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Negative or Positive Contract Value - You Decide


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#61 coldply123

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Posted 23 January 2014 - 07:38 PM

Neutral is Schneider? Guy signed for 4.25M, has an additional year on the contract, is an elite goalie and that's neutral? Steve Mason just signed Cory Schneider's contract. Lundqvist makes twice as much starting next year.


I need a bigger sample size and he needs to play more. I believe next year he will be a positive value contract but I still don't like how he's being handled with Brodeur stil being here.
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#62 Triumph

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Posted 23 January 2014 - 08:18 PM

I need a bigger sample size and he needs to play more. I believe next year he will be a positive value contract but I still don't like how he's being handled with Brodeur stil being here.

 

One win in free agency is worth $3.1 million.  Between 5 and 6 goals is worth one win.  Thankfully goalies are easy to measure in this regard - average save percentage is .914, Schneider is at .926.  He would've allowed 7 more goals with a .914, so already we're at around $3.5 million above average - he's way more than that above replacement level (and indeed, replacement level goaltending would cost a minimum contract, which is $550,000 - Schneider's contract is therefore $3.7 million above replacement).  And I haven't factored in NJ's horrible scorer which costs Schneider a save or two every night he plays in Newark.  Schneider should be paid probably twice as much but NJ has him under control for another year at his very inexpensive price.


Edited by Triumph, 23 January 2014 - 08:19 PM.

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#63 cgb6397

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Posted 23 January 2014 - 10:34 PM

Bernier is absolutely positive. He can be a serviceable second line forward, but isn't because of the team's makeup. If that doesn't spell a good fourth liner, I don't know what does. I would also call Henrique positive, and Zajac "neutral". In both cases, we overpaid a little to make sure we could lock up two, fairly young homegrown centers, both of whom haven't played terribly, just not quite up to scoring expectations.

 

This teams two biggest contractual issues are the old defensemen, Sal contributes nothing to this team, and is our captain to boot. Volchenkov at least provides more on the ice, but is still a piss poor contract.


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#64 ThreeCups

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Posted 23 January 2014 - 10:43 PM

Schneider signs with the Devils for.....7 years, $45M

 

EDIT:  I am hoping for something like 5/30 but do not think he will take that.

 

If he leaves during FA, this is a massive fail for Mr. Lamoriello


Edited by ThreeCups, 23 January 2014 - 10:44 PM.

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#65 Marshall

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 04:18 AM

Schneider signs with the Devils for.....7 years, $45M

 

EDIT:  I am hoping for something like 5/30 but do not think he will take that.

 

If he leaves during FA, this is a massive fail for Mr. Lamoriello

 

When he can go UFA, there'll a half dozen teams (maybe) needing goalies. That's not even factoring in how many goalies that'll be available. There won't be much of a market and I doubt any of them will be a better fit than NJ for Cory.


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#66 coldply123

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 06:07 AM

Bernier is absolutely positive. He can be a serviceable second line forward, but isn't because of the team's makeup. If that doesn't spell a good fourth liner, I don't know what does. I would also call Henrique positive, and Zajac "neutral". In both cases, we overpaid a little to make sure we could lock up two, fairly young homegrown centers, both of whom haven't played terribly, just not quite up to scoring expectations.

This teams two biggest contractual issues are the old defensemen, Sal contributes nothing to this team, and is our captain to boot. Volchenkov at least provides more on the ice, but is still a piss poor contract.


Bernier has been abominably bad to the point that he should be paying the Devils. I mean he's just been awful.
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#67 mouse

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 10:19 AM

Bernier has been abominably bad to the point that he should be paying the Devils. I mean he's just been awful.

We watching the same team? He's no superstar, but he's playing on the 4th line. He's done a decent job as a fill in on the good lines too.


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#68 Devilsfan118

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 10:37 AM

We watching the same team? He's no superstar, but he's playing on the 4th line. He's done a decent job as a fill in on the good lines too.


He's a place filler with a big body. He really hasn't done much this year.

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#69 coldply123

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 12:41 PM

We watching the same team? He's no superstar, but he's playing on the 4th line. He's done a decent job as a fill in on the good lines too.


We do but apparently you don't watch Bernier when he's on the ice. His play has been awful, other Devils fans I sit next to at games are saying the same thing, and he's done literally nothing offensively after that OT goal against the Sabres.

