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The Pete Deboer Thread


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#121 NJDevs4978

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 05:35 AM

DeBoer's not Johnny Mac, the irony is the biggest parallel to Johnny Mac is the team closest to us right now :P

 

But he's still getting toward gots to go territory.  He's been Robbie Ftorek at the end of '00 bad, or Larry at the beginning of '06...it just isn't working anymore and his bizarre quick hook on anyone 27-and-under isn't helping matters.


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#122 MantaRay

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 07:25 AM

Silly thread.

 

This is essentially a team of underachievers, and free agent talent that still needs to develop long term chemistry.

 

The west coast trip is typically brutal physically, but is a good place to come together.

 

I am glad the Devils did this early in the season, because it will pay dividends down the road.

 

This is a better team than last year, by December we will have a laugh at this thread.


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#123 Triumph

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 07:40 AM

Honestly Marty may have made the biggest coaching decision re: shootouts.   If you have two good shooters it's almost impossible to lose them.   If you have no good shooters it's almost impossible to win them

 

lol, how about having a look at shootout results sometime, might help you.  there's no such thing as 'two good shooters', and no such thing as 'no good shooters'.  

 

NJ was 16-6 in 2011-12 in OT/SO, they're 3-13 since.


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#124 Triumph

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 07:46 AM

DeBoer's not Johnny Mac, the irony is the biggest parallel to Johnny Mac is the team closest to us right now :P

 

But he's still getting toward gots to go territory.  He's been Robbie Ftorek at the end of '00 bad, or Larry at the beginning of '06...it just isn't working anymore and his bizarre quick hook on anyone 27-and-under isn't helping matters.

 

Robbie Ftorek's final game as Devils coach was a 5-0 loss to the Hurricanes, a team under .500 at the time, where New Jersey got outshot 37-22.  That was a Devils team that is one of the great territorial teams of all time - they would go on to outshoot the rest of the league by 190 in the playoffs.

 

If this team had won two shootouts, no one is saying boo.


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#125 coldply123

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 07:54 AM

Farewell Pete! It's only a matter of time now before the axe falls especially when you keep playing Gionta and sitting Fayne.
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#126 Triumph

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 08:34 AM

Fayne I'll grant you but Gionta played less than 8 minutes last night and had 3 shots on goal.  He's not good, but he's really not the problem.  If Lou didn't want him played, he could've sent him to Albany.


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#127 coldply123

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 08:54 AM

Fayne I'll grant you but Gionta played less than 8 minutes last night and had 3 shots on goal. He's not good, but he's really not the problem. If Lou didn't want him played, he could've sent him to Albany.


That is 8 mins too much. Lou is as much to blame for this Gionta fetish but he isn't going to wait to drop the axe either on Deboer if this continues for another week or two. If the Devils have a bad season the new owners will clean house and that includes Lou.
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#128 vadvlfan

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 09:07 AM

I'd like to see PDB not change his line combinations every other shift. How does he expect chemistry to develop when there's no consistency. He's gotta have some patience.

 

As for Larsson I think he's too laid back for his own good, which can make it look like he's not trying. He definitely needs to be more aggressive on ice and develop an edge. Opposition players seem to pick on him more than any of our other D.

Deboer stuck to his lines last night throughout the game.  As far as saying larsson is too laid back, many used to say the same thing about #27. calling him "heartless"(Nieds). because he looked so relaxed. Sal plays his heart out,  but, screws  (like on winning goal) up as does Volchie.  We spend time trying to slow down the quicker teams, rather than matching their speed. Larrson/Fahne/Green can keep up.  Sal/ volchie can't. There even a comment made by a Flame last night in intermission (interview) that you wanted to make Volchie "turn and fetch the puck. Why did he specifically say Volchie's name? maybe cause it's true?


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#129 Triumph

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 09:40 AM

That is 8 mins too much. Lou is as much to blame for this Gionta fetish but he isn't going to wait to drop the axe either on Deboer if this continues for another week or two. If the Devils have a bad season the new owners will clean house and that includes Lou.

 

You've projected the imminent firing of Lou on to Vanderbeek and now the new owners.  I think firing either DeBoer or Lamoriello would be a large mistake.  The Devils have 4 new forwards in their top 9.  Michael Ryder and Ryane Clowe have a combined 7 shots on goal in 5 game - those would be disappointing results from one of those two.  Neither guy has fit in right away.  If the players quit on the coach that's one thing, but they didn't do that last year and I don't think they'll do that this year.

