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Sale of Phoenix may finally be here


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#41 DevilMinder

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 11:34 AM

Do the players get a cut of the expansion fees? I can't recall
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#42 Triumph

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 11:35 AM

Do the players get a cut of the expansion fees? I can't recall


No. But if the NHL expands to big markets, the players will see an increase in the salary cap.
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#43 DH26

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Posted 01 February 2013 - 12:33 PM

If the Coyotes relocate, I think it will be to Seattle. The expansion teams, with higher price tags, will be reserved for Toronto and Quebec.


Key Arena's apparently only ready for 10-11K seats for hockey so they might wait on that so Quebec seems to be the only one w/ an arena assuming the Colisee is good enough

Seattle Not ready for relocation
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#44 thefiestygoat

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 09:40 PM

Warning: Bumping this thread to post my own speculation because I'm bored.

 

Right now things appear fairly quiet out of Glendale and QC. Bill Daly (NHL deputy comish) denied Quebecor Inc. has begun negotiations for the Coyotes. This came after well connected journalist and employee of Quebecor, Réjean Tremblay, told a local sports radio station this news. Quebecor has also denied the report here and offered no comment here. As we all remember the NHL kept the Thrashers/Jets news quiet for as long as possible and the Winnipeg ownership group kept quiet for years leading up to it, despite talks with the NHL. I suspect that is what is going on right now. A look back at the Thrashers/Jets saga:

 

May  16 - Atlanta Journal-Constitution report talks for a sale to True North Sports and Entertainment underway.
May 19 - Globe and Mail report deal finalized to relocate.
May 31 - TNSE and NHL announce deal.

 

The newspaper reports came out during the Conference Finals and the deal was announced before the start of the SCF. The playoffs are running behind that schedule this year because of the late start with the lockout so we should be on the cusp of this period if relocation to QC was to happen.

 

I'm kind of rambling but here are the similarities I see going on between the Thrashers/Jets and Coyotes/QC situations:

1) Both sides are denying and/or no commenting on it.

2) A star journalist with ties to the relocating ownership group are leaking news. (Stephen Brunt reported the Jets deal for the Globe and Mail - owned by David Thomson of True North Sports....Réjean Tremblay reporting negotations underway and he is an employee of Quebecor Inc. who are trying to buy the Coyotes).

3) The time frame of when news started to come out and the deal was negotiated and signed was in mid-May to late-May in 2011, during the Conference Finals. We're about to get to that point in about a week and with the late start, a similar time frame would be late-May to early-June - just as long as it won't interfere with the late starting SCF.

 

I could be looking into all of this way too much and maybe the NHL will hold onto the team for another year. I wouldn't be shocked either way. Right now the NHL rejected Darin Pastor's bid for Phoenix Coyotes, Greg Jamison is appearantly trying to jump back into the mix but seems like a longshot, and the only other local group out there is led by George Gosbee and Anthony LeBlanc but I'm not sure how serious of players they are - they will have a ton of work to do with a relucatant City of Glendale mayor/council. Seems like a great oppurtunity for the NHL to rid itself of a headache and bring in some $$$ into the league between relocation fees and revenue by QC.


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#45 Colin226

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 10:03 PM

Can't see it before next season since they went through the trouble of realigning the league and this would nix that.. I'm not even sure how they would do another realignment without moving someone from the eastern time zone to the western conference
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#46 thefiestygoat

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 12:10 AM

Can't see it before next season since they went through the trouble of realigning the league and this would nix that.. I'm not even sure how they would do another realignment without moving someone from the eastern time zone to the western conference

I wouldn't be surprised if the league had a contingency plan for realignment and scheduling. The NHL did include both Winnipeg and Atlanta in their schedule drafts back in May 2011. If I had to give my gut feeling I'd say it's 55/45 the team ends up in QC.  Bettman seems hellbent on keeping a team in Glendale for some reason but at some point somethings gotta give.


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#47 MadDog2020

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 01:44 PM

Can't see it before next season since they went through the trouble of realigning the league and this would nix that.. I'm not even sure how they would do another realignment without moving someone from the eastern time zone to the western conference
I wouldn't be surprised if the league had a contingency plan for realignment and scheduling. The NHL did include both Winnipeg and Atlanta in their schedule drafts back in May 2011. If I had to give my gut feeling I'd say it's 55/45 the team ends up in QC. Bettman seems hellbent on keeping a team in Glendale for some reason but at some point somethings gotta give.

