey

Satans Hockey

    A Legend

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 10,954 posts

Posted 16 October 2012 - 12:05 PM

If the players don't take this they might as well announce that the entire season is canceled.
  • 0

#257 DJ Eco

DJ Eco

    Assistant Coach

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,384 posts

Posted 16 October 2012 - 12:07 PM

Good move by Gary Bettman. I just hope this isn't some PR move with a bunch of undesirable conditions attached to it (that we can't easily understand). I hope this is the real deal, the way it sounds.
  • 0

#258 SMantzas

SMantzas

    Assistant Coach

  • Mod
  • PipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,715 posts

Posted 16 October 2012 - 12:16 PM

Good move by Gary Bettman. I just hope this isn't some PR move with a bunch of undesirable conditions attached to it (that we can't easily understand). I hope this is the real deal, the way it sounds.

Me thinks sponsors are the major drivers here
  • 0

#259 SterioDesign

SterioDesign

    Hall of Famer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 6,716 posts

Posted 16 October 2012 - 12:18 PM

godamnit im excited and can't concentrate at work !!!
  • 0

www.SterioDesign.com

 


#260 devilsfan26

devilsfan26

    Hall of Famer

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 7,777 posts

Posted 16 October 2012 - 12:20 PM

Am I missing something? What are the owners conceding with this offer? 50-50 sounds nice and fair but at the end of the day they are still asking the players to take a 7% cut while they give themselves a 7% raise, right? What are the players getting out of this?
  • 0
"Swim against the tide, don't follow the group, stay away from the majority, seek out the fresh and new, stay away from the poseurs, and don't be a barnacle. Be original, be different, be passionate, be selfless and be free. Be a hockey fan."
--John Buccigross




1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users


    Bing (1)