2873 replies to this topic

[Zubie#8]

i'd like to clear this out, or for anyone else who would want us to go for semin...

let me get this straight... you guys would want Semin... a sniper... super soft and not physical and not going in the corners to play in a team with a system oriented in dump and chase and play the whole shift fighting along the boards and making all their plays on the outside...

doesnt make any sense to me, with our system we need warriors. Soft guys with speed and good hands and no grit are absolutely useless in NJ's system. Semin would pretty much be GUARANTEED to have his worst season ever in NJ

I am not a Semin fan nor I want him but give the guy credit for what he did in the first two series against Boston and New York. He bought into Hunters system and was not a liability out there. He was diving to clears pucks, and he was taking big hits to make a play. It was good to see him do that although it was just 14 gms worth, the guy has so much talent. It should be interesting to see how he adapts to whatever team signs him, if he does not bolt for the KHL.

Edited by Zubie#8, 25 June 2012 - 10:14 PM.

[TheMazz]

Well Kane is in hot water over in Chicago for being a party boy and being in a bad state over on the social media scene. I would think that's why Chicago is discussing a move like this but I don't consider an "outgoing" player such as Pat Kane to be Lou's type of player. Making this all the stranger.

As for Semin? We'd need to make a splash if this move doesn't happen and if we lose Parise. Who is to say P.A. Parentau has as good of a season here as he's been having with the Isles? Semin seems to be the best forward consolation prize if this Kane thing doesn't happen and Zach bolts.

Edited by TheMazz, 25 June 2012 - 10:09 PM.

[MadDog2020]

Just a crazy hunch, but I don't really think Patrick Kane is a Lou kind of guy. So yeah. There's no chance this happens.

[TheMazz]

Just a crazy hunch, but I don't really think Patrick Kane is a Lou kind of guy. So yeah. There's no chance this happens.

Well to be fair I remember when the Kovy rumors broke and Manta was saying that Kovy wasn't a "Lou kind of guy" so I don't know if that holds any stock anymore.

[NJDevs4978]

Aren't sign and trades specifically outlawed in the NHL? I'm pretty sure once you sign a contract you can't be traded for a few months.

[MadDog2020]

Well Kane is in hot water over in Chicago for being a party boy and being in a bad state over on the social media scene. I would think that's why Chicago is discussing a move like this but I don't consider an "outgoing" player such as Pat Kane to be Lou's type of player. Making this all the stranger.

As for Semin? We'd need to make a splash if this move doesn't happen and if we lose Parise. Who is to say P.A. Parentau has as good of a season here as he's been having with the Isles? Semin seems to be the best forward consolation prize if this Kane thing doesn't happen and Zach bolts.

Haha, once again, I'm beaten to the punch.

[NJDevs4978]

Well to be fair I remember when the Kovy rumors broke and Manta was saying that Kovy wasn't a "Lou kind of guy" so I don't know if that holds any stock anymore.

Except Kovy's never had off-ice issues, he just wasn't looked at as a fit style-wise.

[MadDog2020]

Well to be fair I remember when the Kovy rumors broke and Manta was saying that Kovy wasn't a "Lou kind of guy" so I don't know if that holds any stock anymore.

True, but Kovy wasn't on a Bro Tour of college campuses across America acting like a drunk frat boy every chance he got. Kane has some growing up to do. Great player, don't get me wrong. But I don't think he and Lou would get along. I don't think he'd fit here.

[Daniel]

Aren't sign and trades specifically outlawed in the NHL? I'm pretty sure once you sign a contract you can't be traded for a few months.

They happen very rarely with restricted free agents in kind of a round about way. However, it makes absolutely zero sense for a UFA and the supposed destination one week before free agency begins. First, Zach would have to somehow agree to be traded to the Hawks and approve the contract terms. The Hawks would have to have control ocer the contract terms while the Devils have exclusive negotiating rights and work out the trade terms. The Hawks could avoid this entire headache, and get a much better return for Zach by waiting until July 1 without providing a used puck to the Devils and get a kings' ransom for Kane if the plan is to get rid of him. From Zach's point of view he could wait until July 1 and drive up demand.

