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2013-2014 Attendance


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#281 DJ Eco

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 04:06 PM

I always appreciate teachers and I believe a vast majority are good, honest and hard-working people.  However, why do they always get the "untouchable" label thrown at them by a good chunk of society and why are they getting free tickets for a job that is not really far off from what I and most people in the private sector do?

 

I don't think they're "untouchable". I think teachers in 2014 are about as disrespected and held in low regard as they've ever been in the history of the profession. They're teaching our kids and in wayyyy too many cases, they're our last hope for raising our kids the right way because so many of today's parents don't know how to.

 

I wouldn't put teachers in the same bracket as veterans, I don't think we should honor a teacher on the jumbotron every game, but what they do is incredibly important. Definitely more important than any of the bullsh!t luxury architecture/design I do for rich New Yorkers, in the grand scheme of things, and most likely more important than the average desk job in the general impact it has on us and our country's future.


Edited by DJ Eco, 13 January 2014 - 04:07 PM.

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#282 DJ Eco

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 04:11 PM

Most people dislike teachers unions, not teacher themselves.  That's another debate right there though.

 

Most people dislike union anything, and then complain about their longer hours and cut benefits and frozen pay. I wish the field I'm in had a union, but alas it doesn't.

 

The same a$$holes in the government that were wearing NYPD lapels and "First Responder" hats were the ones signing laws cutting first responders' medical benefits. A lot of the same goes for how much our country "respects" its soldiers as well. They all "support the troops" until they come back and are costing their constituents money for medical expenses, mental health programs, and education.

 

But yeah, I'm going off into a tangent. 


Edited by DJ Eco, 13 January 2014 - 04:14 PM.

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#283 DevsMan84

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 04:18 PM

I don't think they're "untouchable". I think teachers in 2014 are about as disrespected and held in low regard as they've ever been in the history of the profession. They're teaching our kids and in wayyyy too many cases, they're our last hope for raising our kids the right way because so many of today's parents don't know how to.

 

I wouldn't put teachers in the same bracket as veterans, I don't think we should honor a teacher on the jumbotron every game, but what they do is incredibly important. Definitely more important than any of the bullsh!t luxury architecture/design I do for rich New Yorkers, in the grand scheme of things, and most likely more important than the average desk job in the general impact it has on us and our country's future.

 

A lot of people are angry at their union, not teachers themselves.  However it gets lost in the translation so I can understand why a lot of teachers feel it is directed at them (and a lot of times it is unfortuantely mis-directed at them instead of the union).

 

Yeah I am not big on unions but that is another debate.  However, I think my paragraph above still holds true.


Most people dislike union anything, and then complain about their longer hours and cut benefits and frozen pay. I wish the field I'm in had a union, but alas it doesn't.

 

The same a$$holes in the government that were wearing NYPD lapels and "First Responder" hats were the ones signing laws cutting first responders' medical benefits. A lot of the same goes for how much our country "respects" its soldiers as well. They all "support the troops" until they come back and are costing their constituents money for medical expenses, mental health programs, and education.

 

But yeah, I'm going off into a tangent. 

 

 

Oh believe me I agree with you on this part.  That's on the politicians though and not the first responders.


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#284 DJ Eco

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 04:19 PM

A lot of people are angry at their union, not teachers themselves.  However it gets lost in the translation so I can understand why a lot of teachers feel it is directed at them (and a lot of times it is unfortuantely mis-directed at them instead of the union).

 

Yeah I am not big on unions but that is another debate.  However, I think my paragraph above still holds true.


 

 

Oh believe me I agree with you on this part.  That's on the politicians though and not the first responders.

 

True that!


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#285 CarterforPresident

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 04:32 PM

Half the kids don't respect teachers now a days. Its hard for a 18 yr old to respect a 22 yr old teacher. Kids don't hesitate to talk back anymore to teachers either now a days.
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#286 DevsMan84

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 04:36 PM

Half the kids don't respect teachers now a days. Its hard for a 18 yr old to respect a 22 yr old teacher. Kids don't hesitate to talk back anymore to teachers either now a days.

 

That's up to the parents to teach kids how to behave.  Unfortunately in today's society you can never criticize or hurt the precious little snowflake's feelings in any way.


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#287 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 04:52 PM

That's up to the parents to teach kids how to behave.  Unfortunately in today's society you can never criticize or hurt the precious little snowflake's feelings in any way.

 

Not to go off topic, but AGREED.


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#288 Mike Brown

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 04:52 PM

You care so much about game to game attendance that you keep a running tally on it yet you say where the devils rank in attendance doesn't matter.

