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Official 2012 New York Mets Thread


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#781 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 08:45 AM

The MVP should be the best player in each league too, but it's often misconstrued as the "most valuable to a contender", for whatever reason.

The Cy Young race is really tight. I couldn't tell you who I'd vote for right now if the season ended. Probably Cueto if I had to pick, but it's not clear cut. Cueto, Dickey, Gonzalez, and Kershaw are all right up there.


MVP shouldn't really be just a "Player of the Year" award. (I think they should have an award like that though, along with the MVP award.) Kirk Gibson is a great example of a guy whose value went well beyond his numbers (which were nothing special when he won the award)...he changed the dynamic of the Dodgers' clubhouse with his attitude...during spring training, Jesse Orosco filled Gibson's cap with eye black, so when he put it on, his head was covered with eye black...supposedly Gibson almost killed Orosco, and screamed something along the lines of "That's why you guys haven't won sh!t." He became the undisputed leader in the clubhouse at that point, and of course, had his signature moment againt Dennis Eckersley in the 1988 World Series. There were definitely guys with bigger numbers, but Gibson's impact on that Dodger team can't be disputed (even with Orel Hershiser going nuts with the scoreless innings streak that season).
  • 0
THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#782 nmigliore

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 08:40 PM

What a game in Miami tonight. Mets have rallied down 3-1 to take the lead. Kelly Shoppach with a huge hit. I seriously thought he had no chance in that at bat; Cishek owns righties, righties own Shoppach. But yeah, that's baseball for ya.
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LETS GO METS
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"Take all that clubhouse [expletive] and all that, throw it out the window. Every writer in the country has been writing about that [expletive] for years. Chemistry don't mean [expletive]."

- Jim Leyland

#783 '7'

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 08:50 PM

In Shoppach, I'm just glad the mets have a catcher who can actually hit the ball over the fence. sure down the line he WILL have some awful 1-18 stretches and such...but a 3 run bomb is always around the corner. You don't get that with Thole (who's in some kind of black hole now) Shoppach is like Barajas...but having an all or nothing slugger down in the order isn't such a bad thing.
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
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#784 nmigliore

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 08:54 PM

Francisco closes it out cleanly. Mets win! Awesome come from behind victory, that was fun.
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LETS GO METS
LETS GO DEVILS

"Take all that clubhouse [expletive] and all that, throw it out the window. Every writer in the country has been writing about that [expletive] for years. Chemistry don't mean [expletive]."

- Jim Leyland

#785 '7'

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 08:56 PM

Francisco closes it out cleanly. Mets win! Awesome come from behind victory, that was fun.


unexpected...hefner pitched well and got lucky on a check swing single and then a no mans land bleeder from mike stanton (which was the softest ball he's hit all year) that made it 2-1

btw...that stadium is only a few months old. But man is it an mishmashed ugly monstrosity. Blue seats and puke green everywhere. I get an Olympic Stadium vibe from it

Edited by '7', 01 September 2012 - 08:57 PM.

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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
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#786 '7'

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 12:26 PM

Jason Bay...grand slam!

But Chris "Batting Practice" Young is on the mound :-P
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
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#787 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 12:44 PM

Jason Bay...grand slam!

But Chris "Batting Practice" Young is on the mound :-P


Gotta admit, we all know how awful Bay has been since he's been here, but when a guy sucks THAT badly, you actually feel good for the guy when something positive actually happens.

And yeah, Young doesn't fool anyone on the mound.
  • 0
THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#788 '7'

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 01:46 PM

You see that 6th inning was the perfect time to use Parnell.

It's not the 8th or 9th so he's not sh!tting his pants

And the Marlins just saw a soft tosser for the previous 5. So now you have a fireballer to adjust to. 3 easy outs
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
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#789 '7'

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 01:50 PM

Parnell threw like 6 pitches that inning. Why pinch hit Lutz...just keep Parnell in and have him bunt Torres to 3rd?

well that ended disastrously.
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
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#790 nmigliore

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 02:32 PM

Mets sweep!

They've won 7 of their last 9; not too bad for a team that looked like they were really mailing it in a week and a half ago. Hopefully they can finish this roadtrip strong and try to play spoiler to St. Louis.

Edited by nmigliore, 02 September 2012 - 02:39 PM.

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LETS GO METS
LETS GO DEVILS

"Take all that clubhouse [expletive] and all that, throw it out the window. Every writer in the country has been writing about that [expletive] for years. Chemistry don't mean [expletive]."

- Jim Leyland

#791 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 02 September 2012 - 07:35 PM

Mets sweep!

They've won 7 of their last 9; not too bad for a team that looked like they were really mailing it in a week and a half ago. Hopefully they can finish this roadtrip strong and try to play spoiler to St. Louis.


7 of 8 actually. Probably about to get ugly again, with St. Louis, Atlanta, and Washington coming up. If they won 5 out of 9 I'd be pretty blown away by that.

