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#41 MantaRay

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Posted 14 November 2011 - 09:26 AM

Un-Frippin' believable. We can beat top contenders but give-away games against lesser teams.

WTF?
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#42 Jerrydevil

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Posted 14 November 2011 - 11:19 AM

Un-Frippin' believable. We can beat top contenders but give-away games against lesser teams.

WTF?


They may be the hardest team to figure out in the NFL.
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#43 CRASHER

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Posted 14 November 2011 - 11:22 AM

They may be the hardest team to figure out in the NFL.


The Saints are FAR more baffling.....

Speaking of....what the bloody blue hell was Mike Smith doing going for it deep in his own end 4th and 1 in OVERTIME....this was dumber then when Belichek did it against the Colts!!!
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#44 NJDevs4978

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Posted 14 November 2011 - 11:57 AM

The Saints are FAR more baffling.....

Speaking of....what the bloody blue hell was Mike Smith doing going for it deep in his own end 4th and 1 in OVERTIME....this was dumber then when Belichek did it against the Colts!!!


The risk - reward was so out of whack it's mind boggling. Even if you make it, big deal you're still on your own 30. The reward was minimal but the risk was off the charts.
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#45 CRASHER

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Posted 14 November 2011 - 12:34 PM

The risk - reward was so out of whack it's mind boggling. Even if you make it, big deal you're still on your own 30. The reward was minimal but the risk was off the charts.


Totally....I'm sitting there thinking, i'd not go for that in Madden when all you need do is dive the QB up the middle which works 95% of the time :P

Every time I think I have those damn Saints pegged, they go the other way :blink:
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Pay homage to the INCREDIBLE scoring goalie!!!! :-)

I saw CRASHER trip a kid on skates and then he stole the kids lunch money and slapped his mom when she came to pick him up.. All because the kid looked at his crease


CRASHER's official list of high stick victims from this forum:
gionta182, devilsfan26 .... WHO'S NEXT??

2005 Fantasy Football League Champion... Bow to my Football knowledge !!!!!!

2003-04 NJDevs.com winner of the Masterton Award for Dedication to the Devils(still proud of that one !)

4, Four (!?!?) Time (2005-2008) NJDevs.com winner of the Whoever the damn Award for the funniest poster in the land is named after...(geesh... post pressure, but I seem ok with it!)
TWO TIME (2005, 2006) Award Winner and the man who can show Jeremy Roenick what a REAL loudmouth is all about.... hell this mouth roars SO loud, they retired the DAMN AWARD!!!! But how do you be emotional about an award for being most emotional when you're sharing it?

2008 NJDevs Stanley Cup Winner for best overall poster... where's my damn ring?

June 6, 2007... the NHL dies just a little bit.....
.. April 20, 2008...it gets a little better :)

#46 devilsrule33

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Posted 14 November 2011 - 10:47 PM

I know I said this last year, but I'll say it again now, and I don't think it is much of a stretch anymore. Aaron Rodgers is the best QB in football, but not only that, he might be playing the QB position over the last year better than anyone in NFL history. He is ridiculous.

That is all.
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#47 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 15 November 2011 - 07:16 AM

I know I said this last year, but I'll say it again now, and I don't think it is much of a stretch anymore. Aaron Rodgers is the best QB in football, but not only that, he might be playing the QB position over the last year better than anyone in NFL history. He is ridiculous.

That is all.


In 2007, during the Patriots' 16-0 season, Brady had 33 TDs and 4 INTs at the 9-game mark, and in 2004, Peyton Manning had 31 TDs and 6 INTs at the same 9-game cutoff. Not trying to diminish anything Rodgers has done, just pointing out that we've seen this ultra, off-the-charts kind of performance from NFL QBs before.

But he is clearly alone in his performance level this season. That cannot be disputed.

The other problem with making declarations like "he might be playing the QB position over the last year better than anyone in NFL history" is that you have to take into account era. Pedestrian QBs are putting up numbers now that would've been considered terrific 20 years ago. QB numbers in this era are bloated...300 yard passing games used to be a big deal. Now you see them all of the time, even in games where the QB didn't even play well (see Mark Sanchez's 306 passing yards against NE on Sunday night).

