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We now have the 30th pick


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#61 dmann422

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 01:44 PM

yea ok keep acting like you didnt think it was a bad decision at the time too

was not on the board back then so I don't have any evidence to point to but there have been rational arguments made why it wasn't necessarily a bad decision. It was a calculated risk that we may still lose a bit on but may be worth it depending on what Matteau becomes.

Either way I don't value draft picks as much as some do, if anything their greatest value is in trades, so IMO the fact that we couldn't use this pick as a trade chip hurts more than it being downgraded to #30.

Just glancing at other forums- other fans' butthurt over this is great.
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#62 Daniel

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 01:53 PM

was not on the board back then so I don't have any evidence to point to but there have been rational arguments made why it wasn't necessarily a bad decision. It was a calculated risk that we may still lose a bit on but may be worth it depending on what Matteau becomes.

Either way I don't value draft picks as much as some do, if anything their greatest value is in trades, so IMO the fact that we couldn't use this pick as a trade chip hurts more than it being downgraded to #30.

Just glancing at other forums- other fans' butthurt over this is great.

 

A rumor that was circulating at the time was that Lou was taking a gamble that Vasilevski or Malcolm Subban would be available at 29.  The Schneider deal indicates that Lou has been looking for Marty's successor for quite a while, which makes the scenario a bit more plausible. 


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#63 Mitico12

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 01:57 PM

The way I see it, the league has to approve all contracts anyways right?  So, why was the first contract even approved or considered if it was cap circumvention?  Why didn't the league just say "nah, nah, nah...this isn't a valid contract...go back to the table and do it again until its right..."  Rather, now they penalize intent...I don't get it


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#64 lucifer91

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 01:59 PM

The way I see it, the league has to approve all contracts anyways right?  So, why was the first contract even approved or considered if it was cap circumvention?  Why didn't the league just say "nah, nah, nah...this isn't a valid contract...go back to the table and do it again until its right..."  Rather, now they penalize intent...I don't get it

 

The league did say that, but then Devils held press conference and they signed the deal anyway.


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#65 Daniel

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:03 PM

It could've, but hey the NHL decided to give us some strings attached to this little gift. You have to accept it as is

 

What this does give us is the opportunity to trade our first in 2015 at next years deadline if Lou feels like it (and is satisfied with our haul this year)

 

Certainly not complaining about it, just noting that the strings diminish the value, which is built into the penalty.

 

And unless the deal would be an absolute heist, in no way, shape or form, should the Devils be trading their 2015 first rounder.  It's the type of team where the bottom could drop out at any time, and you don't want to be in the position where you're essentially trading away a generational talent, even if you could peg the Devils' chances when the trade is made at 3% of landing the number 1 overall.   It's why I think the Islanders are probably having a serious debate about opting to give up what would could very well be a top four pick in this year's draft to Buffalo for the Vanek deal instead of their 2015 first rounder. 


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#66 Daniel

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:08 PM

The way I see it, the league has to approve all contracts anyways right?  So, why was the first contract even approved or considered if it was cap circumvention?  Why didn't the league just say "nah, nah, nah...this isn't a valid contract...go back to the table and do it again until its right..."  Rather, now they penalize intent...I don't get it

 

It's one reason why I found the penalty pretty outrageous.  The spirit of the cap circumvention penalty in the prior CBA was to punish under the table salary, like we'll secretly be putting an extra $2 million in a Swiss bank account, or we'll give your wife a $2 million per year front office job.  The CBA specifically defined that sort of thing as cap circumvention.   On the other hand, everything about the first Kovy deal was permitted, at least by the letter of the CBA.  I could understand that a line had to be drawn, but it's hard to justify such a draconian penalty when there was no clear rule that was violated.


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#67 mort4345

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:19 PM

So the trade was Loki plus a conditional third in 2017 for Rutuu and 1st in 2014. Now how's that trade looking?  :dizzy:


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#68 Chuck the Duck

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:22 PM

Very nice surprise today.  I'm shocked Count Chocula softened and gave us this pick.  That penalty was a total sham anyway considering how other teams had done the exact same thing prior to the Kovy signing. 


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#69 thefiestygoat

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:23 PM

Awesome news, just made my day!


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#70 grcenter47

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:29 PM

i think its good to hear that the nhl can reconsider their punishments


Edited by grcenter47, 06 March 2014 - 02:41 PM.

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#71 Mike Brown

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:33 PM

HF Boards is mad.  lol

 

http://hfboards.hock...=1618731&page=2


Edited by Mike Brown, 06 March 2014 - 02:35 PM.

