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Devils owner short, needs $20M more


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#41 Colin226

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 08:27 PM

Ohhhh I thought by "the other owners" he meant the other NHL owners.. Yup, could totally see the other Devils owners being upset with JVB handing Kovy that contract

I feel like it would be very odd for other team owners to single out one of their own based on something like the Kovy contract.. I could see them getting angry over the Weber deal since it was a rich team twisting the arm of a poorer team
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#42 NJDevs4978

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 08:28 PM

the real reason they were so pissed about the kovalchuk contract wasn't because of the cap circumvention (although that didn't help). it was that they knew HE couldn't afford to pay it. he has leveraged just about everything he can to continue his ownership of this team.


This is the first time I've ever heard that even as a rumor, although it certainly confirms what some people suspected when the weird contract format came out (less money in the first two years before the big payouts, when does THAT ever happen?).

JVB is despised by the NHL. He is despised by his partners. He has done everything with leveraged money earned 10 years ago. Trying to cobble money from people to stay his execution another couple of years is counter productive. This is Wilpon-esque but to a worse degree.


Thing is JVB actually seems like a genuine fan of the Devils, that's what makes it hard for me to root for his demise. I mean until this year the payroll has never been an issue, and the team's fan relations department has been dramatically upgraded the last few years.

As opposed to the Wilpons who are bigger fans of the Brooklyn Dodgers as evidenced by Citi Field, and never open the pocketbook until they 'have' to (when fans were ready to riot in '98 after they refused to consider acquiring Piazza at first, and in '04 when they were terrible for three straight years). Not to mention the Mets' lack of incentives to be a season ticket holder is a disgrace.
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#43 LucifersDog

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 08:50 PM

It's amazing how a thread about Devils financials can turn to Rangers Hate.

You don't have to be a financial wizard to understand what has happened with the financial position of the Devils. Vanderbeek's personal wealth was stock of Lehman, that crashed and went to zero. He sued Lehman for $60M and didn't win that amount I think he got $20 M. His relationship with his present partners went to hell three years ago. His partners was offering any buyer $25M to take their position with the Devils. It is obvious that the League management doesn't like him as an majority owner. They don't like the relationship with the Devils and the City of Newark. The league already has an anchor with Phoenix so they don't want another but know it is coming soon. I have to accept that the Devils owe a delinquent $80M payment. I believe in trying to restructure the loan after all the banks don't want to lose their money that some agreement like I will raise $40M or some amount like that, 1/2 of the amount owed and if I do will you restructure? So here we are 7 days away from the deadline and if reported correctly he has a $20M shortfall. Some one said elsewhere when you are talking these dollar amounts $20M is nothing, that's not true in this economy.

IMO the best course of action to to get rid of Vanderbeek. For sure no one is buying him out? So I don't think the others owners want him to find the money, his current partners don't want him to find the money, and the league management don't want him to find the money. If the loan is called, then bankruptcy... he is gone. they will then have to deal like they have in Phoenix.

Also if the bankruptcy takes place then I think the contracts with the City of Newark will be void and new contracts will have to be written. Cory Booker will win by default.

Vanderbeek was and is a bad business man for these times.

If he had work with the City of Newark unlike what he did, they might have become a partner and floated a City bond to raise the money. They don't want an empty arena in Newark. Nets are gone. If the Devils leave what happen to the White Elephant? We all know the answer. Bars close, restaurants close, parking lots close, and Newark goes backwards.
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#44 maxpower

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 09:05 PM

I see what you're saying, but its likely that any new owner would not be much wealthier and would still have to deal with the loans for years to come. If we can get a rich oil tycoon to make it rain doller bills, great. But I like JVB as a fan-friendy owner who deeply cares about nj hockey. I hope he can get the finances sorted out.


It's pretty safe to say that any new owner WOULD be wealthier. JVB is busted.
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#45 sundstrom

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 09:46 PM

It's amazing how a thread about Devils financials can turn to Rangers Hate.