 

Players like Gionta don't win and lose games, at least not in the role he's in right now.  Most teams play a goon 5-6 minutes a night, a guy who would probably struggle to get top 9 minutes in the ECHL - the Devils play a 3rd line AHLer for 10 minutes a night.  They likely wouldn't expect him to be a -10 in a full season.  It could cost them a win or two over the course of a season.  It's not why they are losing now - they've scaled back his minutes from the 14 or so he was getting at the beginning of last season.


Edited by Triumph, 12 October 2013 - 09:51 AM.

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#130 NJDevs4978

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 10:22 AM

Robbie Ftorek's final game as Devils coach was a 5-0 loss to the Hurricanes, a team under .500 at the time, where New Jersey got outshot 37-22.  That was a Devils team that is one of the great territorial teams of all time - they would go on to outshoot the rest of the league by 190 in the playoffs.

 

If this team had won two shootouts, no one is saying boo.

 

They've had nine non-shootout wins in the last 40 games.  Nine...and two of THEM were in garbagetime the last week of the season.  

 

I know nobody wants to acknolwedge last year but it's going to factor in when Pete gets fired on Thanksgiving instead of Christmas like Mac was.


Edited by NJDevs4978, 12 October 2013 - 10:24 AM.

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"The Devils have high standards, that's the difference. We have a standard to live up to every year, and a couple of teams in our area don't have the standards we do." - Pat Burns

The New Jersey Devils win Stanley Cups everywhere:
-NHL record for most road wins in the playoffs - 10-1 in '95 and 10-2 in '00
-NHL record for most home wins in the playoffs - 12-1 in '03

#131 Triumph

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 10:39 AM

They've had nine non-shootout wins in the last 40 games.  Nine...and two of THEM were in garbagetime the last week of the season.  

 

I know nobody wants to acknolwedge last year but it's going to factor in when Pete gets fired on Thanksgiving instead of Christmas like Mac was.

 

Oh good, not only do we get to select random stretches of games, we get to omit certain games as garbage time.  Then we get to omit shootout WINS but not shootout losses.  Then we get to count this year as part of last year even though the two teams are totally different.  This is rich.  Why not just say 'Out of the last 25 games the Devils have lost, the Devils have lost them?'

 

DeBoer can't coach the goalies to be good.  They were awful last year.  He can't coach the shooters to be better - they weren't good enough last year.  One thing being missed from this stretch is that the Devils are getting their share of goals - they're not drawing PPs but they're scoring 2 goals a game anyway, which is about as good as can be expected.


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#132 NJDevs4978

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 11:21 AM

Oh good, not only do we get to select random stretches of games, we get to omit certain games as garbage time.  Then we get to omit shootout WINS but not shootout losses.  Then we get to count this year as part of last year even though the two teams are totally different.  This is rich.  Why not just say 'Out of the last 25 games the Devils have lost, the Devils have lost them?'

 

DeBoer can't coach the goalies to be good.  They were awful last year.  He can't coach the shooters to be better - they weren't good enough last year.  One thing being missed from this stretch is that the Devils are getting their share of goals - they're not drawing PPs but they're scoring 2 goals a game anyway, which is about as good as can be expected.

 

I wasn't omitting shootout losses...I wasn't saying they'd lost 29 of the last 40 games, just that they'd only WON eleven out of 40 with a couple being shootout and a couple being glorified preseason tilts.  You can't have success if you can't get regulation wins when it matters, or any wins.  The crappy OT loss points are a short-term salve, and god knows the Devils aren't going to win enough OT/SO games to help there (they've won something like 4 of the last 30 or so OT games in OT) so they have to start getting regulation wins.  

 

I can probably count on two or three fingers - if that - the number of teams have have had fewer wins than the Devils over the last half-season, whether you include shootout/junktime or not.

 

Getting goals doesn't do anything net-wise if you open it up more and make more bizarre mistakes defensively because of it.


Edited by NJDevs4978, 12 October 2013 - 11:28 AM.

