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The Official 2014 Trade Deadline Thread


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#1301 SterioDesign

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 10:22 AM

What is sad though is that he probably wouldnt listen to the people around him that he "should" listen to.

 

in my mind Lou would be the only one who could tell him "listen i think its over" and obviously its not something easy to say to Marty.

 

Other than that im sure Brodeur's kids, wife, friends, agent (i mean he wants to make money) would all tell him that he should try to play as much as he can.

 

Plus obviously we all know that Brodeur will have to pay his ex some big money for another few years so he might want to get every single penny he can.


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#1302 Triumph

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 10:32 AM

Everyone keeps saying this, but we don't actually. Brodeur would regularly start 75+ games, and even when Brodeur went down last year, Hedberg started as many games in a row until Brodeur got back.

 

Schneider got weeks off, so he is going to be well rested. It comes down to the Devils not treating Brodeur like a typical Devils backup when he might as well be Kinkaid or Clemmensen.

 

Brodeur never should've been playing that much.  He wasn't worse in back to back games, so maybe that's why he played so much, but I think that was largely an accident.  There was really no sense in Brodeur playing 75 games a year - Schneider should've gotten 62 games this year.


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#1303 Triumph

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 10:44 AM

Re:  Ruutu, in some ways it's like the Devils got him for nothing.  Loktionov wasn't going to be here after this year anyway.  Maybe he turns into something for someone else, but the guess here is he'll continue to show why he was taken in the 5th round, if he's even in the NHL next season.  The fact is that if you really show something and force yourself to be noticed, teams will find a way to get you in the lineup, or at the very least, in more significant roles.  He opened some eyes with that 7 goal, 4 assist burst in his first 18 GP as a Devil, but he hadn't done much since (13 points in his last 58 GP).  Maybe the simple fact is the reason Loki never really made a name for himself here or in LA is that he's simply not very good and hasn't really progressed much.  As for a conditional 2017 3rd-rounder, I can't worry about a mid-round pick that's several seasons away.  I'm guessing the reason it's so far off is that it's contigent on Ruutu re-signing with the Devils?  Anyway, the pick isn't really a big deal.

 

I'm sorry, but Loktionov did not 'show why he was picked in the 5th round'.  5th round players seldom become regular NHLers.  A player's draft position really carries little weight 6 years away from the draft.  Loktionov has run bad in terms of on-ice SH%, not much other way to put it.  He himself is probably not a great shooter.  Either way, there's a regular NHL player in there, and he added a dynamism to NJ that Ruutu does not, so that's a little disappointing.  It's more disappointing that we have to see Henrique moved off the wing where he has been excellent for center which is a position I don't think he plays particularly well.

 

 

As for Ruutu himself, he's not a sexy player and his salary is not great, but at least the 'Canes are on the hook for 20% of the cash he has coming to him.  Hopefully his low shooting% is due for some positive regression.  But I've moved from the "WTF?!" camp to the "OK, doesn't look great at first glance, but let's give it a chance" group.  I like that he at least can get a practice or two in with his new teammates.

 

Positive regression should not be 'expected' - this is the gambler's fallacy.  We should expect Ruutu to shoot closer to his career norm than what he's done this year.  Still, if he's not getting PP time he shouldn't do a ton.

 

One thing Ruutu does do is give them a little depth in case of injury - the Devils aren't tremendously deep right now.  Josefson would be the 13th forward, but then it's either Boucher, Sislo, or Sestito are the first callups - hopefully Ruutu forestalls that a little bit.


Edited by Triumph, 06 March 2014 - 10:46 AM.

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#1304 Pepperkorn

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 10:55 AM

I think Marty is providing a services giving everyone focus to their frustration with this teams many unidentifiable woes.

 

Fact is if we tried to deal with anything real here, the board would be dead silent.


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#1305 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 11:11 AM

I'm sorry, but Loktionov did not 'show why he was picked in the 5th round'.  5th round players seldom become regular NHLers.  A player's draft position really carries little weight 6 years away from the draft.  Loktionov has run bad in terms of on-ice SH%, not much other way to put it.  He himself is probably not a great shooter.  Either way, there's a regular NHL player in there, and he added a dynamism to NJ that Ruutu does not, so that's a little disappointing.  It's more disappointing that we have to see Henrique moved off the wing where he has been excellent for center which is a position I don't think he plays particularly well.

 

 

 

Positive regression should not be 'expected' - this is the gambler's fallacy.  We should expect Ruutu to shoot closer to his career norm than what he's done this year.  Still, if he's not getting PP time he shouldn't do a ton.