This team has to go 17-11 to finish .500 for the year...won't be easy, but at least it can be brought up without laughing.
  • 0
THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#792 '7'

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 04:37 PM

Not a bad job trying to battle back today

Again, why would Terry bring in Parnell with runners on base? This is a classic "bobby sh!ts himself moment" use parnell to start an inning, use parnell when we're up 4-5 runs or down 4-5 runs. This game was still to winnable to use our bullpens biggest choke artist
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
Posted Image Posted Image

#793 '7'

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 04:48 PM

As for torres, we he's not a fault as he did touch the bag. And the umpire has to be 10000% sure to make thats call. Why he felt he needed to interject himself into the game like this to help the already blessed by the baseball gods Cardinals...who knows. But this is an instance where replay is needed. can only imagine the stink if we were 1-3 games out instead of 8
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
Posted Image Posted Image

#794 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 03 September 2012 - 06:08 PM

Not a bad job trying to battle back today

Again, why would Terry bring in Parnell with runners on base? This is a classic "bobby sh!ts himself moment" use parnell to start an inning, use parnell when we're up 4-5 runs or down 4-5 runs. This game was still to winnable to use our bullpens biggest choke artist


Look, I'm not Parnell's biggest fan either, but you can't just make him a mop-up guy...he's better than THAT. He's still going to have to come into key situations here and there...hopefully he's not the #1 closer or #1 set-up guy, but you can bet next season that he's going to come into games where it's close, and there will be games where the closer or main set-up guy won't be available, and Parnell will probably be the first guy to cover in the those situations.

At any rate, Mets might as well use Parnell in as many situations as they can...chances are he'll give up hits in all of them, because that's what Parnell does. He's a frustrating entity,

Really wish I could find Parnell's inherited runners, and how many he's allowed to score...can't find that info anywhere.

David Wright's disappearing act continues...now down to .311, and his OB% and SLG% are about to drop below .400 and .500, respectively. I've seen enough...I'd say trade the guy and let someone else pay him. I don't need to see Wright bat in the .260s, not hit home runs and strike out 150 times for top dollar.
  • 0
THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#795 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 07:32 AM

Article in the Post today about whether the Mets should trade Wright, Dickey, and Niese for as many prospects as they can get:

http://www.nypost.co...tm_content=Mets

I would say no to Niese, because he's signed to reasonable dollars over the next four years, and seems to be hitting his stride...looks like he can be a 10-15 game winner for each year of his deal, maybe even a little better with some run support.

I would say yes to Dickey and Wright. Dickey hurts a little, because he's a great story for sure, and seems to have a great attitude...exactly the kind of guy who want to keep around, one who's good in the clubhouse AND contributes on the field. But he's not young, as we all know, and though the fact that he's a knuckleballer might mean he's younger than his years, his value will probably never be higher than it will be this offseason, and let's face it, if not for his phenomenal season, the Mets are a lot worse than their 64-71 mark. The Mets have a lot of holes that need filling over the next couple of years if they want to think about contending any time soon, and Dickey can definitely help a real contender next season. Even if Dickey repeated this season again next year, it's hard to fathom that the Mets will contend in 2013. The Mets COULD hang onto him and trade him at the deadline of course, hope he has another big sesaon that drives up his price a little more, but that's risky if he doesn't pitch as well next season. I hate to do it, because I like Dickey a lot, but I trade him in the offseason now, when the Mets likely have price certainty with him.

I say yes to Wright for the reasons stated before in this thread...the Wright of the last four seasons is simply not as good as the Wright from 2004-08. Whatever contract Wright gets is really going to be based on THAT version of David Wright, which is a dangerous move. This version of Wright doesn't get on base as much, doesn't hit for as much power, and strikes out a lot more. This season has been propped up by a awesome first half, but as we have seen, as the season moved into the second half, Wright has pretty much become the David Wright of last year. nmig will tell you that sabermetrics dictated that Wright had a good year last season, but let's face it, even if I agreed with that, it's impossible to ignore that Wright's numbers have been up-and-down since 2009...the power numbers definitely have been, and moving in the fences at Citi don't seem to have made that much of a difference. The numbers being bandied about are for seven years and well over $100 million for David. Look at the balance of the last four seasons...no matter how much we may like him, those four years simply do not command the kind of money Wright will likely ask for. But thanks to this season's great first half, if he can turn in a decent September, his overall numbers this season are going to look pretty good...maybe good enough that someone who hasn't been watching Wright over the last four seasons will think they're trading for/paying for the Wright of old. I think the Mets have already gotten his best, and they got those years at a terrific value overall. Now it's time for someone else to pay him over-the-top money for lesser performance...and for the Mets to try to get a player or two that can help them in the years to come.

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976, 04 September 2012 - 07:32 AM.

  • 0
THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#796 '7'

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 08:03 AM

Agree on Niese. He's just too affordable and effective (and young) to jettison right now. If this team does have a winning future, RA is going to be a part of it.

Dickey and Wright I'm both on the fence on. Honestly I don't feel like this team is all that far from contending for a Wild Card...trading BOTH would set us back into super rebuild mode and would further alienate a chunk of the fan base that's stuck with us through some very rough years. I honestly think that at this point Dickey is even more beloved than Wright, who just seems beaten down and going through the motions.

Plus you know, prospects are not a proven commodity. I mean we had generation K...surely AT WORST one of 'em would develop into a solid 2 starter.