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"The Devils have high standards, that's the difference. We have a standard to live up to every year, and a couple of teams in our area don't have the standards we do." - Pat Burns

The New Jersey Devils win Stanley Cups everywhere:
-NHL record for most road wins in the playoffs - 10-1 in '95 and 10-2 in '00
-NHL record for most home wins in the playoffs - 12-1 in '03

#133 mouse

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 11:42 AM

I'm trying not to panic -- it's early, and there are new players who need to adjust -- but since the Cup run, DeBoer's decisions have gotten more and more questionable. I'd love to see this organization get some coaching stability, and I was hoping DeBoer would be the answer, but I just remember the Johnny Mac season, where we were saying a lot of similar things, and once they fired him, the team completely changed.My biggest regret from this year is that they ran out of time, because I think we had a better team than a couple of playoff teams, especially after trading Langenbrunner. If DeBoer is part of the problem, I'd like to see us solve that part soon. The hard part is figuring out if DeBoer is part of the problem or not. Clearly, the roster last year was bad, especially after Kovalchuk went down. IMO this roster is considerably better (at least than the roster we iced when Kovalchuk was hurt). If they don't improve soon, especially if DeBoer keeps making bad lineup decisions with the defense, bad moves that can hurt the future as well as the present, I'm not willing to blame the players, at least not 100%, and I'd like to see if someone else can give them a chance to succeed.

 

Of course, the problem is, the replacement choices leave something to be desired. Short of Lemaire coming out of retirement and creating a miracle again, I don't see anyone fixing things quickly. 


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#134 Triumph

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 11:44 AM

I wasn't omitting shootout losses...I wasn't saying they'd lost 29 of the last 40 games, just that they'd only WON eleven out of 40 with a couple being shootout and a couple being glorified preseason tilts.  You can't have success if you can't get regulation wins when it matters, or any wins.  The crappy OT loss points are a short-term salve, and god knows the Devils aren't going to win enough OT/SO games to help there (they've won something like 4 of the last 30 or so OT games in OT) so they have to start getting regulation wins.  

 

I can probably count on two or three fingers - if that - the number of teams have have had fewer wins than the Devils over the last half-season, whether you include shootout/junktime or not.

 

Getting goals doesn't do anything net-wise if you open it up more and make more bizarre mistakes defensively because of it.

 

I see literally nothing about goaltending, and so I don't need to address this post.  If your goaltending sucks you are not going to win many games without having a fantastic offense, which the Devils do not.  The Devils' goaltending sucked last year.  It could be better this year - indeed, it could be much better, if Schneider starts playing like he's capable of playing and gets the bulk of the starts.  Winning games in OT or the shootout is not a magic formula which the Devils have lost, either.


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#135 NJDevs4978

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 12:25 PM

I see literally nothing about goaltending, and so I don't need to address this post.  If your goaltending sucks you are not going to win many games without having a fantastic offense, which the Devils do not.  The Devils' goaltending sucked last year.  It could be better this year - indeed, it could be much better, if Schneider starts playing like he's capable of playing and gets the bulk of the starts.  Winning games in OT or the shootout is not a magic formula which the Devils have lost, either.

 

They scored 70 goals over the last 35 games of the season last year, they still would have lost games with average goaltending.  It wasn't just 'one' aspect of the team that failed, you make it out as such although Hedberg was historically bad. 


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"The Devils have high standards, that's the difference. We have a standard to live up to every year, and a couple of teams in our area don't have the standards we do." - Pat Burns

The New Jersey Devils win Stanley Cups everywhere:
-NHL record for most road wins in the playoffs - 10-1 in '95 and 10-2 in '00
-NHL record for most home wins in the playoffs - 12-1 in '03

#136 EdgeControl

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 12:34 PM

i cant believe pete called that goailie interference, and how he could let a player backdoor him with 2:00 left. FIRE HIM!

 

and we'll just ignore the effort this team puts forth every night, ......anyone thinking the effort is not there is spinning a false narrative

 

no way is Lou thinking about a change, most of the complaints revolve around personell, thats on lou as much as pete


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#137 caron14

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 01:00 PM

Look like this could be what the devils need

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=YvBsTrPO0p0


Edited by caron14, 12 October 2013 - 01:01 PM.

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#138 SterioDesign

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 01:16 PM

maybe his name got dropped at some point here... not sure why so many are bringing up Laviolette... But Boucher would be a Lou kind of coach don't you guys think?

 

looks badass with his scar too lol


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#139 Mike Brown

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 01:19 PM

maybe his name got dropped at some point here... not sure why so many are bringing up Laviolette... But Boucher would be a Lou kind of coach don't you guys think?

 

looks badass with his scar too lol

 

Dat 1-3-1!


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#140 MadDog2020

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Posted 12 October 2013 - 01:28 PM

@TGfireandice: Devs' D pairs: Greene-Larsson; Salvador-Zidlicky; Volchenkov-Harrold; Fayne. Sigh...
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