 

One thing Ruutu does do is give them a little depth in case of injury - the Devils aren't tremendously deep right now.  Josefson would be the 13th forward, but then it's either Boucher, Sislo, or Sestito are the first callups - hopefully Ruutu forestalls that a little bit.

 

Loktionov was a healthy scratch for six straight games at one point.  Sure sounds like a guy struggling to become a regular NHLer to me.  I remember some thinking the trade was a steal at the time it was made.  Devils did get 76 NHL games out of him, which I guess isn't a bad return for the 5th-rounder they gave up (a lot of 5th-rounders never get that far), but it wasn't like LA got fleeced.  At 23 going on 24, he's already on his third team...we'll see if Carolina re-signs him, or if he goes to the KHL or NHL team #4. 

 

Never said anything about "expecting" positive regression...simply hoping for some.  You're always the guy who would say something like "A career 12.1% shooter is not going to shoot 6.3% for the season, he's due for some luck."  Obviously shot quantity will factor in heavily.  Gotta see how the Devils plan on using him. 


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#1306 moustic

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 11:13 AM

http://www.northjers...dnt_make__.html

 

All Hail Marty ! 

I'm not a rational kind of guy... I wanna have Marty another 10 years between the pipes ! 

 

I know... I knoooow... 

Whatever !

MARTY ! 

 

I saw so many people with a HUGE EGO in my life already...But so little got as many excuse as Marty got ! 

 

I let all the rational people here wanna see him buried in retirement house or worse... in another franchise. Meanwhile, i will be childish, silly, naive, irrational & plain stupid... and Keep thinking that Marty is here for another 10 years.

At the end, rational people are more often right.. and they will be in this case... probably ; ) 

But i don't care being wrong (for once ; ) )... I don't wanna grow up ! And I love you Marty ! 


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#1307 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 11:13 AM

Yes, I think that's what will happen. 

 

Edit: regarding Marty and others being better...it seems he can acknowledge that Corey/Luongo are better goalies but he has zero clue of what it takes to play in the NHL. Zero.

 

Suggesting Marty has no idea what it takes to play in the NHL is a little ridiculous. He's played in the NHL more than any other goalie. He knows what it takes. He just can't accept that he doesn't have it anymore.


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#1308 Neb00rs

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 11:16 AM

Based on this statement Marty should start Friday. I don't believe that I didn't think he should have started Tuesdays game it was too risky but he did and we were lucky that Detroit scored a goal for us while Marty allowed at least one softie.

 

No, I didn't say this is the way it should be. I said this is the way Debo is handling things and I get it. If Marty had had a 40 save shutout then he maybe plays Friday. He didn't, so DeBoer will go back to Schneids.


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#1309 Lateralous

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 11:16 AM

Everyone keeps saying this, but we don't actually. Brodeur would regularly start 75+ games, and even when Brodeur went down last year, Hedberg started as many games in a row until Brodeur got back.

 

Schneider got weeks off, so he is going to be well rested. It comes down to the Devils not treating Brodeur like a typical Devils backup when he might as well be Kinkaid or Clemmensen.

 

 

Not disagreeing that Schneider should start nearly every game down the stretch, especially since he did go to Sochi but weren't Marty's years of over 75 games the same seasons he would typically look burnt out and be a non-factor in the playoffs?  


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#1310 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 11:20 AM

Not disagreeing that Schneider should start nearly every game down the stretch, especially since he did go to Sochi but weren't Marty's years of over 75 games the same seasons he would typically look burnt out and be a non-factor in the playoffs?  

 

In some cases. He played 72 in 2000 and 73 in 2003. He was a real workhorse. But yeah, he looked a little burnt some years. 99 and 04 come to mind, but he supposedly battling a knee injury in 04.

 

I'd like to see Schneider getting at least 15 of the remaining 19.


Edited by Devil Dan 56, 06 March 2014 - 11:21 AM.

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#1311 Triumph

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 12:16 PM

Loktionov was a healthy scratch for six straight games at one point.  Sure sounds like a guy struggling to become a regular NHLer to me.  I remember some thinking the trade was a steal at the time it was made.  Devils did get 76 NHL games out of him, which I guess isn't a bad return for the 5th-rounder they gave up (a lot of 5th-rounders never get that far), but it wasn't like LA got fleeced.  At 23 going on 24, he's already on his third team...we'll see if Carolina re-signs him, or if he goes to the KHL or NHL team #4.