[Devilsfan118]

Aren't sign and trades specifically outlawed in the NHL? I'm pretty sure once you sign a contract you can't be traded for a few months.

Wasn't Setoguchi resigned by the SJ Sharks and then almost immediately shipped to the Wild in the Brent Burns deal, just last summer?

[TheMazz]

They happen very rarely with restricted free agents in kind of a round about way. However, it makes absolutely zero sense for a UFA and the supposed destination one week before free agency begins. First, Zach would have to somehow agree to be traded to the Hawks and approve the contract terms. The Hawks would have to have control ocer the contract terms while the Devils have exclusive negotiating rights and work out the trade terms. The Hawks could avoid this entire headache, and get a much better return for Zach by waiting until July 1 without providing a used puck to the Devils and get a kings' ransom for Kane if the plan is to get rid of him. From Zach's point of view he could wait until July 1 and drive up demand.

Well there have been rumors cycling for a while that Kane is a possible trade away however Chicago has denied that a couple times. The why though makes me scratch my head...but it did with Kovy as well. (as in why would Lou pursue Kane)

Edited by TheMazz, 25 June 2012 - 10:54 PM.

[Devilsfan118]

Kane seems like the PERFECT kinda kid Lou could just put under his wing and straighten out.

[Zubie#8]

Wasn't Setoguchi resigned by the SJ Sharks and then almost immediately shipped to the Wild in the Brent Burns deal, just last summer?

That is correct.

[NJDevs4978]

Wasn't Setoguchi resigned by the SJ Sharks and then almost immediately shipped to the Wild in the Brent Burns deal, just last summer?

Yeah but he was RFA, not UFA and he signed an extension.

[Daniel]

Well there have been rumors cycling for a while that Kane is a possible trade away however Chicago has denied that a couple times. The why though makes me scratch my head...but it did with Kovy as well. (as in why would Lou pursue Kane)

Even if the Devils are interested in Kane, and even if the Hawks wanted to trade him, a sign and trade wth Parise makes no sense for the Hawks or Parise. Question, if you are the Hawks, would you rather have just Zach, or Zach along with Merrill, Josefson and a first? And if you're Zach, would you agree to a deal with the Hawks now, or wait until July 1 where you can join the Hawks (assuming there's some burning desire on his part to play there) for more money and alongside Patrick Kane, or other great assets the Hawks could get in return for Kane.

Ergo, the report of the sign and trade is garbage, or the result of a game of telephone.

[Devilsfan118]

Yeah but he was RFA, not UFA and he signed an extension.

Ah okay, wasn't aware he was an RFA at the time. Totally different scenario then, I suppose

[ghdi]

Even if the Devils are interested in Kane, and even if the Hawks wanted to trade him, a sign and trade wth Parise makes no sense for the Hawks or Parise. Question, if you are the Hawks, would you rather have just Zach, or Zach along with Merrill, Josefson and a first? And if you're Zach, would you agree to a deal with the Hawks now, or wait until July 1 where you can join the Hawks (assuming there's some burning desire on his part to play there) for more money and alongside Patrick Kane, or other great assets the Hawks could get in return for Kane.

Ergo, the report of the sign and trade is garbage, or the result of a game of telephone.

I generally agree that this rumor is likely garbage and the result of two hockey guys talking on a radio show, but I can think of a possible counter to this.

The Hawks will likely not be able to pay Parise 7-8 with Kane on the roster and its highly likely that someone will offer him this. They'd almost have to unload Kane (or someone at least) as they're sitting at 8 million in space right now and theres been rumors about Kane for the last year. If they want Zach, is it not out of the question that they do this deal just to ensure that he doesn't go to market? Yes, the Hawks could wait until the 1st to "drive up the price", but they also may not want to compete with the likes of the Wild, Detroit, the Rags, and all the other teams that are likely to inquire about Zach's interest to play there, espc the teams like the Wild and Detroit who have the money to pay Zach extremely well. They kill two birds with one stone if this is true. They offload Kane who has been rumored to be on the move at various levels, and they sign Zach and dont bleed all their cap room adding Zach + more.