You never seen to keep your opinions straight on anything.

 

First of all, the Devils can never be first in attendance due to the size of the arena.  I keep a tally of the Devils attendance just because.  It's not because I care about it per se.  Besides, the only thing I do keep an eye on is the percentage.


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#289 CarterforPresident

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 05:16 PM

In general we have expensive tickets we could lower them
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#290 DJ Eco

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 05:22 PM

That's up to the parents to teach kids how to behave.  Unfortunately in today's society you can never criticize or hurt the precious little snowflake's feelings in any way.

 

Unfortunately, my friends who are teachers can barely discipline their students without these kids' parents getting upset and angrily calling the principal (teacher has to attend a meeting, fill out a form, write out a statement, sometimes apologize, it's ABSURD)...

 

Doesn't set a good precedent raising our kids that way, especially when they end up in the workforce. I'm only 27, but it wasn't like that when I was a kid.


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#291 CarterforPresident

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 05:31 PM

I graduated last year. I can say from my county wide school, teachers get disrespect alot in today's world. Has a lot to do with everything now a days. And a number teachers take the power walk. I PErsonally rather the older teachers. There better at it and get more respect.

Unfortunately, my friends who are teachers can barely discipline their students without these kids' parents getting upset and angrily calling the principal (teacher has to attend a meeting, fill out a form, write out a statement, sometimes apologize, it's ABSURD)...

Doesn't set a good precedent raising our kids that way, especially when they end up in the workforce. I'm only 27, but it wasn't like that when I was a kid.


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#292 2ELIAS6

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Posted 13 January 2014 - 11:11 PM

I respect you and your family for that, and I guess I should take a bit back from what I said. What I really mean is that the "Hero of the Game" eventually became some kind of game-by-game tradition, which is fine, but it's lost its sincerity, kind of like the typical politician with the American flag lapel. I have the utmost respect for someone who chooses to enlist in the army, but I don't think it needs to be hammered into our brain that we should regard them all as heroes, more specifically when it's some soldier who hasn't really done all of much in their career yet but be stationed nearby. The soldiers they feature who have done many tours abroad and have "seen some sh!t", I regard as heroes.
 
In the context of the discussion though, I guess it's neither here nor there. Sik02GT posted saying that we should honor the military more, and that the ONE GAME teachers get a deal on tickets is somehow out of line. I fundamentally disagree.

again i wasnt saying that the teachers didnt deserve to get some ticket deal .. i didnt understand why? if it was some type of promo things towards teachers or to show some type of appreciation towards educators ok i get it... just didnt know why only teachers were getting free tickets.. personally i dont think its some type of job that deserves an honoring as such... i would think that your armed forces, first responders, the people that put their lives on the line every day to keep others safe and to make a living to support their own families... are the ones that deserve the most out of all of us.. for obvious reasons they sacrifice the most and their is no arguing that.
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#293 DJ Eco

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 02:38 PM

personally i dont think its some type of job that deserves an honoring as such... i would think that your armed forces, first responders, the people that put their lives on the line every day to keep others safe and to make a living to support their own families... are the ones that deserve the most out of all of us.. for obvious reasons they sacrifice the most and their is no arguing that.

 

And they do... You don't think they give free tickets out to veterans? They do, probably every game.


Edited by DJ Eco, 14 January 2014 - 02:38 PM.

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#294 ATLL765

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 03:44 PM

I think your previous statement is valid. I have no problems with military personnel as well as first responders getting free tickets. But why teachers? What do they do that is different than my private sector desk job?

Ok and what does some dude in the army reserves do for me? They sign up for it, then they deserve extra praise? Ridiculous. It's a job, that they signed up for. If they happened to go to war and all that jazz, sure, thanks for your service, but the pedestal some people put them on is insane. What's more important, being literate or being able to fight a war? To me, it's being literate.


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#295 DevsMan84

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 03:50 PM

Ok and what does some dude in the army reserves do for me? They sign up for it, then they deserve extra praise? Ridiculous. It's a job, that they signed up for. If they happened to go to war and all that jazz, sure, thanks for your service, but the pedestal some people put them on is insane. What's more important, being literate or being able to fight a war? To me, it's being literate.

 

The chances of being killed on the job being in the army reserve is much higher than a teacher.  Same goes for police officer, firemen, etc.  Yeah I think they deserve a ticket.

