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#61 DJ Eco

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:38 PM

Yea, this pisses me off. I have zero respect for rangers fans from here. You need to have a total lack of respect for where you're from. I disagree with someone who said there's not a strong sense of community in the state. At least where I'm from, on the Shore, the Jersey pride thing has taken hold in maybe the last five years with my generation. A lot of kids have Jersey related tattoos and bumper stickers, and some "Jersey" culture stores and restaurants have opened up near me. hopefully it's something that continues. I think we're just starting to see some demand for local goods and services, something we've been really behind the game on here. I also think the devils are starting to build some kind of following in south Jersey. Maybe it's just the minority that will always be there, or maybe something that will grow. Glad to hear Carlson was a Devils fan growing up. I was thinking the same thing about all these damn kids in the NHL from here growing up rangers fans.

 

Same up here where I live at in Hudson County. A lot of Jersey pride, almost directly BECAUSE of its proximity to New York. Some new small breweries, Jersey-related bar names and pizza places, etc... It wasn't really like this in the 90s, I think. I'm guessing we have shows like The Sopranos to thank and even some of the less desirable reality shows related to Jersey. The backlash to these shows around the country and knee-jerk reaction to make fun of our state has made people of a certain age uber-proud to be from here, by and large. Even Chris Christie during Hurricane Sandy did a lot in that regard (not so much now, another story though). It's like an inverse reaction this State has had to all the idiots around the country that make fun of us.


Edited by DJ Eco, 07 April 2014 - 01:38 PM.

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#62 thecoffeecake

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:42 PM

When my family rented at the Shore for Summers, we had those types of neighbors who wouldn't pee on you if you were on fire. They looked at anyone who didn't live there all year as Bennies. Didn't matter if we were as quiet as can be or from North Jersey. To them, you might as well been from NY. After Sandy, that changed a bit. Well, a whole lot. They are more then happy to take your money, smile at you, call you a "friend" all for the sake of rebuilding, you know?

Florida residents are the same way with their "Snow Bird" monikers.

People down here are fully within their right to not appreciate the 40 day a year residents. I certainly can't stand it. People who think it's economically good for the area just don't know economics. Before people started renting/buying houses for use on weekends in the summer, there was a full population of people who lived there 365, spending money and paying taxes just as regularly in December than in July. And today, well-to-do people who priced out the average family, some of them who were here for generations, have the balls to act like they're doing us a favor. Don't get me wrong, a few hotels would be great, I'm not saying people shouldn't vacation, but the scale on which our Towns have been bought out by part time residents is a travesty.
Edit: not to mention over-development has basically destroyed local ecologic systems.

Edited by thecoffeecake, 07 April 2014 - 04:00 PM.

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#63 '7'

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:46 PM

80-20. Least here in South Jersey

 

South Jersey is Eagles first. So whatever Giants-Jets split there is just a small breakdown of whatever part of the pie is left. It may very well be 80-20, but you're only splitting like the 10% that are not Eagles fans.

 

When I'm in AC I see tons of Eagles decals on cars. And that's pretty much it.


Edited by '7', 07 April 2014 - 01:48 PM.

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#64 SterioDesign

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:46 PM

Have you also noticed a big dip in your beer league save percentage in recent years?

 

he's way older than i am lol 


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#65 CarterforPresident

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:50 PM

Read above where I cleared that up. Eagles and then giants. Jets are like the Devils in South Jersey. Hard to find. Not the Giants or Eagles(obviously)

South Jersey is Eagles first. So whatever Giants-Jets split there is just a small breakdown of whatever part of the pie is left. It may very well be 80-20, but you're only splitting like the 10% that are not Eagles fans.

When I'm in AC I see tons of Eagles decals on cars. And that's pretty much it.


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#66 TheRedStorm

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 01:56 PM

People down here are fully within their right to not appreciate the 40 day a year residents. I certainly can stand it. People who think it's economically good for the area just don't know economics. Before people started renting/buying houses for use on weekends in the summer, there was a full population of people who lived there 365, spending money and paying taxes just as regularly in December than in July. And today, well-to-do people who priced out the average family, some of them who were here for generations, have the balls to act like they're doing us a favor. Don't get me wrong, a few hotels would be great, I'm not saying people shouldn't vacation, but the scale on which our Towns have been bought out by part time residents is a travesty.
Edit: not to mention over-development has basically destroyed local ecologic systems.

