Daniel Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 A serious question, and I would actually like to have some reason for optimism, but I just don't see it. In the chance he got last game, he got about 11 minutes of icetime, and is once again on the bench. At some point, you can't just say that DeBoer is being irrational. He has been just as skeptical as Gelinas, who's holes in his game are more readily apparent. There's always the Salvador factor, but if Larsson were really what you would expect in a number 4 pick who some thought was the best player in his draft, you find a way to get him into the lineup. Is there any hope that he gets better? Can anyone think of a defensemen who has had a similar start to their career that turned into a good or very good defenseman? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-Man Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 (edited) Google Victor Hedman. You're welcome. http://www.tampabay.com/sports/hockey/lightning/victor-hedman-emerges-as-a-lightning-star/2162957 Part of the article: "Heddy has just come into his own,'' Lightning coach Jon Cooper said. "It's a tribute to him that he has weathered his ups and downs. He has weathered his critics.'' There were plenty of those in Hedman's first four seasons in the NHL. You tend to collect your share when you're the second overall pick and have the poor taste to not look like the next Bobby Orr right off the plane. "That weighs on you,'' Cooper said. Hedman heard the grumbling earlier in his career. No one called him a bust, but there were those who wondered if he was worth the second pick back in 2009. He showed flashes of stardom, but eventually, fans grow tired of potential. They start looking back at the draft and lamenting the players the Lightning could have had. "When you're drafted that high,'' Hedman said, "expectations are sky-high.'' Sound familiar? Edited October 24, 2014 by Z-Man Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derlique Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 (edited) Hedman was better even when he was going through growing pains. I like Larsson and think he'll be a good top 4 guy for a long time, but it appears it won't be here. I wouldn't mind getting a similarly struggling offensive prospect like Sven Baertschi and being done with it. DeBoer/ the coaching staff has issues with Larsson's game. I find it weird that they're putting Gelinas back in considering how well Brunner performed on the PP. Larsson is also a more likely solution to the PK than EG Edited October 24, 2014 by SMantzas Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted October 24, 2014 Author Share Posted October 24, 2014 Google Victor Hedman. You're welcome. http://www.tampabay.com/sports/hockey/lightning/victor-hedman-emerges-as-a-lightning-star/2162957 Part of the article: Sound familiar? Hedman was never demoted to the minors, and never benched for an extended period of time. So I don't think that works, although you could argue that he didn't have the same level of competition for a roster spot that Larsson has and does now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devs3cups Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 (edited) I agree with all of this Hedman stuff, but Larsson just doesn't get the chance to prove himself. Which sucks because we know he has the potential. Larsson will never develop like Hedman or reach his potential if he never plays. Edited October 24, 2014 by Devs3cups Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satans Hockey Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 I'm sure one of our defenseman will go down with an injury at some point, if he doesn't get to play at that point than yeah I guess he's done here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevs4978 Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 With the Devils he's finished. Clearly they don't want to deal with him. If there was a long term injury on D I honestly think Harrold would come back and play over Larsson. Or they bring up Hegelson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Onddeck Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 With the Devils he's finished. Clearly they don't want to deal with him. If there was a long term injury on D I honestly think Harrold would come back and play over Larsson. Or they bring up Hegelson. If what you said is true, then there is absolutely NO REASON why Larsson hasnt been traded yet. Losing value by the second Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilsfan118 Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 (edited) With the Devils he's finished. Clearly they don't want to deal with him. If there was a long term injury on D I honestly think Harrold would come back and play over Larsson. Or they bring up Hegelson. If that happens I might just flip my lid. No, he's not finished. He hasn't had a chance since is rookie year to prove himself or acclimate himself to the NHL-level game. He's done here. If the Devils don't trade him I'm sure he's going back to the SHL next year. Hedman was better even when he was going through growing pains. I like Larsson and think he'll be a good top 4 guy for a long time, but it appears it won't be here. I wouldn't mind getting a similarly struggling offensive prospect like Sven Baertschi and being done with it. DeBoer/ the coaching staff has issues with Larsson's game. I find it weird that they're putting Gelinas back in considering how well Brunner performed on the PP. Larsson