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#72 Pepperkorn

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:37 PM

Watch as that becomes our first round pick anyway :whistling:

:pray:

 

:giggle:


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#73 Colorado Rockies 1976

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:39 PM

Very nice surprise today.  I'm shocked Count Chocula softened and gave us this pick.  That penalty was a total sham anyway considering how other teams had done the exact same thing prior to the Kovy signing. 

 

Lou deserves a lot of blame on that one.  He was warned not to try to push that contract through.  He responded by scheduling a press conference to announce the deal that had no chance to get approved.  What did Lou think was going to happen?  I'll never understand what he was trying to accomplish with that one. 

 

But this is still a great day.  So glad to have this first-rounder.


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#74 Pepperkorn

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:42 PM

HF Boards is mad.  lol

 

http://hfboards.hock...=1618731&page=2

this is hilarious.


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#75 grcenter47

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:43 PM

this was interesting in the hockey news

 

The other strange part of this is it puts into question whether Devils GM Lou Lamoriello knew all along that he would get the first round pick back. When Lamoriello kept the 29th overall pick in 2012 to take Stefan Matteau instead of forfeiting it, the decision was curious. Today’s decision sheds new light on that call, though, and makes you question the NHL’s motives in overturning the penalty.

 

Lou has the fifth sense


Edited by grcenter47, 06 March 2014 - 02:53 PM.

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#76 squishyx

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:45 PM

HF Boards is mad.  lol

 

http://hfboards.hock...=1618731&page=2

I actually see a lot more sympathy for our situation that I would have expected  :noclue:


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#77 Devil Dan 56

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:45 PM

It's one reason why I found the penalty pretty outrageous.  The spirit of the cap circumvention penalty in the prior CBA was to punish under the table salary, like we'll secretly be putting an extra $2 million in a Swiss bank account, or we'll give your wife a $2 million per year front office job.  The CBA specifically defined that sort of thing as cap circumvention.   On the other hand, everything about the first Kovy deal was permitted, at least by the letter of the CBA.  I could understand that a line had to be drawn, but it's hard to justify such a draconian penalty when there was no clear rule that was violated.

 

I think the reason that the Devils got hit so hard is that they held the press conference and everything after the league said they weren't going to approve the contract. Lou or Vanderbeek basically tried to call the NHL's bluff, and the league came down hard.

 

The "spirit of the cap" is a load of bull. The Devils tried to make fools of them and the other ridiculous contracts, so the league hit back. If the league really cared about the "spirit of the cap", Chicago wouldn't have been allowed to "loan" Huet to some team in Switzerland, the Rangers wouldn't be allowed to bury tens of millions of dollars of bad contracts in the minors, the Islanders wouldn't be able to trade for Tim Thomas in a season where he already said he wasn't playing, etc etc.


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#78 DJ Eco

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:47 PM

HF Boards is mad.  lol

 

http://hfboards.hock...=1618731&page=2

 

I'm actually surprised by the amount of level-headed posters there too from around the league. For every idiot who's angry, there's another guy who gets it.

 

 

 

I actually see a lot more sympathy for our situation that I would have expected   :noclue:

 

Same haha


Edited by DJ Eco, 06 March 2014 - 02:47 PM.

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#79 devilsrule33

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:47 PM

I think the reason that the Devils got hit so hard is that they held the press conference and everything after the league said they weren't going to approve the contract. Lou or Vanderbeek basically tried to call the NHL's bluff, and the league came down hard.

 

The "spirit of the cap" is a load of bull. The Devils tried to make fools of them and the other ridiculous contracts, so the league hit back. If the league really cared about the "spirit of the cap", Chicago wouldn't have been allowed to "loan" Huet to some team in Switzerland, the Rangers wouldn't be allowed to bury tens of millions of dollars of bad contracts in the minors, the Islanders wouldn't be able to trade for Tim Thomas in a season where he already said he wasn't playing, etc etc.

 

I also think the NHL knew they let the Devils off the hook from cap jail with the Mogilny and Malahkov circumvention. Regardless what anyone thinks of the Kovy stuff, that was pretty offside.


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#80 devilsfan26

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Posted 06 March 2014 - 02:48 PM

The way I see it, the league has to approve all contracts anyways right?  So, why was the first contract even approved or considered if it was cap circumvention?  Why didn't the league just say "nah, nah, nah...this isn't a valid contract...go back to the table and do it again until its right..."  Rather, now they penalize intent...I don't get it

Actually, they did exactly that, AND still handed out this ridiculous punishment for a contract that they never let go into effect in the first place.  I'm glad they lessened the punishment, but I still can't find justification for there to be any punishment in the first place.


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