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976, 15 November 2011 - 07:33 AM.

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It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

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#48 MantaRay

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Posted 15 November 2011 - 10:41 AM

I know I said this last year, but I'll say it again now, and I don't think it is much of a stretch anymore. Aaron Rodgers is the best QB in football, but not only that, he might be playing the QB position over the last year better than anyone in NFL history. He is ridiculous.

That is all.


I agree 100%. I have NEVER seen anyone which such precision and timing and ability to read defenses or not even CARE what the defense is doing.

CoRo1976: I think he even surpasses Brady (which I never thought I would say). He has elevated the level of play even beyond Manning.
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#49 devilsrule33

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Posted 15 November 2011 - 11:24 AM

In 2007, during the Patriots' 16-0 season, Brady had 33 TDs and 4 INTs at the 9-game mark, and in 2004, Peyton Manning had 31 TDs and 6 INTs at the same 9-game cutoff. Not trying to diminish anything Rodgers has done, just pointing out that we've seen this ultra, off-the-charts kind of performance from NFL QBs before.

But he is clearly alone in his performance level this season. That cannot be disputed.

The other problem with making declarations like "he might be playing the QB position over the last year better than anyone in NFL history" is that you have to take into account era. Pedestrian QBs are putting up numbers now that would've been considered terrific 20 years ago. QB numbers in this era are bloated...300 yard passing games used to be a big deal. Now you see them all of the time, even in games where the QB didn't even play well (see Mark Sanchez's 306 passing yards against NE on Sunday night).


It isn't just stats, and I'm not even talking about stats because that means sh!t in today's NFL. It is watching him carve through defenses. He is unstoppable. Defenses simply have no answer for him. Against San Diego two weeks ago, the Chargers started the game with the perfect game plan. They were bringing a lot of pressure and had great coverage on everyone. Rodgers couldn't get the ball to anyone but got every 1st down with his legs. He had more rushing yards than passing after the 1st quarter and his team was winning.

Last night, on the 4th TD, he had nobody open for 5 seconds. He calmly moves around under pressure, looks like he might run it in for a score, but on the run throws a laser to Nelson for his last play of the night.

His throws are darts. They are always in the perfect spot. It seems like all his incompletions are dropped balls. He becomes a much tougher QB to game plan than Brady, Manning, Brees because the threat that he can run at any minute. And unlike Vick, he is ridiculously accurate.

And if we are talking about stats not meaning much, Brady's stats during the FU season by Belichick were insane, but you'll never see a team run up scores like they did that year to give a QB to put out those numbers. Plus Brady had the advantage of having a checkdown which was throw the ball 55 yards in the air to Randy Moss, and knowing he'll catch whatever.

Edited by devilsrule33, 15 November 2011 - 11:27 AM.

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#50 Onddeck

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Posted 15 November 2011 - 05:07 PM

ok well about Rodgers:

Its tough to say that he is currently, but Aaron Rodgers has the potential to be the greatest QB to ever play. Right now he is elite.. but if he picks it up a little and stays consistent through YEARS... we will be able to say that
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#51 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 15 November 2011 - 07:55 PM

ok well about Rodgers:

Its tough to say that he is currently, but Aaron Rodgers has the potential to be the greatest QB to ever play. Right now he is elite.. but if he picks it up a little and stays consistent through YEARS... we will be able to say that


His QB rating is around 130...don't think he can pick it up much more.

I agree, let me see him do it as long as Brady and Manning have. I'm not saying that he won't or can't, but I have to see it happen first before I anoint him the best of his era.
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[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
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Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

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#52 devilsrule33

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Posted 15 November 2011 - 08:31 PM

His QB rating is around 130...don't think he can pick it up much more.

I agree, let me see him do it as long as Brady and Manning have. I'm not saying that he won't or can't, but I have to see it happen first before I anoint him the best of his era.