is also a more likely solution to the PK than EG All this talk of trading him for a struggling young forward - what makes anyone think that kid will play in PDB's system? Yak or anyone with a game like his will sit in the press box or rot in the AHL, just like Larsson. Unless the kid happens to be a Canadian boy with a physical game - and even then he'd sit for a guy like Zubrus. We're finally getting some kids playing on defense - that's more a result of circumstance than anything else I'd imagine. I'm glad Lou forced his hand, so-to-speak, with the buyout of Volch and by not signing any veteran defenseman. Edited October 24, 2014 by Devilsfan118 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cgb6397 Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 He's been done since PK crushed him in his rookie season. He wasn't ready for the NHL, couldn't handle it, finally developed in the AHL, and never got the chance to regain his confidence. I thought his playoff goal vs. Philly could do it, but no, PDB is simply too big a bully to overcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zubie#8 Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Trade him. Move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted October 24, 2014 Author Share Posted October 24, 2014 All this talk of trading him for a struggling young forward - what makes anyone think that kid will play in PDB's system? Yak or anyone with a game like his will sit in the press box or rot in the AHL, just like Larsson. Unless the kid happens to be a Canadian boy with a physical game - and even then he'd sit for a guy like Zubrus. We're finally getting some kids playing on defense - that's more a result of circumstance than anything else I'd imagine. I'm glad Lou forced his hand, so-to-speak, with the buyout of Volch and by not signing any veteran defenseman. Yakupov, in message board trade hypotheses, makes some sense in that there is offensive upside, which the Devils could use, while Larsson -- if others don't perceive him as a bust right now -- is a defenseman with upside, which is something that Edmonton might want. In other words, the teams would be trading one under performing asset for another, but in each's respective area of need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pumpkin cutter Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 I don't see him becoming a top 4 here. Trade him before his stock lowers any more. I have no regrets with the pick, it just didn't work out. I'm contempt with Merrill,Gelinas,Severson,Greene, and the other youngings we have in the oven. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilsfan118 Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Yakupov, in message board trade hypotheses, makes some sense in that there is offensive upside, which the Devils could use, while Larsson -- if others don't perceive him as a bust right now -- is a defenseman with upside, which is something that Edmonton might want. In other words, the teams would be trading one under performing asset for another, but in each's respective area of need. No I understand where people are coming from, and why such a trade might make sense. My point was that even if such a trade were to occur, do you think a guy like Yak would play in PDB's system? I think he'd be in the doghouse before he even laced up his skates. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 (edited) If that happens I might just flip my lid. No, he's not finished. He hasn't had a chance since is rookie year to prove himself or acclimate himself to the NHL-level game. He's done here. If the Devils don't trade him I'm sure he's going back to the SHL next year. All this talk of trading him for a struggling young forward - what makes anyone think that kid will play in PDB's system? Yak or anyone with a game like his will sit in the press box or rot in the AHL, just like Larsson. Unless the kid happens to be a Canadian boy with a physical game - and even then he'd sit for a guy like Zubrus. We're finally getting some kids playing on defense - that's more a result of circumstance than anything else I'd imagine. I'm glad Lou forced his hand, so-to-speak, with the buyout of Volch and by not signing any veteran defenseman. The idea that he didn't get a chance during the 2012-13 season is insane. He played 37 games that year. He was sat out for the first several but then got into the vast majority of games. He played with Andy Greene. That pairing did not do that well. It wasn't a very good performance. Even so, he's not done here. There will be an injury. He will get in there. Then he has to make the most of his opportunity. Now he might've mentally checked out of here, but that's his prerogative. Going back to the SHL? Hahaha. Yeah. He's going to go back to Sweden to make $300,000 and be the best player in that league. Beautiful career move. Nothing says 'I want to play in the NHL' more than going to a league that's probably behind the AHL in quality. The Devils used Andrei Loktionov extensively before he struggled and wasn't living up to expectation. If the Devils have a need at forward and a new player fills it, that player will get in. Edited October 24, 2014 by Triumph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted October 24, 2014 Author Share Posted October 24, 2014 No I understand where people are coming from, and why such a trade might make sense. My point was that even if such a trade were to occur, do you think a guy like Yak would play in PDB's system? I think he'd be in the doghouse before he even laced up his skates. The advantage with Yakupov is that I believe he is not waiver eligible until next season, so if a trade happened tomorrow, you could send him to Albany in order to learn a more well rounded game, if that's at all possible. It's also possible that Yakupov gets the selfish label just because he's "enigmatic". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted October 24, 2014 Author Share Posted October 24, 2014 He's not done here. There will be an injury. He will get in there. Then he has to make the most of his opportunity. Now he might've mentally checked out of here, but that's his prerogative. I'm sure he's going to get more playing time eventually. I'm more interested in whether we can expect him to impress at that point. In other words, is he really just another top five draft pick that turned out to be not that good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devlman Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Hedman was never demoted to the minors, and never benched for an extended period of time. So I don't think that works, although you could argue that he didn't have the same level of competition for a roster spot that Larsson has and does now. Thats because TB didnt have the depth the Devils had on defense. Hedman played all the time because there was room for him. Also, Lou is known for seasoning guys in the minors. No, he's not finished. He hasn't had a chance since is rookie year to prove himself or acclimate himself to the NHL-level game. And he looked quite promising his rookie year when he actually got ice time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Let's can the Hedman talk right now. Yes, Hedman struggled with the offensive side of the game, but he was almost immediately the Lightning's best defenseman. In 2009-10, Hedman comes to the Lightning - he doesn't receive favorable zone starts. His most common D partners are Kurtis Foster, Mattias Ohlund, and Andrej Meszaros, all of whom put up slightly better Corsi with him than without him. His on-ice Corsi is 3rd among Lightning D. In 2010-11, Hedman doesn't have a great year - he's 2nd on the team among D in on ice Corsi among players with 40+ games, but his zone start is relatively high. He doesn't look to be a huge force for pulling the team ahead. This was the year they weirdly went to the Conference Semis, so yeah, at this point Hedman doesn't look that great. Year 3 is where Hedman really starts to pick it up - he gets unfavorable zone starts and beats the opposition to close to even on a not very good team. He is playing top minutes with Eric Brewer as well. Yes, his offensive game isn't there yet, but he was clearly the best defenseman on that team. This is where the narrative diverges from the Larsson narrative, because last year Larsson looked okay until he got hurt and he was then sent to the minors. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redruM Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 SO frustrated about this !! What eactly did PDB see that he decided to bench him again? what has Gelinas done to cintinue to earn ice time? from what I have seen of Gelinas not much!! and that goes for Salvador as well!! I'm basically done w/ PDB, time to find a new coach Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'7' Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 SO frustrated about this !! What eactly did PDB see that he decided to bench him again? what has Gelinas done to cintinue to earn ice time? from what I have seen of Gelinas not much!! and that goes for Salvador as well!! I'm basically done w/ PDB, time to find a new coach no, don't you know he's a great tactician, based on his missing the playoffs every year as a coach but one and an endless stream of blown leads. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil Dan 56 Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 The advantage with Yakupov is that I believe he is not waiver eligible until next season, so if a trade happened tomorrow, you could send him to Albany in order to learn a more well rounded game, if that's at all possible. It's also possible that Yakupov gets the selfish label just because he's "enigmatic". Yakupov gets the selfish label because he flat out told reporters that he wasn't going to change his style to play like Edmonton wanted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Wensink Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Larsson is playing with the threat of sitting for the rest of the game and being benched for games on end for his mistakes. There is no way to play well with that over your head. When you try to be too perfect things will go wrong. He also is getting bitter seeing others make similar mistakes and play on. I'm fascinated by what PDB will do if one of the vets get hurt. I really believe he'll play Harrold over Lars. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z-Man Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Just wait until next year, when Boucher and Matteau make the team to replace whatever combo of Ryder/Havlat/Jagr/Brunner that leave as UFAs. PDB will make Gionta the 2nd line center and let the kids rot on the bench. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfitz804 Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 If PDB is still here by next season I think I have a shot at being first line center. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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