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DeBoer and Torts Should Be Fined


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#61 Parisalchuk

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 12:48 PM

Don't have the link because I'm on my phone but torts response to deboer's post game comments is quite funny. Said deboer should shut up and that he was disrespectful. At first I was kind of mad about deboer starting the fourth line but then I realized torts did the same thing at the rock. No reason to get all pissy about it.
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#62 95Crash

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 01:10 PM

Don't have the link because I'm on my phone but torts response to deboer's post game comments is quite funny. Said deboer should shut up and that he was disrespectful. At first I was kind of mad about deboer starting the fourth line but then I realized torts did the same thing at the rock. No reason to get all pissy about it.

That's the first I hear about this. Most of the articles in today's papers have Tortorella saying he doesn't comment on how other people run their teams.

When it originally happened, I was liking how it pissed him off. Part of me thinks that one way to get that team sidetracked is to get him flying off the wall. The more heated he gets, the better. Of course, it didn't work yesterday, but maybe it would in a seven-game series.
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#63 McMullen82

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 01:15 PM

looks like there is an article on Newsday about Tortorella telling Deboer to "shut up". Of course...with Newsday you need a description

My link

Edited by McMullen82, 20 March 2012 - 01:15 PM.

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#64 McMullen82

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 01:19 PM

actually...better yet, here's some more comments from Tortorella...

My link
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#65 Joe B

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 01:24 PM

"That crap at the beginning of the game, to try and manipuate it into it. I just don't think it's right for the game." tort's from that link

So Pete manipulated the lineup? I didn't see a D start at center for NJ.
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#66 95Crash

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 01:26 PM

actually...better yet, here's some more comments from Tortorella...

My link


Following the contest DeBoer was quoted as saying, "I guess in John's world you can come into our building and start your tough guys, but we can't do the same here...He's either got short-term memory loss or he's a hypocrite." On Tuesday, following practice, Tortorella responded to DeBoer's comments.


"I think Peter needs to jog his memory as far as starting lineups I have put in over in his building, and really, basically, just shut up," said Tortorella. "And I need to, also. I think the situation last night is disrespectful to the players, and I think we took a backwards step. I get put in a position, when he puts a lineup like that out, and I don't know what's going to happen if I put my top players out, so I have to answer the way I think I need to answer. Really, just look at the two lineups and some of the things he has done here. I don't want to coach his team, but just shut up."


In the three meetings between these two teams at The Prudential Center this season, Tortorella started three different line combinations---Anisimov-Stepan-Gaborik most recently on March 6th, Dubinsky-Richards-Callahan on January 31st, and Fedotenko-Rupp-Prust on December 20th. The visiting coach must always submit his starting lineup first.


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#67 DaneykoIsGod

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 01:41 PM

Funny how Torts is one of the most outspoken coaches in the NHL, and half of what comes out of his gigantic mouth is telling other coaches they need to shut up.

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#68 NJDevs4978

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 01:46 PM

Like someone pointed out elsewhere, this is the same coach that sent his goons out at the end of Game 5 in 2007. Utter hypocrisy.
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#69 Mayday

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 01:49 PM

Wow, this has been blown out or proportion by everyone.
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#70 njdevsftw

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 01:52 PM

The way to police the game is through sanctions towards the players during and after the games. Harder penalties for dangerous plays, more 4-5 minute penalties perhaps. While also being kicked out for the rest of the game, and if deemed fit banned for X amount of more games. (Possibly some kind of correlation between injuries incurred with duration of ban.) Most importantly, bans and FINES need to be put in place immediately after nasty incidents following post game video reviews. The need to increase the size of the fines considerably, so that it actually HURTS THE WALLET to play like a dick. Ideally fines should be based on a % on the players salary instead of the current ridiculous $2500 pocket money stuff. IE, "X player is fined 2 weeks salary".

EDIT: http://www.vg.no/spo...?artid=10079529

That's a link from Norways biggest newspaper (both paper and online) today. They *very* rarely cover any NHL at all. It illustrates the enormous problem hockey has with unecessary fighting. It will continue to be a second rate sports as long as this type of behaviour is encouraged.

Edited by njdevsftw, 20 March 2012 - 02:15 PM.

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#71 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 02:25 PM

The way to police the game is through sanctions towards the players during and after the games. Harder penalties for dangerous plays, more 4-5 minute penalties perhaps. While also being kicked out for the rest of the game, and if deemed fit banned for X amount of more games. (Possibly some kind of correlation between injuries incurred with duration of ban.) Most importantly, bans and FINES need to be put in place immediately after nasty incidents following post game video reviews. The need to increase the size of the fines considerably, so that it actually HURTS THE WALLET to play like a dick. Ideally fines should be based on a % on the players salary instead of the current ridiculous $2500 pocket money stuff. IE, "X player is fined 2 weeks salary".

