27 replies to this topic

[Jerrydevil]

Intolerance is the problem, sadly it's not confined to one geographical region.

Your brand of "tolerance" = appeasement

[squishyx]

Your brand of "tolerance" = appeasement

If you consider appeasement to be "not assigning fault to the one 1,000,000,000 other Muslims on the planet based on what at most 100,000 believe" then you better alert Webster to add in another entry to the definitions table. If only the world were as black and white as you pretend.

[oofrostonoo]

Give them the moment of silence. Although this source doesn't seem to provide the entire story so I can't really make an educated judgement.

Make believe, imaginary friends and "holy land." I hope the human race can survive religion.

[squishyx]

Give them the moment of silence. Although this source doesn't seem to provide the entire story so I can't really make an educated judgement.

Make believe, imaginary friends and "holy land." I hope the human race can survive religion.

But.. will we survive the coming of the Atheist wars??

http://www.southpark...an-to-go-to-war

[Daniel]

But.. will we survive the coming of the Atheist wars??

http://www.southpark...an-to-go-to-war

Yeah, virtually every belief system (the only exception I can think of being new-agey sort of things like scientology) that has taken hold with significant numbers is done, in large part, by violence and war. It goes back as far as ancient Greece, where Athens would spread democracy through war. The Soviet Union and Maoist China engaged in brutal campaigns to eradicate religion and impose atheism or irreligiosity.

To be frank though, there's really no room for doubt that societies governed by Islamic values are much more cruel, on average, than Judeo-Christian ones, at least at the present moment. If a large explosion is deliberately targeted at a large civilian center with the goal of indiscriminately killing as many people as possible, there's a much greater possibility that the perpetrator is a Muslim. And, on too many occasions, the perpetrator is celebrated for doing it. You need look no further than the Black September terrorists being idolized in the Arab world. Here, on the other hand, no one is erecting monuments to or holding parades for James Calley, the officer in charge of the Mai Lai massacre. (He got released by Nixon, but not in celebration for what he did). You only need to look at that difference in behavior to realize something truly rotten is going on over there.

I can't tell you what causes the differences. We can't do an experiment that goes back in time and replaces Islam with Shintoism to see if that mindset would still exist in that part of the world.

Maybe it's that here in the West, the blood-letting reached a point necessary to settle our differences. Maybe the Islamic world is working out their issues and a few decades from now we won't recognize that much of a difference.

In the meantime, we'd be better off to view people individually to judge how good or bad they really are.

Edited by Daniel, 02 August 2012 - 11:46 AM.

[squishyx]

I think you start to hint at the real difference; I believe it's because we are a 1st world nation that has 24/7 media access and we get to watch from the bleachers as 3rd world nations develop and we don't always like what we see. Islam, from the text, is not inherently more violent then Judaism or Christianity or whatever. I think it has more to do with the fact that it's denizens live in poor conditions in a very repressed part of the world. When conditions surrounding people are improved you get very moderate nations (like Indonesia). Blaming, or associating Islam for terrorism is a lot like blaming guns for murders.

[Daniel]

I think you start to hint at the real difference; I believe it's because we are a 1st world nation that has 24/7 media access and we get to watch from the bleachers as 3rd world nations develop and we don't always like what we see. Islam, from the text, is not inherently more violent then Judaism or Christianity or whatever. I think it has more to do with the fact that it's denizens live in poor conditions in a very repressed part of the world. When conditions surrounding people are improved you get very moderate nations (like Indonesia). Blaming, or associating Islam for terrorism is a lot like blaming guns for murders.

Yeah, but you have to also take into account why some countries/cultures are richer than others. China and Korea were both subjugated by foreigners until very recently. South Korea is very rich and prosperous. China's got it's political issues, but it's, on whole and relatively speaking, a prosperous and peaceful country. And with the case of South Korea, it has no natural resources to speak of. Jews, basically everywhere they go they prosper even in the face of open discrimination.

And remember, Mohammed Atta was a college educated, middle-class Egyptian.

[mouse]

And remember, Mohammed Atta was a college educated, middle-class Egyptian.

Which is proof that this is a complex issue, and spouting off generalizations about an entire religion is wrong and dangerous.