None of 'em did

Right now I'm leaning towards keeping everyone. Rebuilding the pen...making the usual offseason periphery bench moves, and coming back with the same team next year. I'm 50/50 on trading Wright depending on the pitching we get back for him
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
Posted Image Posted Image

#797 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 08:40 AM

Agree on Niese. He's just too affordable and effective (and young) to jettison right now. If this team does have a winning future, RA is going to be a part of it.

Dickey and Wright I'm both on the fence on. Honestly I don't feel like this team is all that far from contending for a Wild Card...trading BOTH would set us back into super rebuild mode and would further alienate a chunk of the fan base that's stuck with us through some very rough years. I honestly think that at this point Dickey is even more beloved than Wright, who just seems beaten down and going through the motions.

Plus you know, prospects are not a proven commodity. I mean we had generation K...surely AT WORST one of 'em would develop into a solid 2 starter.

None of 'em did

Right now I'm leaning towards keeping everyone. Rebuilding the pen...making the usual offseason periphery bench moves, and coming back with the same team next year. I'm 50/50 on trading Wright depending on the pitching we get back for him


One thing to keep in mind, re: Wright...if he gets big money and starts turning in 2011-type seasons, he's going to become daily talk fodder for pretty much every sports outlet in NY...a mega-deal is going to make him THE face of the Mets, and if the Mets are struggling and he's not hitting in pre-2009 form, expect him to get a lot of the blame for all that isn't going right, fairly or unfairly. If you think he's beaten down now...

I just think it's too much of a risk to keep him around here. The Mets sign him to a 7 year/$140 million-type deal, and he doesn't come close to living it up to it, it could get so ugly so fast. Look, we'll look back on the balance of Wright's Met career and say, wow, a guy who hit .301 or so as a Met, cracked 100 RBI 5 times (maybe six if he gets hot in September and has runners to drive in), was basically a good guy...there's a lot to remember fondly. But like I said, I can't look back on the last four years and make a solid case as to why the Mets should risk spending this kind of money for a guy who appears to be a lesser performer at this stage in his career.

I do agree that they can't get fleeced if they move him though...even if the propects they get for him don't work, they have to get guys that were at least thought to be upper-echelon prospects at the time of the deal. Like you say, no guarantees, no matter what Sandy decides.
  • 0
THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#798 nmigliore

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 09:16 AM

I prefer to resign Wright, so I'd offer him 6/115 and see what happens. However, if he's looking for a lot more than that, I'd likely pass and trade him. But as I've said so many times, something needs to be done: either he's traded or resigned, no in between. If the situation is still status quo come next spring, I'm going to be very disappointed.

Niese is a young building block with a long-term friendly contract. I'd move him in the right deal, but I highly doubt that right deal comes along.

I'd work out an extension with Dickey. It's difficult to assess his trade value, but I don't think he'd bring back as much as people think due to his age, impending free agency in 2014, and/or the knuckleball risk factor. You'd have to trust the general manager's judgment with this one since we aren't privy to the information he has in regards to what Dickey wants and what other teams are/would offer for Dickey.

Edited by nmigliore, 04 September 2012 - 09:24 AM.

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LETS GO METS
LETS GO DEVILS

"Take all that clubhouse [expletive] and all that, throw it out the window. Every writer in the country has been writing about that [expletive] for years. Chemistry don't mean [expletive]."

- Jim Leyland

#799 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 09:34 AM

I prefer to resign Wright, so I'd offer him 6/115 and see what happens. However, if he's looking for a lot more than that, I'd likely pass and trade him. But as I've said so many times, something needs to be done: either he's traded or resigned, no in between. If the situation is still status quo come next spring, I'm going to be very disappointed.

Niese is a young building block with a long-term friendly contract. I'd move him in the right deal, but I highly doubt that right deal comes along.

I'd work out an extension with Dickey. It's difficult to assess his trade value, but I don't think he'd bring back as much as people think due to his age, impending free agency in 2014, and/or the knuckleball risk factor. You'd have to trust the general manager's judgment with this one since we aren't privy to the information he has in regards to what Dickey wants and what other teams are/would offer for Dickey.


Agree that the Mets can't go into next season keeping their options open with Wright. Either decide he's the rock you're going to build around, or move him.

With Dickey, maybe a team that thinks it's one starting pitcher away coughs up something significant. Same deal with Wright, I don't think the Mets can allow themselves to get fleeced. If that means they keep him until next season's trading deadline in the hope he's 10-4 or something like that and pitching well, and some team decides to go for it and give the Mets more than they will get in the offseason, so be it...but if someone offered them something solid in the offseason, I think the Mets have to listen.
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#800 nmigliore

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Posted 04 September 2012 - 10:01 PM

Not a great night but a pleasant site to see Jeurys Familia make his ML debut in relief just now with a scoreless inning.

With a good September I'm sure he'll be in the mix for a relief role next spring but I hope he goes back to AAA and continues to work as a starter. He really improved in the 2nd half and has fantastic stuff when he can find the plate.

Edited by nmigliore, 04 September 2012 - 10:04 PM.

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