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#421 devilsrule33

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 12:03 AM

Alright some extended thoughts now that I have the time...

 

The Dolphins are a pretty good team. A certain poster here wants to blame everything on the QB, which is crazy. Tannehill was very solid today. He has the tools to be a very good quarterback in this league. But no matter who you are, you need help. And Miami has absolutely no run game. That's asking a lot for any NFL QB when you can't get 2-3 yards at all. And as far as your point above, Daniel, not being able to run has nothing to do with teams not fearing Tanny. Did you see the Panthers bringing anyone extra into the box daring the Dolphins to throw? It didn't really happen. 

 

A lot of so called stud young QBs are struggling around the NFL. So I think your expectations are ridiculous anyway. And he isn't surrounded by tons of talent either. They need to improve their o-line, get healthy and continue to delvelop Ryan.

 

One main thing I saw was not just a QB who is more fully developed, but also a head coach. Joe Philbin is Ron Rivera before his revelation. You had one coach going for it on 4th down on his team's side of the field minutes into the 3rd quarter, and of course the smart 4th and 10 call not to punt. And then you had Philbin who punted in every short yardage situation, and then up 3 on 4th and 2 or 3...decides to attempt a field goal. In the NFL the difference between 3 and 6 isn't that big, especially with that much time left on the clock. There is no reason to attempt a field goal. Get aggressive and go for it. And that isn't even taking into account where they were on the field. Trying a 53 yard kick where a miss would put the Panthers on the 43...makes that an absolute atrocious call. Just atrocious.

 

Should I bother bringing up...the insane prevent defense by the Dolphins with 8 seconds left. They were in hail mary defense with 8 seconds left. That allowed LaFell to catch a short pass and run 30 yards easily putting them in field goal range. Just way too much time to be doing that. 

 

This isn't gloating. It's just bringing up things to combat Daniel's insane claims that all the problems fall on Tannehill. The Panthers were there. It takes a bit of time developing a QB, and coaching has a sh!tload to do with wins and losses in the NFL. The Saints are the perfect example here. And I like to think the Panthers are too. Ron Rivera has finally figured it out. And in this case he realized punting did nothing in that situation with 2:20 left. You don't capitalize on a 4th down, big deal. You try and get a 3-and-out, and you'll be down 6. Still a one score game. If they get a first down, it's over either way --punt or turnover on downs. The difference is if you go for it and miss, a coach most likely plays it conservative and runs it 3 times and takes the points. You punt it and Miami probably realizes that they can't end the game on a 1st down by just running it 3 times. They probably call their best play-action plays with a pass-run option for Tanny. 

 

That's what Rivera learned this year. Don't force a team to do something or they'll do it. Trying to go from 3 to 6 points..you just tell the Panthers exactly what they have to do to win. Miami plays every game to the wire. That's a very good thing. Those games will turn soon. But it's an offensive league with the rules slanted towards the offense. You give an offense enough chances, they will burn you. So as a coach, you have to minimize those chances.

 

Tannehill was mic'd up loudly, and I noticed it to that "GO GO" was always a run, and "Go" was a pass. Very strange. It does make defenses go offside quite a bit. And I was wondering why the Panthers were biting on play-action passes after there was a "Go" at the line.

 

On another note, the Dolphins exposed a lot of the Panthers weaknesses that have been masked a bit the past few weeks. They can't run the ball at all. All their rushing is done by Cam. And their secondary is susceptible to the big play over and over, if there is no pass rush. Johnson being out hurt big time. It was clear that Miami copied a lot from NE's playbook and what worked last week against the Panthers. Some of it worked, but they don't have the personnel to be as successful. 


Edited by devilsrule33, 25 November 2013 - 12:59 AM.

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#422 Daniel

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 12:05 AM

Alright some extended thoughts now that I have the time...

The Dolphins are a pretty good team. A certain poster here wants to blame everything on the QB, which is crazy. Tannehill was very solid today. He has the tools to be a very good quarterback in this league. But no matter who you are, you need help. And Miami has absolutely no run game. That's asking a lot for any NFL QB when you can't get 2-3 yards at all. And as far as your point above, Daniel, not being able to run has nothing to do with teams not fearing Tanny. Did you see the Panthers bringing anyone extra into the box daring the Dolphins to throw? It didn't really happen.