The reason Bettman and the NHL want the team to stay in Glendale is because they don't want a relatively brand new building to be empty. It sets kind of a dangerous precedent for the league to have that kind of a situation, which is why Bettman has bent over backwards to find a local buyer/buyers to keep the team in Arizona. I would imagine if the franchise moves to QC, that maybe they would move Colorado to the Pacific to take the place of the Coyotes, but I have no idea what you do on the East side, seeing as how QC would slot into the Northeast Division with the Northeastern US teams and eastern Canadian teams (along with the Florida teams). They'd have to do some re-shuffling.

Edited by MadDog2020, 24 May 2013 - 03:28 PM.

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#48 thefiestygoat

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Posted 25 May 2013 - 01:14 AM

A couple of new developments...

 

- Quebecor has acquired Gestev, a "dynamic sporting and cultural event management company." Essentially to to manage the logistics of the old and new arena on a day to day basis.

 

- As expected, the Colisee will be ready to host NHL hockey if need be by next fall.

 

- Don Maloney signs a long term extension as Coyotes GM. While at first that may appear pro Phoenix news, keep in mind that GM Rick Dudley had signed a 4 year extension with the Thrashers about 3 months prior to the relocation to Winnipeg.

 

Big meeting and press conference on Tuesday?...

AZ Central

Two weeks ago, Weiers told Bettman not to ask for a meeting until the ownership picture was set.

“If he’s doing what I asked him to do, which is to not bring us anything unless he had it 100 percent ready to go, if he thinks they’re ready to go, we’ll see what they’ve got to propose,” Weiers told The Arizona Republic.
----
Sherwood said he believes any potential owners will want to be paid substantially more than $6 million a year, which is the figure that’s been earmarked in numerous proposed city budgets for the arena management fee.

Similarly, in February, just after the last proposed purchase agreement for the Coyotes fell apart, LeBlanc told the Republic that his interest in acquiring the team was contingent upon an arena management deal that was similar to the $15 million-a-year offer the council approved last year.

The $15-million-a-year offer expired when former San Jose Sharks CEO Greg Jamison missed a city-imposed deadline to purchase the Coyotes from the NHL by Jan. 31.

Since then, four of seven members of the Glendale council have been replaced and the new line-up has struggled to balance the city’s budget. Glendale has implemented cutbacks in municipal services, pay freezes and staff reductions in virtually every department to help balance the books.

For now, Glendale finance officials are comfortable with the $6 million-a-year figure, said interim City Manager Dick Bowers.
 

2 things to consider:
1. If the owner wants $13M-$15M to manage the arena and the city can only give $6M, that is a pretty large $7M-$8M gap for a city in financial trouble.

2. Have to imagine if they do somehow find a way to go above $6M, then the Goldwater Institute would fight the deal again.

 

A week old but relevant info...

Fox Sports Arizona
- NHL wants the sale of the team financed in a 3-5 year window. That is why Pastor's offer was rejected because he wanted 15 years to finance it.

- The only serious local group is Renaissance Sports and Entertainment led by George Gosbee and Anthony LeBlanc. Their lawyers have been meeting with the NHL for some time now.


Edited by thefiestygoat, 25 May 2013 - 01:14 AM.

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#49 Triumph

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Posted 25 May 2013 - 08:19 AM

The scuttlebutt among Phoenix papers is that Renaissance Sports and Entertainment will be presented as the buyer on Tuesday.


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#50 Triumph

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Posted 25 May 2013 - 08:43 AM

If it wasn't a Quebec-based source who is reporting that some Quebecois might buy the team, I would think the stories about Quebec are NHL plants to scare up more money from Glendale.  I think this is the last chance for any buyer to keep the team local, because the NHL owners can't like losing money on this team year after year.  Dreger is reporting that Renaissance are the buyers but there's lots of hurdles, so it's the old story again - unless Glendale bankrupts itself to keep the team in town, they'll leave.


