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Your thought on today / about the team so far ?


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#241 DevsMan84

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 04:27 PM

whatever ended up happening with brunner nothing right? I havent heard anything more about him signing with any other team

 

That Twitter guy and his one fan are still insisting Brunner is a Devil.


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#242 Triumph

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 04:40 PM

It also might mean that Henrique is testing whether he can get a deal approximating what Landeskog got. 

 

Lou had a few chuckles at the recent press conference, but I bet he hasn't had a real good laugh in a while - this would give it to him.


Edited by Triumph, 20 August 2013 - 04:41 PM.

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#243 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 05:14 PM

It also might mean that Henrique is testing whether he can get a deal approximating what Landeskog got. 

 

In which case, I hope Henrique enjoys spending the 2013-14 season in a mental institution.


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#244 GoArmySports

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 07:53 PM

Aren't camps set to open up in about three weeks?


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#245 Daniel

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 08:57 PM


It also might mean that Henrique is testing whether he can get a deal approximating what Landeskog got.



Lou had a few chuckles at the recent press conference, but I bet he hasn't had a real good laugh in a while - this would give it to him.


I'm not defending it, but superficially anyway, it's not something I would put past some agent. Over two years, very close to each other in points per game, plus Henrique is "clutch". It would not shock me if his agent is trying to get something like 20/4.

If Henrique were asking for what we think he is, this deal should have been done. That is not the type of money that the ownership situation needed to be straightened out over.

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#246 Triumph

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 09:51 PM

I'm not defending it, but superficially anyway, it's not something I would put past some agent. Over two years, very close to each other in points per game, plus Henrique is "clutch". It would not shock me if his agent is trying to get something like 20/4. If Henrique were asking for what we think he is, this deal should have been done. That is not the type of money that the ownership situation needed to be straightened out over. Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

The agent can ask and he can get laughed at.  Landeskog is younger, his shots per game are way higher, and he's a much better player right now, never mind in the future.  20/4 is a totally absurd price for Henrique - I don't even think he would get paid that if he were a UFA right now.


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#247 capo

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 09:56 PM

I really can't see Lou giving him a ridiculous contract.  Henrique needs to prove himself some more first.  This guy could still be Kevin Todd for all we know.


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#248 Daniel

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 10:06 PM

The agent can ask and he can get laughed at. Landeskog is younger, his shots per game are way higher, and he's a much better player right now, never mind in the future. 20/4 is a totally absurd price for Henrique - I don't even think he would get paid that if he were a UFA right now.


First, most GMs do not look at shots per game when it comes to these kinds of things, I can't speak for Lou though.

Second, I am not saying that it would be a fair deal. I'm only suggesting that's what his agent might be asking for. We're running out of reasons for why a deal hasn't been announced yet, if Henrique's agent is in fact being reasonable.
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#249 Triumph

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 11:12 PM

First, most GMs do not look at shots per game when it comes to these kinds of things, I can't speak for Lou though.

Second, I am not saying that it would be a fair deal. I'm only suggesting that's what his agent might be asking for. We're running out of reasons for why a deal hasn't been announced yet, if Henrique's agent is in fact being reasonable.

 

Haha, okay, I suppose you talk to most GMs.  If you don't think they at least glance at shots on goal, I suspect you're mistaken.  And then of course we have more and more stories about GMs using analytics.

 

Why can't it be Lou holding Henrique's cap number down?  Henrique has no recourse.  If he gets a 2 year deal it'll probably be for something like 1.5M per.  Henrique might want more.


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#250 DH26

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 11:15 PM

Haha, okay, I suppose you talk to most GMs.  If you don't think they at least glance at shots on goal, I suspect you're mistaken.  And then of course we have more and more stories about GMs using analytics.

 

Why can't it be Lou holding Henrique's cap number down?  Henrique has no recourse.  If he gets a 2 year deal it'll probably be for something like 1.5M per.  Henrique might want more.

 

maybe Daniel and Dave Nonis are best friends forever Tri jeez


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#251 Daniel

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 11:43 PM

maybe Daniel and Dave Nonis are best friends forever Tri jeez


Yup that's right. It's idle speculation on a messageboard.

Get over yourselves.
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#252 Devilsfan118

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 07:54 AM

My thoughts on the team so far:

Jesus Christ, is it October yet?  I'm SO BORED without CFB or NHL..


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#253 ATLL765

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 08:54 AM

Yup that's right. It's idle speculation on a messageboard.

Get over yourselves.

You didn't phrase it like it was speculation though. You said it like you knew it, when it's clear you don't KNOW that. You're guessing that they don't look at shots per game. Why you think they wouldn't is beyond me. You don't think Clarky was helped in getting his contract by the number of shots he takes?


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#254 Daniel

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 11:07 AM

You didn't phrase it like it was speculation though. You said it like you knew it, when it's clear you don't KNOW that. You're guessing that they don't look at shots per game. Why you think they wouldn't is beyond me. You don't think Clarky was helped in getting his contract by the number of shots he takes?

 

I never said any such thing.  I said it "might" be the case.  I never claimed to have any sort of inside knowledge or that I'm in good with the CAA security guard.

 

And I think Clarkson got the deal he did because he was a 30 goal scorer and based on his "intangibles" or "grit".  You can say that the former is primarily based on the amount of shots he took, I just think that your typical GM, or perhaps agent, will look at goals and assists when it comes to contract negotiations. 

 

Ryan O'Reilly got 2 years $10 million on an offer sheet at the same stage of his career as Henrique is at now and with similar stats that Henrique has had.  It isn't that implausible that Henrique's agent is hanging on to the possibility that Henrique could get something like that.