 

This sounds like spite, which it is. Why do you think some of those people left? Here, i'll tell you. The smart ones sold out. They sold out when they saw their existing home values increase and their property become worth more then the homes built on it. These people weren't forced out or priced out. They simply made a decision to cash in their assets. But instead, the property developers and people who made wise investments are made to look like the bad people instead of same people who once pointed fingers at the "Bennies".

 

And if you don't think having people with money spend 3 months at any shore location isn't great for the economy, then i have to question your knowledge of shore economics. Let me tell you, these restaurants and tourist traps aren't surviving without 3 months of tourism on local color alone. Last summer, no one gave a sh!t who was there and this summer no one will as well. Not for a long time until the Sandy recovery is well in the rear view mirror. 


Edited by TheRedStorm, 07 April 2014 - 02:02 PM.

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#67 Mitico12

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 02:19 PM

You're a fan of the team signing your paycheck...that's sports of today.


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#68 NJDevs4978

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 03:07 PM

You're a fan of the team signing your paycheck...that's sports of today.

 

Well gee nobody's disputing that.  People are just complaining that these players aren't Devil fans before their career growing up IN New Jersey.


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#69 PWW

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 03:30 PM

fvck the Rangers. On the train to a game I had some 18 year old Rags fan (I'm 25) say to me "You're from Jersey, why do you root for the Devils?" I literally couldn't even fathom how stupid that was and still to this day haven't made sense of it. A lot of Rangers fans are mongoloids and don't have a sensical reason for being fans of the team. You guys are trying to interpret the thinking or reasoning of those who don't think. Good luck.


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#70 DevsMan84

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 03:35 PM

fvck the Rangers. On the train to a game I had some 18 year old Rags fan (I'm 25) say to me "You're from Jersey, why do you root for the Devils?" I literally couldn't even fathom how stupid that was and still to this day haven't made sense of it. A lot of Rangers fans are mongoloids and don't have a sensical reason for being fans of the team. You guys are trying to interpret the thinking or reasoning of those who don't think. Good luck.


Lol hard to argue the point of your post
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#71 thecoffeecake

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 03:50 PM

This sounds like spite, which it is. Why do you think some of those people left? Here, i'll tell you. The smart ones sold out. They sold out when they saw their existing home values increase and their property become worth more then the homes built on it. These people weren't forced out or priced out. They simply made a decision to cash in their assets. But instead, the property developers and people who made wise investments are made to look like the bad people instead of same people who once pointed fingers at the "Bennies".

And if you don't think having people with money spend 3 months at any shore location isn't great for the economy, then i have to question your knowledge of shore economics. Let me tell you, these restaurants and tourist traps aren't surviving without 3 months of tourism on local color alone. Last summer, no one gave a sh!t who was there and this summer no one will as well. Not for a long time until the Sandy recovery is well in the rear view mirror.

Why would I be arbitrarily spiteful? I, and many others who grew up and reside on the shore have our reasons to resent the summer resident.
People spending 365 days a year in any location will have a greater economic impact than people spending forty. More people spending more time means more money being spent. You can't reasonably argue that less money being spent means a better economy. It's very simple. The economics of places just off the beaches with a high percentage of permanent residents do just fine. Great, in fact. Pretty bold of you to try to lecture me about the place I've lived my entire life, though. Boldness gets you places.

I Understand that the market created the conditions for such a unique form of gentrification. The real estate industry is the one sector that benefited from this.

You're attitude of "you're recovering from a major disaster, you should be thanking me for coming" makes you sound like a real piece of sh!t.
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#72 DJ Eco

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 03:52 PM

People down here are fully within their right to not appreciate the 40 day a year residents. I certainly can stand it. People who think it's economically good for the area just don't know economics. Before people started renting/buying houses for use on weekends in the summer, there was a full population of people who lived there 365, spending money and paying taxes just as regularly in December than in July. And today, well-to-do people who priced out the average family, some of them who were here for generations, have the balls to act like they're doing us a favor. Don't get me wrong, a few hotels would be great, I'm not saying people shouldn't vacation, but the scale on which our Towns have been bought out by part time residents is a travesty.
Edit: not to mention over-development has basically destroyed local ecologic systems.