You don't have to be a financial wizard to understand what has happened with the financial position of the Devils. Vanderbeek's personal wealth was stock of Lehman, that crashed and went to zero. He sued Lehman for $60M and didn't win that amount I think he got $20 M. His relationship with his present partners went to hell three years ago. His partners was offering any buyer $25M to take their position with the Devils. It is obvious that the League management doesn't like him as an majority owner. They don't like the relationship with the Devils and the City of Newark. The league already has an anchor with Phoenix so they don't want another but know it is coming soon. I have to accept that the Devils owe a delinquent $80M payment. I believe in trying to restructure the loan after all the banks don't want to lose their money that some agreement like I will raise $40M or some amount like that, 1/2 of the amount owed and if I do will you restructure? So here we are 7 days away from the deadline and if reported correctly he has a $20M shortfall. Some one said elsewhere when you are talking these dollar amounts $20M is nothing, that's not true in this economy.

IMO the best course of action to to get rid of Vanderbeek. For sure no one is buying him out? So I don't think the others owners want him to find the money, his current partners don't want him to find the money, and the league management don't want him to find the money. If the loan is called, then bankruptcy... he is gone. they will then have to deal like they have in Phoenix.

Also if the bankruptcy takes place then I think the contracts with the City of Newark will be void and new contracts will have to be written. Cory Booker will win by default.

Vanderbeek was and is a bad business man for these times.

If he had work with the City of Newark unlike what he did, they might have become a partner and floated a City bond to raise the money. They don't want an empty arena in Newark. Nets are gone. If the Devils leave what happen to the White Elephant? We all know the answer. Bars close, restaurants close, parking lots close, and Newark goes backwards.


you've got most of this right but the deal with newark is the deal - JVB or any other owner has no change in that. that's one thing that makes the team so attractive. they are not leaving the arena and they are not leaving the area regardless of who buys the team.

and yes, when i said the league despises JVB, i meant Betteman/Daly NHL - although i'd imagine his fellow owners don't love him either.
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#46 RunninWithTheDevil

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 09:50 PM

really? only $20m?

*pulls out checkbook*
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#47 maxpower

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Posted 07 August 2012 - 09:51 PM

Yep, Sharpe James' "lease in name only" isn't going anywhere. Basically the only way JVB could survive in his present financial condition would be as a "steward" owner. Well, when you owe god knows how much money, good luck turning a profit every year to hang on.
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#48 DJ Eco

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 01:01 PM

Also if the bankruptcy takes place then I think the contracts with the City of Newark will be void and new contracts will have to be written. Cory Booker will win by default.

Vanderbeek was and is a bad business man for these times.

If he had work with the City of Newark unlike what he did, they might have become a partner and floated a City bond to raise the money. They don't want an empty arena in Newark. Nets are gone. If the Devils leave what happen to the White Elephant? We all know the answer. Bars close, restaurants close, parking lots close, and Newark goes backwards.



I don't think being on Newark's good side would have helped this situation in any possible way. Newark does not have the means to invest itself in a team, it's begging for money from the government just to barely survive.

If there's one thing that makes this team a potential gold-mine for them to be attracted to, it's THAT deal. From a business perspective, that deal may have been one of the few things Vanderbeek got right. I can't see any reason why that deal would be made null. The agreement is between Newark and the New Jersey Devils. Whoever the owner of the New Jersey Devils is doesn't really influence the deal as it would have been made by the ENTITY that is the "New Jersey Devils" (or whatever the corporation is behind the team). A new owner of anything would inherit all aspects and deals within the business, good or bad. Could be wrong, but that seems pretty standard..
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#49 Devs1965

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 06:55 PM

Lol we can all dream.

If I'd won the lottery or had the money I would never even consider buying any NHL team outside maybe a handful. I would however want an NFL team.

Yes, the NJ Giants sell out every game and keeps me living back in E Rutherford hope I win tonights drawing, Good luck DevsMan, if your playing!
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#50 LucifersDog

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 07:24 PM

Sundstrom and DJ Eoc I understand your points. The NJ Devils owe the City of Newark money today. If the Devils go bankrupt then the City of Newark becomes a creditor within the bankruptcy court but way behind the banks and will probably collect very little of what is owed. I am sure in the contract with the Devils and the City there is a clause that says if you fail to pay in full the contract is void.

