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Lundqvist 2013 - new pad rule?


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#21 msweet

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 12:06 PM

Lmfao, Marty is arguably the greatest goaltender of all-time. He can say whatever the fvck he wants about the Queen of No Rings.

This

 

and remember the Queen of No Rings has trashed talked Marty before


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#22 maxpower

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 12:53 PM

The use of "class" reminds me of whiny HF fans complaining about other whiny HF fans.


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#23 DJ Eco

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 12:57 PM

Don't feed the troll.


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#24 Devilsfan118

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 01:53 PM

The use of "class" reminds me of whiny HF fans complaining about other whiny HF fans.


How many classless Subans are we talking here?

"Class" is one of the most hilariously overused words on that forum, please everyone don't let it bleed over here. A player lacking "class" essentially translates to "he said something I don't like".
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#25 Mike Brown

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 01:53 PM

Marty isn't an angel.  But he's well respected throughout the league.


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#26 Satans Hockey

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 01:56 PM

So glad you are back on the boards to post 50 blog posts and call Brodeur a "classless tool" (wtf? really?). You still can't stay civilized when the Devils get the better of the Rangers. And if you can't do that, no need to come back here again.


This x1000. I'm sick of these threads with links to your blogs. Nobody gives a sh!t.
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#27 ironsights

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 02:09 PM

Marty isn't an angel.  But he's well respected throughout the league.

He's a Devil !


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#28 StarDew

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 03:40 PM

Back to ignoring the OP.  SSDD from him. :blahblah:

 

I thought this was the Embarrassment thread.  Sorry Z-Man.  I would never put you on ignore.  I meant the "Classless Tool" poster.

 

ETA: correcting my big error.


Edited by StarDew, 20 October 2013 - 03:55 PM.

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#29 mouse

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Posted 20 October 2013 - 03:48 PM

You are the only classless tool on this board. Go cry into the Queens jock. Marty is absolutely correct and good for him to call that loser out on it.

I initially had this image of him crying into the jock of someone from Queens. Like a fat Rags fan from Howard Beach with a sleeveless shirt and some terrible jewelry.


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#30 thecoffeecake

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Posted 21 October 2013 - 01:44 PM

Like a fat Rags fan from Howard Beach with a sleeveless shirt and some terrible jewelry.

Thats what they all look like to me.
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#31 Derek21

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Posted 21 October 2013 - 09:57 PM

Yep, here we go again with the cheap shots.  The patented Derek21 meltdown shouldn't be too far behind.

 

It's a Devils website genius...do you think it's a real good idea to come on here and call the greatest player in this franchise's history "a classless tool"?  Surely you can go do that on some Rangers site where you can all crack jokes about Marty's weight and call his team the "Debbies"...Ranger fans have always been such cut-ups that way.

 

The reason a lot of the board would like to see Brodeur retire is not because they don't respect him or his resume (though some Devils fans definitely have short memories)...it's because no one wants to see it get ugly for him (though it kind of already has)...it's been discussed in various threads, but no one really enjoys watching a long-time legend struggle to barely be a shell of what he was.  That being said, as Marty likely thinks he's still got something left, and the franchise is not ever going to embarrass him, he'll play out this final season and hopefully do it as a passable level.  Probably won't be pretty, but it's a small price to pay for everything he's given the Devils over two decades, and if Schneider can continue to do what he has so far, Marty shouldn't get much more than 25 games.   

 

I respect him as a player. But he likes to take subtle shots. I don't respect that. When they ask Lundqvist about it, he took the high road. He should mind his business. I respect Marty's accomplishments. Probably the biggest is his durability. The best comparison I can come up with is Ripken. I gave him plenty of credit for outperforming Hank in 2012. He was better. I can take it. I have no problem losing to the Devils. Even though it hurt and I went for a long walk before composing my thoughts. It was still a great year.

 

I don't like seeing a legend struggle either. It's not fun seeing him give up so many bad goals. Not the way you want him to go out. However, it's a long season. That's why it's premature to write him off. The same with Lundqvist, who's deservedly take it on the chin. Nothing is decided in 7-8 games. I like to wait until the quarter mark before really assessing.

 

As for where Marty ranks all-time, I have my opinion. Not worth debating unless people are open to it.


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#32 devilsfan26

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Posted 21 October 2013 - 10:59 PM

As for where Marty ranks all-time, I have my opinion. Not worth debating unless people are open to it.