The part that gets me in this rumor is why are we trading Zach if he wants to stay? He made 6 million last year and replacing him with Kane is 6.3, so unless Lou has a cap and cant offer the money Zach can get on the market or Zach was bullsh!tting and has decided he doesnt want to stay, I don't see why we do this.

[Daniel]

I generally agree that this rumor is likely garbage and the result of two hockey guys talking on a radio show, but I can think of a possible counter to this.

The Hawks will likely not be able to pay Parise 7-8 with Kane on the roster and its highly likely that someone will offer him this. They'd almost have to unload Kane (or someone at least) as they're sitting at 8 million in space right now and theres been rumors about Kane for the last year. If they want Zach, is it not out of the question that they do this deal just to ensure that he doesn't go to market? Yes, the Hawks could wait until the 1st to "drive up the price", but they also may not want to compete with the likes of the Wild, Detroit, the Rags, and all the other teams that are likely to inquire about Zach's interest to play there, espc the teams like the Wild and Detroit who have the money to pay Zach extremely well. They kill two birds with one stone if this is true. They offload Kane who has been rumored to be on the move at various levels, and they sign Zach and dont bleed all their cap room adding Zach + more.

The part that gets me in this rumor is why are we trading Zach if he wants to stay? He made 6 million last year and replacing him with Kane is 6.3, so unless Lou has a cap and cant offer the money Zach can get on the market or Zach was bullsh!tting and has decided he doesnt want to stay, I don't see why we do this.

Even if the CBA allows for sign and trades (which I'm not sure if it does) it's a self-defeating proposition for a UFA in this scenario. In order for it to work even in theory Chicago would have to negotiate the terms of a deal with Zach. At some point in the game, Zach knows what Chicago wants and Chicago knows what Zach wants. At that point, Zach simply refuses to sign with the Devils, and come July 1 he signs with Chicago. The only risk to Chicago is that Zach somehow double-crosses them and ends up signing with Pittsburgh. Of course, if that were the plan all along, he wouldn't waste his time with the kabuki theater with Chicago unless he just wanted to be spiteful for some bizarre reason. And if they were so determined to do so, the Hawks could easily trade Kane, Parise or no Parise.

The whole idea of a sign and trade makes zero sense even if Zach is hell-bent on signing elsewhere. Basically the underlying premise is that Chicago and Zach want to be "nice guys" and give the Devils something useful for their troubles. Puhlease.

[squishyx]

Even if the CBA allows for sign and trades (which I'm not sure if it does) it's a self-defeating proposition for a UFA in this scenario. In order for it to work even in theory Chicago would have to negotiate the terms of a deal with Zach. At some point in the game, Zach knows what Chicago wants and Chicago knows what Zach wants. At that point, Zach simply refuses to sign with the Devils, and come July 1 he signs with Chicago. The only risk to Chicago is that Zach somehow double-crosses them and ends up signing with Pittsburgh. Of course, if that were the plan all along, he wouldn't waste his time with the kabuki theater with Chicago unless he just wanted to be spiteful for some bizarre reason. And if they were so determined to do so, the Hawks could easily trade Kane, Parise or no Parise.

The whole idea of a sign and trade makes zero sense even if Zach is hell-bent on signing elsewhere. Basically the underlying premise is that Chicago and Zach want to be "nice guys" and give the Devils something useful for their troubles. Puhlease.

I don't think we are going to see a sign and trade here but it could make sense from the Blackhawks perspective if their was some kind of package involved. Say Zach and a 2nd for a 1st rounder + dead weight cap player. Hawks get their guy before having to worry about anyone else, We secure a 1st round pick when we know we need to drop one of ours over the next pair of years and Zach could get a max contract and play with an established team.

Again, I don't think it's likely, I don't think Lou really operates that way but I could see the mechanics and how all parties benefit.

[Martyisth3b3st]

If they replace Parise with Kane, again I know how much of a long-shot it would be, but it would completely put me at ease. The problem with Parise, though it's a small one, is that he seems to be more of an unbelievably talented hardworking role player... I rarely see him generate or score the way someone like Kane can.. and on nights when Kovy is off, Zach seems almost invisible.. I don't know, I mean, obviously Parise is a better player - the face of the franchise to boot, but Parise/Kane swap wouldn't upset me.