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The Battle of Brodeur


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#21 lucifer91

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 11:26 AM

I'm not convinced of anything yet. From my seat at the Rock, we totally sucked for at least one period yesterday, and have for numerous periods past in front of Marty.

Let's see if Deboer can get them playing defensively well and then judge the goalies.


+1. I am not giving up on our Hall of Fame-bound goalie yet, or at least I will give him the respect and benefit of the doubt that he deserves.
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#22 mmajeski06

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 11:40 AM

The Marty of old is gone for sure...on a night this team doesn't show up, he will no longer be able to carry the team.
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#23 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 11:42 AM

No, but he certainly didn't play well. This team is a .500 team in pretty much all respects right now, it can't afford to give up bad goals night after night.

Re: Brodeur fatigue - he did start all 14 games in March 2011 posting a .922 save percentage and 1.68 GAA.


I think they've overachieved to get where they are, even at 14-12-1. All the numbers point to that, really...the bad goal differential (-13 when eliminating phantom shootout goals), the low GF total, only half their wins coming in regulation...it's impossible to make a case for them deserving to have a better record than they do.

I don't think Hedberg will play so well as to take the #1 job for the year, but as much as I appreciate all Marty has done through the years, the GAA and save% are just flat-out bad right now. Hedberg's, for the moment, are solid. Marty's played an absurd number of games for his career, and at his age, it can end or drop off very quickly. Sports fans have seen the both the slow, steady decline in some players, and the much more abrupt one in the others (baseball's Mickey Mantle and Roberto Alomar are great examples of the latter). If this was four or five years ago I let Marty ride it out, but when the other guy is playing better, and the team has almost no margin for error, and I can't really bank on Marty at 39 being able to regain his form, I gotta give the other guy a chance.

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976, 09 December 2011 - 11:43 AM.

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Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
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It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

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#24 95Crash

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 11:57 AM

Why does one of them have to be named the No. 1 goalie? Why can't DeBoer just alternate them every game?

That's what I'd like to see.
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#25 BlueSkirt

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 12:02 PM

My feelings are probably a combo of many. Yes, Brodeur is an aging veteran who will no longer be consistent over long stretches, but can still have flashes of brilliance for a few games at a clip.
Of course that still requires the mental confidence, which is not there now. And we need to win games now so we can stay around .500 until we get back all our players

So, he's still a guy that can win a big game for us, if he's at the right spot in the stretch.

At this point, he's certainly got less than 100 games left in his NHL career, perhaps less than 50.
So I just enjoy watching him in net during the regular season. He's earned the swan song.
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#26 NLinfante

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 12:09 PM

It pains me to say this, but I think we should roll with Hedberg not because he is substantially better, but the team plays so much better in front of him. Can anyone pull up the stats of g/f with Hedberg compared to Brodeur?



this +100
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#27 Triumph

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 12:11 PM

I think they've overachieved to get where they are, even at 14-12-1. All the numbers point to that, really...the bad goal differential (-13 when eliminating phantom shootout goals), the low GF total, only half their wins coming in regulation...it's impossible to make a case for them deserving to have a better record than they do.


I think while it's not possible to argue that they should have a better record - no team is good enough at the shootout to do sustainably well as NJ has been - I do think they should have more overtime games in general. Right now at even strength with the score tied, the Devils are -5 GA despite being even in shots and a .917 save percentage. They've given up a late 3rd goal in a lot of games and haven't gotten many themselves - their shooting percentage is worst in the 3rd period.

I don't think Hedberg will play so well as to take the #1 job for the year, but as much as I appreciate all Marty has done through the years, the GAA and save% are just flat-out bad right now. Hedberg's, for the moment, are solid. Marty's played an absurd number of games for his career, and at his age, it can end or drop off very quickly. Sports fans have seen the both the slow, steady decline in some players, and the much more abrupt one in the others (baseball's Mickey Mantle and Roberto Alomar are great examples of the latter). If this was four or five years ago I let Marty ride it out, but when the other guy is playing better, and the team has almost no margin for error, and I can't really bank on Marty at 39 being able to regain his form, I gotta give the other guy a chance.