Alright so then obviously your opinion is different than most on this forum.  Nobody asked you where you think Marty ranks all-time, so why even bother posting this sentence other than to incite?  Why do you post here when there is no shortage of Rangers forums for you?  I never understood this before you left and now I really don't understand why you came back.


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#33 Mike Brown

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Posted 21 October 2013 - 11:22 PM

TOP 6 BEST ALL TIME

Hasek

Roy

Plante

Dryden

Brodeur

Sawchuk

 

TOP 6 GREATEST ALL TIME

Roy

Brodeur

Plante

Hasek

Sawchuk

Dryden


Edited by Mike Brown, 21 October 2013 - 11:25 PM.

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#34 AEWHistory

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Posted 21 October 2013 - 11:57 PM

I love any chance to mock Lundqvist as anybody here.  But none of the goals tonight with the exception of the Zubrus goal could have possibly been because of the pads.  Zubrus's goal went 5-hole I believe.  However, imo all of the goals were scored because of bad goaltending.
 
Bad rebound control led to the Lokti goal.  
The Henrique goal was simply one he should have stopped.  Not trying to take away from the shot though.  That was a sizzler.
The Ryder goal may have been because of a screen, but to me it should have been stopped.
The Zubrus goal was also a bad rebound goal that went 5-hole.


I think it is possible that the change in the pad rules has led to a short in play style for net minders used to relying on bedroom mattresses instead of goalie pads. This may even be subconscious, but I tend to think it would cause tiny shifts in how they may set themselves, when they commit, etc. So even though I didn't see the game, and I trust that you are correct, I thnk it is worth noting that goals may have been caused by the new pad rules, albeit indirectly, even if the puck was not near the pads when it went in.

That is my philosophy at least....
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#35 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 22 October 2013 - 06:35 AM

I respect him as a player. But he likes to take subtle shots. I don't respect that. When they ask Lundqvist about it, he took the high road. He should mind his business. I respect Marty's accomplishments. Probably the biggest is his durability. The best comparison I can come up with is Ripken. I gave him plenty of credit for outperforming Hank in 2012. He was better. I can take it. I have no problem losing to the Devils. Even though it hurt and I went for a long walk before composing my thoughts. It was still a great year.

 

I don't like seeing a legend struggle either. It's not fun seeing him give up so many bad goals. Not the way you want him to go out. However, it's a long season. That's why it's premature to write him off. The same with Lundqvist, who's deservedly take it on the chin. Nothing is decided in 7-8 games. I like to wait until the quarter mark before really assessing.

 

As for where Marty ranks all-time, I have my opinion. Not worth debating unless people are open to it.

 

Re:  writing Marty off prematurely, if he was at a different stage in his career, and there wasn't a guy who can clearly be an effective #1 on the roster, I'd be preaching patience for sure.  But the numbers are what they are.  He has an .878 save% in his last 18 games (dating back to last season).  He's been up-and-down since the start of the 2010-11 season...his overall regular season save% since that season began is .903 (well below his career .913)...and that includes a couple of nice runs (.923 save% over the final 29 games of 2010-11, .923 save% over the last 27 games of 2011-12).  Problem is it took him a long time in both of those seasons to get it going...it was great when he did, but the Devils aren't in a position where they can give him until January or February to start playing well, especially when they go winless in their first seven games, and even more so when there's a guy who's simply better right now.  Though nothing is decided in 7-8 games, this is one of those situations where DeBoer had to make a judgment call, and based on recent history, I think he's making the right one, but at the same time, he can't bail on Schneider the first time he gives up four or five goals either.    

 

As far as the all-time goalie debate goes, I can only stick to guys I saw play, but I've always maintained:

 

Best pure puck-stopper:  Hasek

Best clutch performer:  Roy

Best all-arounder, most durable:  Brodeur

 

Though Brodeur gets credit for durability (as he should) and for having a very long prime, Roy clearly still could've kept playing if he wanted to...he put up .925 and .920 save%s in his final two years with the Avs...he was not showing any real signs of noticable decline.  Though he wasn't always starting 70+ games like Marty, he started 60+ every year from 1991-92 through 2002-03 (with the exception of '95 of course), right through the end of his career.  Roy doesn't get enough credit for being pretty durable himself, and the fact that his prime was also freakishly long. 