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#51 MadDog2020

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Posted 25 May 2013 - 10:05 AM


If it wasn't a Quebec-based source who is reporting that some Quebecois might buy the team, I would think the stories about Quebec are NHL plants to scare up more money from Glendale. I think this is the last chance for any buyer to keep the team local, because the NHL owners can't like losing money on this team year after year. Dreger is reporting that Renaissance are the buyers but there's lots of hurdles, so it's the old story again - unless Glendale bankrupts itself to keep the team in town, they'll leave.

Basically, it sounds like it will come down to this: on Tuesday, the new owners will ask for around $15 mil to operate the arena. Glendale will offer 6. At that point, the hockey ops staff and the players should start brushing up on their French.

Edited by MadDog2020, 25 May 2013 - 10:07 AM.

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#52 thefiestygoat

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Posted 25 May 2013 - 04:19 PM

I agree that this is most likely the end of the road in this saga one way or the other. The way I see this playing out is the RSE announcement to buy the team on Tuesday to make the NHL look like the good guys who once again are stepping up to keep the team there. Then the ball will be in the City of Glendale's hands who will only offer to pay an AMF of $6M/yr. Then RSE demands the rumored $13-15M/yr which the city won't be able to meet. The NHL will then sell to Quebecor and make it look like Glendale was the bad guys in all of this. It's a nice clean break for the league.


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#53 thefiestygoat

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Posted 26 May 2013 - 12:05 AM

Taking away some info from a google translation of this article:

 

Potential Key Dates

Tuesday - NHL/CoG/RSE officials meet in multiple meetings throughout the day to see how viable a deal would be.

May 31 - Apparently the drop dead date to decide to relocate a team for the NHL is by the end of this day. I'm not 100% positive on that though.

June 11 - Rumored day that the CoG would vote on the new deal with RSE. However this could be too late for the NHL. Some speculation that this is their way of trying to save face and shift blame back to the NHL or force the NHL into owning the team for another year if they can't reach a deal with RSE on the AMF.

 

Also, apparently the CoG may be able to go up to $8M/yr on the AMF which is still far away from what RSE wants...though we'll see if they negotiate down to meet in the middle.


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#54 thefiestygoat

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Posted 30 May 2013 - 08:03 PM

Some hard numbers on the RSE deal have been leaked and as expected it is a very friendly deal towards RSE. Source: Forbes

 

A source close to the negotiations, who traded candor for anonymity, revealed the purchase price as $170 million. The capital structure would consist of RS&E putting in $45 million of equity, Fortress Investment Group lending $120 million (to be repaid by the fee Glendale taxpayers are going to pay the team to run the arena), and an $85 million loan from the NHL.

The $80 million the total capital investment ($250 million) exceeds the enterprise value of the purchase ($170 million) will be used as working capital. In other words, no capital calls even if the team loses a lot of money over the next few years. In addition, the NHL is promising the new owners that they will get the maximum amount of revenue from the league’s revenue-sharing system.

The NHL, which bought the Coyotes out of bankruptcy for $140 million in 2009, is being very flexible with its repayment terms for the new owners. As a result, the new owners would not have to pay any money back to the league for the first five years. And Fortress has something akin to warrants that will allow the hedge fund to swap its loan for equity that could ultimately give the firm a 20% equity stake in the hockey team.

So RSE would only have to put $45M down, not have to worry about the NHL loan for 5 years (at assumed little to no interest), and the taxpayers would be on hook for $120M towards FIG which is supposed to be paid back through the AMF that RSE wants to run the arena...However, Glendale is still accepting 3rd party bids for the arena management thru tomorrow and all reports say that they are still far apart on an AMF with RSE. If this does go through, it's a sweetheart deal for RSE, if not, it's a way for the NHL to say they tried yet again and save face by pinning blame on Glendale.

 

Adjusting the Thrashers timeline for this pushed back season, I'd have to imagine any relocation announcement would come inbetween June 12-15 (conference finals end-SCF begins). Also note that Chris Hansen of the Seattle Arena group recently talked about getting a NHL team there first to pave way for the NBA to return:

 

https://twitter.com/...614269677109248

"Hansen also says new #Seattlearena could be 'shovel ready' this time next year..."

