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The 2014 NJ Devils Offseason Thread


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#921 ATLL765

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 02:57 PM

I'd do Gelinas+2015 1st+Ryder for Kane. No way I'm trading Henrique when we're so lacking in the young forward dept. If Gelinas plays well again this season I think this becomes pretty realistic.


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#922 CarpathianForest

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 03:39 PM

No way I part with Gelinas. Zids is probably gone after this coming season and we need a good power play QB. Plus his shot is a real bonus.


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#923 Jerzey Devil

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 04:11 PM

No way I part with Gelinas. Zids is probably gone after this coming season and we need a good power play QB. Plus his shot is a real bonus.


Agree. We should wait and see how good Severson is gonna be in the nhl before we get rid of any offense from the back. Even if he turns out to be good we can still have two offensively gifted d men like when we had Nieds and Ralfi.

Edited by Jerzey Devil, 10 July 2014 - 04:12 PM.

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#924 ATLL765

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 05:02 PM

No way I part with Gelinas. Zids is probably gone after this coming season and we need a good power play QB. Plus his shot is a real bonus.

Gelinas is no PP QB. His shot is a rocket for sure, but he isn't the kind of player who is going to run the PP from the point, imo. You'll need an Elias type to distribute from the half boards and feed Gelinas the puck at the point. I'd send him in a trade only because he probably has the most value around the league due to his point total from last year. I think between Larsson and Merrill, they'll provide decent offense from the back end and I think they're more likely to be solid NHLers than Gelinas is. Gelinas to me could either be a top end PMD or could be nothing more than a hard shot that gets limited time 5v5 and is used mostly on the PP.


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#925 CarpathianForest

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 05:05 PM

Gelinas is no PP QB. His shot is a rocket for sure, but he isn't the kind of player who is going to run the PP from the point, imo. You'll need an Elias type to distribute from the half boards and feed Gelinas the puck at the point. I'd send him in a trade only because he probably has the most value around the league due to his point total from last year. I think between Larsson and Merrill, they'll provide decent offense from the back end and I think they're more likely to be solid NHLers than Gelinas is. Gelinas to me could either be a top end PMD or could be nothing more than a hard shot that gets limited time 5v5 and is used mostly on the PP.

 

Except you don't mention that he still has plenty of time to develop and probably has the best offensive upside of any defenseman on the team. I'm not giving up Gelinas for someone who has potential to be a top guy on a better team. Sorry, Kane's numbers and play isn't worth what you're offering.


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#926 RizzMB30

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 06:00 PM

Gelinas is no PP QB. His shot is a rocket for sure, but he isn't the kind of player who is going to run the PP from the point, imo. You'll need an Elias type to distribute from the half boards and feed Gelinas the puck at the point. I'd send him in a trade only because he probably has the most value around the league due to his point total from last year. I think between Larsson and Merrill, they'll provide decent offense from the back end and I think they're more likely to be solid NHLers than Gelinas is. Gelinas to me could either be a top end PMD or could be nothing more than a hard shot that gets limited time 5v5 and is used mostly on the PP.

I disagree.  He may not have the passing ability of a PP QB, but you can't say he's no PP QB and then say he could be a PMD.  The PP QB has to have the skating ability to get the puck up ice quickly.  He has the skating ability to be that guy and the shot.  Gelinas will be an NHLer as long as he figures out the defensive side of the game.  He's a big body, will play physical, he's everything you want from a defenseman, but you know, without the solid, reliable defense.  Even if he can get to Zidlicky's level of awareness, he'll be fine.  Zidlicky has had a pretty long and pretty successful career.  


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#927 bekim

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 07:49 PM

IMO the bobby Ryan deal is a good comparable. Two good (although not top-flight) prospects and a first.

If henrique is even mentioned as a starting point in a potential trade for Kane I hangup. Honestly I probably wouldn't make that trade straight up.

You wouldn't trade Henrique for EKane straight up??  That's surprising.  EKane is a pure talent who has the near term potential of being a superstar.  He hits a lot.  Shoots a lot.  Is a fun player to watch.  Henrique is a potential 30 goal scorer, but he's nowhere near as dynamic or talented a player as EKane.  I think any discussion would indeed involve a player like Henrique.  I disagree that it would take Henrique + Ryder + Young D + 1st.  That's not realistic based on the fact Kane seems to want out and Jets need to do something.  I think Henrique + Ryder + 1st gets it done without a D for sure, and I think it's also possible Henrique + Ryder + high 2nd gets it done.  Granted, all with the caveat that it's highly unlikely NJ is even looking at him.


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#928 CarpathianForest

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 09:24 PM

I'm not even looking at Kane. He has "potential" to be a solid player, but he doesn't stack up with Henrique's experience.  I just don't think Kane is as good as everyone thinks he is.


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#929 HellOnICE

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 09:30 PM

At first I was offering up Henrique to get Kane, but now not so much. Today, I'd only do a package involving Larsson and a pick a veteran roster player.

 

I think the Devils would wait too until they can get a look at Severson next week as well.


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#930 devilsrule33

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 09:34 PM

I'm trading Henrique any day as a center piece for Henrique. Just move past "character", and its a no-brainer. And while I absolutely loved Henrique's OT series winners, these are things that stay with GMs and fans for a little too long. Henrique had some huge goals, but I'm not thinking about those goals in the future and labeling him a big-time player.

 

Since Lou is obsessed with "character", I am not expecting any deal with these two players to ever happen.


Edited by devilsrule33, 10 July 2014 - 10:01 PM.

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#931 CarpathianForest

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 09:54 PM

I'm trading Henrique any day as a center piece for Henrique. Just move pass character, and its a no-brainer. And while I absolutely loved Henrique's OT series winners, these are things that stay with GMs and fans for a little too long. Henrique had some huge goals, but I'm not thinking about those goals in the future and labeling him a big-time player.