 

I will say this: my grandparents were part of the earlier crowd from up in Northern NJ/NY state to buy property down on Long Beach Island back in the 80s. When I was going there as a kid, most of the people either lived there year-round, or came every single week rain-or-shine from the Philly area. Some of those kids became my childhood best friends over the years. The change in the late 90s with a lot of a-holes who got rich in the stock market coming down there was pretty dramatic, in a negative way. A lot of the charm was uprooted, houses were demolished block by block and replaced with huge suburban-Long Island-looking 3-story houses with central air and internet. The kids and teens were by and large super spoiled and tended not to go outside and play football or street hockey the way the Philly/South Jersey kids would when I was growing up. Suddenly no one was taking walks or a stroll at night, it was deserted, and a lot of the less flashy restaurants were going out of business, ice cream places too. The richer the people coming down were, year by year, the seemingly less there was to do down there. They brought their HBO and Playstations and big screen TVs and Rangers bumper stickers; it was a whole demographic shift.

 

Like TheRedStorm is saying, the smart ones cashed in on it. I don't think we can know one way or the other how the economics worked out overall, but I saw firsthand the culture shift that happened. You'd be surprised how there seemed to be a lot more thriving businesses when the Philly crowd and locals were still in town than when the upper suburban New Jerseyans and New Yorkers came down.


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#73 DJ Eco

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 03:56 PM

And if you don't think having people with money spend 3 months at any shore location isn't great for the economy, then i have to question your knowledge of shore economics. Let me tell you, these restaurants and tourist traps aren't surviving without 3 months of tourism on local color alone.

 

I don't know the specific economics. But from going down there for 24+ years, my limited experience was that places like Long Beach Island were a lot more hopping and energetic than they are now in the past 10 years. Even at its peak of real estate worth, it seems like restaurants have been a lot less frequented and busy throughout most of the 2000s than they were in the early/mid-90s when the demographic was mostly Philly/South Jerseyans... That's just my limited view though...


Edited by DJ Eco, 07 April 2014 - 03:57 PM.

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#74 TheRedStorm

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 04:17 PM

Why would I be arbitrarily spiteful? I, and many others who grew up and reside on the shore have our reasons to resent the summer resident.
People spending 365 days a year in any location will have a greater economic impact than people spending forty. More people spending more time means more money being spent. You can't reasonably argue that less money being spent means a better economy. It's very simple. The economics of places just off the beaches with a high percentage of permanent residents do just fine. Great, in fact. Pretty bold of you to try to lecture me about the place I've lived my entire life, though. Boldness gets you places.

I Understand that the market created the conditions for such a unique form of gentrification. The real estate industry is the one sector that benefited from this.

You're attitude of "you're recovering from a major disaster, you should be thanking me for coming" makes you sound like a real piece of sh!t.

 

You're spiteful and need to learn more about where you live and the economic impact of people who spend the Summers there. Problem is you're too spiteful and ignorant to think any other way. The shore can not survive just on it's permanent residents alone, whether or not they are there 9 months more. Not everyone who lives there can afford to or has the same level of disposable income and are willing to spend it all year there. There are affluent people there for three months and they spend money every night for three months. I personally know residents who have rented and spent $20-25K a summer. Even 10k a summer. Figure rental, boat storage/fees, gas, dinner every night, 3 kids, etc....and you'll see what i mean. Then try to sell me on your little economic theory some more. It's a hell of alot more then i spend!

 

I've been a Summer shore resident (LBI) for 30 years or probably anywhere from 5-10 years before you were born. I've seen people sell out, people who were "proud" of where they lived until that check was handed to them. Shanties and small housing torn down and rebuilt into rentals. Properties with trailers and abandoned boats turned into million dollar homes. Restaurants that once drew local color turn into social hubs. I've seen the social and economic revival of the Shore and that's just where i was. 