 

Hasek's overall numbers are thrown off because his career started so late, but he was pretty amazing at the end of his career too, given his age...his last two seasons (he was 42 and 43 at the end of each year) he went a combined 65-21-9, had GAAs of 2.05 and 2.14, and a combined save% of .909.  Clearly he was playing for a couple of terrific Red Wings teams, but the fact that he was able to provide competent goaltending as he was approaching his mid-40s is a hell of an accomplishment.    

 

What's fair to say is that Brodeur is going out worse than the other two...Roy and Hasek were helped by playing on better teams than Marty is on right now, but neither player had anyone debating whether or not they had hung on too long...in Roy's case, it's actually the opposite.  Sadly, people are now wondering that about Marty. 


Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976, 22 October 2013 - 06:41 AM.

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Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
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Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

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#36 Daniel

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Posted 22 October 2013 - 09:41 AM

Re:  writing Marty off prematurely, if he was at a different stage in his career, and there wasn't a guy who can clearly be an effective #1 on the roster, I'd be preaching patience for sure.  But the numbers are what they are.  He has an .878 save% in his last 18 games (dating back to last season).  He's been up-and-down since the start of the 2010-11 season...his overall regular season save% since that season began is .903 (well below his career .913)...and that includes a couple of nice runs (.923 save% over the final 29 games of 2010-11, .923 save% over the last 27 games of 2011-12).  Problem is it took him a long time in both of those seasons to get it going...it was great when he did, but the Devils aren't in a position where they can give him until January or February to start playing well, especially when they go winless in their first seven games, and even more so when there's a guy who's simply better right now.  Though nothing is decided in 7-8 games, this is one of those situations where DeBoer had to make a judgment call, and based on recent history, I think he's making the right one, but at the same time, he can't bail on Schneider the first time he gives up four or five goals either.    

 

As far as the all-time goalie debate goes, I can only stick to guys I saw play, but I've always maintained:

 

Best pure puck-stopper:  Hasek

Best clutch performer:  Roy

Best all-arounder, most durable:  Brodeur

 

Though Brodeur gets credit for durability (as he should) and for having a very long prime, Roy clearly still could've kept playing if he wanted to...he put up .925 and .920 save%s in his final two years with the Avs...he was not showing any real signs of noticable decline.  Though he wasn't always starting 70+ games like Marty, he started 60+ every year from 1991-92 through 2002-03 (with the exception of '95 of course), right through the end of his career.  Roy doesn't get enough credit for being pretty durable himself, and the fact that his prime was also freakishly long. 

 

Hasek's overall numbers are thrown off because his career started so late, but he was pretty amazing at the end of his career too, given his age...his last two seasons (he was 42 and 43 at the end of each year) he went a combined 65-21-9, had GAAs of 2.05 and 2.14, and a combined save% of .909.  Clearly he was playing for a couple of terrific Red Wings teams, but the fact that he was able to provide competent goaltending as he was approaching his mid-40s is a hell of an accomplishment.    

 

What's fair to say is that Brodeur is going out worse than the other two...Roy and Hasek were helped by playing on better teams than Marty is on right now, but neither player had anyone debating whether or not they had hung on too long...in Roy's case, it's actually the opposite.  Sadly, people are now wondering that about Marty. 

 

Remember with Roy though that it got pretty ugly at the end in Montreal.  It's too far back though for me to remember whether the departure was similar to Clemens leaving Boston, leaving the steroid issue out of the equation.  If you remember, his last year in Boston was not very good, to the point where Dan Duquette basically came out and said he was past his prime.  


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#37 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 22 October 2013 - 09:50 AM

Remember with Roy though that it got pretty ugly at the end in Montreal.  It's too far back though for me to remember whether the departure was similar to Clemens leaving Boston, leaving the steroid issue out of the equation.  If you remember, his last year in Boston was not very good, to the point where Dan Duquette basically came out and said he was past his prime.  

 

I'm only talking about the end of Roy's career, where it's clear he remained a top #1-type netminder right up until the very end (he was incredibly consistent with the Avs).  Re:  Montreal, sh!t happens...yeah, got ugly just before he got traded, but he's not the first guy who finally got tired of everything that comes with playing there, and his coach (Mario Tremblay) didn't have to leave him in a game where he clearly didn't have it, just to be a dick (and it's not like Tremblay showed himself to be a great coach after the fact). 

