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Sunny Mehta hired by Devils as Director of Analytics


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#41 DevsMan84

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 02:35 PM

Agree 100%. DeBoer should not be involved in the day-to-day of what Sunny Mehta is doing.

 

What Sunny Mehta is doing should inform what players we trade for, sign, or let go. And what Sunny Mehta is doing should inform whether DeBoer is the right coach at the end of the season. DeBoer should otherwise be doing the same job he's been doing.

 

I view it like an HR person at a company. That person's job isn't to consult with every department about the job they're doing every week. The good HR person will lead to the right hires that make the company better down the road, it's a process.

 

Are you serious about the HR person comparison?  You are willing to give a guy who has zero hockey experience that much power including when it comes to whether DeBoer is the right person for the job just by looking at a bunch of numbers on a sheet?

 

Sunny should be a consultant but not a decision maker.


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#42 SterioDesign

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 03:10 PM

Are you serious about the HR person comparison?  You are willing to give a guy who has zero hockey experience that much power including when it comes to whether DeBoer is the right person for the job just by looking at a bunch of numbers on a sheet?

 

Sunny should be a consultant but not a decision maker.

 

Exactly. You can NEVER strictly look at only numbers to make decisions and that's all this guy will be doing. Thats fvcking retarded. For every stats you have to look at the situation and a bunch of other factors and that guy is not qualify to judge all that.

 

Deboer will use him to back up some stuff he sees on the ice and other way around he may bring to Deboer informations that may have went under the radar. It's something you have to work hand in hand absolutely.

 


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#43 DJ Eco

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Posted 13 August 2014 - 03:50 PM

Are you serious about the HR person comparison?  You are willing to give a guy who has zero hockey experience that much power including when it comes to whether DeBoer is the right person for the job just by looking at a bunch of numbers on a sheet?

 

Sunny should be a consultant but not a decision maker.

 

I guess I didn't mean it too literally, but yeah, Lou would be the HR manager, and Sunny his assistant/advisor haha


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#44 HOLLYWOOD

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 11:23 AM

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#45 Pepperkorn

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 09:45 PM

I would have hired someone with a stats background, but whatever. 

 

Masters in music, what?

Music is math.  Additionally: performing artists are focused on high quality production. Highly disciplined, EXTREME work ethic, creative thinkers.  If you ever have the chance to hire performing artists do it.  It's a lesson learned time and time again by the corporate world.  The only problem is when it appears failure is eminent, they might bale out to seek out a more successful endeavor - or worse yet just burn out and hang on in a semi-vegetative state merely collecting a paycheck until someone makes their decision to move on for them.


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#46 Pepperkorn

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 09:53 PM

Are you serious about the HR person comparison? 

 

Sunny should be a consultant but not a decision maker.

HR isn't a decision maker.  Strategic HR (not benefits mgmt, payroll employee relations etc) offers performance metrics for management to use as part of their personnel decision making process.  Would it be wrong of me to say "duh?" at this point?

 

EDIT: Oh sh!t... I didn't even see who wrote that post -- great now it's going to be all about how I hate him blah blah blah.  :argh:


Edited by Pepperkorn, 14 August 2014 - 09:55 PM.

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#47 Pepperkorn

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Posted 14 August 2014 - 09:58 PM

Exactly. You can NEVER strictly look at only numbers to make decisions and that's all this guy will be doing. Thats fvcking retarded. For every stats you have to look at the situation and a bunch of other factors and that guy is not qualify to judge all that.

 

Deboer will use him to back up some stuff he sees on the ice and other way around he may bring to Deboer informations that may have went under the radar. It's something you have to work hand in hand absolutely.

You are responding to a response not the actual post.  Bad habit -- a way to get yourself all fired up about nothing -- just sayin'

 

Me, if I'm DeBoer -- I dont talk to this guy.  It's not my problem.  I talk to Lou.  Lou talks to this guy to see if there is any correlation between his metrics and the players performance as observed by DeBoer -- then discuss this with the coaching staff to aid them in generating that road map for the individual as well as the team. 

 

This thread is driving me insane.  Just stop and think about the situation - don't second guess what you think people will do -- you all are just confounding yourself.  Hmeh -- it's the off season. I guess it's what we do -- OK -- go on then  :P

 

 

Well I'll add a little bit more -- as a coach, I'd initially value my powers of observation.  I cannot look at numbers then form my observation - it's too easy to get confused/distracted.  I cannot check my observations against the numbers on a regular basis - I'd get tangled in minutia.  What i need as a coach is for someone to find the stat that tells me WHY I'm seeing what I'm seeing on ice.  If I cannot correct something and I'm at that can't see the forest for the trees place then it's time to look at the basic skills I might be taking for granted. As a GM I'd look at the product - identify weak spots and then check with Mr Stats guy to see if they an help articulate areas of improvement for my coaching staff.  Basically you dont want your stats to destroy your creativity is all.


Edited by Pepperkorn, 14 August 2014 - 10:27 PM.

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#48 Pepperkorn

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 08:58 AM

I guess I didn't mean it too literally, but yeah, Lou would be the HR manager, and Sunny his assistant/advisor haha

You had it right the first time even if you went of on a bit of a tangent. 

Mehta is indeed part of human resource management. 

It's not a crazy analogy, it's a FACT.   I have no idea why this is even remotely confusing to anyone.

 

If you don't understand that you're not looking at the value of stats correctly.