I have been told that if the Devils go bankrupt Cory Booker wins between he and Vanderbeek.

The City doesn't want to own the Devils nor do they want an empty building nor do they want to be screwed by the Devils. Sometimes it better to swallow the loss and get rid of the pain.

Someone will step up and lease or buy the arena without the Devils as part of the deal.

Personally I want to get rid of Vanderbeek so if bankruptcy is the way great. I also want the City of Newark to be proud and welcome the NJ Devils. That's not the case today.
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#51 maxpower

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 09:14 PM

They don't owe the city money. This has already been settled, it's actually the other way around for a small amount.
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#52 LucifersDog

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 10:18 PM

They don't owe the city money. This has already been settled, it's actually the other way around for a small amount.


The law suit was settled and the city was paid as was the Devils. Then there was the playoffs. Devils owe the City, net net. You must be hoping the Devils don't go bankrupt and Vanderbeek lives on to screw up again?
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#53 Daniel

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 10:57 PM

The law suit was settled and the city was paid as was the Devils. Then there was the playoffs. Devils owe the City, net net. You must be hoping the Devils don't go bankrupt and Vanderbeek lives on to screw up again?


Newark has no say in this one way or another. Newark is NOT a creditor of the Devils. Just because there was a lawsuit (actually an arbitration) where past obligations were decided, does not make Newark a creditor of the Devils. The Devils have a sweetheart lease with Newark, which is also favorable if the Devils go into bankruptcy because it is very difficult for a landlord to cancel a lease once the tenant declares bankruptcy. Not to mention the fact that, if anything, the Devils will get the financing to meet whatever lease obligations it has to city from its creditors considering that's one of the best assets the team has. Otherwise, the Devils kick up parking and concession revenue to the city. How does it serve Newark's interests at all to cancel those arrangements or be counterproductive enough to force the team out?

You want to say the sky is falling, that's ok. It just helps to have something of clue of what you're talking about.

(I also recall you were singing Vanderbeek's praises when it appeared he was pushing Lou out the door).

ADDENDUM: Actually, so long as the Devils are current on their lease payments (which I'm sure they pay before buying hockey sticks) it is virtually impossible for Newark to kick the Devils out even if the team declares bankruptcy, as the debtor gets to choose whether to continue the lease.

Edited by Daniel, 08 August 2012 - 11:19 PM.

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#54 maxpower

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Posted 08 August 2012 - 11:14 PM

The law suit was settled and the city was paid as was the Devils. Then there was the playoffs. Devils owe the City, net net. You must be hoping the Devils don't go bankrupt and Vanderbeek lives on to screw up again?


What about the playoffs? Do you understand anything about the Devils lease? Their yearly rent for the ARENA lease (which has nothing really to do with the team, just the amount that is paid for the ARENA, it just happens the Devils own the arena lease) is like $1-1.5M. Newark is someone the Devils can actually AFFORD to pay because Sharpe James ripped off the city. It doesn't matter how much they earn, it's a yearly rate. If anything clearing $30M or whatever it was makes it easier to pay them and whatever side money they owe for OT or whatnot (and I don't even remember if they had to pay THAT due to arbitration)
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#55 njd3b1ink

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 09:30 AM

I heard about a couple months ago that if the devils declare bankruptcy that the bank takes basically all the money the team has to take care of the debt, and that apparently they will go into the money people have used on season tickets. As a STH is scares the hell out of me to think the money ive put towards next season will just evaporate. For me its a catch 22, cause i want JVB out like everyone else, but if what i heard is true im kind of hoping for selfish reasons that the team doesnt have to file for bankruptcy. Anyone know about that?
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#56 ThreeCups

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 09:39 AM

The real question is...

