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Official 2012 New York Mets Thread


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#1001 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 12:46 PM

His defense wasn't good but his bat was truly amazing. I wouldn't call him the best overall catcher of all-time -- that's Johnny Bench -- but he's certainly up there.


Agree, Bench was best all-around. Piazza's main weakness defensively was throwing, but he was pretty decent at everything else.
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THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#1002 NJDevs4978

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Posted 04 January 2013 - 04:05 PM

Craig Biggio's probably going to be the only guy that winds up getting in lol...it's kinda silly that Piazza would be held out because of rumors, but honestly anything that was too good to be true in those days (like being a skinny 61st round pick to a beast that became the best hitting catcher of all time), usually was too good to be true without additives.

I don't know if I'd hold any of these guys out. Maybe the outed steroid users I wouldn't have as first-ballot but it's not like the steroid hitters weren't hitting against steroid pitchers too, and it wasn't illegal then unfortunately.
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"The Devils have high standards, that's the difference. We have a standard to live up to every year, and a couple of teams in our area don't have the standards we do." - Pat Burns

The New Jersey Devils win Stanley Cups everywhere:
-NHL record for most road wins in the playoffs - 10-1 in '95 and 10-2 in '00
-NHL record for most home wins in the playoffs - 12-1 in '03

#1003 nmigliore

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 02:14 PM

Nobody is going to the Hall of Fame this summer. Nobody even reached 70% of the vote. :lol:

Piazza came in at 58%.
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- Jim Leyland

#1004 '7'

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Posted 09 January 2013 - 03:20 PM

The Hall of Fame is a joke anyway and too big a deal is made of it anyway. I mean come on...Albert Belle was one of the most lethal, dangerous hitters in baseball history and he isn't even eligible anymore. And never implicated with steroids from what I can remember.
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
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#1005 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 07:12 AM

The Hall of Fame is a joke anyway and too big a deal is made of it anyway. I mean come on...Albert Belle was one of the most lethal, dangerous hitters in baseball history and he isn't even eligible anymore. And never implicated with steroids from what I can remember.


He had a hip condition that forced him to retire early...if he had put in 2-3 more strong years (possibly approaching 500 HR), it would've been hard for the writers to deny him entry, regardless of what they thought of him as a person. One could argue that he deserves to get in based on short-term dominance, but the wittle baseball wannabe nerd writers don't like it when players don't talk to them or aren't nice to them. Eddie Murray got away with it because he hit the magic numbers (namely 500+ HRs), though a look at his stats show he was more of a steady compiler than a guy who dominated the game. The Hall of Fame is supposed to be based on one's on-field performance (preferably without performance-enhancing drugs), not how swell of a guy he was. By seemingly all accounts, Albert Belle was a very hard to guy to like, and the voters decided to hold that against him.

His injury made the writers' job that much easier...they won't admit it was Belle's surly attitude that kept him out...they'll tell you he fell short of a .300 batting average, 500 HRs...and they'll point to his poor fielding, though there's guys in the Hall not exactly known for having a Golden Glove.
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THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#1006 '7'

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Posted 10 January 2013 - 10:01 PM

This is shaping up to be a very painful 2013 for the Mets. They've essentially punted it away and have no desire to compete. Hopefully 2014 will be the year we make an effort. But this will be another transition season

No help for the bullpen. It will be agonizingly bad once again

The outfield is looking like the worst in baseball. Again no attempt to improve it. Bay is sort of addition by subtraction though.

The Dickey trade had to be made...so our catching position looks set for the forseeable future.

Who knows what we'll get out of Santana. But they'll likely trade him this year as well. I think he'll be pretty decent, as it is a contract year.

I am excited to see Wheeler eventually to come in and bolster the rotation. Hopefully Harvey is the real deal as well.

This team will win 65-68 games.
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
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#1007 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 07:08 AM

Agree, that the Mets punted away 2013, but the RA Dickey trade should've alerted you to that immediately...if the Mets had any designs on trying to squeak into the playoffs in 2013, they don't make that deal. Sandy won't admit as much, and I wouldn't expect him to.

I have them at about 70 wins. Who exactly is out there that the Mets should've gotten that's going to make them appreciably better for this season? Is there really that much a difference between 70 wins and 80 wins?

