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Who can we trade/sign this off season that's a "Devil" pla


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#61 CarpathianForest

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Posted 28 March 2014 - 06:11 PM

A "Devils" type player isn't going to help this club become a contender. If anything we need almost the exact opposite. This ain't 2003 anymore and it's about time people realize it or suffer in mediocrity at best.

 

True Dat. You can have a roster full of Devils types, but you need at least a Kovy and Parise on the ice too.


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#62 ghdi

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Posted 28 March 2014 - 07:21 PM

First off can we get a "LIKE" button, there i posts I would like but donot want to commetn on....
 

 

See the little green arrow in the bottom right of posts? That's the "like" button.

 

As for the topic, we still need a reliable goal scorer, if not 2.  If this was 5 years ago, Id be all for Iginla, but I don't think he'd come here unless the Bruins win the Cup and Id rather bring Jagr back than another 35+ guy. We're likely not going to be seen as a contender going into next season and I see Iginla still Cup hunting if he doesn't get to raise it this year.

 

Who I'd like to see from the UFA list as it stands now: Moulson and/or Stastny. Id also like to see Sal gotten rid of.


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#63 Devs4LordStanley

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Posted 28 March 2014 - 07:45 PM

True Dat. You can have a roster full of Devils types, but you need at least a Kovy and Parise on the ice too.

Really? You really thought Kovy fit in? In 11-12, he had 82pts but was -9. That's 91 goals against. I don't want that kind of player on this team nor does Elias. Elias - if only we could clone him...

 

Let me ask this - would you want a team like Boston, no superstars (Chara isn't) but very very deep, or a top heavy team?

 

I'd get Cammy/Hemsky, call up Booch and get rid of the 4th line. Cheap, yet a big improvement. Do they fit in? idk but i'd give it a shot.


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#64 hystyk28

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Posted 29 March 2014 - 12:10 AM

In 11-12, he had 82pts but was -9. That's 91 goals against.


???
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#65 SterioDesign

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Posted 29 March 2014 - 12:27 AM

In 11-12, he had 82pts but was -9. That's 91 goals against.


Once you figure out how bad of a statement that was youre probably feel pretty damn ashamed.
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#66 nessus

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Posted 29 March 2014 - 12:50 AM

lol both Parise and Elias were also minus players that year, and not too far off from Kovalchuk. Also, wasn't that the season with all of those shorthanded goals against? I don't think +/- is the best stat to use in order to judge a player, but that's beside the point anyway.


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#67 thefiestygoat

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Posted 29 March 2014 - 12:52 AM

Really? You really thought Kovy fit in? In 11-12, he had 82pts but was -9. That's 91 goals against. I don't want that kind of player on this team nor does Elias. Elias - if only we could clone him...

 

Let me ask this - would you want a team like Boston, no superstars (Chara isn't) but very very deep, or a top heavy team?

 

I'd get Cammy/Hemsky, call up Booch and get rid of the 4th line. Cheap, yet a big improvement. Do they fit in? idk but i'd give it a shot.

Kovalchuk didn't just fit in but excelled.

 

Kovalchuk had 83 points in 77 games in 2011-12. I'll glady take that from my favorite team's star player anytime. He led the team in points, goals, and was 2nd in assists. He had more even strength and power play goals than anyone else on the team and was tied for 2nd in short handed goals.

Kovalchuk also averaged more 5v5 ice time than any other forward by a decent amount, averaged more total ice time than anyone else on the team, and had the best shots per game ratio and most shots on the team.

Sure he had the most favorable 5v5 zone starts but he also did take on the opponent's toughest D and in the end put up Corsi and Fenwick percentages above 53%.

+/- is a pretty useless stat to judge a player. Even if you want to use a +/- type system, I'd rather focus on 5v5 play given that is what the majority of the game is played at. Kovalchuk had a GF/GA ratio of 51/50 at 5v5 play.  For comparison, guys like Elias, Henrique, and Parise only had +6, +4, and +1 GF/GA differentials that year.

 

I wish the Devils had a player of that talent on the team.


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#68 CarterforPresident

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Posted 29 March 2014 - 01:51 AM

Sorry but Chara *IS*
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#69 Daniel

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Posted 29 March 2014 - 04:24 AM

Kovalchuk didn't just fit in but excelled.

Kovalchuk had 83 points in 77 games in 2011-12. I'll glady take that from my favorite team's star player anytime. He led the team in points, goals, and was 2nd in assists. He had more even strength and power play goals than anyone else on the team and was tied for 2nd in short handed goals.

Kovalchuk also averaged more 5v5 ice time than any other forward by a decent amount, averaged more total ice time than anyone else on the team, and had the best shots per game ratio and most shots on the team.

Sure he had the most favorable 5v5 zone starts but he also did take on the opponent's toughest D and in the end put up Corsi and Fenwick percentages above 53%.