 

I am not trying to make this an arguement over who deserves it more.  I have no problems with military personnel, first responders and even teachers getting free tickets.  However, if you are giving a profession that is pretty much a desk job like teachers, then what about me who also has a desk job but in the private sector?

 

Again this is on the Devils to explain this to me, not teachers.


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#296 dmann422

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 04:04 PM

The chances of being killed on the job being in the army reserve is much higher than a teacher. Same goes for police officer, firemen, etc. Yeah I think they deserve a ticket.

I am not trying to make this an arguement over who deserves it more. I have no problems with military personnel, first responders and even teachers getting free tickets. However, if you are giving a profession that is pretty much a desk job like teachers, then what about me who also has a desk job but in the private sector?

Again this is on the Devils to explain this to me, not teachers.

I gave you an answer a page back- you cannot compare the private sector to public education, and the fact that it's a desk job means nothing. There are plenty of military servicemen who have desk jobs and we don't honor them any less.

Again, the education of every citizen is a public trust as essential to our society as is the military or law enforcement, that is why they should be honored. I don't see how doing so takes away from honoring military servicemen. Why can't we hold all public servants in a high regard?

If the only reason we honor these people is the risk involved in their profession, then why do we not honor construction workers before games? Statistically speaking they have the most dangerous job. It's because we don't honor them for the risk they take but the fact they they are serving their country/community.

Edited by dmann422, 14 January 2014 - 04:12 PM.

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#297 DevsMan84

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 04:21 PM

I gave you an answer a page back- you cannot compare the private sector to public education, and the fact that it's a desk job means nothing. There are plenty of military servicemen who have desk jobs and we don't honor them any less.

Again, the education of every citizen is a public trust as essential to our society as is the military or law enforcement, that is why they should be honored. I don't see how doing so takes away from honoring military servicemen. Why can't we hold all public servants in a high regard?

If the only reason we honor these people is the risk involved in their profession, then why do we not honor construction workers before games? Statistically speaking they have the most dangerous job. It's because we don't honor them for the risk they take but the fact they they are serving their country/community.

 

I really hate that sweeping label applied to every person who gets their paycheck from either the local, state or federal government.  That implies they are making a sacrifice or taking a risk for the sake of the greater good.  Outside military personnel and first responders who risk their lives on a daily basis, this is simply not true.

 

We don't honor contruction workers because they do not fall under that sweeping "public servant" label that you just used.  It seems like everyone who works in the private sector are doing it just for greed or necessity while anyone who draws a paycheck from the government are doing it for the greater good.  As I just said before this is completely false.  I would honor construction workers as well as any profession as I believe every job is neccessary, no matter how small.  If it wasn't, the job would simply not exist.


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#298 ATLL765

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 04:31 PM

The chances of being killed on the job being in the army reserve is much higher than a teacher.  Same goes for police officer, firemen, etc.  Yeah I think they deserve a ticket.

 

I am not trying to make this an arguement over who deserves it more.  I have no problems with military personnel, first responders and even teachers getting free tickets.  However, if you are giving a profession that is pretty much a desk job like teachers, then what about me who also has a desk job but in the private sector?

 

Again this is on the Devils to explain this to me, not teachers.

Maybe it's because, overall, teachers are underpaid and cops are paid fairly well in this state. Not to mention police and fire unions are some of the strongest in the nation and certainly this state, as no one has the balls to say their pensions are nuts. I'd love to get a cop's salary and pension where they bump your salary up the last few years to get you extra $$. Hell, I'd take getting a gun pointed at me for it too, maybe even on a regular basis. My town has 26 cops and 0 crime, Hunterdon County's(where I live) featured fugitive last week was some 5'4" chick who skipped her pre-trial intervention bullsh!t on a narcotics charge. These people are getting paid $80-100k to track down people like that???? This state WASTES money on police like nobody's business. I'd do it for half the pay and it'd still be a waste of money. They don't need extra help unless they're the poor guys getting stuck working in Newark, Trenton, Camden, AC or other such places where they get paid like teachers and actually do encounter dangerous situations.

Then the ridiculously inconsistent application of the law based on who you are is too much for me to be able to respect the organization. Not just because they're police, but because it's asinine. Any reason why municipal vehicles in the towns near me don't get ticketed for never having been inspected? Yet I get pulled over every 3 days for not wearing a damn seatbelt or because my tail light goes out occasionally until I kick it and then they get fed bs to intimidate me...know how many times I've heard, "I'm gonna call the K9 unit" just because I said there's no way you are searching my car without a warrant, especially when I'm not even getting pulled over for a moving violation. I can't take police seriously when they don't take their job seriously, the job of protecting citizen's rights and not the us vs them game they all seem to be playing. They also commit just as many violent crimes as the general population, or at least did so in the year 2010, yet they almost never are prosecuted and even fewer convicted. Why are they held on high? I do not get it, at all. Not trying to bash cops, I just think they're nothing to praise anymore than a regular person. There's nice cops and a$$hole cops, as there is in any organization, but the inconsistency is too much to ignore for me.