EDIT: http://www.vg.no/spo...?artid=10079529

That's a link from Norways biggest newspaper (both paper and online) today. They *very* rarely cover any NHL at all. It illustrates the enormous problem hockey has with unecessary fighting. It will continue to be a second rate sports as long as this type of behaviour is encouraged.


If you really think players are thinking "I shouldn't do this because it will cost me money or a suspension" before they do something, I really don't know what to tell you. Players do a lot of things in the heat of the moment. There's a reason fighting has been around for as long as the sport has been.

As for saying too much fighting makes it a second rate sport, the number of fights a season has been dropping for a long time. It's not like it's some sort of epidemic. Additionally, one of the first things a casual fan asks about is the fighting. It's very unique and intriguing to an outsider.

Edited by Devil Dan 56, 20 March 2012 - 02:26 PM.

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#72 njdevsftw

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 02:37 PM

As for saying too much fighting makes it a second rate sport, the number of fights a season has been dropping for a long time. It's not like it's some sort of epidemic. Additionally, one of the first things a casual fan asks about is the fighting. It's very unique and intriguing to an outsider.


I assume the NHL has done some market research on the issue. Guessing that's one of the reasons they want it gone. I can safely say that the fighting and the bad rep it has given hockey is the main reason it is not taken seriously as a 'big sport' on this side of the pond. Womens handball (not joking) gets a TON more media coverage here then hockey. I have plenty of soccer fan friends who dismiss hockey outright as "silly fighting".

Edit: And yes, if a player risks being sidelined for the duration of the injury he causes another player while additionally getting fined 2 months salary, I do believe you will see the end of dangerous plays real soon.

Edited by njdevsftw, 20 March 2012 - 02:40 PM.

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#73 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 02:52 PM

I assume the NHL has done some market research on the issue. Guessing that's one of the reasons they want it gone. I can safely say that the fighting and the bad rep it has given hockey is the main reason it is not taken seriously as a 'big sport' on this side of the pond. Womens handball (not joking) gets a TON more media coverage here then hockey. I have plenty of soccer fan friends who dismiss hockey outright as "silly fighting".

Edit: And yes, if a player risks being sidelined for the duration of the injury he causes another player while additionally getting fined 2 months salary, I do believe you will see the end of dangerous plays real soon.


And soccer can easily be dismissed outright for the ridiculous (and sometimes constant) diving and 'ow my leg is broken but now I'm ok' theatrics. That's part of the sport, though, and it's fans accept it. Same for fighting in hockey.

As for tying injury duration to suspension duration, that is an absolutely terrible idea. Bad hits aren't always intentional. That's way too black-and-white of a solution. It's bad enough that someone gets injured on a bad play, but then you're going to make the guy who admittedly hit someone too high, for example, sit out? Hedman would have missed an entire year for hitting Crosby into the boards last January if it was deemed he targeted the head.
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#74 sundstrom

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 03:18 PM

weird TG tweet regarding no damage to visitors lockerroom @ MSG. did someone say there was?
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#75 95Crash

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 03:20 PM

weird TG tweet regarding no damage to visitors lockerroom @ MSG. did someone say there was?

I think I read a line about it in the Daily News.
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#76 SMantzas

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 03:22 PM

Torterella strikes back. From tg

"I read it,” Tortorella said of DeBoer’s comment. “I think Peter needs to job his memory as far as the starting lineups that I’ve put in over in their building and really, basically, just shut up. And I need to also. I think the situation last night is disrespectful to players and I think we took a backwards step. I get put in a position when he puts a lineup like that out - and I’m not sure what’s going to happen if I put my top players out - so I have to answer the way I need to answer. Really, just look at the two lineups and some of the things he’s done through the games here, again, I don’t want to coach his team, but just shut up.
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#77 njdevsftw

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 03:23 PM

And soccer can easily be dismissed outright for the ridiculous (and sometimes constant) diving and 'ow my leg is broken but now I'm ok' theatrics. That's part of the sport, though, and it's fans accept it. Same for fighting in hockey.