 

Montreal clearly backed the wrong horse in that one.    


Edited by Colorado Rockies 1976, 22 October 2013 - 10:00 AM.

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Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
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It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

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#38 DJ Eco

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Posted 22 October 2013 - 10:11 AM

Remember with Roy though that it got pretty ugly at the end in Montreal.  It's too far back though for me to remember whether the departure was similar to Clemens leaving Boston, leaving the steroid issue out of the equation.  If you remember, his last year in Boston was not very good, to the point where Dan Duquette basically came out and said he was past his prime.  

 

Roy let in like 7 goals and was angry at the coach for not pulling him earlier. On his way off the ice, he passed the Habs' owner, I think, and demanded a trade immediately. He got traded to Colorado a few days later... Little whiny biatch...


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#39 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 22 October 2013 - 10:30 AM

Roy let in like 7 goals and was angry at the coach for not pulling him earlier. On his way off the ice, he passed the Habs' owner, I think, and demanded a trade immediately. He got traded to Colorado a few days later... Little whiny biatch...

 

Let in 5 goals on 17 shots in the first period, then gave up 4 more in the second.  The crowd mocked-cheered him everytime he made a routine save after 7 goals (he gave a sarcastic salute back), then after he was finally pulled after the 9th goal (about halfway through the second), he told the team president (Ronald Corey) that he was done with Montreal.  He said he wouldn't have demanded a trade if he'd been taken out after the first period, but he felt like Tremblay was trying to humiliate him. 

 

Tremblay is as much to blame, as was the organization...Tremblay and Roy had a pretty lousy history, and Tremblay had never been a coach before...not sure why Montreal thought that was going to work.  I get that no team wants to give the impression that the players are calling the shots, but hiring Tremblay was clearly an odd move.   


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THE NHL MUST LOVE THE DEVILS - from who else? A RANGER fan!
[Mark Messier]: A big, bald attention whore with a stupid Easter Island-lookin face. - from who else? DaneykoIsGod!

Even when Marty comes back maybe Larry should put Clemmensen to be on the goal during the shootouts.
Can the coach do that ? Switch the goalies 5 seconds to go in overtime?
- Most priceless quote ever posted on a message board.

Martin Brodeur: THE MOST ALL-TIME WINS!, 12 straight seasons of 30+ wins, 3 Stanley Cups, 4 Vezina Trophies, and zero respect from too many so-called Devils "fans" who are either too young or too bandwagon to remember the much darker days of Sean Burke, Craig Billington, Bob Sauve, Alain Chevrier, and the talented but overwhelmed Chico Resch, among many others.

It's easy to support a great player when he's playing at his very best. It takes a true fan to support that same player during those rare moments and stretches when he's not. Babe Ruth went 0-4 some games, and sometimes Wayne Gretzky was held pointless. There may be such a thing as greatness, but no such thing as absolute perfection every single night.

#30 FOREVER!

20 out of 1,946 njdevs.com members agree: CR1976 is the Most Knowledgable Poster of 2008! Victory is mine...oh yes, victory is mine!

#40 devils102

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Posted 22 October 2013 - 10:48 AM

I don't think it's fair to say Lundqvist's struggles this year are due to smaller pads anymore than it's fair to say Brodeur's struggles this year are due to smaller pads. It's 8 games into the season.

 

I haven't watched the Rangers closely enough to say whether every goal he's let in this year has been bad, but from what I HAVE seen (our game and highlights from San Jose) shooters are get better chances against him than they have in the past. It seems like we never got second looks like the ones Zubrus and Loktionov scored off of the other night.

 

Granted, it seemed like Lundqvist ALWAYS stopped shots like the one Henrique scored on (I still can't believe Zajac scored off that wrister in the 2012 playoffs) but that was a high slapper and had nothing to do with pad size.

 

The Rangers suck so far this year from top to bottom, and as we've seen on this forum it's hard to pinpoint one reason why that kind of thing can happen.

 

Don't get me wrong I'm a hug Devils fan and for as long as Lundqvist decides to suck I will continue to enjoy it.

 

But I don't think we can attribute it solely to pad size and say he actually sucked his career and now he's being exposed.

 

Maybe pad size effects the way he plays certain shots and he's still getting used to a slightly altered style. But that's as far as I'll go.


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