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Lockout 2012-2013 (Hockey's back!)


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Poll: Lockout 2012-2013 (Hockey's back!) (130 member(s) have cast votes)

When will we see hockey?

  1. Oct 12 (10 votes [7.69%])

    Percentage of vote: 7.69%

  2. Nov 12 (19 votes [14.62%])

    Percentage of vote: 14.62%

  3. Dec 12 (26 votes [20.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.00%

  4. Jan 13 (33 votes [25.38%])

    Percentage of vote: 25.38%

  5. Feb 13 (1 votes [0.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.77%

  6. Mar 13 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  7. Apr 13 (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  8. Oct 13 (14 votes [10.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.77%

  9. Never (27 votes [20.77%])

    Percentage of vote: 20.77%

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#641 Triumph

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Posted 09 November 2012 - 11:31 PM

They've had three months and neither side's moved an inch, the owners still want to take money out of the players' pockets with one hand after giving it to them with the other months ago and the players still think they should not only get 50% plus but now Fehr is being petulant in wanting the players to get paid as if there was no lockout.


You're not paying attention if you think neither side has moved an inch. You just don't have the facts at all. Furthermore, you take offers in negotiation at face value, which is ridiculous. Both sides have moved and will continue to move.

Logic may say they have to get a deal done but logic doesn't account for the egos and arrogance on both sides, starting with (but not limited to) Bettman and Fehr, the two biggest enemies to labor peace in pro sports.


Baseball has not had a labor issue since 1995, which is the longest streak in the 4 major sports by an incredible amount. Football, basketball, and the NHL are going to be locked into a lockout strategy to pull player salaries down every time the CBA expires. It will happen again and again. Baseball, on the other hand, is humming along smoothly.

Edited by Triumph, 09 November 2012 - 11:31 PM.

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#642 NJDevs4978

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 07:34 AM

You're not paying attention if you think neither side has moved an inch. You just don't have the facts at all. Furthermore, you take offers in negotiation at face value, which is ridiculous. Both sides have moved and will continue to move.



Baseball has not had a labor issue since 1995, which is the longest streak in the 4 major sports by an incredible amount. Football, basketball, and the NHL are going to be locked into a lockout strategy to pull player salaries down every time the CBA expires. It will happen again and again. Baseball, on the other hand, is humming along smoothly.


The only reason baseball hasn't had a labor issue since '95 is because the FANS finally made their collective voice heard in terms of declining attendance and very public fan backlash. It's going to finally come to that in hockey, I'm afraid.

If you want to 'read between the lines' and say there's movement that's fine. It's impossible to take anything either side says at face value, especially when Fehr behind closed doors says they're still far apart then goes in front of the media and says they're not. Most of this public bs is like an election, everything's PR-driven. And like Congress, nothing gets done in the end.
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#643 Triumph

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 11:20 AM

The only reason baseball hasn't had a labor issue since '95 is because the FANS finally made their collective voice heard in terms of declining attendance and very public fan backlash. It's going to finally come to that in hockey, I'm afraid.


The players could use this to their advantage and threaten a strike. Salaries are not tied to revenues in baseball. The baseball owners got into big trouble when they colluded.

If you want to 'read between the lines' and say there's movement that's fine. It's impossible to take anything either side says at face value, especially when Fehr behind closed doors says they're still far apart then goes in front of the media and says they're not. Most of this public bs is like an election, everything's PR-driven. And like Congress, nothing gets done in the end.


Numbers. Not quotes. Numbers. Numbers are all that matters here, and numbers have been getting closer, even with this latest news.
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#644 Satans Hockey

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 12:20 PM

This whole thing is a disgusting joke.
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#645 halfsharkalligatorhalfman

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 12:27 PM

FWIW:

https://twitter.com/...098709597241344

Tough meeting [Friday]. Talks were good this week but some say its because Jeremy Jacobs was not there...until [Friday].


Tweet edited by me to account for tweet's timing.

Edited by halfsharkalligatorhalfman, 10 November 2012 - 12:27 PM.

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#646 Marshall

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 02:36 PM

I am OK with losing this season if Fehr kills the Bettman and we have labor peace in perpetuity. Yes, seriously. But if this ends up as another cashgrab where the owners see that they have this fully armed and operational battle station called a "Lock Out" and say "hey let's use it again in the next lock out to get more Benjamins from the players"...then I will pissed off because nothing has been accomplished other than ensuring we will have labor strife again in 5-8 years.