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#255 ATLL765

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 12:20 PM

I never said any such thing.  I said it "might" be the case.  I never claimed to have any sort of inside knowledge or that I'm in good with the CAA security guard.

 

And I think Clarkson got the deal he did because he was a 30 goal scorer and based on his "intangibles" or "grit".  You can say that the former is primarily based on the amount of shots he took, I just think that your typical GM, or perhaps agent, will look at goals and assists when it comes to contract negotiations. 

 

Ryan O'Reilly got 2 years $10 million on an offer sheet at the same stage of his career as Henrique is at now and with similar stats that Henrique has had.  It isn't that implausible that Henrique's agent is hanging on to the possibility that Henrique could get something like that.

ROR got an offer sheet from Calgary. If LL follows Calgary's lead, we're in deep sh!t. Also, he's played over double the NHL games that Henrique has, thus has proven his worth more so then Henrique has. Many say a forward peaks in his 3rd year. ROR is at that point of his career where he should be hitting his peak. Henrique hasn't gotten there yet, so his peak is an unknown quantity compared to ROR.

Landeskog is a better comparison, but he's taken twice as many shots as Henrique has, so it's far more likely that he will maintain that pace, if not better it, especially given that he shot something like 8%. Henrique shot 12% in his rookie year, then bettered that last year with 14%. I'd wager he won't shoot that well his whole career. If I'm wrong, he's WAYYYY better than anyone here thinks.

Also, you never said "might". You said, "most GMs do not look at shots per game".

 

First, most GMs do not look at shots per game when it comes to these kinds of things, I can't speak for Lou though.

Second, I am not saying that it would be a fair deal. I'm only suggesting that's what his agent might be asking for. We're running out of reasons for why a deal hasn't been announced yet, if Henrique's agent is in fact being reasonable.


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#256 Daniel

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 12:34 PM


Also, you never said "might". You said, "most GMs do not look at shots per game".

 

 I said Henrique's camp "might" be trying to get a Landeskog type deal, or, if it makes you feel better, a deal that is much more lucrative than a lot of us here believe he is worth or would otherwise expect him to accept, at least until he starts missing paychecks because of a hold out.  I think this is plausible because the season is fast approaching, someone with similar stats just got a huge deal, and the ownership situation, to the extent it had any relevance at all, has been worked out.  Yes, Lou could be low balling him too, who knows.

 

Tri argued that the very idea was ludicrous because of Henrique's shot totals.  If it makes you feel better, I should have said that "it appears to me" (or some kind of qualifier) that GMs and agents still tend to look at the traditional goals/assists than they do at shots when negotiating deals.  I have no direct knoweldge of how these negotiations tend to play out.  It's just an off-the-cuff observation.


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#257 Triumph

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 12:59 PM

 I said Henrique's camp "might" be trying to get a Landeskog type deal, or, if it makes you feel better, a deal that is much more lucrative than a lot of us here believe he is worth or would otherwise expect him to accept, at least until he starts missing paychecks because of a hold out.  I think this is plausible because the season is fast approaching, someone with similar stats just got a huge deal, and the ownership situation, to the extent it had any relevance at all, has been worked out.  Yes, Lou could be low balling him too, who knows.

 

Tri argued that the very idea was ludicrous because of Henrique's shot totals.  If it makes you feel better, I should have said that "it appears to me" (or some kind of qualifier) that GMs and agents still tend to look at the traditional goals/assists than they do at shots when negotiating deals.  I have no direct knoweldge of how these negotiations tend to play out.  It's just an off-the-cuff observation.

 

I argued the idea was ludicrous for a myriad of reasons, one of which was the shot totals.  You argued definitively that GMs don't look at shot totals.  Shot totals tend to correlate with goal totals, btw.


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#258 Daniel

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 01:18 PM

I argued the idea was ludicrous for a myriad of reasons, one of which was the shot totals.  You argued definitively that GMs don't look at shot totals.  Shot totals tend to correlate with goal totals, btw.

 

Sigh...

 

It's a messageboard, my apologies if I was not as precise as one would hope.  Neither you, nor I, have any idea how these negotiations go, or what stats a GM or agent finds or pretends to find persuasive, or the extent to which they do.  If you want to get hung up on syntax, more power to you.  So whether shot totals objectively correlate with goals scored is besides the point, and I didn't really dispute the concept anyway. 

 

The only other reason you said the idea was ludicrous was that Landeskog was younger, by a whopping 2 and half years.  Otherwise you just said he was "better", which of course begs the question, at least if what we're speculating about are contract demands.  I don't disagree with that by the way, but again, it's besides the point.

 

While I don't recall what your thoughts were at the time, Lou gave Clarkson a deal that many of us thought was ludicrous, and at a time when there was a serious cap crunch.  I don't think it's that unreasonable to speculate that Henrique's camp might be overplaying its hand. 


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#259 Devils731

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 01:36 PM

I don't think it's that unreasonable to speculate that Henrique's camp might be overplaying its hand.


Based on what Lou, Henrique, and his agent have said I still think its most likely the numbers are basically settled and both Lou and Agent are just waiting for Adam to decide whether long or short term fit him better.
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#260 Daniel

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 01:48 PM

Based on what Lou, Henrique, and his agent have said I still think its most likely the numbers are basically settled and both Lou and Agent are just waiting for Adam to decide whether long or short term fit him better.

 

Seems like a long time to make up one's mind, since those statements were made almost a month ago.  But I agree, there's no rush at the moment, and this could be much ado about nothing.


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