 

Since Lou is obsessed with "character", I am not expecting any deal with these two players to ever happen.

 

You lose a very valuable two-way center if you lose Henrique. Besides that Kane has already suffered at least one concussion in his career.


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#932 2ELIAS6

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 10:04 PM

im not even sure why its being discussed its not going to happen.. henrique is not going to be traded.
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#933 Devilsfan118

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 10:12 PM

im not even sure why its being discussed its not going to happen.. henrique is not going to be traded.

It's the offseason - have something better we should be taking about?

And never say never. Hockey is a crazy sport.

And for the record, I'd definitely okay with trading Gelinas. I don't know if people here remember just how bad he was defensively.. That shot is sexy, sure. But he could definitely become a MAB which would be unfortunate.

Edited by Devilsfan118, 10 July 2014 - 10:14 PM.

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#934 Triumph

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 10:17 PM

People saying 'he could become an MAB' have never seen Bergeron play defense, I think.  Gelinas is horrible but is light years ahead of where that guy was.  I would only deal Gelinas in the right package, and Winnipeg does not want Larsson, they need centers, which we also do not have.


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#935 2ELIAS6

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 10:23 PM

It's the offseason - have something better we should be taking about?
And never say never. Hockey is a crazy sport.
And for the record, I'd definitely okay with trading Gelinas. I don't know if people here remember just how bad he was defensively.. That shot is sexy, sure. But he could definitely become a MAB which would be unfortunate.

its just not realistic and its not going to happen..it would be extremely stupid to trade away young top 6 talent just to replace it with something else.. this team needs young top 6 talent youre not going to trade away what you need to get back a slightly better player.. one that doesnt even have that much proven time under his belt at that. but anyways i would be for trading gelinas in a package if it returned something of real use up front.. he has a sick shot but he is not that strong in his own end..who knows what will end up happening but i doubt he gets traded as well.
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#936 devilsrule33

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 10:28 PM

I'm really not ready to trade Gelinas in many packages, and definitely not because the Devils have Severson. Not sure he's going to translate into a big offensive players. Let's see how this AHL season goes.

 

As for Gelinas...rookie season of 29 points in 60 games on crummy offensive team, and I believe he played mostly on the 2nd PP.

 

His defense was atrocious. Probably as bad as I can remember any defenseman playing on the Devils. Definitely don't blame Pete for scratching him at all, but it just seemed like there was too much thinking being asked of him by the way he was jerked around."

 

"We are scratching you because your defense sucks, and you need to improve it"

"Be more physical because you are big and that's what big defenseman do"

"But our team desperately needs offense, so we will play you, but don't be stupid and be smart defensively"

"Just we REALLY need your offense..so create something"

"Okay, you suck defensively, but we need offense, so you'll be the 7th defenseman and get no shifts"

"Better do something offensively or there is no reason for you in the lineup....but don't fvck up"

 

He'll figure it out. I'm excited for him to QB the first PP, and put up some good numbers. Not expecting him to be remotely good defensively, but some improvements have to be there. Just don't try and hit anybody.


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#937 Triumph

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 10:32 PM

I don't think he'll be on the first unit this year.  I don't think what he wants to do works with what guys like Jagr and Elias want to do.  I think the first unit'll be Jagr-Elias-Cammalleri-Zidlicky-?  where ? can really be anyone from Merrill to Zajac to Greene, and the 2nd unit will have Gelinas, some D, Henrique, Clowe, Ryder/Havlat.  This team has too many forwards.

 

Also I think Kurtis Foster was worse defensively, though he was better positionally, I suppose.  


Edited by Triumph, 10 July 2014 - 10:34 PM.

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#938 CarterforPresident

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 11:40 PM

Henrique, and a dman/pick is a loss of a trade for Kane IMO. We lose a valuable forward, potential pick and value on the back end for a a forward. Isn't worth it!!!
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#939 devilsrule33

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Posted 10 July 2014 - 11:48 PM

Lot of people overrating Henrique here. 36 goals and 23 assists in the past two years (119 games). Sure it hasn't always been roses with linemates, but if you have him penciled in as a center....23 assists in 119 games! Then there is his incredible high shooting percentage (5th in the NHL last season).

 

If you have him penciled in as part of the core, the Devils don't have much of a core then. Obviously the ideal thing is to trade a defenseman for more offense, but no one on the NJ defense is getting you Kane. Of course this exercise is irrelevant since I don't think Kane is the player Lou goes after.


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#940 dmann422

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Posted 11 July 2014 - 06:46 AM

You wouldn't trade Henrique for EKane straight up?? That's surprising. EKane is a pure talent who has the near term potential of being a superstar. He hits a lot. Shoots a lot. Is a fun player to watch. Henrique is a potential 30 goal scorer, but he's nowhere near as dynamic or talented a player as EKane. I think any discussion would indeed involve a player like Henrique. I disagree that it would take Henrique + Ryder + Young D + 1st. That's not realistic based on the fact Kane seems to want out and Jets need to do something. I think Henrique + Ryder + 1st gets it done without a D for sure, and I think it's also possible Henrique + Ryder + high 2nd gets it done. Granted, all with the caveat that it's highly unlikely NJ is even looking at him.

it's close, I mean you say henrique is a potential 30 goal scorer yet Kane has only scored 30 goals and 50 points once. It's not as if he's already a bonafide star. Take out the lockout year and their stats over the past 3 years are very similar. I'm sure Kane will be the better player in the end but henrique is a top end pker. It's close straight up but I'm not adding a first rounder or a prospect.

Your right it's not happening, not because we're not looking at Kane but because henrique will never be traded. But it's also July and we all miss hockey.
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