Best of the era is different than saying over the last calendar year, he is playing at a level above. He has to prove it for a long time to be in that class, but even if he retired after this year, I'd have no objection with saying that he retired playing the highest level of football a QB can.

I sort of feel bad for Brett Favre. And I know no one usually does. But his legacy is almost tarnished. Sure the Packers fans booed him, but if they went through a funk for 10-15 years, even 5 years, they'd prob warm up and remember all the good Favre brought them. But all his individual game and season records are all going to be wiped. Rodgers already brought them a Super Bowl. Maybe a second one coming soon. Rodgers is making it very easy for Packers to forget Brett Favre's legacy and career. And if you forget that, all you are going to remember is the past 3-4 years and what a mess they were. That's unfortunate.
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#53 CRASHER

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Posted 16 November 2011 - 09:36 AM

I sort of feel bad for Brett Favre. And I know no one usually does. But his legacy is almost tarnished. Sure the Packers fans booed him, but if they went through a funk for 10-15 years, even 5 years, they'd prob warm up and remember all the good Favre brought them. But all his individual game and season records are all going to be wiped. Rodgers already brought them a Super Bowl. Maybe a second one coming soon. Rodgers is making it very easy for Packers to forget Brett Favre's legacy and career. And if you forget that, all you are going to remember is the past 3-4 years and what a mess they were. That's unfortunate.


I don't......if Brett had packed his sh!t and walked away without REPEATED retirement drama fits, embarrassed himself by playing too long (that last year in Minnesota) and on top of that his prissy little comments this year, Favre damn near deserves A-Rod writing his name right out of the Packer history books....and not to mention he does it at a TENTH of the INT and turnover level Favre had......sometimes karma is a bitch.....sometimes she punches you in the kidneys too.......3 years of 3900 + yards, 65.7 % completions, 28 TDs a year....and no year with over 13 INTs.....and here's an interesting one....he has 15 rushing TDs and averages about 300 yards a year with his feet....his stats are nuts at this point, and this team is SO YOUNG (aside of Driver and Woodson pretty much)...the upside for him is staggering
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Pay homage to the INCREDIBLE scoring goalie!!!! :-)

I saw CRASHER trip a kid on skates and then he stole the kids lunch money and slapped his mom when she came to pick him up.. All because the kid looked at his crease


CRASHER's official list of high stick victims from this forum:
gionta182, devilsfan26 .... WHO'S NEXT??

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4, Four (!?!?) Time (2005-2008) NJDevs.com winner of the Whoever the damn Award for the funniest poster in the land is named after...(geesh... post pressure, but I seem ok with it!)
TWO TIME (2005, 2006) Award Winner and the man who can show Jeremy Roenick what a REAL loudmouth is all about.... hell this mouth roars SO loud, they retired the DAMN AWARD!!!! But how do you be emotional about an award for being most emotional when you're sharing it?

2008 NJDevs Stanley Cup Winner for best overall poster... where's my damn ring?

June 6, 2007... the NHL dies just a little bit.....
.. April 20, 2008...it gets a little better :)

#54 MantaRay

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Posted 16 November 2011 - 10:25 AM

I sort of feel bad for Brett Favre. And I know no one usually does. But his legacy is almost tarnished. Sure the Packers fans booed him, but if they went through a funk for 10-15 years, even 5 years, they'd prob warm up and remember all the good Favre brought them. But all his individual game and season records are all going to be wiped. Rodgers already brought them a Super Bowl. Maybe a second one coming soon. Rodgers is making it very easy for Packers to forget Brett Favre's legacy and career. And if you forget that, all you are going to remember is the past 3-4 years and what a mess they were. That's unfortunate.


Why? He tarnished his own legacy. A legacy, I might add that was built only on partial recall amplification, and mythology.

Farve did everything he could to sabotage Rodgers after the Packers drafted him. ( "Tutoring and mentoring other QB's is NOT part of my job description"). Favre's selfishness probably helped make Rodgers that much more superior than Favre (the turnover king) ever was.