+/- is a pretty useless stat to judge a player. Even if you want to use a +/- type system, I'd rather focus on 5v5 play given that is what the majority of the game is played at. Kovalchuk had a GF/GA ratio of 51/50 at 5v5 play. For comparison, guys like Elias, Henrique, and Parise only had +6, +4, and +1 GF/GA differentials that year.

I wish the Devils had a player of that talent on the team.


Even Brian -- Go Home You Pointy Headed Numbers People -- Burke says that +/- is pretty useless as a judge of an individual player anyway.



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#70 CarpathianForest

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Posted 29 March 2014 - 09:59 AM

Really? You really thought Kovy fit in? In 11-12, he had 82pts but was -9. That's 91 goals against. I don't want that kind of player on this team nor does Elias. Elias - if only we could clone him...

 

Let me ask this - would you want a team like Boston, no superstars (Chara isn't) but very very deep, or a top heavy team?

 

I'd get Cammy/Hemsky, call up Booch and get rid of the 4th line. Cheap, yet a big improvement. Do they fit in? idk but i'd give it a shot.

 

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=5hfYJsQAhl0

 

Kovy did pretty well I would say. He was a point per game player and even played the tail end of PKs.


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#71 Devs4LordStanley

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Posted 29 March 2014 - 11:40 AM

Okay, fine. but do you think he would've stayed a ppg player? the reason he broke out that year was because he forced him to fit. then parise left and he became the #1. In 37gp, he had 31pts albeit he broke his collar bone and played with SKA (where he tore up). Then AFTER the nhl season, he tore up the World whatever.

 

Washington has Ovy - 0 Cups - 0 cup appearances

Tampa has Stamkos - 0 cups - 0 cup appearances

Pittsburgh has Crybaby/Malkin - 1 cup. Look at last years dream team - barely beat the Islanders! - Back to back appearances against the same team

Vancouver has the Sedin twins - 0 cups - 1 Cup appearance (beat by boston)

Boston has great depth - 1 Cup and destroyed Pittsburgh's dream team. - 2 cup appearances within 3 years.

Chicago has Toews/Kane with depth - 2 cups (One against Philly) - 2 Cup appearances within 4 years

LA has Kopitar with depth - 1 cup - 1 Cup appearance.

NJ had Kovy/Parise (Parise's borderline) - 0 cups - 1  cup appearance (beat by LA)

 

Although it seems more likely to win with a duo, I still believe depth wins. Has pittsburgh done anything since their 2 runs? They crap out in the playoffs because their scorers are always peeling themselves off the boards or are choking. Look at 2012, depth saved our ass.

 

Back to my original point - how come Jagr excels in our system while Ryder doesn't? Jagr fits like a glove but Ryder stands out like a sore thumb. We just need two more Jagrs :P


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#72 Triumph

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Posted 29 March 2014 - 12:22 PM

I'm going to have to take LordStanley's side here - yeah, Kovalchuk had a nice season, but if you look at Parise's lifetime Corsi numbers via behindthenet, you'll see one season that stands out like a sore thumb:

 

http://www.behindthe...33 34 45 46 63#

 

That of course is the season he played with Kovalchuk.  The -9 is itself not indicative of poor play - +/- isn't very good because it incorporates all sorts of dumb stuff like empty net goals and short handed goals and so forth - but you'd like to think that Kovalchuk and Parise could've done better together.  Every other full season, Parise's up above +10 Corsi Rel/60 - with Kovalchuk they barely broke even.  Maybe it was Henrique in part too, I don't know.

 

Kovalchuk has also been a giant disappointment in Russia so far - one more year like the one he's having and we will be so thankful that he isn't here anymore.

 

I think a team that has a strict system like the Devils can use players like Kovalchuk, but not one who just doesn't really play the system (beyond the breakout).  They never could get him to forecheck in a North American style.


Edited by Triumph, 29 March 2014 - 12:24 PM.

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#73 Devs4LordStanley

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Posted 29 March 2014 - 01:16 PM

Another point - from 94-03, we had a ton of depth. Gomez, Gio, Arnott, elias, sykora, mogilny, raffy, neids, holik, langs, I know there's more... Since 03, we never had that kind of depth! The 2012 run was a fluke because we had some kind of depth/luck. We need to start drafting smarter and begin trading/signing players that fit in. I believe we're a line short of success.

 

If you want examples of fitting in, look at Hemsky and Loki (even St. Louis/Cally)..


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#74 Derek21

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Posted 30 March 2014 - 12:10 AM

Okay, fine. but do you think he would've stayed a ppg player? the reason he broke out that year was because he forced him to fit. then parise left and he became the #1. In 37gp, he had 31pts albeit he broke his collar bone and played with SKA (where he tore up). Then AFTER the nhl season, he tore up the World whatever.