A lot of so called stud young QBs are struggling around the NFL. So I think your expectations are ridiculous anyway. And he isn't surrounded by tons of talent either. They need to improve their o-line, get healthy and continue to delvelop Ryan.

One main thing I saw was not just a QB who is more fully developed, but also a head coach. Joe Philbin is Ron Rivera before his revelation. You had one coach going for it on 4th down on his team's side of the field minutes into the 3rd quarter, and of course the smart 4th and 10 call not to punt. And then you had Philbin who punted in every short yardage situation, and then up 3 on 4th and 2 or 3...decides to attempt a field goal. In the NFL the difference between 3 and 6 isn't that big, especially with that much time left on the clock. There is no reason to attempt a field goal. Get aggressive and go for it. And that isn't even taking into account where they were on the field. Trying a 53 yard kick where a miss would put the Panthers on the 43...makes that an absolute atrocious call. Just atrocious.

Should I bother bringing up...the insane prevent defense by the Dolphins with 8 seconds left. They were in hail mary defense with 8 seconds left. That allowed LaFell to catch a short pass and run 30 yards easily putting them in field goal range. Just way too much time to be doing that.

This isn't gloating. It's just bringing up things to combat Daniel's insane claims that all the problems fall on Tannehill. The Panthers were there. It takes a bit of time developing a QB, and coaching has a sh!tload to do with wins and losses in the NFL. The Saints are the perfect example here. And I like to think the Panthers are too. Ron Rivera has finally figured it out. And in this case he realized punting did nothing in that situation with 2:20 left. You don't capitalize on a 4th down, big deal. You try and get a 3-and-out, and you'll be down 6. Still a one score game. If they get a first down, it's over either way, punt or turnover and downs. The difference is if you go for it and miss, a coach most likely plays it conservative and runs it 3 times and takes the points. You punt it and Miami probably realizes that they can't end the game on a 1st down by just running it 3 times. They probably call their best play-action plays with a pass-run option for Tanny.

That's what Rivera learned this year. Don't force a team to do something or they'll do it. Trying to go from 3 to 6 points..you just tell the Panthers exactly what they have to do to win. Miami plays every game to the wire. That's a very good thing. Those games will turn soon.

Tannehill was mic'd up loudly, and I noticed it to that "GO GO" was always a run, and "Go" was a pass. Very strange. It does make defenses go offside quite a bit. And I was wondering why the Panthers were biting on play-action passes after there was a "Go" at the line.

On another note, the Dolphins exposed a lot of the Panthers weaknesses that have been maxed a bit the past few weeks. They can't run the ball at all. All their rushing is done by Cam. And their secondary is susceptible to the big play over and over, if there is no pass rush. Johnson being out hurt big time. It was clear that Miami copied a lot from NE's playbook and what worked last week against the Panthers. Some of it worked, but they don't have the personnel to be as successful.


They changed up the go, go-go call this game.


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#423 MadDog2020

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 07:56 AM

Lmfao, Daniel with the typical Tannehill hate. Hey Daniel, how about your thoughts on the deal Tannehill made with Iran this weekend? I know most of the world's upset about it, just wanted to hear your thoughts.


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#424 Beezer34

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 08:43 AM

..ask any Jets fan if they would take Tannehill.. and if they say no, they're either on drugs, or flat out lying!!
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#425 MadDog2020

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 08:46 AM

..ask any Jets fan if they would take Tannehill.. and if they say no, they're either on drugs, or flat out lying!!

More than half the teams in the league would beg, borrow, and steal to get Tannehill.


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#426 Daniel

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 09:46 AM

Lmfao, Daniel with the typical Tannehill hate. Hey Daniel, how about your thoughts on the deal Tannehill made with Iran this weekend? I know most of the world's upset about it, just wanted to hear your thoughts.

 

He gave away the farm.  He also stole my puppy, and trashed my house.

 

In all seriousness though (at least seriousness for a thread about a football team) the Dolphins better destroy the Jets next week, especially if Geno's starting.  The Jets secondary is absolute garbage at this point, and garbage by AFC East standards, at that.  If EJ Manuel can pick apart the Jets defense, our supposedly good QB ought to be able to.