People need to stop with this 4th line obsession. It's over for that group and they need to be chucked off the roster this offseason and bring in fresh energy players.

He's a place filler with a big body. He really hasn't done much this year.

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He's another of Deboers favorites. That's Pete's MO with these guys. As long as he likes you, you will play, regardless of how terrible you actually are.
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#70 Devilsfan118

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 12:56 PM

Listen, I mean I like Carter, Bernier and (to a lesser extent) Gionta, but they're replaceable.  Even as 4th liners.

 

The whole situation is worsened when PDB decides to put Bernier on a line with Elias (the fvck was that about) or Gionta in the top-6 because they're his favorites.

 

THEY'RE 4TH LINERS, PLAY THEM ONLY IN THAT ROLE.  Having them play above their pay grade is just..senseless.


Edited by Devilsfan118, 24 January 2014 - 12:56 PM.

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#71 dmann422

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 01:07 PM

Listen, I mean I like Carter, Bernier and (to a lesser extent) Gionta, but they're replaceable. Even as 4th liners.

The whole situation is worsened when PDB decides to put Bernier on a line with Elias (the fvck was that about) or Gionta in the top-6 because they're his favorites.

THEY'RE 4TH LINERS, PLAY THEM ONLY IN THAT ROLE. Having them play above their pay grade is just..senseless.

once again this falsehood is bandied about on these boards. Here are the lowest 5v5 toi averages this season for players who've played at least 30 games:

Gionta- 10:23
Carter - 10:43
Loktionov- 11:21
Brunner- 11:41
Bernier- 12:21

As you can see, the guys you mentioned are played very much like a 4th line in terms of ice time. Brunner's will no doubt rise after his improved play before the injury.

They do average slightly more (perhaps 30 seconds?) than other 4th lines, but that's probably because of our age and trying to limit ice time amongst older forwards. Heck even jagr complained the other week of not giving other lines more ice time.
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#72 Triumph

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 01:09 PM

Bernier was getting power play time for a while - he's been fine.  His issue is not finishing - lots of shots, no goals.  The trouble is where NJ might've used someone like Olesz in Bernier's role when people got hurt and NJ needed fill-ins, they used Bernier.  His contract is absolutely fine - he'll get more than he's making now on his next contract, wherever it ends up being.


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#73 cgb6397

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 09:47 PM

Do you guys judge our players just in the goals column? A player like Bernier doesn't have an amazing shot or hands, but he has serviceable skill, and is a big body who can be a presence in front of the crease and grind along the boards. He's a good contract


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#74 mouse

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Posted 24 January 2014 - 10:51 PM

Bernier was getting power play time for a while - he's been fine.  His issue is not finishing - lots of shots, no goals.  The trouble is where NJ might've used someone like Olesz in Bernier's role when people got hurt and NJ needed fill-ins, they used Bernier.  His contract is absolutely fine - he'll get more than he's making now on his next contract, wherever it ends up being.

This. He's no more than a 4th liner, but he's done that well, and when called upon to fill in for an injury, he didn't embarrass himself, even if he didn't produce a ton. That's about what you want from your 4th line (and Bernier's been the best of that group). I'm not holding onto CBGB memories, but no one has done better, even when given chances. I don't agree with this expectation that our 4th line should magically be more than a 4th line. That's a rare miracle.


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#75 2ELIAS6

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 11:49 AM

Bernier has been abominably bad to the point that he should be paying the Devils. I mean he's just been awful.

i really hope he is not resigned to be honest.. its time for some change of faces around here
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#76 SterioDesign

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 11:54 AM

i'd certainly keep Bernier. Who else do you get really? he knows the system, we already have him all set. he's a good 4th liner who plays his role well and he actually has good hands around the net.


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#77 Marshall

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 12:17 PM

i'd certainly keep Bernier. Who else do you get really? he knows the system, we already have him all set. he's a good 4th liner who plays his role well and he actually has good hands around the net.

 

Yep, as long as we're not handing out 6m/3y deals.


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#78 SterioDesign

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 12:27 PM

Yep, as long as we're not handing out 6m/3y deals.

 

I think Bernier would be a guy who would simply want stability at this point so take a longer deal with lower salary around 1m top. Plus he's still young and in his prime years. Enough of signing old farts


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#79 mouse

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Posted 25 January 2014 - 02:10 PM

Yep, as long as we're not handing out 6m/3y deals.

I don't see that being likely. He's no more than a 4th liner.


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