 

 

(FYI - The HR department fires you not because they made that decisions  - they're doing your boss's dirty work.  Your boss fired you.  No one else did.  Your boss thought you were doing a lousy job.  No one told them you were so they went ahead and agreed. No. They thought you sucked and didn't want to bear the responsibility of telling you so.  Don't kid yourself folks.  Well -- unless facing the truth severely inhibits your ability to move on... I guess then you have to pretend the stats guy got you fired...err I mean laid off because sucking down more revenue than you generate doesn't mean you suck, right?  :unsure: ...  *cough cough*  You know, I used to really talk to people like that, particularly in high school.  Right straight to their face.  I didn't see any other possible way to communicate. I thought to not speak that plainly was to waste peoples time.  hence my soft spot for Bobby Holik I guess :P  But if you really need me to tell you why -- well I'm going to tell you why in the most basic of terms - with a little worst-case thrown in there so you can face the worst and move on.  Funny, now I kind of hate the expression "Get over it"  It sounds so hopelessly out of touch. )


Edited by Pepperkorn, 15 August 2014 - 09:18 AM.

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#49 Daniel

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Posted 15 August 2014 - 09:12 AM

You are responding to a response not the actual post.  Bad habit -- a way to get yourself all fired up about nothing -- just sayin'

 

Me, if I'm DeBoer -- I dont talk to this guy.  It's not my problem.  I talk to Lou.  Lou talks to this guy to see if there is any correlation between his metrics and the players performance as observed by DeBoer -- then discuss this with the coaching staff to aid them in generating that road map for the individual as well as the team. 

 

This thread is driving me insane.  Just stop and think about the situation - don't second guess what you think people will do -- you all are just confounding yourself.  Hmeh -- it's the off season. I guess it's what we do -- OK -- go on then  :P

 

 

Well I'll add a little bit more -- as a coach, I'd initially value my powers of observation.  I cannot look at numbers then form my observation - it's too easy to get confused/distracted.  I cannot check my observations against the numbers on a regular basis - I'd get tangled in minutia.  What i need as a coach is for someone to find the stat that tells me WHY I'm seeing what I'm seeing on ice.  If I cannot correct something and I'm at that can't see the forest for the trees place then it's time to look at the basic skills I might be taking for granted. As a GM I'd look at the product - identify weak spots and then check with Mr Stats guy to see if they an help articulate areas of improvement for my coaching staff.  Basically you dont want your stats to destroy your creativity is all.

 

Again, a lot of analytics people will tell you DeBoer is doing the right thing with high possession numbers.  (They fault him for starting Marty in too many games last year, but that's not an issue anymore). 

 

I believe that in baseball, the players, coaches and managers do look at the analytics, and will have face to face discussions with the quants.  Baseball's a different animal than hockey I realize, so don't know if it would translate that well into in game strategy, except perhaps for line combinations and divying out ice time. 


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#50 devilsrule33

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Posted 23 February 2015 - 04:01 PM

ESPN did a feature on ranking professional sports teams in how receptive they are to analytics. Of course, it's hard to truly know the inner-workings of any team that isn't announcing the information.

 

According to the Devils blurb, in addition to Sunny, the Devils hired Sai Okabayashi. "who created and ran the popular website shiftchart.com"

 

http://espn.go.com/e...lytics-rankings


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#51 StormJosh

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Posted 01 April 2015 - 04:07 PM

Is there any indication that the Devils have used the services of Sunny or Sai this season? I haven't seen a shred of evidence that says yes and a lot that says no.


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#52 Daniel

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Posted 01 April 2015 - 04:15 PM

[quote name="StormJosh" post="1311668" timestamp="1427922425"]Is there any indication that the Devils have used the services of Sunny or Sai this season? I haven't seen a shred of evidence that says yes and a lot that says no.[/quote

I'm pretty sure I saw both of them in the press box at the Kings game last week. Both had lap tops, so I guess they were doing something. Kind of hard to see, but I'm pretty sure it was them.

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Edited by Daniel, 01 April 2015 - 04:21 PM.

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#53 William D'Aquila

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Posted 01 April 2015 - 04:48 PM

Sai is a Ranger fan.


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#54 Marshall

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Posted 02 April 2015 - 02:30 AM


I'm pretty sure I saw both of them in the press box at the Kings game last week. Both had lap tops, so I guess they were doing something. Kind of

 

Checking twitter.

 

It's really hard to gauge from an outsider's perspective what the impact of a certain person has been. People easily jump to conclusions whenever a move is made that corresponds with what we perceive to be said person's opinion. It's not like Lou hasn't made moves in the past that would make sense from an analytics perspective, but future moves that do just that will have people saying "oh that's Sunny's influence right there". Same goes for "bad" moves or if the organization is still treading water a few years down the line. It's really hard to tell what type of influence and role Sunny has (is it more data scouting of other players/teams, more about getting data on your team etc). Director of Analytics probably doesn't mean the same thing in all organizations.


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#55 Jas0nMacIsaac

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Posted 02 April 2015 - 03:24 AM

You have to collect data before decisions can be made, much of this season was sample size collection IMO. I believe FA signings will be more involved with sunny.


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#56 DJ Eco

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Posted 02 April 2015 - 02:20 PM

Is there any indication that the Devils have used the services of Sunny or Sai this season? I haven't seen a shred of evidence that says yes and a lot that says no.

 

Can't imagine any meaningful decisions being able to be made until this offseason. It's a game of patience, I guess, the bulk of their job will probably be a lot of reviewing of film from this season, starting mid-April onwards.


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