 

At the very least, lets establish that the Dolphins aren't that bad. 


Edited by Daniel, 25 November 2013 - 10:13 AM.

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#427 Daniel

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 04:07 PM

So far as Philbin, he's a big meh.  He's not Tony Sporano bad, but he's not in the same league as the "good" coaches, of whom I include Andy Reid, John Fox, Marvin Lewis, Jeff Fisher or even a guy like Jack Del Rio that did a lot with some very average Jacksonville teams.  I would probably give him one more year without a slew of devastating injuries to see if he can make the playoffs. 

 

What will be interesting to see if Ross eventually hires Shanahan.  According to one report that's out there, he wanted to draft Tannehill instead of RGIII, albeit, in part because he would not have had to trade up to draft Tannehill. 


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#428 MadDog2020

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 04:29 PM

So far as Philbin, he's a big meh. He's not Tony Sporano bad, but he's not in the same league as the "good" coaches, of whom I include Andy Reid, John Fox, Marvin Lewis, Jeff Fisher or even a guy like Jack Del Rio that did a lot with some very average Jacksonville teams. I would probably give him one more year without a slew of devastating injuries to see if he can make the playoffs.

What will be interesting to see if Ross eventually hires Shanahan. According to one report that's out there, he wanted to draft Tannehill instead of RGIII, albeit, in part because he would not have had to trade up to draft Tannehill.

I agree with you on Philbin. He's very 'meh' to me. The fact that this team constantly comes out in the beginning of games and second halves unprepared is a HUGE black mark on Philbin and his staff imo. I'm still torn about bringing him back next year. It all depends on how these last 5 games go really.


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#429 Daniel

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 04:38 PM

I agree with you on Philbin. He's very 'meh' to me. The fact that this team constantly comes out in the beginning of games and second halves unprepared is a HUGE black mark on Philbin and his staff imo. I'm still torn about bringing him back next year. It all depends on how these last 5 games go really.

 

I'd keep him around for at least another year unless there's some kind of huge disaster for the remainder of this year.  I don't think there's any hot commodity coach out there, like a John Harbaugh or Chip Kelly, that advances the ball all that much.  And as much as he drives me crazy, Tannehill is at least the guy for another year.  Give Philbin, and Sherman, for that matter, another year to finish what they started.   

 

EDIT:  A lot of people also seem to be calling for Gruden.  If you want to see Tannehill (or Tanny-Hill) as the QB though, Gruden is probably not your guy.  Seems to me Gruden does not like him all that much.


Edited by Daniel, 25 November 2013 - 04:40 PM.

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#430 MadDog2020

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 04:57 PM

I'd keep him around for at least another year unless there's some kind of huge disaster for the remainder of this year. I don't think there's any hot commodity coach out there, like a John Harbaugh or Chip Kelly, that advances the ball all that much. And as much as he drives me crazy, Tannehill is at least the guy for another year. Give Philbin, and Sherman, for that matter, another year to finish what they started.

EDIT: A lot of people also seem to be calling for Gruden. If you want to see Tannehill (or Tanny-Hill) as the QB though, Gruden is probably not your guy. Seems to me Gruden does not like him all that much.

I'm not a big Shanahan guy (particularly because of the fact that there's built-in nepotism with his son as the OC, and we have enough of that with Sherman and his son-in-law, Zac Taylor as the QB coach), but I'd be curious to see what he may be able to do with Tannehill. I think Tannehill would be a good fit in Shanahan's offense. I think its a foregone conclusion Shanahan is out in Washington, but I have a gut feeling Philbin will probably be back no matter what because the moron owner loves him.


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#431 Daniel

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Posted 25 November 2013 - 05:28 PM

I'm not a big Shanahan guy (particularly because of the fact that there's built-in nepotism with his son as the OC, and we have enough of that with Sherman and his son-in-law, Zac Taylor as the QB coach), but I'd be curious to see what he may be able to do with Tannehill. I think Tannehill would be a good fit in Shanahan's offense. I think its a foregone conclusion Shanahan is out in Washington, but I have a gut feeling Philbin will probably be back no matter what because the moron owner loves him.