 

And by the way, that last line? Thanks for putting words in my mouth, punk. I've donated more money and spent more money last Summer to help LBI and it's businesses then i care to admit or could spare, but i did because i love the area. Again, just like 24 years worth of Devils tickets from a previous thread you attacked me in.....how about you?


Edited by TheRedStorm, 07 April 2014 - 04:42 PM.

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#75 Neb00rs

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 04:30 PM

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#76 thecoffeecake

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 04:50 PM

You're spiteful. Just stop it already. 

 

You need to learn more about where you live and the economic impact of people who spend the Summers there. Problem is you're too spiteful, stubborn and ignorant to think any other way. The shore can not survive just on it's permanent residents alone, whether or not they are there 9 months more. Not everyone has the same level of disposable income and are willing to spend it all year there. There are affluent people there for three months and they spend money every night for three months. 

 

I've been a Summer shore resident (LBI) for 30 years or probably anywhere from 5-10 years before you were born. I've seen people sell out, people who were "proud" of where they lived until that check was handed to them. Shanties and small housing torn down and rebuilt into rentals. Properties with trailers and abandoned boats turned into million dollar homes. Restaurants that once drew local color turn into social hubs. I've seen the social and economic revival of the Shore and that's just where i was. 

 

And by the way, that last line? Thanks for putting words in my mouth, punk. I've donated more money and spent more money last Summer to help LBI and it's businesses then i care to admit. Just like 24 years worth of Devils tickets.....how about you? 

The Shore can't survive on its permanent residents alone because all the permanent residents are gone. What can't you understand about that? I can't tell you in any more a creative way that 365 days of economic activity is going to have a bigger impact than forty. It's simple.

 

For what reason do I have to be spiteful? I care about the interest of my home. That's where my interests lie. I have no reason to resent or have some ill feelings towards anything that is beneficial to the culture and economy of the place I've spent my entire life. The way the Shore has been exploited is not in the interest of the people or the wildlife of our region. Ask the baymen. Ask the pineys. Ask the decoy carvers and scallop fishermen. Ask the families who have been here for generations. Your interests lie elsewhere. It's attitudes like yours that has led the feeling of resentment to be focused not only on the unfortunate market conditions that have created this environment, but to the people like you.


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#77 mikepeluso8

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 05:05 PM

Why would I be arbitrarily spiteful? I, and many others who grew up and reside on the shore have our reasons to resent the summer resident.
People spending 365 days a year in any location will have a greater economic impact than people spending forty. More people spending more time means more money being spent. You can't reasonably argue that less money being spent means a better economy. It's very simple. The economics of places just off the beaches with a high percentage of permanent residents do just fine. Great, in fact. Pretty bold of you to try to lecture me about the place I've lived my entire life, though. Boldness gets you places.

I Understand that the market created the conditions for such a unique form of gentrification. The real estate industry is the one sector that benefited from this.

You're attitude of "you're recovering from a major disaster, you should be thanking me for coming" makes you sound like a real piece of sh!t.

 

 

I can see both sides having been a part of a family with a home "down the shore" for over 20 years.  That being said, out of curiosity, where exactly do you live?  I am curious because there are varying levels of this argument...for instance, Red Bank is very different than Lavalette or Ortley Beach and Asbury Park vs. Harvey Cedars...where do you live? 


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#78 TheRedStorm

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 05:10 PM

The Shore can't survive on its permanent residents alone because all the permanent residents are gone. What can't you understand about that? I can't tell you in any more a creative way that 365 days of economic activity is going to have a bigger impact than forty. It's simple.

 

For what reason do I have to be spiteful? I care about the interest of my home. That's where my interests lie. I have no reason to resent or have some ill feelings towards anything that is beneficial to the culture and economy of the place I've spent my entire life. The way the Shore has been exploited is not in the interest of the people or the wildlife of our region. Ask the baymen. Ask the pineys. Ask the decoy carvers and scallop fishermen. Ask the families who have been here for generations. Your interests lie elsewhere. It's attitudes like yours that has led the feeling of resentment to be focused not only on the unfortunate market conditions that have created this environment, but to the people like you.