But I will accept losing a season if it brings stability to this game, stability we have not seen for two decades.
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#647 NJDevs4978

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 03:27 PM

We said the same types of things in '04, losing a season is not going to help bring stability to the game. The only thing that'll bring stability to the game is the fans revolting and letting both sides know 'business as usual' is no longer acceptable.

re: Jacobs, wtf is his problem anyway? It's not like the system's preventing him from having a good team, is he such a frigging miser that having a popular team that has good attendance isn't enough?

Edited by NJDevs4978, 10 November 2012 - 03:28 PM.

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"The Devils have high standards, that's the difference. We have a standard to live up to every year, and a couple of teams in our area don't have the standards we do." - Pat Burns

The New Jersey Devils win Stanley Cups everywhere:
-NHL record for most road wins in the playoffs - 10-1 in '95 and 10-2 in '00
-NHL record for most home wins in the playoffs - 12-1 in '03

#648 DaneykoIsGod

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 03:47 PM

This is getting so bad that I actually have more faith in the U.S. Congress to compromise and solve our budget issues before Fehr and Bettman will compromise and solve the NHL's labor issues.
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#649 Zubie#8

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 12:10 PM

Talks will resume this afternoon according to @JSportsnet
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#650 DevilMinder

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 04:29 PM

Talks ended within an hour with both sides calling each other smelly and making your mom jokes.
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#651 Devilsfan118

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 06:07 PM

So after all the talks this week, no progress was made.

Typical.
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#652 sundstrom

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 07:05 PM

I am OK with losing this season if Fehr kills the Bettman and we have labor peace in perpetuity.


if it's not bettman, it's someone else pushing the owners agenda. revenues have gone up, franchise values have gone up. why would the owners get rid of bettman?
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20082719943.png
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“They’re the ones that makes it happen,” Lemaire said. “It’s not us. It’s not me. It’s not the other guy. It’s not the guy before. It’s not the guy after. It’s them. And they have to take care of business.”
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#653 '7'

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 07:12 PM

if it's not bettman, it's someone else pushing the owners agenda. revenues have gone up, franchise values have gone up. why would the owners get rid of bettman?


revenues and franchise values go up regardless of who is the commish. They went up under Calder, Dutton, Campbell, Ziegler, and Stein
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#654 sundstrom

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 08:05 PM

revenues and franchise values go up regardless of who is the commish. They went up under Calder, Dutton, Campbell, Ziegler, and Stein


not like they have with bettman.

trust me - the owners love him.
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"This team was never the same once we lost Patrik Sundstrom"- Lou Lamoriello


20082719943.png
_________________________________________________________________
“They’re the ones that makes it happen,” Lemaire said. “It’s not us. It’s not me. It’s not the other guy. It’s not the guy before. It’s not the guy after. It’s them. And they have to take care of business.”
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#655 NCDevsFan

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 09:11 PM

Its 11/11. Do you know where your hockey teams are?
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#656 SMantzas

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 09:41 PM

Today would have been the day Parise returned to the Rock. Sigh
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#657 SterioDesign

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:15 AM

I said it a few weeks ago...Jeremy jacob is to blame way more than bettman
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#658 Zubie#8

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 12:46 AM

"Contract Issues Emerge as Final Hurdle in N.H.L. Talks"

http://www.nytimes.c...e-in-talks.html

I doubt this is the only issue left but its a good read for the optimistic folks!

Edited by Zubie#8, 12 November 2012 - 12:48 AM.

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#659 Marshall

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 01:19 AM

if it's not bettman, it's someone else pushing the owners agenda. revenues have gone up, franchise values have gone up. why would the owners get rid of bettman?


Oh, they have no reason to. But he has to work with the players once all this is resolved and that will be...interesting,
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#660 Daniel

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Posted 12 November 2012 - 10:14 AM

"Contract Issues Emerge as Final Hurdle in N.H.L. Talks"

http://www.nytimes.c...e-in-talks.html

I doubt this is the only issue left but its a good read for the optimistic folks!


That the league hasn't walked away completely after Fehr's hardball tactics and pessimistic statements to the press leads me to believe the owners are pretty desperate to get the seasons started. For all of the grief he gets, Fehr is very good at his job.
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