I don't see Ross as being in love with Philbin. The most he did was give Philbin a vote of confidence during the Martin garbage. And considering how much of a joke Martin is, I have no problem with that.

You don't become a billionaire by being attached to substandard employees that are "nice" guys.


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#432 CRASHER

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 08:31 AM

I can't see Philbin surviving this Martin/Incognito debacle (even though this is more on the O-Line coach if you ask me...)

 

Personal feeling....you don't want Shanahan.....though he would draft you a gem RB (and then stop using him once he had 90-some yards each game :P ).....look at the HORRIBLE job they did with Griffin in Season Two.....


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#433 Daniel

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 09:54 AM

Evidently, Wells is interviewing Jake Long, and there's some indication that he'll be interviewing people at Stanford, perhaps Luck and Harbaugh.  The word with Long is that he would be the guy that would tell Incognito that he was taking things too far.

 

http://profootballta...ks-at-stanford/


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#434 Daniel

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 10:38 AM

And Maddog, did you end up getting a ticket for the game on Sunday?  Everyone's going to be in section 323.  I checked stubhub and the tix available there are a bit pricey, but maybe check in closer to Sunday to see if the price falls.  Everyone had a blast last year, so I highly recommend it. Same for all other Phin fans here.

 

I promise to mute my Tannehilll hatred if anyone decides to come.


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#435 MadDog2020

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 11:48 AM

And Maddog, did you end up getting a ticket for the game on Sunday? Everyone's going to be in section 323. I checked stubhub and the tix available there are a bit pricey, but maybe check in closer to Sunday to see if the price falls. Everyone had a blast last year, so I highly recommend it. Same for all other Phin fans here.

I promise to mute my Tannehilll hatred if anyone decides to come.

Nah, decided its too big a game. They always lose when I go, so I stay home and watch the must-win type games on TV. I'm serious, I haven't seen this team win a game in-person since 2003. I even turned down tickets to the 2008 Pennington division-clincher because I was afraid they'd lose if I showed up. We all ended up happier in the end for that lol.


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#436 Daniel

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 11:57 AM

Nah, decided its too big a game. They always lose when I go, so I stay home and watch the must-win type games on TV. I'm serious, I haven't seen this team win a game in-person since 2003. I even turned down tickets to the 2008 Pennington division-clincher because I was afraid they'd lose if I showed up. We all ended up happier in the end for that lol.

 

Good that you're taking one for the team. 

 

I'll admit that I'm tempting fate.  It's been win one, lose one for me thus far.  Marino fake spike game, followed by Monday night debacle, followed by pre-Sandy game last year.  Not quite a trend, but a little dicey.

 

EDIT:  To be clear, I mean it's win one/lose one in East Rutherford.  There was a two game losing streak from the Monday night game to the home game two years ago against Houston.


Edited by Daniel, 26 November 2013 - 12:06 PM.

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#437 MadDog2020

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 12:23 PM

Good that you're taking one for the team.

I'll admit that I'm tempting fate. It's been win one, lose one for me thus far. Marino fake spike game, followed by Monday night debacle, followed by pre-Sandy game last year. Not quite a trend, but a little dicey.

EDIT: To be clear, I mean it's win one/lose one in East Rutherford. There was a two game losing streak from the Monday night game to the home game two years ago against Houston.

I'm on an epic in-person losing streak, dating back to the 2004 game against the Jets on Monday Night Football. Then I saw them lose to the Jets again in 05, Buffalo (in Miami) in 06, Jets again in 07, Oakland in 07 (in Miami), Indy Monday Night home opener in 09, Jets Sunday Night home opener in 2010, and the famous Gator Day debacle against Denver in 2011, which is the last game I attended in person. Its ridiculous at this point lol.


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#438 MantaRay

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Posted 26 November 2013 - 10:28 PM

The Jets/Fins game this week looks like an evenly matched battle of two pretty inconsistent teams. Miami D isn't that much better than the Jets inept O.
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#439 MantaRay

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Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:07 PM

What is the spread tomorrow?
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Posted 30 November 2013 - 09:22 PM

What is the spread tomorrow?

 

Jets are a two point favorite via CBS Sportsline


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