I know, in ways it sucks that the Mets are not going to be much of a factor, as far as being in any playoff races go, but here is what you are hoping for, in this transition year:

Harvey builds off last season.
Wheeler gets called up and at best does what Harvey did last season, and at worst at least gets some major league experience. Ditto Travis D'Arnaud
Wright doesn't turn in a full season as lousy as 2011 and the second half of 2012. If he turned in something like 2010 and was consistent, I think we'd all be OK with that going foward.
Ike Davis isn't hitting .158 as late as June 8, and becomes far more consistent than he was 2012. He was all over the place last season, but there were positive signs: though he hit just .228 for September, he had a .365 OB% for that month.
Gee stays healthy.
Parnell shows he's more than just a sabermetric curiosity, and can come into a big spot without Met fans being terrified of what's going to happen.
Daniel Murphy can start to increase his value at the plate, either by getting more hits or taking more walks. He's too average right now, especially with his iffy fielding (which probably isn't going to get any better) and lack of home run power.
Ditto Tejada, as far as OB% goes.

I don't care what Santana does, but if it's something good, the Mets should unload him the first chance they get.

I agree, the 2013 outfield is probably a lost cause. Duda gets one last shot at being an everyday-type because of his power.

2013 will go a long way towards answering some of these questions. The Mets are stuck with Wright if he's not good, but I think if enough good things happen in 2013 that point to the team having a shot in 2014, Sandy will be much more aggressive come next offseason, and will try to upgrade where appropriate. It means we'll likely have to suffer through another also-ran season, but I think good things are coming for the Mets, come 2014 and beyond. Just gotta be patient.

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976, 11 January 2013 - 09:54 AM.

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THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#1008 nmigliore

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 10:00 AM

Again, we've all known that, just by looking at the payroll situation, the post-2013 offseason would be the one where Sandy would truly get to remake the team. There's no payroll inflexibility to use as an excuse at that point. Although it would have been nice to see Sandy more active with the ML roster in the meantime, he's built up a good farm system, one that certainly ranks in the top half of baseball. If you look at Baseball Prospectus' Mets' Top 10 for 2013, outside of a few IFA prospects, they've all come from Sandy's regime:

1) Wheeler - Beltran trade, 2011
2) d'Arnaud - Dickey trade, 2012
3) Syndergaard - Dickey trade, 2012
4) Fulmer - Supplemental 1st round pick, 2011 draft
5) Flores - 2007 IFA (Omar regime)
6) Cecchini - 1st round pick, 2012 draft
7) Tapia - 2009 IFA (Omar regime)
8) Familia - 2007 IFA (Omar regime)
9) Nimmo - 1st round pick, 2011 draft
10) Montero - 2011 IFA (Sandy regime)

Edited by nmigliore, 11 January 2013 - 10:00 AM.

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- Jim Leyland

#1009 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 10:44 AM

Re: Sandy, he inherited a mess, just like Frank Cashen did. And just like Cashen, it's taking Sandy time (multiple seasons) to fix it all. Not saying Sandy will make the Mets a WS champion and a perrenial contender YET, but he's going about it the right way at least. The funny thing is, I think it was nmig who posted the free agent class for 2013, and from what I remember, it wasn't terribly good. So Sandy might be better off looking at trade options come the 2013 offseason.

Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976, 11 January 2013 - 10:44 AM.

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THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#1010 nmigliore

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 11:34 AM

There's some intriguing players but for the most part, yes, it's a weak class. That's why it's nice to have a good farm system though. Look at what the Blue Jays did this winter - they basically decimated the top of their farm system but flipped their roster from mediocre to quite possibly the best team in the AL in the process. Signing Melky Cabrera and Maicer Izturis were solid moves in free agency but their difference-making moves came via trade.

Edited by nmigliore, 11 January 2013 - 11:37 AM.

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LETS GO METS
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"Take all that clubhouse [expletive] and all that, throw it out the window. Every writer in the country has been writing about that [expletive] for years. Chemistry don't mean [expletive]."

- Jim Leyland

#1011 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 11 January 2013 - 11:42 AM

Clearly it's a different era, but Cashen nabbed several of the '86 Mets key players via trade. The only starting pitchers on that team that were drafted by the Mets were Dwight Gooden and Rick Aguilera. Hernandez and Carter both came in blockbuster-type deals. And I think Sandy will try to make some big deals come 2013, though it may meaning waving bye-bye to some prospects some fans will be sorry to see go.
  • 0
THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#1012 nmigliore

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Posted 21 January 2013 - 06:34 PM

Good article by John Dewan (The Fielding Bible), who tackles the myth that Piazza was some albatross behind the plate: http://www.billjames..._hall_of_fame_/


The most important part of a catcher’s job is handling his pitchers and in this area Piazza was superb. Here is one of the most telling statistics. In his career behind the plate, pitchers had a 3.80 ERA when Piazza was catching. If you look at all the other catchers who caught the same pitchers in the same year that Piazza did, they allowed a 4.34 ERA. That’s a major difference, much more important than a few extra bases stolen. (In fact, Piazza’s catcher ERA of 3.81 includes the run value of any extra stolen bases he allowed.)