Does Kevin Smith have $20 mill lying around?
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#57 SterioDesign

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 09:45 AM

at this point i really dont care anymore... i know the team won't move or anything, worst case scenario they go bankrupt and get a new owner which would not be a bad thing.

i was just worried about that situation cause we had to be somewhat attractive to re-sign Zach or other free agents... certainly didnt go our way so wtv i really dont care anymore lol
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#58 Daniel

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 09:51 AM

I heard about a couple months ago that if the devils declare bankruptcy that the bank takes basically all the money the team has to take care of the debt, and that apparently they will go into the money people have used on season tickets. As a STH is scares the hell out of me to think the money ive put towards next season will just evaporate. For me its a catch 22, cause i want JVB out like everyone else, but if what i heard is true im kind of hoping for selfish reasons that the team doesnt have to file for bankruptcy. Anyone know about that?


When bankruptcy is declared, there's an automatic stay of all attempts by creditors to collect. In the meantime a plan of reorganization will get worked out, which will almost certainly involve a new owner and revised repayment terms. It's also quite possible that a buyer will simply purchase the outstanding debt and take control of the team that way. How creditors get paid, whether it's from season ticket sales, is irrelevant so long as the team can remain competitive in the amount it can spend, which it can given the fact that there is a salary cap.

Like I keep saying, bankruptcy is not the end of the world, and will probably be beneficial in that Vanderbeek will no longer be in the picture, and will be replaced with healthy ownership. Numerous teams have declared for bankruptcy in the past, including a certain Stanley Cup winning LA Kings.

The real question is...

Does Kevin Smith have $20 mill lying around?


I hope so, if that keeps him from continuing to make crappy movies.
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#59 DaneykoIsGod

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 02:53 PM

What does JVB's height have to do with this?


A couple pages later, and this is still the best post of the thread.
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#60 LucifersDog

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Posted 09 August 2012 - 05:42 PM

They don't owe the city money. This has already been settled, it's actually the other way around for a small amount.



Newark has no say in this one way or another. Newark is NOT a creditor of the Devils. Just because there was a lawsuit (actually an arbitration) where past obligations were decided, does not make Newark a creditor of the Devils. The Devils have a sweetheart lease with Newark, which is also favorable if the Devils go into bankruptcy because it is very difficult for a landlord to cancel a lease once the tenant declares bankruptcy. Not to mention the fact that, if anything, the Devils will get the financing to meet whatever lease obligations it has to city from its creditors considering that's one of the best assets the team has. Otherwise, the Devils kick up parking and concession revenue to the city. How does it serve Newark's interests at all to cancel those arrangements or be counterproductive enough to force the team out?

You want to say the sky is falling, that's ok. It just helps to have something of clue of what you're talking about.

(I also recall you were singing Vanderbeek's praises when it appeared he was pushing Lou out the door).

ADDENDUM: Actually, so long as the Devils are current on their lease payments (which I'm sure they pay before buying hockey sticks) it is virtually impossible for Newark to kick the Devils out even if the team declares bankruptcy, as the debtor gets to choose whether to continue the lease.



What about the playoffs? Do you understand anything about the Devils lease? Their yearly rent for the ARENA lease (which has nothing really to do with the team, just the amount that is paid for the ARENA, it just happens the Devils own the arena lease) is like $1-1.5M. Newark is someone the Devils can actually AFFORD to pay because Sharpe James ripped off the city. It doesn't matter how much they earn, it's a yearly rate. If anything clearing $30M or whatever it was makes it easier to pay them and whatever side money they owe for OT or whatnot (and I don't even remember if they had to pay THAT due to arbitration)



OK I you say I don't know what I am talking about. I know the rent is fixed. I know the arbitrator made a decision in favour of the Devils. But I said there were the playoffs and you laugh at me. Well the lease calls for parking revenues and percentages plus other items. The Devils have paid the rent not the rest while accepting from the City the money required monthly if they continue to play like in they did in the playoffs. The City is owed money. The City complied with the arbitration decision during the playoffs but the Devils didn't pay their share of extras but paid the rent.

When you understand the relationship between the Devils and the City of Newark get back to me.

I may be wrong but if the Devils go bankrupt I believe there is a provision to break the lease and re-write it with Vanderbeek or the NHL or the new Owner.

I care less so I won't discuss this again. I just want the Donald Trump of the NJ Devils out.

Edited by LucifersDog, 09 August 2012 - 05:46 PM.

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