I think the terrible offensive start last year masked how not good Brodeur was, but he did come on stronger at the end of the year. I still think we'll see Brodeur on Saturday, but if he's not good then, we will be seeing a lot more of Hedberg.
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#28 Jmorc2003

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 12:15 PM

He started his career platooning with Terreri, so its only fitting that he ends it platooning with another aging but serviceable goalie. The circle of life.
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#29 Devilsfan118

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 12:18 PM

Why does one of them have to be named the No. 1 goalie? Why can't DeBoer just alternate them every game?

That's what I'd like to see.


Bingo. Just alternate every game or every two games
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#30 britoon

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 12:27 PM

I'm not convinced of anything yet. From my seat at the Rock, we totally sucked for at least one period yesterday, and have for numerous periods past in front of Marty.

Let's see if Deboer can get them playing defensively well and then judge the goalies.


Yes. This.
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#31 bishops317

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 12:39 PM

alot of people hate on Marty here but do any of you see the complete lack of help from the D he gets very lazy play from them on both goals last night and they seem at least to me to play like a completely different team for headburg much more responsible in front of him.the defense looks to almost not try when marty's in the net, i do agree that marty gives up the softy goals every now and then but for the most part and definitely last night most goals this year are not his fault.....just my opinion
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#32 Devils Pride 26

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 12:44 PM

I thought Marty last year was worse, IMO. Marty could easily come back and have another second half like last year, and win a round or two. I think a lot of people would be begging him to come back with a one year deal at that point.
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#33 devilsfan26

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 12:50 PM

I think they've overachieved to get where they are, even at 14-12-1. All the numbers point to that, really...the bad goal differential (-13 when eliminating phantom shootout goals), the low GF total, only half their wins coming in regulation...it's impossible to make a case for them deserving to have a better record than they do.

Shootouts don't count for goal differential, they are -8.
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#34 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 12:50 PM

i totally blame marty for both goals - no question.

too casual and bad puck handling on goal one and then out of position.

awful, unnecessary rebound and inability to recover on goal 2.



The first was a poor rebound and is definitely on Marty. But on the second one, he had Tedenby standing on top of him.
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#35 EdgeControl

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 01:14 PM

The first was a poor rebound and is definitely on Marty. But on the second one, he had Tedenby standing on top of him.

Tedy took the wrong guy and got man-handled into marty's lap. you could tell by the look on his face that he was going to hear about it lol

plus, our D-men have been collapsing too much and taking bad angles
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#36 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 01:58 PM

Shootouts don't count for goal differential, they are -8.



No they're not.

They are 6-1 in shootouts. That means they have 6 goals added to the GF column and 1 goal added to the GA column that were never scored. The team that wins a shootout gets a "phantom" goal added to their total.

So in reality, the Devils have scored 70 - 6 = 64 goals
and have given up 78 - 1 = 77 goals

Understand?
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THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#37 RowdyFan42

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 02:24 PM

Why does one of them have to be named the No. 1 goalie? Why can't DeBoer just alternate them every game?

That's what I'd like to see.

Because the thought of Marty being the #2 goalie on this team (or any other) gives a lot of us hives.

I might be okay with Marty and Moose being #1 and #1A, but the idea of Marty flat-out losing his starting job is just too painful.
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#38 NJDevs4978

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 02:31 PM

Because the thought of Marty being the #2 goalie on this team (or any other) gives a lot of us hives.

I might be okay with Marty and Moose being #1 and #1A, but the idea of Marty flat-out losing his starting job is just too painful.


I'd much rather see him lose his job than keep getting obliterated and pulled after a period.

Besides, he did already lose his job a couple of times last winter, albeit temporarily.
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#39 HellOnICE

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 02:40 PM

No one is saying he should lose his job yet. I'm saying they need to do a better job of putting him in more positions to succeed. Last night proved to me, he shouldn't play in 2 games in a row unless there's at least 2 days off.
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#40 mrthemike

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Posted 09 December 2011 - 02:48 PM

Because the thought of Marty being the #2 goalie on this team (or any other) gives a lot of us hives.

I might be okay with Marty and Moose being #1 and #1A, but the idea of Marty flat-out losing his starting job is just too painful.


Really? I don't give a sh!t. I want the better goalie to start. If Marty can't compete effectively, or if the team doesn't play effectively in front of him, he shouldn't play. I'm totally cool with that.
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