 

https://twitter.com/...614607415050240

"It is only 'shovel ready' so-to-speak, after enviro review, and with a team acquisition. Expansion or otherwise. #SeattleArena"

 

https://twitter.com/...614865834528768

"Hansen also cracked door open for NHL first, but acknowledged it would take some changes to the MOU, & help from NHL owner. #SeattleArena"

 

Some speculate that the NHL would be willing to own the Coyotes one more year if CoG and RSE don't reach a deal and then relocate to Seattle since it's an attractive market and wouldn't screw up realignment. Seems like if Quebec is ever going to get the Coyotes it's now or never.


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#55 thefiestygoat

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 08:34 PM

I'm going to continue to speculate we're getting to the end of this saga. Today Bettman and Daly spoke on the Coyotes and I found their quotes to suggest that a deal between Glendale and RSE is unlikely and relocation could come soon. 

 

TSN

 

"It's been a complicated process," Bettman said Wednesday before Game 1 of the Stanley Cup final. "We, in our minds, understand that we're dealing with a time frame, but a specific day isn't going to do it. But time is getting short and this is really going to be a decision that the city of Glendale is going to have to make."

 
Daly said the 2013-14 schedule will be released a bit later than usual in part because of the uncertainty surrounding the Coyotes.
 
"It certainly means that it's possible that the team won't play there next year," Daly said. "We're in the short strokes in Phoenix now."
 
"No matter how this plays out, I don't think anybody can accuse us of kind of (taking) a grass-is-greener approach to this," Daly said. "We've been committed to this market; we've done everything humanly possible to make this franchise work in this market, and now's the time we're going to find out whether that works."
 
Bettman and Daly put the pressure on the Glendale city council, even when not revealing any hard deadlines. That city council meets June 25 and the board of governors convenes June 27.
 
Asked if there must be a decision in place by that June 27 meeting, Bettman said "maybe." In that time, he said, "stuff is going to happen," and there could be a resolution before then.

 

Some Key Dates

June 14 - Glendale to finalize budget which will tell us how much they will pay towards an arena management fee.

June 25 - Glendale and RSE need to reach agreement by this council meeting.
June 26 - SCF Game 7
June 27 - NHL Board of Governors meeting.
 
I believe last night was the last time Glendale could amend the proposed budget before the vote Friday and in that they only allocated around $6M to the arena management fee which is nowhere close to what RSE wants. Also keep in mind they have 4 other bids from companies willing to manage the arena for less than what RSE wants and city officials wouldn't meet with the RSE people yesterday despite a request from RSE. I'd be surprised if the team stays there at this point. 
 
TSN/RDS keep suggesting Seattle but I think that's just them acting as mouth pieces for the NHL to take away from all the movement that's been quietly happening in Quebec. Quebec is really the only option that is ready and it won't take them as long as Winnipeg did to get ready, hence why relocation is viable this late.

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#56 MadDog2020

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 09:36 PM

I'm going to continue to speculate we're getting to the end of this saga. Today Bettman and Daly spoke on the Coyotes and I found their quotes to suggest that a deal between Glendale and RSE is unlikely and relocation could come soon. 
 
TSN

 
"It's been a complicated process," Bettman said Wednesday before Game 1 of the Stanley Cup final. "We, in our minds, understand that we're dealing with a time frame, but a specific day isn't going to do it. But time is getting short and this is really going to be a decision that the city of Glendale is going to have to make."
 
Daly said the 2013-14 schedule will be released a bit later than usual in part because of the uncertainty surrounding the Coyotes.
 
"It certainly means that it's possible that the team won't play there next year," Daly said. "We're in the short strokes in Phoenix now."
 
"No matter how this plays out, I don't think anybody can accuse us of kind of (taking) a grass-is-greener approach to this," Daly said. "We've been committed to this market; we've done everything humanly possible to make this franchise work in this market, and now's the time we're going to find out whether that works."
 
Bettman and Daly put the pressure on the Glendale city council, even when not revealing any hard deadlines. That city council meets June 25 and the board of governors convenes June 27.
 
Asked if there must be a decision in place by that June 27 meeting, Bettman said "maybe." In that time, he said, "stuff is going to happen," and there could be a resolution before then.