 

Washington has Ovy - 0 Cups - 0 cup appearances

Tampa has Stamkos - 0 cups - 0 cup appearances

Pittsburgh has Crybaby/Malkin - 1 cup. Look at last years dream team - barely beat the Islanders! - Back to back appearances against the same team

Vancouver has the Sedin twins - 0 cups - 1 Cup appearance (beat by boston)

Boston has great depth - 1 Cup and destroyed Pittsburgh's dream team. - 2 cup appearances within 3 years.

Chicago has Toews/Kane with depth - 2 cups (One against Philly) - 2 Cup appearances within 4 years

LA has Kopitar with depth - 1 cup - 1 Cup appearance.

NJ had Kovy/Parise (Parise's borderline) - 0 cups - 1  cup appearance (beat by LA)

 

Although it seems more likely to win with a duo, I still believe depth wins. Has pittsburgh done anything since their 2 runs? They crap out in the playoffs because their scorers are always peeling themselves off the boards or are choking. Look at 2012, depth saved our ass.

 

Back to my original point - how come Jagr excels in our system while Ryder doesn't? Jagr fits like a glove but Ryder stands out like a sore thumb. We just need two more Jagrs :P

 

Okay. Let's try each in order:

 

1.Caps-lack a true number 1 goalie and the D isn't a team strength. Halak good pick up. Despite star talent (Ovechkin/Backstrom) lack fundamentals.

 

2.Bolts-Stamkos. Traded MSL to NYR for Callahan. Hoisted Sens for Bishop. A Vezina frontrunner. Good scoring. Calder candidates-Johnson, Palat. Could make a run.

 

3.Pens-Crosby/Geno 1 Cup 2 appearances MVPs Fleury but no Letang or Martin. Depleted blueline could mean early exit. Malkin returns in playoffs.

 

4.Canucks-1 Cup Final 10 consecutive playoff defeats. Sedins have aged. Neither has 50 points. Kesler leads in goals and wants out. Traded Lou. Lack is the guy. Little offensive depth. Gillis keeps his job.

 

5.Bruins-1 Cup 1 runner up. great overall depth and leadership. Chara. Bergeron. Krejci. Lucic. Iginla. Marchand. Best 4th line in hockey. Good coach. Rask arguably best in sport. Well constructed.

 

6.Hawks-2 Cups in 4 years. Toews. Kane. Sharp. Hossa. Keith Norris frontrunner teams with Seabrook best D tandem. Crawford. Great depth guys like Shaw and Saad. Plus Queeneville.

 

7.Kings-1 Cup. Underappreciated stars up front (Kopitar) and on back end (Doughty). A top 5 goalie in Quick. Center depth (Carter, Richards, Stoll). Added Gaborik for run. Plus a clutch playoff performer (Williams) and energy guy (King).

 

These are just current. I'll add from history perspective:

 

8.Ducks-1 Cup. Getzlaf/Perry. Niedermayer. Pronger. Beauchemin. Giguere. Selanne. Penner. Pahlsson. R. Niedermayer. Current roster still features dynamic duo plus new goalie tandem (Hiller/Andersen), Beauchemin and Teemu. S. Koivu. Fowler on back end. Good forward depth that must perform in playoffs.

 

Other contenders:

 

9.Blues-Great leadership, balance and toughness. Added goalie (Miller) to core of Backes, Oshie, Steen, Schwartz, Tarashenko. Pietrangelo anchors blueline with Shattenkirk. Jay Bou. Hitchcock won 1 Cup. Lost the next year to '00 Devils. Are they ready?

 

10.Sharks-Thornton/Marleau/Pavelski and Couture. Dynamic scorers. Burns. Can a blueline with Boyle, Demers and Vlasic win? Niemi has a Cup with Hawks.

 

11.Avalanche-Roy should probably win the Adams. Talented forward core featuring Duchene (knee injury?), Landeskog, O'Reilly, Stastny and Calder frontrunner MacKinnon. Varlamov with a career year. Young back end led by E. Johnson and Barrie. Solid depth. Is their style too wide open? They're my sleeper.

 

12.Canadiens-Price in net. Subban/Markov anchor blueline. Emelin tough. Pacioretty tops in goal department. Rented Vanek. Solid nucleus features Plekanec, Desharnais, Gallagher, Gionta and Briere. Plenty of experience. But Michel Therrien behind the bench. Not sure if they win more than a round.

 

13.Flyers-Giroux carrying team. JVR. Voracek. Simmonds one of best power forwards. Good center depth (Schenn, Couturier). Plus Read. As usual, can a D led by Timonen, Streit and MacDonald plus unproven Steve Mason make a dent? Should be a tough out.