If not for Reggie White, Favre would have never won a Super Bowl.

if I could quote Greg Jennings:

"We played with Brett, we had success with Brett. We didn’t go all the way with Brett, but we did with Aaron. I think that kind of speaks for itself.”

Edited by MantaRay, 16 November 2011 - 10:35 AM.

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#55 CRASHER

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Posted 16 November 2011 - 10:43 AM

the thing I WILL give Favre credit for.....he was maybe the most FEARLESS QB of all time....and that was part of his appeal, he'd make stupid passes in absurd coverage and not care about the INT, just the CHANCE to make a play was all he needed.....and more often then not they did work out, and that more then anything should truly be his legacy...and the will to play through some injuries that would have put a horse down...but that goes back to the fearless factor.....or too stupid to miss a game :P
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Pay homage to the INCREDIBLE scoring goalie!!!! :-)

I saw CRASHER trip a kid on skates and then he stole the kids lunch money and slapped his mom when she came to pick him up.. All because the kid looked at his crease


CRASHER's official list of high stick victims from this forum:
gionta182, devilsfan26 .... WHO'S NEXT??

2005 Fantasy Football League Champion... Bow to my Football knowledge !!!!!!

2003-04 NJDevs.com winner of the Masterton Award for Dedication to the Devils(still proud of that one !)

4, Four (!?!?) Time (2005-2008) NJDevs.com winner of the Whoever the damn Award for the funniest poster in the land is named after...(geesh... post pressure, but I seem ok with it!)
TWO TIME (2005, 2006) Award Winner and the man who can show Jeremy Roenick what a REAL loudmouth is all about.... hell this mouth roars SO loud, they retired the DAMN AWARD!!!! But how do you be emotional about an award for being most emotional when you're sharing it?

2008 NJDevs Stanley Cup Winner for best overall poster... where's my damn ring?

June 6, 2007... the NHL dies just a little bit.....
.. April 20, 2008...it gets a little better :)

#56 MantaRay

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Posted 16 November 2011 - 10:57 AM

the thing I WILL give Favre credit for.....he was maybe the most FEARLESS QB of all time....and that was part of his appeal, he'd make stupid passes in absurd coverage and not care about the INT, just the CHANCE to make a play was all he needed.....and more often then not they did work out, and that more then anything should truly be his legacy...and the will to play through some injuries that would have put a horse down...but that goes back to the fearless factor.....or too stupid to miss a game :P


Fearless or insecure?
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#57 CRASHER

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Posted 16 November 2011 - 01:23 PM

Fearless or insecure?


Aa QB....fearless.....as a player and teammate off the field.....insecure bag of douche.....
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Pay homage to the INCREDIBLE scoring goalie!!!! :-)

I saw CRASHER trip a kid on skates and then he stole the kids lunch money and slapped his mom when she came to pick him up.. All because the kid looked at his crease


CRASHER's official list of high stick victims from this forum:
gionta182, devilsfan26 .... WHO'S NEXT??

2005 Fantasy Football League Champion... Bow to my Football knowledge !!!!!!

2003-04 NJDevs.com winner of the Masterton Award for Dedication to the Devils(still proud of that one !)

4, Four (!?!?) Time (2005-2008) NJDevs.com winner of the Whoever the damn Award for the funniest poster in the land is named after...(geesh... post pressure, but I seem ok with it!)
TWO TIME (2005, 2006) Award Winner and the man who can show Jeremy Roenick what a REAL loudmouth is all about.... hell this mouth roars SO loud, they retired the DAMN AWARD!!!! But how do you be emotional about an award for being most emotional when you're sharing it?

2008 NJDevs Stanley Cup Winner for best overall poster... where's my damn ring?

June 6, 2007... the NHL dies just a little bit.....
.. April 20, 2008...it gets a little better :)

#58 Beezer34

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Posted 16 November 2011 - 03:21 PM

3x MVP.. 11x ProBowl.. 500+ TD Passes.. 70,000+ yrds.. 300 Consecutive games played.. 200 Career Wins (including playoffs).. you can go on and on. The numbers simply speak for themselves.
Is he THE greatest quarterback of all-time? --No. Is he ONE OF the greatest QB's all-time? --Absolutely.