If cops deserve a ticket, everyone on the planet deserves a free ticket imo.


Edited by ATLL765, 14 January 2014 - 04:33 PM.

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#299 DevsMan84

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 04:38 PM

Maybe it's because, overall, teachers are underpaid and cops are paid fairly well in this state. Not to mention police and fire unions are some of the strongest in the nation and certainly this state, as no one has the balls to say their pensions are nuts. I'd love to get a cop's salary and pension where they bump your salary up the last few years to get you extra $$. Hell, I'd take getting a gun pointed at me for it too, maybe even on a regular basis. My town has 26 cops and 0 crime, Hunterdon County's(where I live) featured fugitive last week was some 5'4" chick who skipped her pre-trial intervention bullsh!t on a narcotics charge. These people are getting paid $80-100k to track down people like that???? This state WASTES money on police like nobody's business. I'd do it for half the pay and it'd still be a waste of money. They don't need extra help unless they're the poor guys getting stuck working in Newark, Trenton, Camden, AC or other such places where they get paid like teachers and actually do encounter dangerous situations.

Then the ridiculously inconsistent application of the law based on who you are is too much for me to be able to respect the organization. Not just because they're police, but because it's asinine. Any reason why municipal vehicles in the towns near me don't get ticketed for never having been inspected? Yet I get pulled over every 3 days for not wearing a damn seatbelt or because my tail light goes out occasionally until I kick it and then they get fed bs to intimidate me into admitting things...know how many times I've heard, "I'm gonna call the K9 unit" just because I said there's no way you are searching my car without a warrant, especially when I'm not even getting pulled over for a moving violation. I can't take police seriously when they don't take their job seriously, the job of protecting citizen's rights and not the us vs them game they all seem to be playing. They also commit just as many violent crimes as the general population, or at least did so in the year 2010, yet they almost never are prosecuted and even fewer convicted. Why are they held on high? I do not get it, at all. Not trying to bash cops, I just think they're nothing to praise anymore than a regular person. There's nice cops and a$$hole cops, as there is in any organization, but the inconsistency is too much to ignore for me.

If cops deserve a ticket, everyone on the planet deserves a free ticket imo.

 

I hope you are not serious with this statement.

 

I wish I had guaranteed annual salary increases, premium health benefits (with little to no contributions towards it), full pension, large amount of sick/vacation days that can be rolled over and banked as well as tenure.  I do agree in the grand scheme of things that teachers, cops, firement, etc should be paid more for what they do, but they are not exactly licking the curb poor either.  If the money was as bad as a lot of these public employees make it out to be, then there would always be severe shortages of these jobs but there isn't.

 

Also teacher's unions are just as strong as any public employee union there is, so not sure why you singled out the cops and firemen's union.


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#300 dmann422

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Posted 14 January 2014 - 04:40 PM

I really hate that sweeping label applied to every person who gets their paycheck from either the local, state or federal government. That implies they are making a sacrifice or taking a risk for the sake of the greater good. Outside military personnel and first responders who risk their lives on a daily basis, this is simply not true.

We don't honor contruction workers because they do not fall under that sweeping "public servant" label that you just used. It seems like everyone who works in the private sector are doing it just for greed or necessity while anyone who draws a paycheck from the government are doing it for the greater good. As I just said before this is completely false. I would honor construction workers as well as any profession as I believe every job is neccessary, no matter how small. If it wasn't, the job would simply not exist.

ok, you picked two words to respond to specifically, yet disregarded the entire meat of the answer to your question. Again, we do not necessarily honor military members for risking their lives, as has been pointed out there are many members of the military that never put their lives at risk. We honor them for their public service.

Public servant is a generic term in this sense- I know it's a spark plug for many but it's basic meaning is a person who serves the public interests. It has nothing to do with a paycheck.

Teachers are as essential to the functioning of our society as servicemen and women and deserve to be held in just as high regard. Fortunately many will recognize this and unfortunately some don't.

Since this is the attendance thread I'll just leave it at we can agree to disagree and have a difference of opinion, luckily we live in a country where the military protects that freedom and teachers promote it in our youth.
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