 

 

You listed all your reasons. You're spiteful. This isn't about where your interests lie. If it were so, you wouldn't sound like you had a grudge or spite towards others. It's about finger pointing, laying blame and failure to understand where money comes from that sustains parts of the shore region. Instead, you should focus your spite/grudges on the people who sold out when the money came calling. The people laughing to the bank who certainly "cared about where their interests lay". 


Edited by TheRedStorm, 07 April 2014 - 05:15 PM.

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#79 mikepeluso8

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 05:13 PM

You're spiteful and need to learn more about where you live and the economic impact of people who spend the Summers there. Problem is you're too spiteful and ignorant to think any other way. The shore can not survive just on it's permanent residents alone, whether or not they are there 9 months more. Not everyone who lives there can afford to or has the same level of disposable income and are willing to spend it all year there. There are affluent people there for three months and they spend money every night for three months. I personally know residents who have rented and spent $20-25K a summer. Even 10k a summer. Figure rental, boat storage/fees, gas, dinner every night, 3 kids, etc....and you'll see what i mean. Then try to sell me on your little economic theory some more. It's a hell of alot more then i spend!

 

I've been a Summer shore resident (LBI) for 30 years or probably anywhere from 5-10 years before you were born. I've seen people sell out, people who were "proud" of where they lived until that check was handed to them. Shanties and small housing torn down and rebuilt into rentals. Properties with trailers and abandoned boats turned into million dollar homes. Restaurants that once drew local color turn into social hubs. I've seen the social and economic revival of the Shore and that's just where i was. 

 

And by the way, that last line? Thanks for putting words in my mouth, punk. I've donated more money and spent more money last Summer to help LBI and it's businesses then i care to admit or could spare, but i did because i love the area. Again, just like 24 years worth of Devils tickets from a previous thread you attacked me in.....how about you?

 

And I will jump on board and make a broad-sweeping, presumably "ignorant" statement....2-3 years ago, my dad got wacked with a property tax increase of something like 2-3x what he was paying in the past for our home in Berkeley Township (I can't recall the exact figure but he, along with our neighbors and friends were besides themselves).  As the residents of this particular area of this township(the non-365 day a year types) began to fight back, the reply by the mayor and the "365 day a year" residents: "welp, you come down here from North Jersey with all of your money, this is your second home, you can clearly afford it..." so on and so forth.  So to attack people who come down and spend lots of time, dollars, etc. in your "home" is foolish and misinformed; not only are WE helping to support the local economy, we are ALSO footing the bill for a lot of property tax increases and other associated costs.  The best part of this story is that the "365 day a year" residents all had a slight increase in their property taxes and did not feel the pain that my dad and others did in our area.

 

For the record: my family is by no means "rich" or "wealthy"...simply afforded a comfortable lifestyle by a long line of extremely hard-working people who made a lot of out a little...specifically in real estate.


Edited by mikepeluso8, 07 April 2014 - 05:17 PM.

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#80 mikepeluso8

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Posted 07 April 2014 - 05:16 PM

The Shore can't survive on its permanent residents alone because all the permanent residents are gone. What can't you understand about that? I can't tell you in any more a creative way that 365 days of economic activity is going to have a bigger impact than forty. It's simple.

 

For what reason do I have to be spiteful? I care about the interest of my home. That's where my interests lie. I have no reason to resent or have some ill feelings towards anything that is beneficial to the culture and economy of the place I've spent my entire life. The way the Shore has been exploited is not in the interest of the people or the wildlife of our region. Ask the baymen. Ask the pineys. Ask the decoy carvers and scallop fishermen. Ask the families who have been here for generations. Your interests lie elsewhere. It's attitudes like yours that has led the feeling of resentment to be focused not only on the unfortunate market conditions that have created this environment, but to the people like you.

 

 

Dude, you and every other person who lives near a beach/ocean/body of water/Mother Earth on the planet.  You are of a very provincial mindset, clearly.  Ever been to Florida?  California? Costa Rica? Anywhere but NJ?  Wake up.  Your problems are far bigger than what's occurring at the Jersey Shore.  


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