 

After absolutely crushing territorially for 6 games and somehow not coming away with a goal.  Again, just because Loktionov was a 5th rounder means nothing - a 1st round pick could've done the same, an undrafted free agent could've done the same.  His draft status means nothing in 2013-14.

 

 

Never said anything about "expecting" positive regression...simply hoping for some.  You're always the guy who would say something like "A career 12.1% shooter is not going to shoot 6.3% for the season, he's due for some luck."  Obviously shot quantity will factor in heavily.  Gotta see how the Devils plan on using him.

 

I never really say anything like that.  Regression to the mean does not work like that.  It just means that we should expect a success rate similar to that of a player's career success rate on any given shot.  Players are not 'due'.


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#1312 Z-Man

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 12:34 PM

This is all great discussion, but bottom line:  If keeping Marty around somehow prevents Schneider from signing an extension, that would be the worst mistake of all.

 

If Schneider signs, a lot of this immediately goes away. 


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#1313 Triumph

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 12:47 PM

This is all great discussion, but bottom line:  If keeping Marty around somehow prevents Schneider from signing an extension, that would be the worst mistake of all.

 

If Schneider signs, a lot of this immediately goes away. 

 

A lot, but not all.  Brodeur should not play 30 games next year.  He should not play 20 games next year.  If he has to be here - and indeed, I think his ego will force him to be - he should be playing 18 games maximum.  


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#1314 Z-Man

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:47 PM

Another point...I saw two articles today stating along the lines of "he's not washed up, he actually has more wins that Schneider."  That's just terrible journalism.  The Devils have scored 1.85 GPG in Schneider's decisions, compared to 3.03 GPG in Marty's decisions.  I can't believe the split is that high.  But journalists won't look at that side of the story.


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#1315 devilsrule33

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:55 PM

Another point...I saw two articles today stating along the lines of "he's not washed up, he actually has more wins that Schneider."  That's just terrible journalism.  The Devils have scored 1.85 GPG in Schneider's decisions, compared to 3.03 GPG in Marty's decisions.  I can't believe the split is that high.  But journalists won't look at that side of the story.

 

There is a large portion of die hard fans and the MSM that sight wins and GAA. the NHL's Dan Rosen actually said how important the tandem is by combining their GAA together and saying it is 5th best in the league! Firstly, a useless stat to compare goalies from one team to another, and secondly why combine a 1.92 average and 2.49 average to make your point.

 

As for the goal support, I went through those stats the other day:

 

 

Some numbers:

 

Brodeur 91 GF in 30 games.

 

Schneider 61 GF in 33 games.

 

Tonight was Brodeur's 5th win of the season when giving up 3 or more goals. Cory has 0 such wins. Cory actually only has 3 wins all season when giving up 2 goals.

 

 

To add to that, Schneider had 4 losses when giving up 1 goal or less in regulation.


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#1316 SterioDesign

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 03:34 PM

http://www.northjers...dnt_make__.html

 

All Hail Marty ! 

I'm not a rational kind of guy... I wanna have Marty another 10 years between the pipes ! 

 

I know... I knoooow... 

Whatever !

MARTY ! 

 

I saw so many people with a HUGE EGO in my life already...But so little got as many excuse as Marty got ! 

 

I let all the rational people here wanna see him buried in retirement house or worse... in another franchise. Meanwhile, i will be childish, silly, naive, irrational & plain stupid... and Keep thinking that Marty is here for another 10 years.

At the end, rational people are more often right.. and they will be in this case... probably ; ) 

But i don't care being wrong (for once ; ) )... I don't wanna grow up ! And I love you Marty ! 

 

one of the Ghostbusters just died... it sucks to see your heros fade into obscurity but thats life lol


Edited by SterioDesign, 06 March 2014 - 03:34 PM.

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#1317 LucifersDog

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 04:09 PM

Congrats Marty you won

 

Ride Schneider to the playoffs, WAIT

 

Cory starts against Detroit and Marty stars against Carolina.

 

Marty wins, Devils lose, not necessary games in the win loss column.

 

Big winner Marty. Game over.


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#1318 MantaRay

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 04:11 PM

Lost in all this fuss, I have to ask:  "how does Garth Snow still have a job?"


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#1319 MadDog2020

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 05:11 PM

Lost in all this fuss, I have to ask: "how does Garth Snow still have a job?"

How does Mike Gillis still have a job? The both of them should co-write a book on how not to be GM of a professional hockey team.


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#1320 lazer

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 06:33 PM

remember when lokti was a healthy scratch that night lil gio injured his knee and lokti had to come back in the next game.

 

debo gonna debo.


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