As for tying injury duration to suspension duration, that is an absolutely terrible idea. Bad hits aren't always intentional. That's way too black-and-white of a solution. It's bad enough that someone gets injured on a bad play, but then you're going to make the guy who admittedly hit someone too high, for example, sit out? Hedman would have missed an entire year for hitting Crosby into the boards last January if it was deemed he targeted the head.


Soccer, and it's occasional ridiculous theatrics, has a completely dominant position on the global sports market. A position hockey can never even dream to achieve. (There are similar debates in soccer as well because of various incarnations of 'unsportsmanlike conduct', but that is besides the point as it's occasional theatrics are unlikely to hinder the sports commercial success.)

If you want hockey to grow as a sport, you need to realize that the fighting is standing in the way of making hockey more mainstream.
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#78 95Crash

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 03:25 PM

Here's that line in the Daily News

The frustrated Devils even left one of the locker stalls in the visiting team room damaged following the emotional contest.

Link

Edited by 95Crash, 20 March 2012 - 03:26 PM.

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#79 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 03:33 PM

Soccer, and it's occasional ridiculous theatrics, has a completely dominant position on the global sports market. A position hockey can never even dream to achieve. (There are similar debates in soccer as well because of various incarnations of 'unsportsmanlike conduct', but that is besides the point as it's occasional theatrics are unlikely to hinder the sports commercial success.)

If you want hockey to grow as a sport, you need to realize that the fighting is standing in the way of making hockey more mainstream.


People I know who don't watch soccer will say it's from the diving and perceived "wimpiness" diving gives it. It has a dominant position in global sports for one very very simple reason. It's the easiest sport to get together with people and play. All you need is a ball. Everyone can play it and therefore relate to it and it can be played in any climate. Rich people can play it, people in third world nations can play it. There's plenty of stories of how US Troops bond with Iraqis over soccer. It's a universally understood and appreciated sport.

Not a whole lot of people grow up with the ability to go out on a pond and play hockey, and most people who don't watch it mention their inability to follow the puck and the confusing rules as the reason, and not fighting. Hockey will probably always be a niche sport.

Hell, things that go on in soccer stands are way more violent than anything we'll see in most hockey games.

Edited by Devil Dan 56, 20 March 2012 - 03:35 PM.

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#80 Steven M.

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Posted 20 March 2012 - 03:39 PM

If you really think players are thinking "I shouldn't do this because it will cost me money or a suspension" before they do something, I really don't know what to tell you. Players do a lot of things in the heat of the moment. There's a reason fighting has been around for as long as the sport has been.

As for saying too much fighting makes it a second rate sport, the number of fights a season has been dropping for a long time. It's not like it's some sort of epidemic. Additionally, one of the first things a casual fan asks about is the fighting. It's very unique and intriguing to an outsider.


Exactly! Especially in a match like NJ vs. NY. It almost makes it easier to get the person interested in the game. Now, I have a girl that pretty much hangs with me 24/7 so she is exposed to Devils hockey all the time, but that does not necessarily mean shes actually watching the entire thing. We sit down to watch Devils v. Rangers, and I try to explain how much this game will effect my emotional well being (because even both FANBASES hate each other!) and it's kinda like, "ok, well I believe you but let's see this" kinda thought process.

We sit down for puck drop, and next thing you know we have an all out brawl. Immediately sucks in casual fans like herself into the game. She's huge into college football (bama fan) and all she can say is, "Holy sh!t. They really do hate each other, it's like the Auburn versus Alabama of hockey. That was awesome."

Fights are beneficial in different ways. Now do I agree with it happening at the start of every game? No... but sometimes it's justified. I like the way DiG put it... it's more than just the start of a game. It's the continuation of a brutal and hate filled saga (season series) coming to a climax (as far as the regular season goes anyway.) I thought it was exciting.

edit: I'd like to add that I don't believe that fighting is "stopping" hockey from going mainstream. Where do we gather that information from? Seriously? Hockey will never go mainstream completely in the U.S. because of the fact that a lot of people can't relate to it. When you've got every single Euro country and Russia making up the huge percentile of players on teams rosters, people have trouble relating to them in the U.S. With a sport like football or basketball you've got every single state in the union, kids grow up playing football, baseball, and basketball. The predominant players in those leagues are normally American (maybe not so much Baseball anymore, lol). There is ease of access to these sports. The equipment doesn't cost as much. Yada yada yada I know I'm going off on a tangent but you get my point.

Hockey has been making strides in the United States but it will never get on the same level as other sports as far as popularity or media coverage and frankly I think fighting has absolutely nothing to do with it.

Edited by DevilsFanSteve30, 20 March 2012 - 03:51 PM.

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