 
Some Key Dates
June 14 - Glendale to finalize budget which will tell us how much they will pay towards an arena management fee.
June 25 - Glendale and RSE need to reach agreement by this council meeting.
June 26 - SCF Game 7
June 27 - NHL Board of Governors meeting.
 
I believe last night was the last time Glendale could amend the proposed budget before the vote Friday and in that they only allocated around $6M to the arena management fee which is nowhere close to what RSE wants. Also keep in mind they have 4 other bids from companies willing to manage the arena for less than what RSE wants and city officials wouldn't meet with the RSE people yesterday despite a request from RSE. I'd be surprised if the team stays there at this point. 
 
TSN/RDS keep suggesting Seattle but I think that's just them acting as mouth pieces for the NHL to take away from all the movement that's been quietly happening in Quebec. Quebec is really the only option that is ready and it won't take them as long as Winnipeg did to get ready, hence why relocation is viable this late.

Yeah, it sounds like they're outta there. I agree that it will likely be Quebec, but again, that fvcks with realignment, so it'll be interesting to see what they do with regards to that if it is Quebec.
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#57 CarterforPresident

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 10:18 PM

Oklahoma city guys? Big basketball fan base
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#58 thefiestygoat

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 12:38 AM

Yeah, it sounds like they're outta there. I agree that it will likely be Quebec, but again, that fvcks with realignment, so it'll be interesting to see what they do with regards to that if it is Quebec.

I still can't wrap my head around why Seattle would be mentioned at this moment in time, even though it'd be better for realignment purposes. Screams of a diversion tactic to keep Quebec news from leaking out before the league wants it to. But who does the league think they are fooling when it breaks down like this:

Quebec
- Temporary arena that is being renovated to NHL standards
- New NHL caliber arena that is already under construction
- Ownership in place
- Hockey and business management in place
 
Seattle 
- No suitable temporary arena
- Need to change Memoriam of Understanding to get new arena built for hockey before basketball
- Need to find ownership group
- No hockey or business management in place
 

 

Oklahoma city guys? Big basketball fan base

I've never thought about that before so I did a quick search. The Chesapeake Energy Arena in OKC used to host a Central Hockey League team, though I have no idea what the capacity was and if there would even be a market for it. If the NHL is to go anywhere in the middle of the country down the road, I'd guess Kansas City since the Sprint Center seats 17,544 for hockey and its only a few years old. However the arena is managed by the Anschutz Entertainment Group which owns the LA Kings so I'm not sure if that would represent some sort of issue. Still I think Quebec and Seattle are more enticing to the league at this moment in time.


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#59 Vic Rattlehead18

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 06:51 AM

 

 

 

I've never thought about that before so I did a quick search. The Chesapeake Energy Arena in OKC used to host a Central Hockey League team, though I have no idea what the capacity was and if there would even be a market for it. If the NHL is to go anywhere in the middle of the country down the road, I'd guess Kansas City since the Sprint Center seats 17,544 for hockey and its only a few years old. However the arena is managed by the Anschutz Entertainment Group which owns the LA Kings so I'm not sure if that would represent some sort of issue. Still I think Quebec and Seattle are more enticing to the league at this moment in time.

 

I've never thought of Oklahoma City either. Maybe we could toss that into the list of future possible destinations :) But from what I've heard Kansas City is the most NHL ready arena and has been since it was built. But would there even be a following there? Quebec is really the only ideal destination since the fans there are ready to cheer. The NHL would probably have to cancel the realignment and just swap quebec with Winnipeg and tinker with the teams in the divisions.


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#60 Triumph

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Posted 13 June 2013 - 09:20 AM

Oklahoma City isn't big enough to support 2 pro sports teams.  The NBA and NHL have to avoid each other in all but the biggest markets, lest they overlap and destroy one another.  

 

fiesty:  I am not convinced the NHL wants to go to Quebec at all.  There were issues beyond finances there when they left - like that Quebec is much less bilingual than Montreal, and what players want to learn French to e.g. conduct interviews?  They've played in ill-suited arenas before, and they don't need a buyer for the team to move it there - they own the team, they can move it there themselves.


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