 

14.Rangers-Lundqvist. McDonagh and Girardi anchor D plus Staal and overlooked Stralman. Don't boast a true 1 center. Scoring by committee (Stepan, Zuccarello, Richards, Nash, Brassard). St. Louis 0 goals 3 assists since trade. Mystifying. Kreider loss hurts. Underrated depth (Boyle, Hagelin, Pouliot, Moore). Little toughness. Unless MSL produces, hard to see them winning more than a round. Likely match-up with Flyers.

 

15.Blue Jackets-not sure what's going on in net. McElhinney has played lately and well over Bobrovsky. One 30-goal scorer in Johansen. Solid two-way forwards (Anisimov/Dubinsky/Umberger). Battle tested Cup winner in Horton. Atkinson is an exciting player. Foligno gritty as is Jenner. Blueline anchored by J. Johnson, Wisniewski and Tyutin. They don't play much D, are offensively challenged but play hard. If they get in, could be similar in style to last year's Islanders.

 

As for the point about how to build, I believe you have to have elite offensive talent to win now. It can't just hinge on goaltending and D. That doesn't get it done anymore. Every recent Cup winner has scored enough thanks to star talent and depth. The Kings relied on Quick but needed Jeff Carter to win. Their center depth gave them an edge. Plus Doughty is one of game's best who'll probably never win a Norris. Scuderi was also on that team and Mitchell too. Got a good postseason from Voynov, who's been alright this year.

 

If you're serious about contending, you can't have number two centers as your top guy. It only works in Boston because Bergeron and Krejci are better than average. One is one of the game's best overall players and the other always flies under radar. They're both reliable two-way centers who dominate on faceoffs. That's another thing. Unless your center depth is rock solid, you're not going anywhere. The name of the game is puck possession. The really good teams have it.

 

The Devils rank near the bottom in faceoffs aside from Travis Zajac. Henrique has had a breakout. But they lack overall talent. Jagr cannot be your leading scorer. Given what they have in the farm on D, maybe they should consider moving a piece for an offensive player (Yakupov?). I've seen Hasan and others discuss how mismanaged their prospects are. They destroyed Tedenby and Josefson. I'm not sure what they're doing with Larsson. There are way too many vets who are blocking spots. Salvador gets mocked but without him in '12, they don't make that run. It still was a big miscalculation by Lou. Volchenkov is tough despite his age. He's a gamer. But you have to free up spots. Peter Harrold is serviceable but shouldn't be in over Gelinas even with his defensive deficiencies. I'm not sure if you pin that on DeBoer or the organization.


Edited by Derek21, 30 March 2014 - 12:18 AM.

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#75 Derek21

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Posted 30 March 2014 - 12:19 AM

If I suggested free agents for the Devils, Moulson would top the list. Gets nose dirty in front and scores garbage goals. Good on power play. Obviously, they need a center. I'm not sure I'd overspend on Stastny. He's in a contract year and has performed but also is injury prone. Just something to consider.


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#76 nessus

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Posted 03 April 2014 - 10:42 AM

If the Devils aren't able to get Moulson or Stastny, which is a very realistic possibility (note: I did not say a likely possibility. getting struck by lightning is a realistic possibility but not likely), the Devils are going to have to look into a trade for a young scoring forward.

 

Aside from the talk of maybe getting Skinner through a big trade, there really haven't been many other possibilities discussed. I really don't see Eberle happening because it seems like it would take a huge overpayment. But what about a guy like Tomas Tatar or Mika Zibanejad? These aren't guys that have as much experience (or have excelled to the same degree) as Skinner or Eberle have, but they are both very likely to continue to progress over the next few years. They're also both very young players that can give the Devils the energy and speed that is so badly needed.

 

I know Ottawa is looking for a top pairing left handed defenseman, which makes them a decent trade partner. It'd suck to see him go since he has been our best defenseman in the past few seasons, but would anyone be interested in something around Greene and Zibanejad? 

 

Not sure where to go with Tatar. I'm sure Detroit would be interested in one of the Devils' D as well.


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#77 roomtemp

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Posted 03 April 2014 - 10:42 PM

1) Trade for Ovie

2) Get Lemaire to coach for a season

3)???

4) Profit


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#78 Devs4LordStanley

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 04:26 PM

I know you're joking but I'd love Ovie on this team. He's a scorer, very physical (for an elite scorer), and comes up big in big games. Although, I'm not sure how he'd handle defense 1st...


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#79 Devilsfan118

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Posted 04 April 2014 - 07:23 PM

Ovie's scored something like 5 ES goals in the past 30 games.

I like him as a player, but pass. Big time pass.

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#80 CarterforPresident

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Posted 05 April 2014 - 12:23 AM

Not sure what you mean, he kinda disappears in big games but even so, anyone would be stupid to pass on him, best pure goal scorer in the league.
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