Craig Wright wrote an excellent article in The Hardball Times Baseball Annual 2009 calledPiazza, Hall of Fame Catcher. He did a detailed sabermetric study that showed that hitters had a .723 OPS with Piazza behind the plate and a .748 OPS with other catchers. This 25-point differential is highly significant. In further studies that we did in The Fielding Bible—Volume II, we found that Piazza saved at least 20 to 70 runs more than an average catcher defensively, depending on the technique that we used.


Edited by nmigliore, 21 January 2013 - 06:35 PM.

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LETS GO METS
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"Take all that clubhouse [expletive] and all that, throw it out the window. Every writer in the country has been writing about that [expletive] for years. Chemistry don't mean [expletive]."

- Jim Leyland

#1013 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 07:28 AM

I said it in an earlier post...the only real deficiency I remember in Piazza's game was throwing to second. He was pretty good at everything else...enough so that I thought he didn't get enough credit for his defense.

BTW, Mets re-sign Pedro Feliciano. A treading water move for a club that is clearly treading water in 2013. Whatever...it's all about 2014 and beyond.
  • 0
THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#1014 nmigliore

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 09:38 AM

BTW, Mets re-sign Pedro Feliciano. A treading water move for a club that is clearly treading water in 2013. Whatever...it's all about 2014 and beyond.


I like the signing mostly for the nostalgia behind it; I'm sure I've cursed him a few times through the years but he was always so durable and dependable at getting lefties out. After I heard of the signing, I looked up the numbers yesterday; I knew Pedro was a fantastic LOOGY but I never realize just how dominant he was - from 2006-2010, he quite literally was a top 3 reliever when matched up against left-handed hitters: 3rd in ERA, 2nd in FIP, 2nd in wOBA against. The common pair of relievers who outpaced him were Papelbon and Mariano Rivera.

Of course, I have absolutely no expectation of him returning to that form since he's a few years older and has been on the DL the last 2 seasons with a bum shoulder, but it would be nice to see him healthy enough to crack the Opening Day roster. He did pitch a little bit in the PWL this winter.

Edited by nmigliore, 22 January 2013 - 09:52 AM.

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"Take all that clubhouse [expletive] and all that, throw it out the window. Every writer in the country has been writing about that [expletive] for years. Chemistry don't mean [expletive]."

- Jim Leyland

#1015 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 22 January 2013 - 10:19 AM

Feliciano was pretty good. It's a "what the hell, why not?" move, low risk with some upside. This is a 70-win team more than likely...what do they have to lose?
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THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#1016 '7'

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 09:26 AM

Mets signed Shaun Marcum.

Not a bad pitcher. Has had a solid ERA the past 4 seasons. Also probably a good chance he gets dealt at the deadline...but not impossible he figures in the 2014 plans as a 4th starter either

Also, Hairston to the Cubs
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
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#1017 nmigliore

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 10:13 AM

This is a fantastic signing, Marcum was one of the top starters left on the market. He's had elbow problems in the past: Tommy John surgery in 2009 and a sore elbow limited him to just 120 innings last year, but he did finish the season healthy and he did throw nearly 400 above average innings between 2010-2011. Hopefully he pitches healthy and well enough to be an attractive trade piece at the deadline.

Edited by nmigliore, 24 January 2013 - 10:21 AM.

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LETS GO METS
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"Take all that clubhouse [expletive] and all that, throw it out the window. Every writer in the country has been writing about that [expletive] for years. Chemistry don't mean [expletive]."

- Jim Leyland

#1018 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 01:31 PM

Hard not to like this one. Like nmig notes, if he pitches well, he might fetch something back, like a mid-level prospect. If he doesn't, some team desperate for starting pitching at the deadline might take a shot at him anyway (though they won't give up much). If he sucks, he's only here for a year. So maybe now the Mets win 72 games instead of 70 if he works out. But the Mets get somebody who has a pretty good shot to at least turn in a winning record and some QSs while he's here. Good upside and not too much downside.
  • 0
THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#1019 Devils Pride 26

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 01:33 PM

Good value move by Sandy
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#1020 '7'

'7'

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Posted 26 January 2013 - 08:22 PM

Mets are supposedly still interested in Oswalt...and still sort of middling around with Michael Bourn.
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^7^ is just defending his sport sheeps.. as Alcibiades the exiled Athenian rationalizes in his speech to the enemy Spartans, he wants to take revenge on Athens because he loves it and can't stand to see the state it's in now - Triumph
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