The "Favre Antics" that transpired towards the end.. (retiring 100 times.. sex-ting.. his time with the Jets\Vikings) ..it all came in the final 2 years of his career. Yet last time I checked, Favre played 20 years. The haters and naysayers tend fixate on Favre from 2008-2010. But that's like only focusing on Brodeurs last 2 years.
In regards to Favres ego and self admiration.. why do people obsess on this as such an unusual issue? :noclue: Most great athletes, regardless of the sport.. have a little diva in them all. No one is questioning Favre's humility. (or lack thereof) However.. again.. this comes with many accomplished athletes. Not sure why so many fans gasp at this.

The appreciation of Favre will grow, as times goes by. Again, like I said before, the numbers speak for themselves.
Did his career end well? Absolutely not. But should that "tarnish his legacy" or corrupt the body of work in a 20 year HOF career? Not a chance.

-------------
EDIT: He may only have 1 Superbowl.. but the man played in 7 Championship games. Just a little FYI.

Edited by Beezer34, 16 November 2011 - 03:23 PM.

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#59 MantaRay

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Posted 16 November 2011 - 04:17 PM

3x MVP.. 11x ProBowl.. 500+ TD Passes.. 70,000+ yrds.. 300 Consecutive games played.. 200 Career Wins (including playoffs).. you can go on and on. The numbers simply speak for themselves.
Is he THE greatest quarterback of all-time? --No. Is he ONE OF the greatest QB's all-time? --Absolutely.

The "Favre Antics" that transpired towards the end.. (retiring 100 times.. sex-ting.. his time with the Jets\Vikings) ..it all came in the final 2 years of his career. Yet last time I checked, Favre played 20 years. The haters and naysayers tend fixate on Favre from 2008-2010. But that's like only focusing on Brodeurs last 2 years.
In regards to Favres ego and self admiration.. why do people obsess on this as such an unusual issue? :noclue: Most great athletes, regardless of the sport.. have a little diva in them all. No one is questioning Favre's humility. (or lack thereof) However.. again.. this comes with many accomplished athletes. Not sure why so many fans gasp at this.

The appreciation of Favre will grow, as times goes by. Again, like I said before, the numbers speak for themselves.
Did his career end well? Absolutely not. But should that "tarnish his legacy" or corrupt the body of work in a 20 year HOF career? Not a chance.

-------------
EDIT: He may only have 1 Superbowl.. but the man played in 7 Championship games. Just a little FYI.


I will say it again, if Farve did not have Reggie White on the Packers he would have had no championship games, no superbowl, and would have had a greater INT to TD ratio.

Favre had the benefit of being in the right place at the right time with a defense that could limit the opposition offense.
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#60 NJDevs4978

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Posted 16 November 2011 - 04:31 PM

I can't take the 300 consecutive games played away from him, that's the all-time iron man streak in any professional sport. I do half think he was sticking pins in a Peyton voodoo doll before this season so he could keep the record and it worked :lol:

And his talent was certainly enormous at his peak, but he wasn't consistently one of the top QB's in his later years (people seem to forget now about the number of meh seasons he had there after Holmgren left - kind of like Kovy unleashed, he had nobody that could put the leash on him until McCarthy got there)

But he was extremely egocentric between all the retirements, the way he left GB and maneuvered himself to Minnesota, the coach issues and not helping Rodgers (to be fair Montana pulled the same thing with Steve Young) - so I agree with CRASHER and Manta in that I don't feel sorry for him one bit. He's going to the Hall of Fame, he'll get his number retired someday, it's not like his legacy will be obliterated, just some of his massive ego :P
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"The Devils have high standards, that's the difference. We have a standard to live up to every year, and a couple of teams in our area don't have the standards we do." - Pat Burns

The New Jersey Devils win Stanley Cups everywhere:
-NHL record for most road wins in the playoffs - 10-1 in '95 and 10-2 in '00
-NHL record for most home wins in the playoffs - 12-1 in '03




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